Viscount Legend Soul

[HammondDave]

A HAMMOND player friend of mine played the Soul at NAMM.  He was very disappointed at the feel of the keyboard. He said that it felt like no HAMMOND he has ever played. I trust his judgment and I’m surprise that Joey allowed that to happen. I’m curious what other people feel about the Keyboard feel. 

[JohnDoe]

37 minutes ago, HammondDave said:

A HAMMOND player friend of mine played the Soul at NAMM.  He was very disappointed at the feel of the keyboard. He said that it felt like no HAMMOND he has ever played. I trust his judgment and I’m surprise that Joey allowed that to happen. I’m curious what other people feel about the Keyboard feel. 

In the NAMM video from Fortner, Brian Ho said the Soul 273 was a prototype. Hope the keyfeel is correct when production starts.

[LX 88]

I was cruising through this thread and saw Ken's comments on the original Numa 1

 

I want to say I am in absolute agreement. I recently revived my Numa 1 and I will say.... both the CV and leslie sim are both my current favorite ( I have owned most other clones.)

 

The Numa got trashed on these pages by a few self proclaimed experts. Not enough " cut" in the upper register? After how many people purchased tube preamps to eliminate some of that same shrillness? 

 

To be honest....the keybed of Numa and Viscount has been in need of improvement. The newer Crumar Mojo addresses this but I still am inclined toward the sound of Key B for various reasons which I will not go into here. Mostly to do with editing....I still think it is insane to edit via wifi. And to me the Key B does not really need editing. The Numa sim is amazingly neutral and free from attempts to emulate cabinets and miking....yuck....I can't get anywhere with any of that.

 

I am curious about this new addition but the price is probably prohibitive. I am sticking with Numa an Viscount Legend live for now

 

 

[Aussie_Chicago]

Speaking of price , the 273 @ $5300 and the smaller 261 @$3990 plus applicable tax. Essentially close to $6k for the full size one. I’m not going to comment on whether this is high or low …. You decide ! Makes me feel a bit better about ordering the OBX8 😉

[JohnDoe]

50 minutes ago, Aussie_Chicago said:

Speaking of price , the 273 @ $5300 and the smaller 261 @$3990 plus applicable tax. Essentially close to $6k for the full size one. I’m not going to comment on whether this is high or low …. You decide ! Makes me feel a bit better about ordering the OBX8 😉

Where are these prices anounnced?

[Delaware Dave]

On 6/7/2022 at 2:50 PM, JohnDoe said:

In the NAMM video from Fortner, Brian Ho said the Soul 273 was a prototype. Hope the keyfeel is correct when production starts.

 

In the video Brian Ho explained the technology about using magnets and how the magnets connect to trigger the contacts.  I'm wondering how the magnets might impact the 'feel' of the keybed.

[Delaware Dave]

2 hours ago, Aussie_Chicago said:

Speaking of price , the 273 @ $5300 and the smaller 261 @$3990 plus applicable tax. Essentially close to $6k for the full size one. I’m not going to comment on whether this is high or low …. You decide ! Makes me feel a bit better about ordering the OBX8 😉

for $1300 difference between the 61 and 73 key I can purchase an XK1c or a Mojo 61.  Ridiculous.

[kaptainkeys]

32 minutes ago, Delaware Dave said:

for $1300 difference between the 61 and 73 key I can purchase an XK1c or a Mojo 61.  Ridiculous.

$1300 could buy you a used FA-08 or MOXF8 and make it a whole rig, seems like a much better value proposition than some preset keys.

[Aussie_Chicago]

7 hours ago, JohnDoe said:

Where are these prices anounnced?

[Al Coda]

16 hours ago, Aussie_Chicago said:

Speaking of price , the 273 @ $5300 and the smaller 261 @$3990 plus applicable tax.

 

 

What do they smoke ?

Current price of Viscount Legend @Thomann is  2.390.-

Viscount Legend_Thomann

 

Black Signature Edition is 2.699.-

Viscount Legend Black Signature

 

Plz search yourself for the Legend Live being way more affordable.

 

Even a MAG Custom Organ flagship P2 built according to your needs is cheaper.

 

 

A.C.

 

[Spider76]

I think this is intended as a competitor of the XK-5.

And when you think that to have a direct H/S equivalent you have to factor in the XLK-5, the half moon and the wooden music stand,the Legend Soul's price begins to look quite competitive actually. Not to mention that it's smaller, lighter, with a more faithful interface and with more features.

 

That said, it is still a price tag that will scare away most potential customers...me included.

 

 

 

[Al Coda]

2 minutes ago, Spider76 said:

think this is intended as a competitor of the XK-5.

