Roland V-Combo VR-09

[Bossbandbob]

My VR-09 arrived late this afternoon. I had to get a practice session in tonight to be ready for band practice tomorrow so I did not have a lot of time to dive in or tweak anything. I used it as my top "organ" keyboard. First impressions after brief use: Nice looking, solidly built keyboard. VERY easy to figure out how to use even without the owners manual. I just used the Rock Organ tonight but adjusted drawbars. It sounded pretty decent to me. I liked the Twin Rotary effect the best so far. The OD was OK at lower levels not great over 1/4 up but in Stones and Petty tribute bands I don't need a lot of Major OD. IIRC my old VK-7 had a better OD than that. Also Disappointed I could not find a sitar patch which I need at times for both bands. My PX-5S has one but this could negate using the VR-09 alone for any "lack of space" gigs. On first impression, I think I like the EP's and AP's better on the Casio but I may be more used to them. I also use the damper/sustain pedal as the Leslie fast slow pedal which was easy to assign but is there any way to set it as a "momentary" pedal (on fast while pressed, on slow when released)?

[Craig MacDonald]

Hey BBB,

 

Glad the VR-09 worked out reasonably well for you, first time out with not much prep.. I think you'll get to really like it once you've had time to tweak the various sounds you use to your liking and stored them as registrations.

 

Regarding your questions, I don't know off hand if there is a sitar patch hidden somewhere but I'll double check later to day when I'm near my VR-09.. however, remember that you can create a lot of additional sounds using the virtual analog synth and it's 350+ wave forms!! You need the free ipad editor, to edit/create synth tones, but if you don't have an ipad, perhaps you can borrow one from a friend to get the one sound that you need?

 

There are at least three sitar waves included in the PCM waves..

 

225 E Sitar (I assume electric sitar)

226 Sitar Wave

227 Sitar Drone

 

I would expect that you could use these waves to create a sitar sound that works for you.. Assuming you have an ipad, you should go through all of the names of the PCM waves so you have an idea of what types of sounds are available.. there or other organ samples, including Jon Lord organ tones, and other EP's and Wurly's, and all kinds of waves.. I would recommend that everyone who owns a VR-09 have a look at this list.. you can always use the VA synth to create sounds that aren't built into the VR.

 

As far as the momentary vs latch setting on the sustain pedal when playing organ.. off hand I don't think this is possible, but I will double check when I get to my VR..

 

Edit: As far as the Overdrive goes.. I absolutely agree. beyond 9:00 it's practically useless.. I would love to see Roland update this and provide more granularity and subtlety, and give us an overdrive that is warmer and more realistic.. That said the VR-09 is a compromise in a few areas and obviously this is one of them. BTW quite a number of Roland Drawbar organ users have said that they prefer the VK7/8 overdrive, so you're not alone.

[Bossbandbob]

Thanks Craig,

I do have an IPad and will definitely look into your suggestions!

Bob

[To B3]

So, I asked some time ago and at the time only Craig had experimented this... As now we have some more VR09 owners here, I want to ask again:

 

anyone here uses the EXT input of the VR09 to feed another keyboard? If so, how do you use and how do you like it? Does it work well, is it trust worth? Any phase cancelling or sound loss?

 

I'd like to use that solution to use both my NE2 and the VR09 together without a submixer, with the NE2 plugged in mono into the VR09. And only the 1/4 mono cable going from the VR09 to the FOH or amp.

 

Anyone had a similar experience or gigs with something like that?

[xKnuckles]

Hi To B3. As far as I understand (which admittedly may not be very far....) the EXT input is only for CD players, ipods and other such audio devices. I thought that only LINE ins were for keyboards, and as the VR-09 has none, that you would have to run it into something else rather than the other way round.

 

I have tried running my VR into my PX-5S but do not think I would do it on a gig unless something forced me to (ie. not enough inputs in the desk or similar). I found when trying it that I could not operate the Vr at high volumes without it distorting - which it did not do when fed directly in. Interesting question and I am interested to hear how other people set up their keyboards.

[To B3]

xKnuckles, on the manual we read:

 

EXT INPUT jack

If you use a stereo mini-plug cable to

connect your audio player or other

audio source here, the sound from the

connected device will be output from

the OUTPUT jacks. Use the controls

of the connected device to adjust its

volume.

* This sound cannot be recorded.

 

Question is, if with a 1/4 cable (with a 1/8 adaptor) another keyboard could be considered as "an audio source"?

[brenner13]

I run 1/8" cable out of an iPad headphone jack for synth apps to the 1/8" input of the VR09 and that runs stereo 1/4" to the inputs on a Fantom X7 that goes straight into a QSC K12, stereo out to FOH...no stage mixer needed. There is no volume adjustment on the VR09's AUX input, but not an issue with any source that has it's own volume knob or lever.

