Moog Muse - Cat's out of the bag!

[HammondDave]

I’ve been looking for a new synthesizer toy. This may just fit the bill.

 

https://www.wired.com/review/moog-muse-review/

[CrossRhodes]

Lisa Bella Donna is one of the best Moog evangelists out there imo. Always dig her performances.
 

 

[DrSynth]

On 7/31/2024 at 12:24 PM, marino said:

I had a look at the manual, and I must say I'm impressed. Given the Muse's mainly subtractive architecture, there are LOTS of useful functions for the dedicated programmer.

 

Sure, a third envelope is sorely missing. The pitch lfo has an "envelope" button, which I guess is a "one shot" mode; But since in the manual there's no list for mod sources, only destinations - it's not clear whether the pitch lfo can be assigned to other parameters (other than pitch) in the mod matrix or not.

And it looks like the lfos lack a fade in time control - a surprising omission. 

 

But these are about the only missing thing I could find in a very complete voice channel. The menus even include some quite esoteric functions. And judging from the demos, it sounds really good to my ears. I want to play one ASAP!

Yes! You can freely assign the Pitch LFO in the Mod Matrix 

[DrSynth]

On 7/31/2024 at 7:28 PM, Jim Alfredson said:

I absolutely love the look of it. It hits the sweet spot between vintage kitsch and modern slickness. But so far from all the demos I've heard, the sound is rather... uninspiring. It doesn't sound bad by any means, but just kind of run of the mill, heard-it-before compared to other polysynths. Both the original PolyBrute and the upcoming PolyBrute 12 are more intriguing to me.

I do want to try one, though, even though I have my heart and wallet set on the PolyBrute 12.

EDIT: To add that I hope it does well for Moog. It's great to see them release a lower cost polysynth. And I like that it has 61 keys although I think the lack of poly aftertouch is a missed opportunity.

Jim, it sounds pretty good in person !  

 

The cool thing about the Polybrutes is that you set your A patch and your B patch and it takes care of the 'morphing' of parameter changes for you;  The Muse can do a very similar thing within a single Timbre (A, B or Both) using the Macro Knob like Yamaha's Montage SuperKnob.  But you have to build the parameter modulations in the Mod Matrix manually.  I did a lot this on quite a few of my presets to mimic that behavior of the 'Brutes.

 

My Polybrute 12 just arrived the other day and this weekend I'll have it up and running next to the Muse.

[sunspot]

I agree with Jim, none of the demos I've heard online sound great to me.  Not like the ones that hit me when the OB-X8 got released.  But Mike Martin and DrSynth say it sounds good in person, so I guess I need to go to Guitar Center and try for myself (if GC even has synths in their stores anymore). Plus I read that Steve Dunnington was the lead designer behind it and I really dig his work.  He did the DFAM which I LOVE...

 

It could also be that, when it comes to analog polys, I'm just a Les Paul (Obie) guy and not a Strat (Moog) guy, and that's ok too.

[J.F.N.]

1 hour ago, sunspot said:

I agree with Jim, none of the demos I've heard online sound great to me.  Not like the ones that hit me when the OB-X8 got released.  But Mike Martin and DrSynth say it sounds good in person, so I guess I need to go to Guitar Center and try for myself (if GC even has synths in their stores anymore). Plus I read that Steve Dunnington was the lead designer behind it and I really dig his work.  He did the DFAM which I LOVE...

 

It could also be that, when it comes to analog polys, I'm just a Les Paul (Obie) guy and not a Strat (Moog) guy, and that's ok too.

 

I definitely lean towards LP too...

 

[murphybridget]

1 hour ago, sunspot said:

I agree with Jim, none of the demos I've heard online sound great to me.  Not like the ones that hit me when the OB-X8 got released.  But Mike Martin and DrSynth say it sounds good in person, so I guess I need to go to Guitar Center and try for myself (if GC even has synths in their stores anymore). Plus I read that Steve Dunnington was the lead designer behind it and I really dig his work.  He did the DFAM which I LOVE...

