Heads-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back

[Daddyg3042]

OK here's the situation everyone:

 

Our ship arrived Jan 2 and is anchored off shore, waiting for a "berth number". My import agent's best estimate is that earliest delivery I can expect is Friday, but it is more likely it will be early next week. I need a few days to spot check (I personally double check about 25% of each shipment...some of you may have seen my signature on a QC check list inside the box)...even though so far I have not had a single reject.

That means I should get most of these off to Sweetwater by a week from this Friday at the latest. It takes about 2-3 days by truck to Indiana, so then by the following week of the 19th they will be filling your orders. Or perhaps before if they get out of LA port by this Friday.

 

So short story; we are slightly ahead of schedule.

 

So Aspen....did the schedule above hold? Are they on the way to SW?

 

Not to be a PITA, but, after a 3+ month wait...I'm way beyond anxious to finally get this.

 

Thanks

[rickzjamm]

Just ordered mine this week, c'mon pony express!!

[Dglavko]

Interesting thing about the placement - i auditioned for a new group today in a nice dead sounding room, nobody too loud despite the big kit, marshall stacks etc.

 

I set up the ss with the side speaker facing the guitarist about 7 feet away and after a couple tunes (switched to wurli patch) he actually stopped the song and asked me to turn it down!

 

So i repositioned it behind me and all good.

 

But to my ears (receiving front speaker about the same distance away) it wasnt too loud at all. Makes me wonder if the side speaker is louder?

[cedar]

I ordered mine recently, mostly with a view towards using it in blues and funk bands.

 

But I also sometimes play jazz in small combos, including a duet with a guitarist or upright bass in a tiny room. For such a small room, I wonder whether the SS will be suitable, or whether I'd better off using my Alto TS 110A.

 

In other words, do you get much benefit from the stereo effect if the volume is very low and the room very small?

[S_Gould]

I...guitarist about 7 feet away and after a couple tunes (switched to wurli patch) he actually stopped the song and asked me to turn it down!

 

 

Of course he did - he's a guitarist In 4 decades of gigging, I've learned that if the guitarist can hear the keys, they're too loud!

[AndyW]

I ordered mine recently, mostly with a view towards using it in blues and funk bands.

 

But I also sometimes play jazz in small combos, including a duet with a guitarist or upright bass in a tiny room. For such a small room, I wonder whether the SS will be suitable, or whether I'd better off using my Alto TS 110A.

 

In other words, do you get much benefit from the stereo effect if the volume is very low and the room very small?

 

You get the stereo at low volumes.

[HAMEGZ]

 

 

Of course he did - he's a guitarist In 4 decades of gigging, I've learned that if the guitarist can hear the keys, THE GUITAR AMP IS NOT LOUD ENOUGH!

 

corrected for you

[Les Mizzell]

I set up the ss with the side speaker facing the guitarist about 7 feet away and after a couple tunes (switched to wurli patch) he actually stopped the song and asked me to turn it down!

 

After reading a number of messages about the side speaker causing folks to the left of the cabinet thinking it's too loud, I wonder if there should be a option to switch the side speaker from left to right?

 

Or, is this when you just turn it upside down?

[DanL]

That wouldn't help as the speaker is exposed on the back side as well.

[cphollis]

Interesting thing about the placement - i auditioned for a new group today in a nice dead sounding room, nobody too loud despite the big kit, marshall stacks etc.

 

I set up the ss with the side speaker facing the guitarist about 7 feet away and after a couple tunes (switched to wurli patch) he actually stopped the song and asked me to turn it down!

 

So i repositioned it behind me and all good.

 

But to my ears (receiving front speaker about the same distance away) it wasnt too loud at all. Makes me wonder if the side speaker is louder?

 

Same sort of thing happened to me, except it was the drummer complaining. The side-firing speaker is certainly loud, and it sends a L-R difference signal (the opposite of the L+R out front), so it sounds relatively unpleasant by itself. You wouldn't want to hear it solo.

