Roland RD-08

[AUSSIEKEYS]

8 minutes ago, DeltaJockey said:

 

The RD08/88 dimensions are very slim laterally, but the Rolands compromise are its vertical height. But I suppose you have to put the folded action weighting somewhere.

 

 

 

Yes i think all hammer type action will be deep as per my old casio and this. I think the modern casio is slim top but still thickish underneath.

 

i liked a Roland action on one of their budget pianos a few years ago. I find them crisp in a good way. So i understand the depth.

 

Looks like Niacin has found some of its differences that make the RD88 better for live gigging and a better buy at aussie prices

 

Are they going to delete the RD88 for this. But if so why?

[AUSSIEKEYS]

16 minutes ago, ElmerJFudd said:

 If you want the RD-08 to do what it was designed to do (capabilities are there but turned off) owners have to make an account and a first purchase

 

Isnt this a Tesla way of upgrading or adding functionabilty?

 

Would you like to buy the simulated disk brake option. Or the simulated power steering option? Its in the "cloud"

 

Note: im not having a go at Tesla just getting a handle on the marketing used here

[D. Gauss]

7 minutes ago, AUSSIEKEYS said:

 

Isnt this a Tesla way of upgrading or adding functionabilty?

 

 

 

I thought the Tesla way was catching on fire and/or running somebody over whilst in autosteer.   

[Mike Kent]

It's the software model.

You can buy the budget option of the software or the full-featured option.

Or buy the budget option and upgrade later.

Or buy the sampler and it comes with some library. Buy other libraries as add-ons.

 

It feels uncomfortable to me because it's in hardware. But maybe it shouldn't?

 

Mike.

[AnotherScott]

$1300 vs $1000 in the U.S. Though if you're using it mostly as a controller for an tablet/laptopm (perhaps even something running Roland Cloud), you can also get the FP10 for $600 (same action, and a bit lighter at 27.1 lbs). or the FP30x (which adds audio over USB to get your external sound back into the board's speakers and line outs, and it's got better speakers, but you're up to 32.7 lbs).

 

Yeah, a 73 would have been nice, especially since Roland has nothing as light as the lighter hammer action boards from the competitors.

[D. Gauss]

Overheard in Roland boardroom product planning meeting:

 

"Hey, you know that RD-88 keyboard we have that's almost great, but has a totally terrible, clumsy, cumbersome and shitty interface? Let's release a new model."

 

"Cool, shall we upgrade it with a new, simpler, intuitive, non menu interface like those new Yamahas that folks seem to like?"

 

"Hell no!  Let's dumb ours down and make people pay extra money just to get back some of the features we already have."

 

"Yes sir, I'll get on right on it!"

 

[DeltaJockey]

Listening to that last Kraft video, there was nothing much he described that was any different to the RD88, though he did seem impressed with the fact that it had a lesser number of controllers than on the RD88 , and was very excited about the "new" features already provided on the RD88. except he never mentioned that you have to enable features by paying more. He omitted the fact that all of the 3000 onboard sounds were not immediately accessible?

 

The more I listen to this marketing, the more I think omission to detail is a key part of the sell. As an existing RD88 owner, despite the advertising, I'm still confused about where it all sits in practice from a users point of view.

[Fleer]

I’ve always thought the RD-88 had too much to offer for its price. A good action, all those great Roland sounds (3000+), good speakers, MainStage compatibility and a USB audio interface in a full blown controller keyboard with 88 keys. 
So I guess that’s why they introduce the RD-08 at a similar price point. And probably will discontinue the RD-88 when they launch the RD-880 to replace the RD-2000. 

[niacin]

43 minutes ago, Fleer said:

I’ve always thought the RD-88 had too much to offer for its price. A good action, all those great Roland sounds (3000+), good speakers, MainStage compatibility and a USB audio interface in a full blown controller keyboard with 88 keys. 
So I guess that’s why they introduce the RD-08 at a similar price point. And probably will discontinue the RD-88 when they launch the RD-880 to replace the RD-2000. 

maybe it’s like groceries and inflation, some have increased in price while others have kept the price point but shrunk the item by 20%, the latter being pretty much what’s happened with the RD-88 being replaced by the RD-08.

[Ibarch]

8 hours ago, MarkusB47 said:

For me, as someone that loves Roland keybed PH04 and 05 feel but uses iPad instead of a Macbook with Mainstage for sounds in live performance, this adds class compliant usb. That is what really sets it appart from both the RD2000 and RD88 (which are not class compliant) for me. 

 

The Roland website states USB Midi class compliance, ie exactly like the RD-88 with no audio class compliance. Unless anyone has the actual board and can prove to you otherwise, I think you will be disappointed. 

 

Every bit of information so far suggests it is merely a crippled RD-88, there isn't a single upgraded feature bar maybe one new Supernatural piano in the extra cost pack. 