 

It could also be that, when it comes to analog polys, I'm just a Les Paul (Obie) guy and not a Strat (Moog) guy, and that's ok too.

Sometimes demos just don't do the gear justice. Trying it out in person is definitely the way to go,

[J.F.N.]

On 7/31/2024 at 4:48 PM, eric said:

This thing looks pretty snazzy. I'm checking out the preset portion of the video, just like Moonglow, LOL.

 

I have lost track of what's up with Moog's business situation, aside from tangential awareness they were purchased, something's changing about the Asheville Moog shop, and various things that could spell worry for Moog fans. I wonder if this is a bold move to get traction from the Moog brand in a product that's more accessible than something like the Moog One. Or at least getting closer to the Sequential and Oberheim modern products? Not sure. I'm intrigued.

 

InMusic seems to have acted fast on the production to make this a success with a very competitive price point for what you get.

 

"The box for the Muse specifically says made in Taiwan, with no 'assembled in US' claim. The remaining Asheville claim on the packaging is only "designed and engineered in Asheville"."

 

I definitely look forward to future other Moog products now!

[Mark Schmieder]

3 hours ago, J.F.N. said:

 

I definitely lean towards LP too...

 

 

Haha, I'm single coils all the way; they have so much more character! Never thought of a synth analog and am not sure I even agree with the relative assignments.......

[J.F.N.]

3 hours ago, Mark Schmieder said:

 

Haha, I'm single coils all the way; they have so much more character! Never thought of a synth analog and am not sure I even agree with the relative assignments.......

 

I mean the synth analogy, though guitar I have an Ibanez hollowbody with humbuckers, to be mentionted is that I am not a guitar player per se.

 

[HammondDave]

9 hours ago, DrSynth said:

Jim, it sounds pretty good in person !  

 

The cool thing about the Polybrutes is that you set your A patch and your B patch and it takes care of the 'morphing' of parameter changes for you;  The Muse can do a very similar thing within a single Timbre (A, B or Both) using the Macro Knob like Yamaha's Montage SuperKnob.  But you have to build the parameter modulations in the Mod Matrix manually.  I did a lot this on quite a few of my presets to mimic that behavior of the 'Brutes.

 

My Polybrute 12 just arrived the other day and this weekend I'll have it up and running next to the Muse.

Would love to hear the pros and cons for both. This falls right within my financial wheelhouse. You get a lot for the $$$.

[Bill H.]

16 hours ago, CrossRhodes said:

Lisa Bella Donna is one of the best Moog evangelists out there imo. Always dig her performances.
 

 

 

I can't help but listen to this thing. I did it again this morning. Aside from the virtuoso playing, it's the sonority of the patch, the fact that it just screams "Moog!" to me, and how damn playable it is throughout the entire five octave range of the keyboard. 

 

Assuming the front panel is the patch, I noticed that the overload slider is about 1/3 the way up. Do you guys think it's that, or the filters, or a combination of everything that just makes this thing sing? And is this something that's really achievable on other contemporary analog polys today? I haven't really been playing much recently, and am curious to the thoughts of the forum. 

[HammondDave]

2 minutes ago, Bill H. said:

 

I can't help but listen to this thing. I did it again this morning. Aside from the virtuoso playing, it's the sonority of the patch, the fact that it just screams "Moog!" to me, and how damn playable it is throughout the entire five octave range of the keyboard. 

 

Assuming the front panel is the patch, I noticed that the overload slider is about 1/3 the way up. Do you guys think it's that, or the filters, or a combination of everything that just makes this thing sing? And is this something that's really achievable on other contemporary analog polys today? I haven't really been playing much recently, and am curious to the thoughts of the forum. 

 

2 minutes ago, Bill H. said:

 

I can't help but listen to this thing. I did it again this morning. Aside from the virtuoso playing, it's the sonority of the patch, the fact that it just screams "Moog!" to me, and how damn playable it is throughout the entire five octave range of the keyboard. 