 

I learned to watch where the side speaker was pointing, or simply rotate the unit 90 degrees so the side speaker is pointing up.

[Dave Bryce]

Okay, I finally got to use the SSv3 at a rehearsal.

 

First of all, putting it sideways on the amp stand really didn't work for me, and the guitar player immediately asked me to turn down....so then, I tried putting it right on the floor leaning up against the back wall.

 

That did it.

 

Right away, the clarity of the parts jumped out at me...and the other members of the band as well! Volume was excellent, bass was nice and full without stepping on the bass player at all...but the clarity and detail of the sounds was the thing that really grabbed me the most. I use some fairly detailed layered sounds in this band, and both guitar players commented that they could hear tones they hadn't heard before, especially on the synth heavy stuff.

 

I'm really impressed with this bad boy. I like it much better than the V2...

 

dB

[Aspen]

OK here's the situation everyone:

 

Our ship arrived Jan 2 and is anchored off shore, waiting for a "berth number". My import agent's best estimate is that earliest delivery I can expect is Friday, but it is more likely it will be early next week. I need a few days to spot check (I personally double check about 25% of each shipment...some of you may have seen my signature on a QC check list inside the box)...even though so far I have not had a single reject.

That means I should get most of these off to Sweetwater by a week from this Friday at the latest. It takes about 2-3 days by truck to Indiana, so then by the following week of the 19th they will be filling your orders. Or perhaps before if they get out of LA port by this Friday.

 

So short story; we are slightly ahead of schedule.

 

So Aspen....did the schedule above hold? Are they on the way to SW?

 

Not to be a PITA, but, after a 3+ month wait...I'm way beyond anxious to finally get this.

 

Thanks

 

Well DaddyG, the union slow down that caused this backlog is still the problem. As of Friday our container wass till on the boat and no berth yet assigned.

 

However today I got a bit of good news, the boat was docked and the container was off loaded...but now waiting for a p/u to the warehouse where it gets cleared by customs.

 

My agent is getting tired of me calling him daily but I am sure he is pushing as hard as he can. So as of today his best estimate is a few more days to get them cleared and delivered to me. So I am hopeful that happens and I can still get them turned around to SW by end of this week (I also need some for NAMM show!).

 

So, we are basically "on schedule), but if not for this darn trucker strike and the Teamsters slow down I would have already sent these to SW by now.

 

Of course I will chime in here just as soon as I lay eyes on them.

[Aspen]

Interesting thing about the placement - i auditioned for a new group today in a nice dead sounding room, nobody too loud despite the big kit, marshall stacks etc.

 

I set up the ss with the side speaker facing the guitarist about 7 feet away and after a couple tunes (switched to wurli patch) he actually stopped the song and asked me to turn it down!

 

So i repositioned it behind me and all good.

 

But to my ears (receiving front speaker about the same distance away) it wasnt too loud at all. Makes me wonder if the side speaker is louder?

 

Same sort of thing happened to me, except it was the drummer complaining. The side-firing speaker is certainly loud, and it sends a L-R difference signal (the opposite of the L+R out front), so it sounds relatively unpleasant by itself. You wouldn't want to hear it solo.

 

I learned to watch where the side speaker was pointing, or simply rotate the unit 90 degrees so the side speaker is pointing up.

 

Just my 2 cents on this side speaker positioning discussion.

 

As promised I have now tried it on it's side and even upside down. While It is interesting, certainly different, and does not "ruin" the stereo image I do not think it sounds as good as just straight up like usual. However I understand that the other band member who may get "all side" will not like that, so I liked the suggestion of placing it at a slightly different angle (remember this has a 300 degree dispersion, so you will still hear it OK almost any way it points...and also remember the farther away you are the less that "positioning matters and the better it will "bloom" for you.

 

But if are options are limited and you are in close quarters, I would then recommend placing a small object just in front of the offending side speaker to block and/or redirect it forward, like a briefcase or a guitar case...which would also offer more frontal projection for you and the audience.

