Yamaha CK61 and CK88

[AnotherScott]

7 minutes ago, Sam Mullins said:

Great...congrats.  Can you do me a favor and measure the octave width to see if Yamaha is still 3/16" narrower than most other manufacturers?

Kind of like asking if the sky is still blue...

[Sam Mullins]

4 minutes ago, AnotherScott said:

Kind of like asking if the sky is still blue...

Yeah I know...just thought maybe this FSB keybed would be different.  A man can dream, can't he 😄

 

I'm looking at the CK88 anyway, but was curious.

[EscapeRocks]

I'm going to try and find some time to go check out the CK88 tomorrow.  A few GC's in the area got there's in stock now.

[ElmerJFudd]

55 minutes ago, EscapeRocks said:

I'm going to try and find some time to go check out the CK88 tomorrow.  A few GC's in the area got there's in stock now.

Good luck!  There’s two GCs short distance from me.  Neither has been ordering anything interesting to try out for a few seasons now. Unless you’re hot for a Williams or an Akai MPC Key.  

[AnotherScott]

The GC near me admitted that they are unlikely to get the CKs. They have a small keyboard department that only stocks/displays lower end stuff, except for the odd higher end piece which he told me only show up on the floor because they are returns or trade-ins.  At least he was honest about their offerings (he said I might have better luck at one of the bigger GC locations i.e. in Manhattan or one of the bigger NJ locations). The funny/sad thing is that nearly half the gear that actually was on display there wasn't even plugged in. 

[LarsHarner2]

Mine is arriving today as well. I hope to open it up and write a review today. @AnotherScott I find that I have often only seen certain keyboards on my trips to NYC as opposed to the stores in South Jersey- a far change from 30 years ago where there were several independent chains and one could try out anything. Seems like my last few keyboards I have purchased without trying out.

[pjd]

I've given up on GC anywhere in the Seattle area. Had a run-in with a tin guitar god clerk and decided that's it. Why look at empty space and be insulted at the same time?

 

If you're in the Seattle area, I suggest Patchwerks: http://sandsoftwaresound.net/synthesizer-heaven/

 

I could live there (if they'd let me) and have food brought in -- pj  🙂

 

[Docbop]

15 minutes ago, pjd said:

I've given up on GC anywhere in the Seattle area. Had a run-in with a tin guitar god clerk and decided that's it. Why look at empty space and be insulted at the same time?

 

If you're in the Seattle area, I suggest Patchwerks: http://sandsoftwaresound.net/synthesizer-heaven/

 

I could live there (if they'd let me) and have food brought in -- pj  🙂

 

 

When I lived in Boston they'd say don't like the weather just wait ten minutes.   Well GC these days you can say... Don't like a salesperson wait ten minutes the revolving door will bring another in you might like. 

[LarsHarner2]

I went into a GC in NYC to try and look at a Roland Fantom 06-nothing was plugged in their keyboard department. I was asked "are you thinking of picking one up today"

I said "Umm its hard to tell when you don't have power cords". (They didn't know if they got all the parts with the keyboards

Then I was asked all these job interview questions like "wha tother boards do you have ?" It was really annoying.

 

My CK61 just arrived I am going to unbox after dinner. 

[ewall08530]

On 4/7/2023 at 2:09 PM, Sam Mullins said:

Great...congrats.  Can you do me a favor and measure the octave width to see if Yamaha is still 3/16" narrower than most other manufacturers?

My CK61 was delivered today    Octave separation is 6 1/4”

Verses 6 7/16” on my Kawai ES 520.
. So yes, the keys are slightly narrower.  

[ClassicKeys]

My CK61 was supposed to be delivered today, but the FedEx driver skipped my apartment. I talked to three people at FedEx and they called the driver but he never came back today. So it will likely come on Monday, with Easter being tomorrow. I was and am pretty bummed. I also currently have Covid and am kinda exhausted, so I should probably just relax and take it easy.

[ElmerJFudd]

1 minute ago, ClassicKeys said:

My CK61 was supposed to be delivered today, but the FedEx driver skipped my apartment. I talked to three people at FedEx and they called the driver but he never came back today. So it will likely come on Monday, with Easter being tomorrow. I was and am pretty bummed. I also currently have Covid and am kinda exhausted, so I should probably just relax and take it easy.