 

Assuming the front panel is the patch, I noticed that the overload slider is about 1/3 the way up. Do you guys think it's that, or the filters, or a combination of everything that just makes this thing sing? And is this something that's really achievable on other contemporary analog polys today? I haven't really been playing much recently, and am curious to the thoughts of the forum. 

Overload is what we used with our MiniMoogs back in the 70’s….  Old trick that Moog has not forgotten about. 

[Jim Alfredson]

12 hours ago, DrSynth said:

Jim, it sounds pretty good in person !  

 

I'm sure it does! I'm not trying to be negative, I think it's a cool synth but for me personally, considering the other modern polysynths I have (PolyBrute, OB-X8, Prophet 12, Prophet 10, and many other vintage pieces), I don't feel that this offers anything my other gear cannot do. The sound is unmistakably Moog, which is awesome.

 

5 hours ago, murphybridget said:

Sometimes demos just don't do the gear justice. Trying it out in person is definitely the way to go,

 

Yes, and most likely I'll fall in love with it, like I did the PolyBrute when I played it at Sweetwater two years ago.

[YashN]

On 7/31/2024 at 11:54 AM, J.F.N. said:

Not overly convinced by what I hear from that preset part of the video, feels like "subtractive synthesis 101" more or less...

 

It looks FAT though!

Kind of expected: 70's sound, it's a Moog...

 

The Dan Fisher video is cool: he does some nice experimental noodling with it.

 

Some people think this sounds like a Roland Jupiter or Roland Poly - they hear very differently from me. I am not a fan of these slider knobs. I prefer the Kurzweil style.

[Moonglow]

58 minutes ago, Jim Alfredson said:

The sound is unmistakably Moog, which is awesome.

This is what I find most attractive.

 

3 hours ago, HammondDave said:

Overload is what we used with our MiniMoogs back in the 70’s….  Old trick that Moog has not forgotten about. 

Fancied the idea of a “polyphonic Minimoog” since the Mini I had back in 1978. 

[CrossRhodes]

8 hours ago, J.F.N. said:

 

InMusic seems to have acted fast on the production to make this a success with a very competitive price point for what you get.

 

"The box for the Muse specifically says made in Taiwan, with no 'assembled in US' claim. The remaining Asheville claim on the packaging is only "designed and engineered in Asheville"."

 

I definitely look forward to future other Moog products now!

 

Interesting. InMusic had said they would be keeping a small team in Asheville to build their high end synths. I would've thought this would be considered high end but maybe not? Whatever the case, I hope this allows them to hit the profit margins they need to keep the Moog sound alive.

[J.F.N.]

12 minutes ago, CrossRhodes said:

 

Interesting. InMusic had said they would be keeping a small team in Asheville to build their high end synths. I would've thought this would be considered high end but maybe not? Whatever the case, I hope this allows them to hit the profit margins they need to keep the Moog sound alive.

 

Margins talks...

 

[jerrythek]

Kudos also need to be heaped on Erik Norlander, who is now part of the Moog/Inmusic team. He was at Alesis and was part of the Andromeda and Fusion teams, did a lot of great work for I.K. Multimedia, did the IK/Hammond BX3 virtually by himself, and many other great products. A brilliant designer, team leader and musician, he no doubt played a significant role in the final development and bringing to market of the Muse.

 

https://eriknorlander.com/home

 

 

[ProfD]

1 hour ago, CrossRhodes said:

InMusic had said they would be keeping a small team in Asheville to build their high end synths.

 

The Moog One was the last high end Moog synth and let's just say 🤣:

 

 

 

1 hour ago, CrossRhodes said:

I would've thought this would be considered high end but maybe not? 

I believe the Moog Muse will fare better even if it is somewhere in the middle.😎

 

 

[J.F.N.]

Paying 10k+ for an 8 voice analogue synth is a lot of cash for a niche board, considering that probably a fair chunk of the price is affected by where it's made, it's definitely not for the masses.

 

I would assume a 3.5k equivalent board, with possibly equal percentage production cost (labour), will be more profitable based on way more units being sold due to its price/value relation.

 

Though in all fairness I am pretty sure the Moog One will keep a high, possibly increasing, second hand price due to the number of units being manufactured and sold in total during its product life cycle.