And when you think that to have a direct H/S equivalent you have to factor in the XLK-5, the half moon and the wooden music stand

 

yeah,- nice try !

 

A.C.

[Adan]

If it recreates the feel of playing a real Hammond -- and that's a big "if" -- then it will be worth it to some players.  But many people playing clones these days have not played a real Hammond, or played one only briefly, so how big is this market?

 

Price-wise still costs less than an SKXPro.  The SKXPro also gives you other sounds, most of which are not as good as what could be midi'd in from Korg Module.  

 

All depends on how this thing feels under the fingers.  Kraft Music has a solid return policy.

[M_G]

 

Multicintact or not........

 

Nice try, but cheesy sound.....

[Delaware Dave]

2 hours ago, M_G said:

 

Multicintact or not........

 

Nice try, but cheesy sound.....

 

Almost this....  I wouldn't say cheesy but there is definitely a plasticky or sterile sound to the instrument.  Also, when first introduced on youtube the spread between the 9 contacts was large, you had to be 3/4 of the way down on the key to get all 9 contacts to fire.  In the video I heard two days ago from NAMM (with Brian Ho) they were so close together that I could barely here the different contacts firing and certainly in a live performance you would never hear the benefit of the contact system.  Given that, the price increase for barely hearing the contacts trigger on the Soul vs. not having them on the original legend is a $2K difference?  Not doing it for me; I'd take SKXPro and at least get additional sounds and pocket some money as well.  What is it with these manufacturers who think that the average Joe can drop $4-5K on an instrument.  I'm obviously not their target market.

 

A friend of mine wrote this a couple of days ago:  "...last weekend I got to play a vintage B3 at a blues festival. I had my Nord Stage 3 set up for pianos. On a whim, I set both keyboards to the exact same settings. Even with the Nord in mono and no leslie, the tone of it was so close to the real B3 that it really surprised me. Sure, the layout is different and some of the little things like multi contacts are not there, but on stage, no one is going to notice..."

 

[AnotherScott]

35 minutes ago, Delaware Dave said:

when first introduced on youtube the spread between the 9 contacts was large, you had to be 3/4 of the way down on the key to get all 9 contacts to fire.  In the video I heard two days ago from NAMM (with Brian Ho) they were so close together that I could barely here the different contacts firing

Maybe this is user-configurable behavior.

 

35 minutes ago, Delaware Dave said:

What is it with these manufacturers who think that the average Joe can drop $4-5K on an instrument.  I'm obviously not their target market.

Yeah, I don't think these are targeted at the "average Joe." But niche products have their place, too.

 

Also, I suspect that the church market could be interested in this... and that's a big market, probably bigger than "we" are.

 

42 minutes ago, Delaware Dave said:

certainly in a live performance you would never hear the benefit of the contact system.

...

A friend of mine wrote this a couple of days ago:..."Even with the Nord in mono and no leslie, the tone of it was so close to the real B3 that it really surprised me. Sure, the layout is different and some of the little things like multi contacts are not there, but on stage, no one is going to notice..."

We're also back to the old question of who some of these benefits are for, along with how they are experienced. The audience won't notice multi-contact, and maybe you won't even hear it specifically, but if they've come up with something that just somehow responds in a way that you find more satisfying to play, it conceivably increases your enjoyment (worthwhile on its own), and even perhaps inspires you to play better, more interesting stuff (possibly worthwhile to the audience).

 

[cedar]

Not sure if this has been posted yet.

 

 

[HammondDave]

1 hour ago, AnotherScott said:

Maybe this is user-configurable behavior.

 

Yeah, I don't think these are targeted at the "average Joe." But niche products have their place, too.

 

Also, I suspect that the church market could be interested in this... and that's a big market, probably bigger than "we" are.

 

We're also back to the old question of who some of these benefits are for, along with how they are experienced. The audience won't notice multi-contact, and maybe you won't even hear it specifically, but if they've come up with something that just somehow responds in a way that you find more satisfying to play, it conceivably increases your enjoyment (worthwhile on its own), and even perhaps inspires you to play better, more interesting stuff (possibly worthwhile to the audience).

 

 

This is how I look at it...  It weighs over 50lbs, making it useless for me to gig with it. The added effects are kind of useless for me, although the Thump effect is cool (if it could be triggered randomly by the key, and not a pedal).  Plus the Mojo 61 with its lower manual has the best and most authentic keyboard feel than any other clone I have played, and the Soul has a questionable key feel.  Maybe for people who want a "new B3" for home, or for musicians who can afford roadies... fine.  For me, I already have two B'3s at home. But I would probably throw down $5000 if they could get close to the Mojo key feel, and I was 10 years younger (lol), 

[HammondDave]

50 minutes ago, cedar said:

Not sure if this has been posted yet.

