Arturia Astrolab

[JoJoB3]

1 hour ago, Jose EB5AGV said:

Another nice review. I like Jeff style:

 

 

Comparing to an Essential?
I'd suggest pausing early iteration at least.

[Jose EB5AGV]

1 hour ago, Mighty Motif Max said:

I was looking for some specs on polyphony - found this on the Synth Anatomy site.

 

"To avoid audio dropouts, the polyphony is limited per part to 8 voices for the synths and 48 voices for pianos/organs."

 

That seems pretty low-spec. Not good 

[ElmerJFudd]

The polyphony limitations are interesting.  I’m guessing that they are balancing between sound quality, latency and what hardware they can afford to put in the box.  It does seem under powered.  That doesn’t mean it wouldn’t be useful for a lot of applications. Just maybe that it wouldn’t be one’s pick for certain performances.  

[CHarrell]

...8...voices? On a $1,500 machine? Using instrument tech that I've had for years on my computer that I got bundled with the Keylab41 mk2 for 25% of the price, which was explicitly designed and marketed to easily and intelligently link up with those software instruments for expansive real-time control? What am I missing?

[JoJoB3]

4 minutes ago, ElmerJFudd said:

The polyphony limitations are interesting.  I’m guessing that they are balancing between sound quality, latency and what hardware they can afford to put in the box.  It does seem under powered.  That doesn’t mean it wouldn’t be useful for a lot of applications. Just maybe that it wouldn’t be one’s pick for certain performances.  

Also true. Even an old, funky V Machine can be a hoot and find it's place in the music.

Btw, this product is sort of like a V Machine for today...but with parts from 2018.
 

[Franz Schiller]

Although this isn't perfect, I have to give them credit, I really like the concept of a V Collection sounds without a computer. 

 

I wonder if a workaround for low polyphony is to program all the splits and layer into the patch on the computer side of things.

[Mighty Motif Max]

1 hour ago, CyberGene said:

So, you can’t layer a piano and pad and use the sustain pedal. Seems people will keep using romplers for live playing then. 

 

Well, it's per-part, so for a split/layer you have 8 synth voices or 48 piano/organ voices per patch, so at least it's not 8 total or 48 total. Nords used to have polyphony somewhere in the 40s for their pianos IIRC.

 

1 hour ago, J.F.N. said:

A tiny keyhole window, no numeric keypad for selecting patches, and very odd design with the parameter buttons and knobs on the right side of the top plate?

 

Not designed for live work clearly.

 

 

I will say - they do have a set list function for organizing and scrolling through patches for different songs (they call it a "playlist" function).

[ElmerJFudd]

19 minutes ago, JoJoB3 said:

Also true. Even an old, funky V Machine can be a hoot and find it's place in the music.

Btw, this product is sort of like a V Machine for today...but with parts from 2018.
 

For comparison this is what the MPC Keys uses: 

4GB Ram / Quad Core ARM Processor / 32 GB Internal Storage

 

Are these specs available for the Arturia?  

[AnotherScott]

7 minutes ago, Mighty Motif Max said:

Nords used to have polyphony somewhere in the 40s for their pianos IIRC.

 Yes...40 stereo or 60 mono. But it's hard to compare these figures when companies' implementations can vary so much. The original Korg Kross had polyphony of 80 single mode, 40 double mode... but their main piano sound hit the wall at 20.

[J.F.N.]

1 hour ago, Mighty Motif Max said:

 

Well, it's per-part, so for a split/layer you have 8 synth voices or 48 piano/organ voices per patch, so at least it's not 8 total or 48 total. Nords used to have polyphony somewhere in the 40s for their pianos IIRC.

 

 

I will say - they do have a set list function for organizing and scrolling through patches for different songs (they call it a "playlist" function).

 

Yes, I saw that, then the singer gave me a note 2 minutes before we went on stage, with a new playlist...

[tapes]

An utterly pointless product, IMO. 61 semi-weighted keys (not a true ”stage instrument” without 73/88 weighted), poor polyphony, limited controls. 
 

A lot of people have Arturia’s V set already and a powerful enough Mac/laptop. Add some small audio interface and a Keystep 88 MKII and you’re much better off. Granted, the total cost for all that is of course a lot more than what they’re asking for here. 

[ElmerJFudd]

I think it is every software instrument developer’s dream to see their instrument in hardware and to see musicians make music with it.  Hardware is also typically less susceptible to theft (warez, pirating).  Having hardware definitely is another source of income for Arturia.  
 