 

I've been considering running the iPad into my new Wavedrum that will run into the VR09 (with 1/4 to 1/8 cables) that runs into the Fantom...

[To B3]

Thanks, gonna try and hope not to blow anything.

 

So... is it time for a new OS update wishlist yet?

 

Pedal assignment saved to each performance is too much to ask? What about some pedal wah as effect option?

[jmemcse517]

I'm happy to report I used the Netgear N150 WNA1100 adapter to connect up to my iPad last night. I bought the adapter new with delivery included on eBay for ummm... I think it was $10.50 US.

 

The editor app installed and connected up to the VR09 with no issues - it was simple.

 

I played around for a bit but had to move on to learning 4 new songs this weekend.

[Bossbandbob]

Thanks, gonna try and hope not to blow anything.

 

So... is it time for a new OS update wishlist yet?

 

Pedal assignment saved to each performance is too much to ask? What about some pedal wah as effect option?

Add momentary Rotary assignment to the list as well!

[Craig MacDonald]

Thanks, gonna try and hope not to blow anything.

 

So... is it time for a new OS update wishlist yet?

 

Pedal assignment saved to each performance is too much to ask? What about some pedal wah as effect option?

To B3,

 

I don't think that the ext input is intended for line outs from other keyboards.. it is designed for other devices such as CD players, ipad, iphones etc.. I believe these types of consumer devices have a lower output level than professional devices (ie electronic keyboards etc).. Give it a try but make sure you set your volume way down on the keyboard you're taking the input from!

[Jags]

Thanks, gonna try and hope not to blow anything.

 

To B3,

 

I don't think that the ext input is intended for line outs from other keyboards.. it is designed for other devices such as CD players, ipad, iphones etc.. I believe these types of consumer devices have a lower output level than professional devices (ie electronic keyboards etc).. Give it a try but make sure you set your volume way down on the keyboard you're taking the input from!

 

I'm an audio technician. It will be no problem to hook the line outputs of another keyboard into the external input of the VR-09, as long as you use the correct cable. My suggestion would be to use a stereo 1/8 inch to 2 RCA adapter and then put a RCA - 1/4 inch adapter on the end of each of the RCA connectors to convert them to go into your line out of your keyboard. You must keep it in stereo. (pics below)

 

FYI the 1/8 output of an ipad or computer is actually a stronger signal than the line outputs of a keyboard. Remember those 1/8 outputs are designed to drive a set of headphones and a set of headphones do need some power to drive the little speakers. So when you connect an ipad or computer to the line inputs of a mixer you do need to keep the volume on the ipad or computer set relatively low so that you don't overdrive the line inputs of the mixer.

 

In the case of the VR-09 and another keyboard the line outputs of the second keyboard will not overdrive or "blow" the aux input of the VR-09. A matter of fact you may need to turn the volume up on the second keyboard to match the volume coming off the VR-09. Just start with the volumes set low and slowly bring things up till it sounds right.

 

It all should work just fine as long as you have the proper interconnect adapters. I have some pics below for what you would need.

 

Have fun!!

 

http://www.usbgear.com/images/SS-6FT-1F2RCA.jpg

 

http://www.long-mcquade.com/files/3332/lg_AA1.jpg

 

Or one of these below.

 

http://g-ecx.images-amazon.com/images/G/01/musical-instruments/detail-page/B000068O3C_img1.jpg

 

 

[Jags]

 

I'd like to use that solution to use both my NE2 and the VR09 together without a submixer, with the NE2 plugged in mono into the VR09. And only the 1/4 mono cable going from the VR09 to the FOH or amp.

 

 

To B3,

 

Why would you want to go MONO from your Nord Electro 2? Use the above setup and you can maintain the stereo sound from your Nord and have it pass through the VR-09. But if you do want to go MONO from your NE2 into the VR-09 you would need the adapters shown below. What you need to watch for is to make sure the 1/8 plug is stereo (tip-ring-sleeve) to feed into the VR-09 and the 1/4 inch plug needs to be mono (tip-sleeve) to come out of your NE2.

 

I do also see that you want to go MONO from the VR-09 to the front of house. I'm not sure if the VR-09 will internally sum the stereo from the aux input to mono if you only use the mono output from the VR-09. In that case using the setup below will insure that a mono signal from your NE2 is reaching both inputs in the VR-09 aux and you would not loose half of the NE2 signal going through the VR-09 if you use the mono out from the VR-09.

 

Hope this helps!

 

 

http://www.usbgear.com/images/SS-6FT-1F2RCA.jpg

 

http://cache.smarthome.com/images/849899big.jpg

[Craig MacDonald]

Jags, thanks for the clarification...!! That's very helpful!!

[jcazzy]

Got my VR-09 yesterday and didn't get into it much at that time. I've played it more today and I have to say that it is better than what I expected. The organ section is good and the piano sounds, to me, are usable. With an iPad, I'm sure I can tweak the synth sounds to duplicate what I've done on my GAIA.

