What is the next ‘big thing’ in keyboards?

[Paul Woodward]

More fun than prediction perhaps, and a lot of this already touched upon within board specific threads, but it seems to me that there are a lot of incremental updates in keyboard technology, or even bringing back long lost features. The Montage M brings back decades old AN-X and even older poly aftertouch. Fantom adding their ACB, Korg bringing back AT to a flagship product at the same time others are looking at poly AT (ironically just as they launch their own poly AT controllers).

Almost a parallel with the phone industry where once we had groundbreaking features, now small quality of life improvements.

USB interfaces are the norm at a certain price level, touch screen tech, new keybeds, DAW integration…all becoming the norm. The workstation dies, rises again and the choice of performing ‘stage’ keyboards is probably greater than ever.

Last thing that intrigued me was the Roli, but it was just a controller and depended on the hardware connected for sounds. I likes the programmable ribbon controller on the new Montage but, again, incremental.

So, where is (or should) keyboard tech heading and what would make a truly groundbreaking new purchase?

let’s avoid the ‘has absolutely everything and the kitchen sink’ options as that will likely never happen or would cost the earth.

[Paul Woodward]

There does seem to be this ongoing conflict between expansion and convergence. I am guilty of it myself.

At one point loving the modularity of a good controller, modules, IOS or DAW integration so I can hook up and control as I like and drop in new sound engines and apps as I wish.

And then, fed up with the wiring and mess, and wishing for something that has it all in one tidy package….and so it goes on. I have lost count of the times I have gone through this grow/shrink/grow cycle….

Would something ever come out to stop his cycle? 

[CyberGene]

I wish Apple made a workstation 😀 Like: integrate Logic Pro, MainStage, iPad, Mac, AppStore and their expertise in making intuitive and usable products into a sleek keyboard with great touch and feel and some revolutionary stuff only Apple can do. 

[UnderGroundGr]

Polyphonic aftertouch and keyboards like osmose by expressive e and lumi keys by roli...

I was send an email a year ago to Arturia to make a hardware synth that will contain all their soft synths(V collection) and effects(fx collection)...

[nadroj]

I wouldn’t be surprised if we started seeing more modular keyboards like the Viscount Legend 70s.

 

Pick your size, pick your keybed, pick which modules you want, pick which specs you want and have it shipped to you. Kinda like when you have a car or PC built for you based on specs. 

 

It would be a manufacturing nightmare of course…

[yannis D]

Ι would love to see a keyboard with intergrated Apple apps (Mainstage as a host with all available VSTs) - a laptop rig withouth the laptop with updates, app store connection etc, as Paul indicated. In 49/61/88 version of course.  

[rogs]

I started on my keyboard 'journey' way back in 1968.

Since then I would suggest there have been relatively few what might be described as 'groundbreaking' electronic keyboard advances...

Lots of revisions, additions and amalgamations, but few ' game changers'.

 

I offer the following, as a suggested list of the real game changers over the years:

• Hammond organ (with Leslie of course!)

• Rhodes electric piano (and perhaps Wurlitzer, to a lesser extent?)

• Minimoog

• Solina string ensemble (lots of derivatives since)

• Prophet 5 polysynth (and other analogue polysynths of that time - Roland, Oberheim etc)

 (I should perhaps give the CS80 a special mention.... Nothing quite like it before or since - but really still just a comprehensive analogue polysynth)

• DX7 ( and other digital synths of that time - D50 etc)

• Fairlight sampled sound synthesier  (lots of subsequent derivatives of that since of course !)

 

Since then, most  other electronic keyboards seem to have been variations, derivatives or combinations of the above 'instruments' ....

Plus of course better and better simulations of acoustic pianos, and electronic simulations of electromechanical pianos ( Rhodes, Wurli... )

 But nothing truly 'new', sound wise, for many years?

 

(....Lights blue touch paper and retires!   )

 

 

[Outkaster]

I think part of it is performing musicians like us are becoming a thing of the past...

[Radagast]

Many years ago, Oberheim was owned by Gibson.  They had a genius working there.  I think his name was Lynx Crowe.  He developed a synth technology called Fourier Analysis and Resynthesis (F.A.R.).  All the accounts I read made me salivate.  The moron running Gibson at the time shut it down and made people’s lives miserable while doing it.  I’ve heard nothing but bad things about that guy.  He was finally replaced after almost bringing Gibson Guitars to total destruction.  F.A.R. would have been the next big thing.