Question - does Arturia ship the VSTs on this keyboard?  Or is this really for owners of their software instruments because you have to be licensed?   Or is it that the patch exchanging from computer only works when you own the software. I’m not clear on that.  

[jason88]

I own the Pigments software, as well as the complete V collection X. I do like a lot of the functionality of the Arturia software and am generally a fan of lots of their gear. This unit has some cool features but has lots of demerits too, including limited polyphony, only a 61-key semi-weighted action (unless that changes), limited control surface, external power supply (wall wart), and a micro screen. Hard to see who the board is really best suited for at $1600. But I'd still love to tinker around on one at some point.

[David Emm]

Long-story short, I'm oddly impressed. I'd modify a few things about it like the number of splits, as we always want to do, but if the keybed feels good, that's a huge WIN, the massive library being what it is. Its perfectly fair to require a full instrument to get to the programming micro-level; I see that as an inducement, not a drawback.

 

The piano may not be your first choice, but its no slouch, either. I don't hear any cause for hate. That dial had better be extra-tough, because its going to get a serious workout. The implementation seems well-considered, so if its as OLED-crisp as it looks, I applaud the design.

 

It straddles a twisty line for me, because its not quite enough of a feature-rich powerhouse to be a winner for every kind of live work and it sort of gyps someone who wants to program in detail. Flip side: if you're a composer who owns a couple of their full synths like Pigments, you could lean on it heavily and make out well. The modifiers available for the presets are well-chosen. Also, the 61 keys are appreciated. 73-76 would be better, but 4 octaves would make a split near-pointless. 

 

"VST in a box" seems like much less of an insult now. This is a good example of the idea working properly.

[konaboy]

1 hour ago, ElmerJFudd said:

I think it is every software instrument developer’s dream to see their instrument in hardware and to see musicians make music with it.  Hardware is also typically less susceptible to theft (warez, pirating).  Having hardware definitely is another source of income for Arturia.  
 

Question - does Arturia ship the VSTs on this keyboard?  Or is this really for owners of their software instruments because you have to be licensed?   Or is it that the patch exchanging from computer only works when you own the software. I’m not clear on that.  

  

1 minute ago, konaboy said:

to answer the question, analog lab vst runs onboard in the hardware, analog lab is v collection but with limited editing capabilies,

to do deep editing, yes you need v collection on computer, then you can edit and transfer patches to the keyboard.

if you are happy with the onboard sounds, you don't need any licenses or vsts on your pc.

analog lab software is included with the purchase, for basic tweaking and patch management.

 

[Thethirdapple]

They are not the first nor the only company which is looking to retain a client base by any means possible.
 

This current Arturia workflow/eco-system seems strangely familiar to the KARMA workflow with the 2001 Korg KARMA Workstation having onboard realtime controls but limited editing and then with Karma-Lab software running on a computer providing a MORE than complete midi programming environment which could be “loaded” into the WS for playing and working directly onboard.

 

I guess drag and drop or cloud transfers are indeed better than diskette or SysEx transfers…

 

The style of this new vst hardware dongle is nice and agree in having one to try out is not out of the question. Hopefully the functions will not be pay-per-play or blocked when using a non-arturia controller. Meaning, could someone make a generic controller to function with the computer software? Doesn’t seem like thats “their” plan!
 

 

 

 

PEACE

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[CHarrell]

I'm seeing some comments, so I'll make one of my own: if this keybed is the same as the Keylab mk2, then people shouldn't have anything to worry about. That keybed has such a unique feel that I find to be quick, and very expressive. I really can't think of another key action that feels like it.

[LarsHarner]

Its admittedly not for me, but I am a huge Arturia fan.

The keylab MKII was one of the important healing things for me that I got as post trauma pandemic isolation therapy. 

If it had 88 keys , sliders, and transport controls then I would purchase it. 

However, i think it is great for someone to take on gigs; perhaps a parallel audience to the CK61, but those more focused on vintage synth sounds. 

[16251]

My supercar interests came to mind when I saw interface.  Besides Nest, Ferrari Purosangue makes use of this circular interface.

 

[CrossRhodes]

What’s with all the empty real estate to the left of the thermostat wheel? Are the brains under there so no room for additional sliders/controls etc? Just seems odd to ship all these great synths with so many controllable parameters and then have so few controls at the ready.

[niacin]

Reminds me of GSI's Gemini: 2 timbres, do your editing on the software.  With a keyboard attached, but no poly aftertouch is disappointing given it's become a thing again just lately, and I'm not a fan of wheels above the keyboard on a 61.  I think you'd have to be already heavily invested in Arturia's software for it to be attractive.  

[J.F.N.]