 

 

 

[niacin]

38 minutes ago, Ibarch said:

The Roland website states USB Midi class compliance, ie exactly like the RD-88 with no audio class compliance.

 

Audio over usb is one of the things in the upgrade purchased through the Cloud, whether it’s class compliant and will work with a iPad isn’t stated:

 

“The RD-08 Upgrade adds USB audio interface capabilities for working with music production software on computers. Communicate with MainStage on a laptop while performing. And use the RD-08 as both a MIDI controller and a high-quality audio sound source for your favorite DAW.”

 

Other things mentioned are:

 

SuperNATURAL Acoustic Piano 3

 

Apple MainStage integration

 

Support for Wave Expansions on Roland Cloud

 

https://www.roland.com/us/products/rc_rd-08_upgrade/

[Ibarch]

9 minutes ago, niacin said:

 

Audio over usb is one of the things in the upgrade purchased through the Cloud, whether it’s class compliant and will work with a iPad isn’t stated.  Other things mentioned are:

 

SuperNATURAL Acoustic Piano 3

 

Apple MainStage integration

 

Support for Wave Expansions on Roland Cloud

 

https://www.roland.com/us/products/rc_rd-08_upgrade/

 

It adds a USB audio interface. That is not the same thing as audio class compliance. It is just unlocking the USB port on the back. There is no mention of audio over class compliant drivers.

 

If this is someone's main reason to buy, I would expect the worst till proven otherwise. 

[Paul Woodward]

A little more transparency about the cost of the upgrade would help. It could be minimal, but you need to download the cloud manager, then the upgrade just to see what it costs to activate it. At that point, they are 50% of the way to getting you into their cloud based system. Anyone seen the cost of this?

I still feel it’s hobbled, imagine the aircon in a new car being disconnected, but the mechanic will ‘switch it on’ for a price…

[DeltaJockey]

3 hours ago, niacin said:

maybe it’s like groceries and inflation, some have increased in price while others have kept the price point but shrunk the item by 20%, the latter being pretty much what’s happened with the RD-88 being replaced by the RD-08.

The thought also crossed my mind. Shrinkflation may have hit Roland now too. It will be interesting to see if future shipments of RD88's are more expensive than presently.

This would shift the mindset to a point where the RD08 appears a more cost effective offering.

[ElmerJFudd]

7 hours ago, AnotherScott said:

$1300 vs $1000 in the U.S. Though if you're using it mostly as a controller for an tablet/laptopm (perhaps even something running Roland Cloud), you can also get the FP10 for $600 (same action, and a bit lighter at 27.1 lbs). or the FP30x (which adds audio over USB to get your external sound back into the board's speakers and line outs, and it's got better speakers, but you're up to 32.7 lbs).

 

Yeah, a 73 would have been nice, especially since Roland has nothing as light as the lighter hammer action boards from the competitors.

Notice how careful Roland was to make class compliant USB, a functional audio interface and the MainStage implementation part of the upgrade.  RD-08 is for Roland Cloud - you’ll have to at least make an account, provide a payment method and pay for the upgrade or buy a lifetime key.  This is only cheaper than the RD88 standalone, as is. 

[Paul Woodward]

If this type of board was something I was interested in I would struggle to invest in the 08 when the 88 can be had at this sort of price with extras…I expect the ‘upgraded’ RD08 will be near to RD88 prices anyway.

[ElmerJFudd]

3 minutes ago, Paul Woodward said:

If this type of board was something I was interested in I would struggle to invest in the 08 when the 88 can be had at this sort of price with extras…I expect the ‘upgraded’ RD08 will be near to RD88 prices anyway.

 

My thoughts exactly.  I guess it depends on how many 2nd hand or B-Stock RD88s are floating around and at what point Roland discontinues the RD88.  

[ProfD]

The RD88 was on sale for $999 a couple months ago.

 

Maybe that was a Roland effort to clear out inventory and make way for the brand new Wegovy model with a Botox shot in the face.😁😎

[Ibarch]

Roland originally sold the RD-88 at a lower price point. It was great value at the £799 mark when I bought mine. This was subsequently increased by 25%.

 

Maybe the reason for the RD-08 is that the RD-88 price move has backfired and they have not sold as expected. So they are adding a budget RD piano back to the range. This is to capture the sales where the new RD-88 price is a deal breaker. Also, if there is a lower budget model, sales psychology says that the mid range varient becomes more desirable. 

 

I can't see many other reasons for selling  essentially the same keyboard for less. I doubt that removing a few dials and moulding a new plastic shell is saving more than a few dollars in manufacturing costs. 

 

[nadroj]

Locking features behind a paywall is absolute BS imo, and is a scary prospect for the future of instruments. What’s next? Paying extra for MIDI, layers, splits? 
 

In one sense I can see it eventually working this way: buy a Nord Electro 9, pay £500 to turn it into a Nord Stage 6!
 

But the cynic in me sees this being being more likely: buy the workstation for full price at £4000, then spend another £1000 to unlock everything. You’re tricked into thinking you’re spending the same when you’re actually spending more. 