 

 

 

Ya gotta love Joey.   What a talent...  And what a nice guy!  

[drawback]

Yeah, but… but… slap down $5k US and you too will be be able to show off inconsequential pentatonics really really fast.

 

 

[Adan]

Joey D confirms in that video that the contact spacing is adjustable, which is very cool.

 

The 61-note version is 43 lbs.

[Polychrest]

3 hours ago, drawback said:

Yeah, but… but… slap down $5k US and you too will be be able to show off inconsequential pentatonics really really fast.

 

 

The Inconsequential Pentatonics were a Viletones cover band, weren’t they?  I’m astounded they’re still above ground and can command $5000 for a gig.  Maybe it’s a coattails effect of that Sex Pistols series on Disney+….😜

[HammondDave]

2 hours ago, Adan said:

Joey D confirms in that video that the contact spacing is adjustable, which is very cool.

 

The 61-note version is 43 lbs.

 

Hmmm... and since its the same organ but without preset keys and rocker tabs, and $1300 cheaper...   I may consider this if the key feel is great.

[Jim Alfredson]

Not going to comment on the instrument itself (people know what I think) but I will say it's nice to see complaints about pricing directed towards a clonewheel company other than HamSuz for once.

[Outkaster]

Not just that Jim but Joey D. has endorsed Hammond, Diversi and everyone else under the sun,  This has been going on for YEARS.  Sal and I gave him backline onetime ten years ago and he uses none of those instruments he endorse live most of the time so take it with a grain of salt.  Let's just say with the clones you are splitting hairs now and none of them will ever have the presence of the real thing. 

[HammondDave]

33 minutes ago, Outkaster said:

Not just that Jim but Joey D. has endorsed Hammond, Diversi and everyone else under the sun,  This has been going on for YEARS.  Sal and I gave him backline onetime ten years ago and he uses none of those instruments he endorse live most of the time so take it with a grain of salt.  Let's just say with the clones you are splitting hairs now and none of them will ever have the presence of the real thing. 

And StudioLogic as well. I don’t question Joey’s sincerity as all these companies have great products.  And I have seen him play clones that he endorses live. But let’s face it… no one has created a clone that is better than the Hammond B3. So if I had the talent and star power that Joey has (maybe in another universe), I would perform on B3’s as well. 

[cedar]

1 hour ago, Outkaster said:

Not just that Jim but Joey D. has endorsed Hammond, Diversi and everyone else under the sun,  This has been going on for YEARS.  Sal and I gave him backline onetime ten years ago and he uses none of those instruments he endorse live most of the time so take it with a grain of salt.  Let's just say with the clones you are splitting hairs now and none of them will ever have the presence of the real thing. 

I'm pretty sure that I have seen him live - sometime during the last couple of years - playing a Legend.

[Noah DC]

2 hours ago, Outkaster said:

Not just that Jim but Joey D. has endorsed Hammond, Diversi and everyone else under the sun,  This has been going on for YEARS.  Sal and I gave him backline onetime ten years ago and he uses none of those instruments he endorse live most of the time so take it with a grain of salt.  Let's just say with the clones you are splitting hairs now and none of them will ever have the presence of the real thing. 

I kind of don’t see what the problem is here? Seems good to have high-profile support for the development of more and better clonewheels across the cost spectrum, especially considering the inevitable increase in B3 scarcity over the long run?

[Adan]

While the B3 geek in me is tickled to see the multi-contact simulating technology, I think it's very debatable how much difference this really makes.  Arguably, it's going too far down the authenticity rabbit-hole.  Good Hammond playing technique doesn't depend on that the same way it depends on other physical attributes such as (to pick an obvious example) waterfall keys.  In that video, Joey D demonstrates his "squabble" technique and you can see the listeners' eyes bugging out.  But it's not highly musical and those people are not the general audience.  I think Hammond-Suziki captured 90% of the musicality of multi-contacts in the SKPro.

 

So is the multi-contact simulation cool?  Yeah, for sure.  Should it be a pivotal point for deciding which clone to buy?  I'd say no.  But maybe the Legend Soul has an improved key action as well, which for me would be a bigger selling point.  HamSuz improved the key action between the SK and the SKPro, putting it almost on a par with Crumar for buttery goodness.

[JohnDoe]

Why can´t Viscount just give us a proper technical/ user info of the "Soul", like a YT rundown of the organ, not the player? 

All of the "HammondOrganPeopleNerds" know that JoeyD can play, but give us relevant info re. the Legend Soul.

Or is it still in prototype stage, like they don´t know the final result?