[JamPro]

I'm predicting keyboards with AI-powered sequencers that will play specific styles, and even mimic specific players - "I'll just dial up the salsa style, add the Herbie Hancock model, and push Start".

[Ibarch]

4 hours ago, CyberGene said:

I wish Apple made a workstation 😀 Like: integrate Logic Pro, MainStage, iPad, Mac, AppStore and their expertise in making intuitive and usable products into a sleek keyboard with great touch and feel and some revolutionary stuff only Apple can do. 

 

Since 2007 the only revolutionary stuff Apple have done is marketing. 

 

How long have they owned Logic? I don't see this as standing head and shoulders above other DAWs. If anything it is falling further behind the competition each year, despite the practically unlimited resources of it's parent. 

[Threadslayer]

1 hour ago, Outkaster said:

I think part of it is performing musicians like us are becoming a thing of the past...

 

53 minutes ago, JamPro said:

I'm predicting keyboards with AI-powered sequencers that will play specific styles, and even mimic specific players - "I'll just dial up the salsa style, add the Herbie Hancock model, and push Start".

And there you have it.

[cphollis]

I think direct neural implants will make physical keyboards unneeded much like training wheels.

[CyberGene]

54 minutes ago, Ibarch said:

If anything it is falling further behind the competition each year, despite the practically unlimited resources of its parent.

How is that measured? People switch to other DAW-s? Or it has less features? Or is having issues? Or are you just sharing your own feelings of how Logic Pro compares to other DAW-s?

[Paul Woodward]

2 minutes ago, CyberGene said:

How is that measured? People switch to other DAW-s? Or it has less features? Or is having issues? Or are you just sharing your own feelings of how Logic Pro compares to other DAW-s?

I was thinking the same, it’s way more than I need and loaded with more plug ins than I can actually use, some so deep I have hardly touched the surface. I don’t want ableton live features, but even then it has those now. The iPad was after 2007 and look how that has changed music production.

[CyberGene]

Every DAW nowadays comes with a complete suite of plugins. If you don’t need them, don’t use them 😉 But Logic Pro’s set of instruments and FX is often mentioned as the best bang for buck.

 

The closest I found to a usage stats poll is this:

https://www.production-expert.com/production-expert-1/2023-daw-user-survey-the-results
 

Logic Pro is the second most popular DAW after Pro Tools (well, the blog that conducted the poll used to be a Pro Tools blog, so that may have influenced the results but they mentioned it). Hardly seems like Logic Pro is “falling further” except if you mean it used to be number one but got overthrown by Pro Tools. 

[Delaware Dave]

I think that you are seeing it now; keyboards will be nothing but controllers for tablets and ipads running software for your instruments and VST plugins.  One advantage is that it allows the user to buy the instruments of your choice rather than buying a keyboard with 500 instruments built in (of varying realistic sound quality), 470 of which you never use.  

[zukskywalker]

HDMI out?

im so tired of the teeny, tiny (fragile) displays.

[octa]

40 minutes ago, cphollis said:

I think direct neural implants will make physical keyboards unneeded much like training wheels.

You can type w/ yer eyeballs w/ Apple goggles, bet musical keyboard apps may work similarly. 
 

 

[stoken6]

5 hours ago, CyberGene said:

I wish Apple made a workstation 😀 Like: integrate Logic Pro, MainStage, iPad, Mac, AppStore and their expertise in making intuitive and usable products into a sleek keyboard with great touch and feel and some revolutionary stuff only Apple can do. 

I kind of half agree. They should create MainStage for iPad, and partner with an established manufacturer like M-Audio to build controllers with a slot to hold the iPad, built-in USB audio interface (I notice that Korg has got the memo!), USB MIDI interface or USB hub for adding additional controller tiers, and power delivery to the iPad through the controller keyboard (as I've banged on about in the past). That kind of streamlined setup would make an iPad-based rig much more appealing in my opinion.

 

Cheers, Mike.

 

 

[Ibarch]

2 hours ago, rogs said:

I started on my keyboard 'journey' way back in 1968.