Feel better, brother. Disappointing I know. But you have the right idea.  Rest up, Monday comes around soon enough.  

[ElmerJFudd]

22 minutes ago, ewall08530 said:

My CK61 was delivered today    Octave separation is 6 1/4”

Verses 6 7/16” on my Kawai ES 520.
. So yes, the keys are slightly narrower.  

I played the SX900 today.  That’s the $2k arranger.  I think it shares the action with the CK.   This is definitely a lighter feeling semiweight synth action.  A bit springy, but preferable to FA06 or MODX6+ actions.  Do you feel the same?  

[Sam Mullins]

29 minutes ago, ewall08530 said:

My CK61 was delivered today    Octave separation is 6 1/4”

Verses 6 7/16” on my Kawai ES 520.
. So yes, the keys are slightly narrower.  

Thank you!  As I said in another thread it seemed to bother me when i was playing one hand on another conventional keyboard and one on Yamaha.  Might be in my head but that counts too. 😀

[LarsHarner2]

I unpacked it and played the 61 a bit. My first impressions were I could have used something like this (in a good way) onwards from 30 years ago to now as a travel/songwriting group board. I found the action decent for a 12 pound or so board; of course not as heavy as my original Motif 6 or Nautilus, - better than my Korg Krome I traded in.

I really didn't go through the list of 363 presets or so- I am wondering as I haven't dug into it if there are specific Hammond presets vs. moving the drawbars.

 

It has a 3 band eq and you cant edit up to 3 parts of volume in the event you are combining sounds together.

 

I don't believe it gets as loud as my Yamaha P125, due to 7 watts vs 6 and the fact the Yamaha P125 has a total of 4 speakers.

 

This board is going to be beneficial to me when I can take it somewhere, plug in batteries (getting 2x sets of recycables)  

 

As a side note, I could always use it out in conjunction with my Electrovoice Z90 (or whatever it is called).

 

EDIT: I found a master setting to increase audio output; thereby gave more volume on the board. i was pleased with that. 

[ewall08530]

I took delivery of a CK61 yesterday afternoon and played it around 3 hours. 

I purchased this keyboard to be a lighter/ cheaper version of my Nord Stage 3 Compact which I love on band gigs as my only keyboard.  However I want to play more piano parts on weighted keys and I don’t want to keep bringing my Stage 3 as the top board for bar gigs, etc. Also the CK would be a great option for “living room”: band rehearsals, which seem to be a thing for me now. 
 

So far I’ve spent most of the time playing organ sounds and getting familiar with the panel layout.  I’ll be using this as a top board over an 88key and 90% of the time playing organ. 
 

With the sound off the action is meh…but when triggering organ patches I felt a nice connection.  I have a Casio CT S-1 and I found this keybed is easier to play and more enjoyable. It feels like just the right amount of resistance (springs), at least for organ/synth. 
As noted in an earlier post the keys are a slightly narrower in width than standard so some folks may have trouble adjusting to that. So far I have not. 
 

The raw organ tones are ok up to a point.  I find that the more you pull out the top 3 drawbars the more harsh and less realistic it becomes. That can be tamed some by the Master EQ but I’m trying to keep from pulling them wide open. 
 

I prefer Rotary B which is the Leslie sim plus warm tube-like overdrive. I have never played the Reface Organ but the videos I’ve watched lead me to believe that Rotary A is the one in the Reface. It’s a little more like tremelo than moving rotors but with a little overdrive it’s usable and some might prefer it. 
 

The panel UI and layout is pretty intuitive and coming from my experience with Nord keyboards I like it. 
 

I’ll spend more time with it today and get a feel for the Piano/EP sounds.  
 

I may have to send this unit back.  The speakers don’t seem to be working.  I noticed it as soon as I turned it on.  Speaker switch was ON but still with nothing plugged into the outputs or headphone jack, no sound.  Headphone jack and outputs work fine. 
I emailed Sweetwater this morning.   