 

At trade shows, when I got similar complaints from exhibitors to my immediate Left and Right, I fashioned a small hinged double sided "V"shaped plexi panel that I set just behind the speaker and projected the Side energy forward. I really liked what it did for the sound.

 

So much so that I have envisioned "wings that could be hinged to fill the side area on either side. These "wins" would collapse for storage into the box for travel, but then could be opened up for the gig...again looking like a small horn flare.

 

But in practice, and if space allows, just moving the SS v.3 a bit farther back from you, and so moving the side speaker out of a direct line to the drummer or guitar player's ear, works as well...and maybe better.

[J. Dan]

While everything said makes perfect sense, in reality, keyboard players get stuffed in extremely tight spots. That's reality.

[drawback]

My reality most of the time is the guitar players have plexi v baffles in front of their amps, and the drummer is in a plexi cage, and anything I use other than in-ears for stage monitoring of the keys has to be similarly isolated or pointed at me as sidefill. In either case I can't see a V.3 working out, much as I wish otherwise.

[Daddyg3042]

Well DaddyG, the union slow down that caused this backlog is still the problem. As of Friday our container wass till on the boat and no berth yet assigned.

 

However today I got a bit of good news, the boat was docked and the container was off loaded...but now waiting for a p/u to the warehouse where it gets cleared by customs.

 

My agent is getting tired of me calling him daily but I am sure he is pushing as hard as he can. So as of today his best estimate is a few more days to get them cleared and delivered to me. So I am hopeful that happens and I can still get them turned around to SW by end of this week (I also need some for NAMM show!).

 

So, we are basically "on schedule), but if not for this darn trucker strike and the Teamsters slow down I would have already sent these to SW by now.

 

Of course I will chime in here just as soon as I lay eyes on them.

 

Thanks for the update, Aspen. Hope to hear you chime in soon.

[endlessummerkeys]

Aspen, I just wanted to comment on how much this thread and method of getting your positive product details out to the public has been successful. I ordered mine around middle of December and the only information that I had was the testimonials on the SW website, and then followed the links to your centerpointstereo web site and found this forum. That is how I established my decision to purchase this item and it was a great way and maybe the only way to get a product out that is somewhat of a disruptive technology. I liken it to the days of when the CD was taking over the cassette tape industry. Good job on the marketing technique!!

 

[Raymb1]

Hi Aspen. Does the Width Control change the volume of the side speaker? Ray

[Aspen]

Aspen, I just wanted to comment on how much this thread and method of getting your positive product details out to the public has been successful. I ordered mine around middle of December and the only information that I had was the testimonials on the SW website, and then followed the links to your centerpointstereo web site and found this forum. That is how I established my decision to purchase this item and it was a great way and maybe the only way to get a product out that is somewhat of a disruptive technology. I liken it to the days of when the CD was taking over the cassette tape industry. Good job on the marketing technique!!

Thanks ESK, I'll take that as a complement for certain. I love your term "disruptive technology", Les Paul and Dick Rosmini (my mentors) would have laughed out loud! If we do half as well, and last half as long, as the CD I'll be very happy.

 

But my "Spartan" grass roots marketing technique is more born out of both a frustration with the usual frontal assault with an expensive advertising and promotional campaign where the heavy cost is passed along to the end user, and from the reality that any new (disruptive) technology like mine will never catch on overnight. So I had to be patient, God knows I had to be patient! There are a lot of dead pioneers out there on the audio trail,while there are a lot of Elvis impersonators that make a very good living.

 

But when you are selling color TV, for much less than folks have been paying for Black & White...I believe you can "go direct", as I have done with ONE great retail partner (Sweetwater) and ONE great forum (Keyboard Corner), and we have made a small dent in "the market". It's like that line from the movie Field of Dreams; build it and they will come. I did, and they are.