Since then I would suggest there have been relatively few what might be described as 'groundbreaking' electronic keyboard advances...

Lots of revisions, additions and amalgamations, but few ' game changers'.

 

I offer the following, as a suggested list of the real game changers over the years:

• Hammond organ (with Leslie of course!)

• Rhodes electric piano (and perhaps Wurlitzer, to a lesser extent?)

• Minimoog

• Solina string ensemble (lots of derivatives since)

• Prophet 5 polysynth (and other analogue polysynths of that time - Roland, Oberheim etc)

 (I should perhaps give the CS80 a special mention.... Nothing quite like it before or since - but really still just a comprehensive analogue polysynth)

• DX7 ( and other digital synths of that time - D50 etc)

• Fairlight sampled sound synthesier  (lots of subsequent derivatives of that since of course !)

 

Since then, most  other electronic keyboards seem to have been variations, derivatives or combinations of the above 'instruments' ....

Plus of course better and better simulations of acoustic pianos, and electronic simulations of electromechanical pianos ( Rhodes, Wurli... )

 But nothing truly 'new', sound wise, for many years?

 

(....Lights blue touch paper and retires!   )

 

 

I don't go quite as far back but I remember seeing the landscape change with the DX7 and D50. 

 

As to whether anything truely revolutionary since then, I would say that this applies to most areas of our lives. There haven't been many truely revolutionary changes to cars since they became available to the masses. Phone updates  haven't been revolutionary since that first iPhone.  Everything builds and improves on what we have and truely revolutionary tech happens but a few times in our entire lives. 

 

As to my presonal wishlist, having a top of the range stage piano combined with a flagship workstation and great synths, all in a single board with the best Kawai style grand piano action that weighs 30 lbs or less would do me. 

I'd also like a full computer based editor and sound libraries /synths that are the same as on the board, along with full two way integration between the board and the DAW so I can work on the same project with either / both with automatic sync between the two. 

For that I'm happy enough to let my preferred manufacturer keep only to it's own stuff and not expect the board to simply be a generic VST host. 

 

The current Fantom 0 series are a step along this road. But why do I have to compromise the number of synth engines and live with a tiny amount of Ram for expansions and samples just to have a board my dodgy back can lift? 

The daw integration to Ableton looks promising but why isn't the pattern sequencer on board synced with an Ableton project when they both use the same idea session view? 

[Stokely]

Does it even matter?   This feels like a passionate discussion over horse breeding techniques right around the time cars were coming out...  More and more "live" performances are becoming tracks, and audiences mostly don't care (we've had at least one local club tell our singer she can't do her duo act without them, they like a "full sound").   At home and in studios, I reckon software is king and for good reason IMO.

 

  (Sorta tongue in cheek, but only sorta)
 

[16251]

How about, probably not feasible, for manufacturers to design an additional lid, which would replace, or sit on top, that would be able to support a 2nd board, or computer, etc. I guess Korg and Kawai and other co's. I just like the idea that I could play two keyboards without carrying heavy scaffolding. 

 

I know ppl will say Rhodes and similar, but I'm thinking light dp's like Nord and Yamaha offered extra mods.

[Paul Woodward]

6 minutes ago, Stokely said:

Does it even matter?   This feels like a passionate discussion over horse breeding techniques right around the time cars were coming out...  More and more "live" performances are becoming tracks, and audiences mostly don't care (we've had at least one local club tell our singer she can't do her duo act without them, they like a "full sound").   At home and in studios, I reckon software is king and for good reason IMO.

 

  (Sorta tongue in cheek, but only sorta)
 

Does it matter? Well forums wouldn’t really exist without healthy passionate discussion, which is also optional. No need for any sort of negativity in such a topic, not saying you were, but it is passionate discussion. There is no review or opinion, more speculation, second guessing and wish lists to some extent. The Montage proves there are still horses to get about, so what would make a difference (or your jaw drop) in the world of keyboards.

[Ibarch]

28 minutes ago, CyberGene said:

How is that measured? People switch to other DAW-s? Or it has less features? Or is having issues? Or are you just sharing your own feelings of how Logic Pro compares to other DAW-s?

 

My point is that Logic is just one amongst peers. One of the pack. If it were possible to run blind tests of DAWs without knowing which is which, logic may do fine but it wouldn't win by a landslide. Having Apple own and develop it has not made it the most amazing DAW ever. 