 

(If I had the cash just sitting doing nothing I definitely would consider grabbing one of the last 16 voice units...)

 

 

[Tusker]

10 hours ago, Bill H. said:

Assuming the front panel is the patch, I noticed that the overload slider is about 1/3 the way up. Do you guys think it's that, or the filters, or a combination of everything that just makes this thing sing? 

 

Overloading the Moog Modular CP3 Mixer Module was magical and legendary. That magic carried on to the Minimoog and to its famous "feedback trick," where you route the output of the synth back into the mixer. The circuitry was a bit different for Voyager. It was also different (and varied) for the Phatty's / Sub / Subsequent synths which had their own character. By the time they got to Mother and Grandmother, Moog was back to emulating the brilliant old CP3 type circuit. Moog claims that the Muse also draws on the CP3 circuitry. I don't doubt that. I imagine Lisa knows exactly how to dial in the magic with a combination of oscillator levels, filter settings and the overload slider. 

 

[ProfD]

52 minutes ago, J.F.N. said:

I would assume a 3.5k equivalent board, with possibly equal percentage production cost (labour), will be more profitable based on way more units being sold due to its price/value relation.

Made in Taiwan should lower production cost compared to Asheville NC.

52 minutes ago, J.F.N. said:

Though in all fairness I am pretty sure the Moog One will keep a high, possibly increasing, second hand price due to the number of units being manufactured and sold in total during its product life cycle.

Collectors might scoop up Moog One to pad retirement account when prices skyrocket over the next decade or three.😁

52 minutes ago, J.F.N. said:

(If I had the cash just sitting doing nothing I definitely would consider grabbing one of the last 16 voice units...)

I'd consider grabbing 16 women with beautiful voices.  Funny how priorities work.🤣😎

[J.F.N.]

18 hours ago, ProfD said:

Made in Taiwan should lower production cost compared to Asheville NC.

Collectors might scoop up Moog One to pad retirement account when prices skyrocket over the next decade or three.😁

I'd consider grabbing 16 women with beautiful voices.  Funny how priorities work.🤣😎

 

Yeah the actual cost is definitely lower, but in percentage 10k/3.5k RRP I would believe it's probably not that different..

 

Hmm 16 of them women, that is definitely way too much trouble... 🤣

[Dave Bryce]

17 hours ago, ProfD said:

I'd consider grabbing 16 women with beautiful voices.  Funny how priorities work.🤣😎

 

 

dB

[Joe Muscara]

Are we sure it's not supposed to be pronounced Mooo-g Myu-se? Or maybe Mow-gue Mow-se?

 

 

[Motif88]

If I buy one more keyboard for my retirement, Muse, Moog One 16v, PolyBrute 12, Super Gemini or Waldorf Quantum Mk2, I won’t be spending $3500++ unless I can play the damn thing first. That will be difficult as even if I flew to IN, Sweetwater is not a UDO dealer. Never owned a Moog, just other historical hardware mfgs - Yamaha, Roland, Korg, Sequential and Oberheim.

 

I took a calculated risk and bought my Montage M8x before playing but had 3 Motif’s, a Kronos and RD-2000 with soft synths before doing so. Couldn’t be happier with the new Montage M8x hardware/UI and GEX keyboard. 

[dazzjazz]

LBD’s demo sounds great. Lovely tones all round, and great playing. 

[HammondDave]

It’s pretty smart marketing. Sure looks like a Moog with its classic dials, dark gray faceplate, white toothed mod/pitch wheels, wood side panels, with updated features like sliders for mixing sounds and preset buttons.  All analogue except for the delay section, and of course the great overdrive.  Also sounds like a Moog. And for $3500?  I am very tempted. 

[HammondDave]

Here is a good walk through of the Muse by Sound on Sound. Unfortunately, it does display its Achilles heal at 22:30 when the demonstrator hits the preset button without waiting for the sound to end (I became suspicious when he was waiting so long to change presets). It seems that the previous sound cuts off as soon as he changes the preset. This is unfortunate.