 

But CPS is certainly not an "overnight sensation". Our first 3 CPS systems came out back in 2,000 when I licensed our patent to Fender. They made an acoustic guitar amp that did VERY well (42% market share, TEC nomination and other awards, etc.), a KB amp that flopped (covered in Black carpet, 3 highly EQ'd channels w/ built-in FX, and a Pizeo for the high end), an even bigger flop in the Satellite (Side Only). Then I made great sounding GT systems that nobody could afford (except Ray Manzarek and Ted Nugent)..and later a rushed to market for Christmas Guitar Center Spacestation that was just not finished and priced too low to be any good.

 

If I learned anything from that, it was you just can't rush the future, and that no matter how good the stereo everywhere "gag" worked...this is still the MUSIC business and you had better make great sounding music!

 

This time around I followed the KISS principle; Keep It Simple Stupid. And avoided "feature fluff", that nobody needed. Today's keyboards (and modeled guitar systems) do not NEED any EQ (or they have it built in), and they do not NEED cheesy FX (again, built in). They just need The One Thing; accurate sound and a stereo transmission that covers the whole room.

 

So for v.3, my THIRD bite at the apple, I focused my time and money on sounding great; spending more on the components, and taking more time perfecting the design.

 

Frankly spoken, I don't think I have ever brought as much to the party in a new product, while spending LESS spent less on "marketing", yet had MORE fun than I am having now.

 

But as you so correctly point out; I could never have done it without this unique and relatively recent ability to reach the performing community like I can do here. This forum is a godsend for me, and other small inventors. I am grateful for that opportunity, amazed at the high level of experience and discourse, and humbled by the overwhelming response from my "early adopters" who have supported me an encouraged me. It has been a dream come true.

 

But really ESK, I can't take credit fit it, I did not CREATE this "marketing technique"; the folks on this forum did, and THEY deserve all the credit! I had always thrived on word of mouth, but today forums like this amplify that word as never before.

 

And, if CPS didn't deliver the goods, and do the ONE THING no other KB amp can, then all the advertising money and salesmen spiffs in the world could not have sustained me, and this 36 page thread would have been dead on page 1 after the first brutally honest review.

 

My only regret is that I have not been up to the task of delivering more systems in a timely fashion. But I believe that is about to change. I have tripled my Q1 2015 production over my Q4 2014 deliveries, and can/will double that again in Q2 2015 if required. So from the mid February delivery on I believe the wait time will be days, not months.

[Aspen]

Hi Aspen. Does the Width Control change the volume of the side speaker? Ray

 

Yes, that is exactly what it does Ray. Use the Width control to balance the Side speaker level (L-R, the unique and "widest" parts of the stereo signals) with the Front speaker (L+R, or the mono compatible parts of the stereo signals).

 

(NOTE: but if "Level" is set at "0", then you will also hear "0" from the Width control)

 

So the Width level sets the "balance" b/w Front and Side systems.

 

I recommend starting off with the Width at "0", then set the Level (Front speaker only now) to the volume you may want to play at. Then bring up the Width level until the stereo image is "just right", or to the point where is sounds natural (like it might sound thru stereo headphones). I recommend doing this at a distance if possible, and not necessary directly in front of of the SS. Walk around, you will be amazed how consistent the stereo image remains. The farther away you stand, the better you can judge the stereo image, and your level. As many have reported here, when you are "wide", you do not need to be as "loud" as you have in past.

 

 

Usually, the Side Level will sound best around 12 o'clock...at least that where we dialed it in here. So if in a hurry, just set the Width "straight up", and season to taste from there.

 

However that "sweet spot" balance can change depending on the environment, just depending on how "live" your room acoustics are. Use more Width for a "dead" room (full of people who absorb sound) or for outdoor gigs that have no reflection points, and usually less Width required for a "Live" room.

 

[Aspen]

My reality most of the time is the guitar players have plexi v baffles in front of their amps, and the drummer is in a plexi cage, and anything I use other than in-ears for stage monitoring of the keys has to be similarly isolated or pointed at me as sidefill. In either case I can't see a V.3 working out, much as I wish otherwise.