[AnotherScott]

1 hour ago, ewall08530 said:

I have a Casio CT S-1 and I found this keybed is easier to play and more enjoyable. It feels like just the right amount of resistance (springs), at least for organ/synth. 

...

I’ll spend more time with it today and get a feel for the Piano/EP sounds.

I'll be curious to hear how you'd compare the two actions for how they feel for playing piano.

 

1 hour ago, ewall08530 said:

I prefer Rotary B witch is the Leslie sim plus warm tube-like overdrive. I have never played the Reface Organ but the videos I’ve watched lead me to believe that Rotary A is the one in the Reface. It’s a little more like tremelo than moving rotors but with a little overdrive it’s usable and some might prefer it. 

With it being Reface based, I would almost expect Rotary A to be the Reface rotary. But I wonder what the source of Rotary B is.  Maybe one of the three Rotary effects of the YC (I don't think any of those were the Reface one)? Or maybe something else, unique to the CK...?

[ewall08530]

1 hour ago, AnotherScott said:

I'll be curious to hear how you'd compare the two actions for how they feel for playing piano.

 

With it being Reface based, I would almost expect Rotary A to be the Reface rotary. But I wonder what the source of Rotary B is.  Maybe one of the three Rotary effects of the YC (I don't think any of those were the Reface one)? Or maybe something else, unique to the CK...?

Comparing the actions, the CK61 feels as if once I press and get past a certain point it gets easier to the bottom whereas on the CT S-1 I feel the spring tension all the way down.  At least that’s the way my brain perceives it.  Neither is a walk in the park for playing piano parts however the little bit of Wurly and Rhodes that I messed with yesterday on the Yamaha felt pretty nice and actually fun. 

[AnotherScott]

 

2 hours ago, ewall08530 said:

the CK61 feels as if once I press and get past a certain point it gets easier to the bottom

That describes the YC61 as well, as I mentioned elsewhere. But you also said

 

5 hours ago, ewall08530 said:

when triggering organ patches I felt a nice connection

which makes me think about comparing how the YC61 and CK61 feel when playing organ. I'm guessing that, like the YC61, the CK61 doesn't have a high trigger point, but I also wonder about whether it has the low release point of the YC (which, to me, is a negative).

 

If you layer a drawbar organ sound with, say, a string sound (or poly synth, or any other "held" sound), do the two sounds trigger on the way down and release on the way up at the same points? Or is there any difference between the "on" and "off" points of the two sounds when played together?

[EscapeRocks]

On 4/7/2023 at 5:37 PM, ElmerJFudd said:

Good luck!  There’s two GCs short distance from me.  Neither has been ordering anything interesting to try out for a few seasons now. Unless you’re hot for a Williams or an Akai MPC Key.  

I'm headed over to my main GC where the keys department is actually good, and my guy, who is a keys guy, has been working for 10 years.

 

Side note: my local GC has a great department for keys and other pro-audio.   You can audition pretty much everything from a Williams to a Nord.

And everything's plugged in.

[Sam Mullins]

I pulled the trigger on a CK88.   Decided it was cheaper for me to just order online (and return if necessary) than drive to Chicago.    Hopefully here by Thursday.  

[ClassicKeys]

My CK61 arrived today, and it's great. I've tried to connect it to my Yamaha P-125, but it hasn't worked. Does anyone have any advice? I tried plugging in from the MIDI ports in the CK, then used an adapter to plug into the USB-B port in the Yamaha P-125. I selected the appropriate settings on the CK, but then the P-125 wasn't controlling the part that the CK said it was. I think the adapter I was using wasn't working, so I ordered a couple new adapters off of Amazon.

[AnotherScott]

12 minutes ago, ClassicKeys said:

I think the adapter I was using wasn't working, so I ordered a couple new adapters off of Amazon.

Be sure you're using a USB host adapter, i.e. the kind that allows you to connect a USB slave/peripheral/client device to a 5-pin DIN MIDI device. (As opposed to the kind of adapter that lets you connect a 5-pin DIN MIDI device to a USB host like a computer.) For example,  the one at https://amzn.to/41eIIlD

 

 

[ewall08530]

   I called Sweetwater this morning and after talking to someone in the Tech Dept we determined the unit has a faulty speaker. This afternoon as I’m packing up the keyboard to return it I get an email that the replacement has been shipped and is scheduled to arrive tomorrow.  Now that’s customer service, people! 