 

I've ordered the Roland DP-10 damper pedal for it but don't see it necessary to order an expression pedal for it right now. That will come later if I need it.

 

Next thing to get will be an iPad for my son (which I can hopefully borrow) to use with it for deep editing. You think he will go for that?

[brenner13]

There's definitely mixed reviews about the effectiveness of expression pedals with the VR09. I tried the Roland EV5 and an M-Audio EX-P and personally found them both unusable for volume swells, because of the tiny area of the pedals' throws that actually affect the VR09's parameters. It is odd because both of those pedals work great with the Fantom X7. Others have reported the Roland EV5 works fine for them. Intriguing.

 

While you can easily modify the synths with the draw faders for envelope and filter/resonance directly on the board, the iPad editor is pretty neat when one wants to program sounds that are not included in the presets...like sitar or bagpipes, but definitely nowhere near as intuitive, fun, and instantly gratifying as grabbing real sliders and twisting real knobs like those found on the Gaia. Also, no arpeggiator on the VR09.

 

One last gripe...to use the deep editing available with the iPad, one must find a preset that will not be needed in any other sound or registration, and one that can be edited (there's a list in the manual). Be sure to save your tweaks to a registration every few minutes because it is way too easy to accidentally hit a wrong button or tap the dial and loose an hour of editing by inadvertently switching to a different sound...there is no "ARE YOU SURE?"...ooooh that's so frustrating! Also you must remember which presets you have modified, because as you search for presets to modify, they play as the factory default and not as the edited modification that you've done and saved to a registration. I've accidentally overwritten several fantastic synth sounds and a wicked pipe organ because I did not write down the presets used to make them.

 

Still it is a great board for me and my band. Superb organ for classic rock. Great synths for all kinds of 70's, 80's, 90's, and new millennial stuff, too. Pretty fair piano for stage; much better when layered with strings or pads. Not terrible EP's...effects are great enhancers. Pretty decent clav, but no pedal wah. N-flute and N-alto sax as well as a dirty blues harmonica goes over great as long as there are no real players of these instruments in the house.

 

I certainly hope your VR09 works as well for you as it does for me. I've eyed the FA, but am still having much fun with my little V-Combo...gots to have those drawbars for what I do.

[promusik]

Has anyone tried the 'long throw' expression pedal from Crumar with the VR-09?

 

http://www.crumar.it/?a=page&p=accessories

 

I'm about to order a GSI burn to use with my VR but am still unhappy with all the expression pedals I've tried. The Crumar site says:

 

"This long throw pedal is perfect for playing organ or keyboards when sit on a bench or on a stool. Built of solid plastic and a wooden base with high rubber feet, has a 10 Kohm potentiometer. Friction can be adjusted. The TRS cable is attached. It's the perfect companion for the Mojo organ but can be used with a multitude of other equipment. "

 

Anyone know if this will def work with VR? Or has anyone found another pedal that will actually work properly?

[Six-string-man]

I know absolutely nothing about the VR-09.

 

However, I can tell you a bit about the Crumar pedal, if that's any help, I got one with my Mojo.

 

The first time I used it, it felt really weird. Imagine placing a house brick underneath an FC-7, and playing with that. After an hour or so, it felt natural. I have seen pics of the B3 pedalboard, with the expression pedal mounted fairly high off the floor, I imagine it might be something akin to that.

 

In use, the pedal is really smooth and even, the action is all you would want. The price isn't bad either, especially if you compare it to a Hammond!

 

I love the FC-7, but I'm really glad I got the Crumar. It's not better, or worse, just different.

 

 

SSM

[jmemcse517]

I use Ernie Ball stereo volume pedals - have been for 30 years. They work perfect for me, and I've never had an issue with one in all these years.

[Jags]

Or has anyone found another pedal that will actually work properly?

 

I'm using a Moog EP-2 and it works great!! Easy to find on eBay and not too expensive.

[iluvchiclets]

To Craig MacDonald:

 

remember that you can create a lot of additional sounds using the virtual analog synth and it's 350+ wave forms!!

 

There are at least three sitar waves included in the PCM waves..

 

225 E Sitar (I assume electric sitar)

226 Sitar Wave

227 Sitar Drone

 

you should go through all of the names of the PCM waves so you have an idea of what types of sounds are available.. there or other organ samples, including Jon Lord organ tones, and other EP's and Wurly's, and all kinds of waves.. I would recommend that everyone who owns a VR-09 have a look at this list.. you can always use the VA synth to create sounds that aren't built into the VR.

 

Am I understanding correctly that there are additional "sounds" available to the VR-09 that are not accessible unless you have an ipad? Trying this keyboard out, I have always felt I ran out of options and sounds a bit quickly. But if there is more under the hood, that is very interesting indeed...