 

I guess if you are already in a "no amps on stage" all ear monitor gig now, like many churches today, then you could be right.

 

However, if there is a guitar amp and a live drummer on stage now, you may change your mind once you give it a try.

 

Many here who have used the SS v.3 have already observed that they do not NEED to play as loud, because they are so "wide".

 

CPS had a very a gentle non-agressive dispersion that is ultra low on distortion...and very transpartent.

 

I know this may sound crazy (until you hear it), but I can be standing 20 feet away off axis from a v.3 pumping out 95dB+ and whisper to the person next to me and be clearly understood. You can have normal voice level conversation when it's 100+dB...it's perhaps the most unusual thing about the CPS technology. Every time I demo this phenomenon to somebody they can't believe their ears...so I usually save it for last.

 

So you just have to try it...I think you will be pleasantly surprised.

[Theo Verelst]

.... I tried putting it right on the floor leaning up against the back wall.

...

 

You know that gives you a mostly unnaturally emphasized mid-low "bass" sound, right ? I mean lots of guitar amps aren't neutral, low in distortion or full range AT ALL, that's a given from the past. But aside from being able to create a sound field that's pleasing (like anything from a Bose L's to a Leslie Box), which of course is a fine art, I think it's interesting to note that putting the sound you create on a decent, passable stereo producing (moderately big) PA system has become part of the (electronic) musical stage game since the 80s. Something to think about is that apparently people search for a way to use synth sounds that have a stereo image that doesn't work well that standard way, and come up more with the idea of low distortion.

 

T.

[DanL]

Theo, it works with this speaker. You'd have to hear it.

[endlessummerkeys]

great post Aspen and keep up the great work there are a lot of very talented people on this post that have hundreds of combined years of performing and they are all on your side!!!

[Dave Bryce]

.... I tried putting it right on the floor leaning up against the back wall.

...

 

You know that gives you a mostly unnaturally emphasized mid-low "bass" sound, right ?

I know that conventional knowledge would indicate that would be the case where a conventional speaker is involved, yes.

 

I did it because the designer recommended it to me, and told me this was the most likely way to get optimal performance out of his product...which does not function like a conventional speaker....

 

...and he was right. The moment I set the amp up that way, the sound improved dramatically - not just for me, but for the other musicians in the band as well.

 

Math isn't always the end-all answer. Bumblebees are a great example - engineers will tell you they can't fly, because their bodies are too big and their wings are too small. The bee doesn't know this, though...

 

Also, the amp does have tone sculpting controls, and I do seem have a relatively decent set of ears...

 

dB

[Jazzmammal]

Theo, you really can't jump in on a 36 page thread with a comment like this. Your point has been discussed and explained in detail already. The SS is NOT a standard amp. I know you're an educated guy so you should go back to where Aspen started posting (around page 15 or so) and read from there. You need to understand the acoustic principles that CPS is based on and with your background it should become clear to you.

 

Bob

[ITGITC]

 

Math isn't always the end-all answer. Bumblebees are a great example - engineers will tell you they can't fly, because their bodies are too big and their wings are too small. The bee doesn't know this, though...

 

THAT is the quote of the day!

 

 

[cphollis]

Ditto. Due to the SSv3's unique design, much of what I thought I knew about speaker design, placement, etc. had to be re-thought. Keep an open mind.

 

And bumblebees do fly.

[16251]

Math isn't always the end-all answer. Bumblebees are a great example - engineers will tell you they can't fly, because their bodies are too big and their wings are too small. The bee doesn't know this, though...

 

THAT is the quote of the day!

 

Just watch BEE Movie (Seinfeld,) for that and more

[AndyW]

Ditto. Due to the SSv3's unique design, much of what I thought I knew about speaker design, placement, etc. had to be re-thought. Keep an open mind.

 

Ditto of ditto.