 

Relating that back to the comment where if Apple made a workstation it would be full of revolutionary stuff that only Apple can do, Apple simply haven't filled their DAW up with revolutionary stuff that only Apple can do. They have locked it down to only plugins that Apple can use. 

 

If you want a bang average workstation locked down with proprietary tech, then Apple can join the club with all our current companies. And, no doubt there would be a big take up as their revolutionary marketing department has created a small army of folk who can only see Apple. But a dream board, forget it. 

 

 

[Paul Woodward]

3 minutes ago, 16251 said:

How about, probably not feasible, for manufacturers to design an additional lid, which would replace, or sit on top, that would be able to support a 2nd board, or computer, etc. I guess Korg and Kawai and other co's. I just like the idea that I could play two keyboards without carrying heavy scaffolding. 

Good point. Is modularity and flexibility the way forward? Will keyboard manufacturers let you ‘drop in’ other systems much like the old expansion cards only with whole engines or operating systems on there?

Probably been playing too much Cyberpunk 2077….

[Ibarch]

17 minutes ago, Stokely said:

Does it even matter?   This feels like a passionate discussion over horse breeding techniques right around the time cars were coming out...  More and more "live" performances are becoming tracks, and audiences mostly don't care (we've had at least one local club tell our singer she can't do her duo act without them, they like a "full sound").   At home and in studios, I reckon software is king and for good reason IMO.

 

  (Sorta tongue in cheek, but only sorta)
 

Of course it matters. That's why I'm here 😊

[CyberGene]

34 minutes ago, Ibarch said:

My point is that Logic is just one amongst peers. One of the pack. If it were possible to run blind tests of DAWs without knowing which is which, logic may do fine but it wouldn't win by a landslide. Having Apple own and develop it has not made it the most amazing DAW ever. 

 

Relating that back to the comment where if Apple made a workstation it would be full of revolutionary stuff that only Apple can do, Apple simply haven't filled their DAW up with revolutionary stuff that only Apple can do.

But that's because you look at it in isolation. Logic Pro as a DAW, compared to other DAW-s. Of course nobody cares just about a DAW, they are all the same.

 

You missed my point. It's about the total integration of everything. Why are people gigging with iPad-s or Macs with MainStage? It's because you have very dependable hardware/software integration. Why are so many people using Logic Pro (the second most used DAW, according to that poll) if you consider it's only available on macOS, unlike all other DAW-s that are available both on PC and Mac? It's because Logic Pro runs really well on their own hardware, and especially now on Apple Silicon it's just head and shoulders above the competition. You can run countless instances of the most resource-intensive plugins on a fanless laptop such as the MacBook Air.

 

Apple may not be revolutionary when you compare single components in isolation, but it's the entire ecosystem and how well the separate components integrate that's revolutionary.

[ProfD]

As we can see with new product releases, there is really no "next big thing in keyboards" technology.

 

Truth be told, as mentioned above, there hasn't really been a big thing in keyboards since the ROMpler.

 

Sure, the samples/sounds have gotten marginally better with physical modeling and synthesis technologies. YMMV.

 

Along with every sound required to make music, modern KBs have more sample memory and computer integration and tactility.

 

But, overall, it's the same sounds across categories...piano, organ, brass, wind, horn, synth and percussion.

 

Any modern ROMpler and most digital stage pianos have everything necessary to play and/or compose music. 

 

IMO, the next big thing in keyboards won't be technological.  Manufacturers don't have a clue.

 

The next big thing in keyboards will be a musician equally proficient in sound design and musicianship creating new music. 

 

A great example of what I see is listening to what dudes like Nick Semrad and J3PO are doing with any KB they touch.😎

[Paul Woodward]

Well, I’m willing to indulge my imagination and think what might be revolutionary in the same way the Hammond, Minimoog, Rhodes, DX7, D50, M1 etc. were.

So many artists were influenced by such technologies, which then shaped their sound, just as there will always be some who can make a dilapidated piano sound amazing, or through sound design, but they are often inspired by new hardware….or there wouldn’t be any new tech created.

Considering those advances in music (keyboard) tech, what would be that next big thing that might be remembered in another decade for changing the landscape of keyboard playing/performing?