It's interesting how their marketing trick calling it a "stage keyboard" is uncritically received everywhere, loads of posts all over the internet about how this must be a great live/stage/band/whatnot keyboard, by people who are not players...

 

I love the concept, VIs in a hardware unit, a wet dream from the dawn of VIs, but the packaging here with AstroLab feels like a total hit and miss for their intended target group.

 

I can see this as a great noodling machine for a home studio and for inspiration when composing or when starting to sketch on an arrangement for a pop song, but that's it!

 

Let's give it an incarnation or three, or see if NI is picking up on this, they already have the parts, Software, Keyboard, and the brain in Machine+.

[Thethirdapple]

34 minutes ago, J.F.N. said:

I love the concept, VIs in a hardware unit, a wet dream from the dawn of VIs, but the packaging here with AstroLab feels like a total hit and miss for their intended target group.

True that, feels like sometimes innovative ideas such as OpenLabs and many others are simply too early for the available tech to bring to market… 

 

Could see myself, if I had unlimited resources, getting multi Arutria boards and build a custom stack to get around the polyphony issues… which is the whole point of running multiple instances of a plugin.

 

 

 

 

PEACE

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[Tusker]

9 hours ago, CrossRhodes said:

What’s with all the empty real estate to the left of the thermostat wheel? Are the brains under there so no room for additional sliders/controls etc? Just seems odd to ship all these great synths with so many controllable parameters and then have so few controls at the ready.

 

This has been a peeve for me across multiple keyboard designs for many years. Often the controllers are huddling on the right hand side of the keyboard. Do manufacturers not know that most keyboard players have stronger right hand technique and are more likely to reach for controllers with their left? 'Tis a puzzlement.

 

As to VI instruments at gigs, I take the long view: Virtual instruments were initially solving a technical problem: let's make that sound with computer code. That's pretty far from the problem of instrument design. I expect to see a line of evolutionary instruments, inching closer and closer to human ergonomics. Some designs more useful to patch and others more useful to play.

 

For playing, something which looks like the Nonlinear labs C15 with two large ribbons and four pedal inputs speaks to me. That's a design worth emulating. 

[ElmerJFudd]

Nick has his hands on it. 

 

 

[RABid]

I don’t see any advantage of having all those synths shoved into one keyboard when you don’t have the controls to make good use of them. ASM Hydrosynth Deluxe and Novation Summit are at the top of my buy list. Nothing here makes me want it more than those, or makes me consider replacing my Jupiter X or System 8. I really like my Auturia software collection. I would not enjoy it with such a simple interface as this keyboard.

[CyberGene]

Has anyone of the YT reviewers checked how fast you can switch between the presets, especially when they are based on different synth models? My impression with the Analog Lab on my pretty fast Apple Silicon Mac is there’s still awkward lag. I wouldn’t want to scroll through thousands of presets if that’s slow. And hopefully there are no audible artifacts when doing so, because that’s often the case with FX chain. I guess it would be optimistic to expect so, but any chance of seamless transitions? Like e.g. keeping a chord held from current preset while changing to a new performance or whatever it’s called. 

[Stokely]

I've been gigging with a single keyboard for a while now (though I'll be bringing my Modx as backup)....seamless transitions are an absolute requirement at this point, at least for a main keyboard.  Whether it's switching in song mode or to another preset while holding (or sustaining) notes, I use this feature constantly.  

[Jose EB5AGV]

30 minutes ago, Stokely said:

I've been gigging with a single keyboard for a while now (though I'll be bringing my Modx as backup)....seamless transitions are an absolute requirement at this point, at least for a main keyboard.  Whether it's switching in song mode or to another preset while holding (or sustaining) notes, I use this feature constantly.  

 

I am also a mono-keyboard gigger (in my case mostly because of my limited abilities so far 😆) and find the MODX/MONTAGE very good on seamless patch changes. Not all can do it, but quite a lot do. As is also seamless when you switch scenes and the sustained notes keep sounding at the original volumes, even if the new scene has louder or quieter ones. That is really useful when switching from verse to chorus and vice versa.

 

So this new keyboard seems to me like a good idea, but somewhat limited. Perhaps the MK2 will be closer to what I would like. Meanwhile, GP+laptop+V Collection (and other VSTs)+controller will do for me when I jump to that wagon 😁

[johnchop]

I now realize how out of touch I’ve been about current keyboard pricing.

 

1700 for Juno X.  Less for a MOD-X.

 

So 1600 is a tough sell for this for customers doing feature-by-feature comparisons.

 

I like the overall design, and it has most of the features I’d want, except that it feels underpowered.