In either case I don’t like it. It’s a sad state of affairs. Cars, TVs, printers, even home appliances are going the same way - hardware locked behind subscriptions and fees, that are bricked if you stop paying.

 

Prioritising shareholders over consumers is a one way ticket to administration. 
 

Sorry for the off topic rant. 

[Paul Woodward]

1 hour ago, nadroj said:

What’s next? Paying extra for MIDI, layers, splits? 

Ahem, cough, Korg Keystage.....

Admittedly there is nothing about 'paying' for these sort of features, but they are not there on a board claiming to be 'the ultimate master keyboard you've always desired to control your live rig'....I wonder if they will be added later, but its becoming like the gaming industry where we are essentially paying to be beta testers while the developer/manufacturer decide what to fix or add later.

[ProfD]

44 minutes ago, Paul Woodward said:

...but its becoming like the gaming industry where we are essentially paying to be beta testers while the developer/manufacturer decide what to fix or add later.

This has been ongoing ever since the rehashing of hardware in newer models and the inception of firmware updates.😉😎

[The Piano Man]

15 hours ago, D. Gauss said:

Overheard in Roland boardroom product planning meeting:

 

"Hey, you know that RD-88 keyboard we have that's almost great, but has a totally terrible, clumsy, cumbersome and shitty interface? Let's release a new model."

 

"Cool, shall we upgrade it with a new, simpler, intuitive, non menu interface like those new Yamahas that folks seem to like?"

 

"Hell no!  Let's dumb ours down and make people pay extra money just to get back some of the features we already have."

 

"Yes sir, I'll get on right on it!"

 

Exactly. Shambolic

[The Piano Man]

Next up the Roland RD008

A further £100 cheaper 

 

Now including 8 top sounds from our popular vintage RD100 model.

 

But also including the D Beam!!!

 

(line outs not included)

[ElmerJFudd]

11 minutes ago, The Piano Man said:

Next up the Roland RD008

A further £100 cheaper 

 

Now including 8 top sounds from our popular vintage RD100 model.

 

But also including the D Beam!!!

 

(line outs not included)

The line outs are of course there -  but they turned them off in the firmware. $19.99 a month subscription to turn them on.  You have to connect your RD double O eight to the cloud to confirm your subscription is active once a month.  

[nadroj]

33 minutes ago, The Piano Man said:

Next up the Roland RD008

A further £100 cheaper 

 

Now including 8 top sounds from our popular vintage RD100 model.

 

But also including the D Beam!!!

 

(line outs not included)

*D-beam available for an extra £999. 

[DeltaJockey]

Interestingly, my Montage M is financially modelled the other way. Pay a premium for the hardware, all functionality is available and additionally get the ESP vst for free.

 

I have to wonder whether Roland are putting their toe in the water with the RD08 to see what they can get away with for future financial models. Maybe the RD08 will sink, and they decide to then go another route.

[ElmerJFudd]

14 minutes ago, DeltaJockey said:

Interestingly, my Montage M is financially modelled the other way. Pay a premium for the hardware, all functionality is available and additionally get the ESP vst for free.

 

I have to wonder whether Roland are putting their toe in the water with the RD08 to see what they can get away with for future financial models. Maybe the RD08 will sink, and they decide to then go another route.

We’ve covered this before.  Nothing in this world is free.  😉

 

But yes, M owners put the money out up front and get an instrument as described with the flexibility of it mirrored in software for desktop OSes.  An added value and differentiation from their competitors.  
 

RD-08 owners get a crippled instrument for less if the standalone functionality does the job.  But they’ve been bated to get functional hardware that’s already there and to cross over to the dark side of cloud subscriptions… for a few dollars more.  
 

[DeltaJockey]

8 minutes ago, ElmerJFudd said:

But they’ve been bated to get functional hardware that’s already there and to cross over to the dark side of cloud subscriptions… for a few dollars more.  

Yes, we've discussed this over many times,

 

This type of behaviour triggers me into disliking a product even if it is a good one. One thing I can't stand is deception and trickery to coerce you into buying something you wouldn't be considering. Or, if it is something worthy of consideration, for me, this tactic destroys further interest.

 

Why do marketing dudes think we are as gullible as they are in believing trickery will sell the product like hot cakes? Why isn't it common knowledge that honest up front marketing will, in the long run give them a good reputation, holding them in good stead for future sales.

[Thethirdapple]

3 hours ago, ElmerJFudd said:

… for a few dollars more.  
 

Finally, ultra hi definition celluloid film grain!!!

Too bad they didn't use AI to make it even better…

 

You will own nothing and be more happy.

 

anybody remember how lambasted the maudio Venom got back in the day, for essentially being a hardware dongle for a soft synth subscription!?!?

 

he who laughs last…

 

As long as MPN doesn't start charging per word, Im ok…

 

 

PEACE

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