[promusik]

Cheers guys, 6-string, does the Crumar pedal have a longer throw than the fc-7?

 

[Bossbandbob]

The used VR-09 I just bought is version 1.0. should I install 1.1 before installing 1.2 or just go straight to 1.2?

[brenner13]

Or has anyone found another pedal that will actually work properly?

 

I'm using a Moog EP-2 and it works great!! Easy to find on eBay and not too expensive.

Oooh, that's what I wanted to hear...that Moog pedal has always intrigued me for the VR09. Thanks for sharing that.

[brenner13]

To Craig MacDonald:

 

remember that you can create a lot of additional sounds using the virtual analog synth and it's 350+ wave forms!!

 

There are at least three sitar waves included in the PCM waves..

 

225 E Sitar (I assume electric sitar)

226 Sitar Wave

227 Sitar Drone

 

you should go through all of the names of the PCM waves so you have an idea of what types of sounds are available.. there or other organ samples, including Jon Lord organ tones, and other EP's and Wurly's, and all kinds of waves.. I would recommend that everyone who owns a VR-09 have a look at this list.. you can always use the VA synth to create sounds that aren't built into the VR.

 

Am I understanding correctly that there are additional "sounds" available to the VR-09 that are not accessible unless you have an ipad? Trying this keyboard out, I have always felt I ran out of options and sounds a bit quickly. But if there is more under the hood, that is very interesting indeed...

 

363 tones plus the usual virtual analog waves to chose from. Each preset can layer 3 of these "partials" to be saved to a registration. Each partial or oscillator has it's own filter and amp settings with ADSR envelopes and two LFO's: one modulation and one free. Either or both LFO's can be tempo synced. Some really enormous sounds are possible with this thing...nearly Gaia-like, but without the arpeggiator.

 

Here I quote myself from a few posts up to reiterate some programming tips:

While you can easily modify the synths with the draw faders for envelope and filter/resonance directly on the board, the iPad editor is pretty neat when one wants to program sounds that are not included in the presets...like sitar or bagpipes, but definitely nowhere near as intuitive, fun, and instantly gratifying as grabbing real sliders and twisting real knobs like those found on the Gaia. Also, no arpeggiator on the VR09.

 

One last gripe...to use the deep editing available with the iPad, one must find a preset that will not be needed in any other sound or registration, and one that can be edited (there's a list in the manual). Be sure to save your tweaks to a registration every few minutes because it is way too easy to accidentally hit a wrong button or tap the dial and loose an hour of editing by inadvertently switching to a different sound...there is no "ARE YOU SURE?"...ooooh that's so frustrating! Also you must remember which presets you have modified, because as you search for presets to modify, they play as the factory default and not as the edited modification that you've done and saved to a registration. I've accidentally overwritten several fantastic synth sounds and a wicked pipe organ because I did not write down the presets used to make them.

[brenner13]

The used VR-09 I just bought is version 1.0. should I install 1.1 before installing 1.2 or just go straight to 1.2?

I nearly screwed up my update when I did it...so glad I was able to reset and start over. The dark, blank screen of doom gave me palpitations. I would think you could go straight to the latest operating sys, but I am just about the farthest possible departure from an OS expert. Maybe better to play it safe and do 'em both?

[Bossbandbob]

The used VR-09 I just bought is version 1.0. should I install 1.1 before installing 1.2 or just go straight to 1.2?

I nearly screwed up my update when I did it...so glad I was able to reset and start over. The dark, blank screen of doom gave me palpitations. I would think you could go straight to the latest operating sys, but I am just about the farthest possible departure from an OS expert. Maybe better to play it safe and do 'em both?

That is probably the best idea. With a bit of tweaking I'm liking the organ on this board which is what I'll primarily be using it for. How do you get the percussion to work on just the top octaves?

[brenner13]

This probably would require a split with the lower's perc turned off.

[Six-string-man]

Cheers guys, 6-string, does the Crumar pedal have a longer throw than the fc-7?

 

Ah, difficult question to answer! I have come across loads of people who don't know that you can take out the adjusting screw on the FC-7, and this detaches the piece where you put your foot from the base. You can then re-attach the top bit at a different angle. This helps if you play while standing up. I don't know if this also changes the throw, hence the convoluted answer.

 

Anyway, I play sitting down, so my FC-7 is in "normal" mode. While it is like this, checking the throw against the Crumar, it seems that the FC-7 has about 1/4" less travel than the Crumar, but it's really insignificant to me. YMMV.

 

Hope this helps.

 

 

SSM

[Craig MacDonald]

This probably would require a split with the lower's perc turned off.

Like a real stock 3 series hammond (b3, c3,etc), there is no percussion on the lower manual of the VR-09.

 

Just create a split wherever you want the percussion to stop. Turning on/off the percussion will only affect the upper organ part.