[Docbop]

23 minutes ago, ewall08530 said:

   I called Sweetwater this morning and after talking to someone in the Tech Dept we determined the unit has a faulty speaker. This afternoon as I’m packing up the keyboard to return it I get an email that the replacement has been shipped and is scheduled to arrive tomorrow.  Now that’s customer service, people! 

 

Sweetwater did the same for me when I bought my first good keyboard a RD-2000, a small knob was broken off.  I thought they would arrange for a repair, but they overnighted me another RD-2000 and arranged for me broken one to be picked up and returned to them.    Sweetwater is amazing. 

[LarsHarner2]

Great service by Sweetwater- MF did that for as well; it was really nice that they sent it before getting back the original and arranged for the pickup. 

[Sam Mullins]

I got my CK88 yesterday and have a few quick impressions.

 

- The keybed is not great but usable; closer to the better GHS actions I played recently (P125, P45) and not like the horrible MX88 I played.  A little sluggish for my taste.  My initial reaction was pretty negative but after playing it for 30 minutes, I adjusted. 

- The user interface is really well done.  This has not always been a Yamaha strength (I had several Motif era keyboards and was well versed in the menu diving....I know, it's a more complicated engine but even simple things were often arduous).  Doing splits and layers is straightforward.  The color coding of the parts with effect chains is brilliant. 

- The sounds are generally very good.  I was also considering the YC73 but I think for my purposes the greatly expanded sound palette here is the right choice.   Yamaha tends to do a good job on many of the sounds I use frequently.  I would love a better organ but I have B3-X to fall back to.

- A nice variety of effects that are easily accessible and assigned to parts.  Having three insert effects per part is great.

- The build is what you would expect in this price class.  Would I love to have something in the YC73/Stage build quality (steel chassis, internal power, etc.)?  Sure, but that's not gonna happen at this price and (more important to me) weight.  

- I hooked up to my iPad and everything worked immediately...no fuss.  

 

Overall, this is another example of "Gosh I would have been ecstatic to get this much when I was a kid."  Having said that, I haven't made a final decision on whether I'm keeping it.  It's part of a larger rig overhaul I am considering to reduce weight (Stage 3 88/Kronos -> CK88/Arturia Keylab/iPad) and there are issues outside the CK88 that need to be resolved. 

 

I will have more time this weekend and will update with any additional feedback.

 

 

[skipeb3]

I got my CK88 yesterday. So far I like it, but I've only messed around a little here at home. I'll take it to a gig this Saturday.

The action is a bit stiff, but not bad stiff. I know, that's totally subjective. And yeah, it is pretty intuitive when you start fiddling with things.

Not impressed with the organ. It's nice to have the controls, but the sound is meh. That's really ok, since I didn't buy it for the organ.

One thing, though... the power cable to the wall wart is the thinnest, cheapest POS cable I've seen. Don't have a good feeling about how it's going to stand up to the rigors of gigging. If I'm going to keep the board, a spare power supply is in my future.

[Sam Mullins]

26 minutes ago, skipeb3 said:

One thing, though... the power cable to the wall wart is the thinnest, cheapest POS cable I've seen. Don't have a good feeling about how it's going to stand up to the rigors of gigging. If I'm going to keep the board, a spare power supply is in my future.

Agreed. Back when I had my MOXF, I made sure to have two power supplies because it was just begging to fail (although it never did).  The good news is they aren't expensive.  

[LarsHarner2]

9 hours ago, Sam Mullins said:

I

 

Overall, this is another example of "Gosh I would have been ecstatic to get this much when I was a kid." 

 

 

This is my 100% opinion of my CK-61- and not in a bad way whatsoever. internal speakers, batteries, and 12 pounds. One of the most practical items I have purchased.

Something like this would have served me extremely well in the 90's, dragging around amps, cables etc.