A-frame keyboard stand question

[Jim Alfredson]

I was gifted an old three tier Ultimate A-frame stand by a friend. I'd like to add another tier to it. Ultimate no longer makes these stands nor the parts for them. Does anyone know if the On-Stage A-frame uses the same diameter tubes?

Here's a picture because it's cool.

 

[The Real MC]

Don't use those.  Get that Minimoog off that thing!

Those plastic clamps are their Achilles heel - they will crack if overtightened and you can't tighten them enough to prevent the round tiers from slipping.  Twice those damn tiers dumped my Memorymoog to the floor when they slipped.

There's a reason you got it free.

 

I have one left in my studio and it is configured as a table support for my MIDIBoard.  It is supported with two tiers, no worries about tiers slipping, and I can bang on the MB like a piano pounder without the thing bouncing.  Can only use one tier above it, and I use it for a music stand.

[Jonathan Hughes]

"Those plastic clamps are their Achilles heel - they will crack if overtightened and you can't tighten them enough to prevent the round tiers from slipping."

I got one in the late 80s and although I never used it live, I never had any issues with cracking, over tightening, or slipping. I still have it, although it's in storage, as it's too big for what I need right now. But it was so nice to be able to reconfigure it and adjust the height of things fairly easy.

[mcgoo]

Sorry to derail the thread,  but Ultimate Support is on my $hit list at the moment.  Not only do they not have parts for their legacy stuff,  they don't have parts for their current stands!  I've been waiting over a year for replacement parts for their V Pro Stand.  Grrr... 

 

Rant over.  Sorry for the derail... 

[stoken6]

5 hours ago, mcgoo said:

Sorry to derail the thread,  but Ultimate Support is on my $hit list at the moment.  Not only do they not have parts for their legacy stuff,  they don't have parts for their current stands!  I've been waiting over a year for replacement parts for their V Pro Stand.  Grrr... 

 

Rant over.  Sorry for the derail... 

How things have changed! My vintage AX48's carry handle broke some years ago, they sent me one FoC. 

 

Cheers, Mike.

[Al Coda]

10 hours ago, The Real MC said:

Don't use those.  Get that Minimoog off that thing!

Those plastic clamps are their Achilles heel - they will crack if overtightened and you can't tighten them enough to prevent the round tiers from slipping.  Twice those damn tiers dumped my Memorymoog to the floor when they slipped.

There's a reason you got it free.

 

I have one left in my studio and it is configured as a table support for my MIDIBoard.  It is supported with two tiers, no worries about tiers slipping, and I can bang on the MB like a piano pounder without the thing bouncing.  Can only use one tier above it, and I use it for a music stand.

 

 

Well, that´s your experience and mine is very different !

 

I used 3 of these silver A-frames at the same time and in a U-config. in the past,- toured with ´em being handled by roadies and they had been set up/teared down for daily studiowork, club gigs and TV shows for more than 1 1/2 decades.

The stands carried 2 Minimoog D (top tiers), Prophet-5, OB-8, DX-7, KORG CX-3, a stringmachine and some other smaller toys like Roland MC-202, custom modified E-MU Drumulator, Yamaha QX-1 etc..

Sometimes I put the Fender Rhodes 73 and Clavinet D6 under one of the stands which needed wider tiers (longer tubing) and in that case there was only 1 tier above Clavinet D6 then.

 

Never ever had an issue like you described.

It all about correct handling,- when tighten T-nut´s scews,- you hear when you have to stop, otherwise the nut cracks.

 

When concert touring, we didn´t disassemble/assemble tiers every day,- instead we only made ´em slim by bringing legs close together and put ´em upright into the truck, the stands being straped against one of the truck´s walls and leaving enough room for all the other flightcases and cabs.

But when I had to transport myself, I disasembled and put all in the Ultimade Support bags available for the A-frame stands.

I still own such bag for the case I need it.

 

Later, I went away from the A-frame form,- bought black Ultimate tubing available by the meter and parts needed for custom built stands.

Also never had an issue with these,- except 2 t-nuts cracked because stagehands weren´t carefull enough when loading the truck.

I really hate I cannot buy this tubing anymore and love building my stands from all the Ultimate tubing and parts I collected.

My prefered construction is a base stand w/ 4 legs (similar to a B3) and on casters with 1- or 2-tier wings (no casters !) while I ideally want a flat-top keyboard on the base stand with another keyboard on top.

This stand was for touring only and for transport the wings were removed and strapped to the base stand, all going into a custom made bag and into the truck.

Easy setup/teardown, very stable,- but not usable for transport by private car.

But it´s possible constructing stands from Ultimate tubing being collapsable and usable for private transport

 

Today, Jaspers stands are the alternative and they also sell single parts and tubing.

B.t.w,- can be the tubing and t-nuts fit Ultimate support specs.

Jaspers System Parts

 

☺️

 

A.C.

 

[Al Coda]

12 hours ago, Jim Alfredson said:

I was gifted an old three tier Ultimate A-frame stand by a friend. I'd like to add another tier to it. Ultimate no longer makes these stands nor the parts for them. Does anyone know if the On-Stage A-frame uses the same diameter tubes?

Here's a picture because it's cool.

 

 

 

 

looks great !

 

Please double check if Jaspers System Parts might help.

Go thru the pages to find nuts, screws and s##t.

 

It all depends on the USS A-frame stand´s tubing diameter.

When it´s identical, all other parts might fit too.

I guess, the original USS tubing diameter was 3/8",- but I´m not sure a.t.m..

I´m also not sure about if that was the inside or outside diameter of the tubing.

It might also be necessary to convert to metric dimensions.

 

good luck

 

☺️

 

A.C.

[Mr -G-]

11 hours ago, The Real MC said:

Those plastic clamps are their Achilles heel - they will crack if overtightened and you can't tighten them enough to prevent the round tiers from slipping.

 

I never had one of those, but I agree that the logic in the design of round tiers without some kind of better locking mechanism (other than friction) is difficult to follow.

 

[DaveMcM]

Any reason you are using the stand backwards?

 

P.S. I have a stash of parts for when I used the USS A-Frames. The tiers I have are the 'newer' black anodized tubes but they may not be long enough. How long are the tiers in the picture? I am going out of town for a couple of weeks but if I hear back from you by tomorrow night I can measure what I have and let you know. BTW, I'm in Cincinnati.

[mate stubb]

I have successfully mixed my old USS Apache tubes and connectors with parts from On Stage tripod lighting stands. I assume their A frame uses the same stuff.

 

But everything is black these days.

[vonnor]

Last time I used those in the factory configuration was 1986 (attached). I have had the T-Connectors break from over tightening and just plain age - older ones have a brass nut cast right into the plastic and seem to crack more often. Like Dave McMahan I also have a bunch of newer parts (not enough to be called a "stash") but now days I only use them in a "box" config, so I don't tighten them too much. I try to keep any "tiered" keyboards with center of gravity over the bar so there's less "roll" torque on the connectors. I got black tubes and tier cross-supports out the @$$ in my closet but not many T-connectors any more.

 

~ vonnor

 

p.s. I never had that Memorymoog+ fall to the floor...

 

[Jim Alfredson]

2 hours ago, DaveMcM said:

Any reason you are using the stand backwards?

 

P.S. I have a stash of parts for when I used the USS A-Frames. The tiers I have are the 'newer' black anodized tubes but they may not be long enough. How long are the tiers in the picture? I am going out of town for a couple of weeks but if I hear back from you by tomorrow night I can measure what I have and let you know. BTW, I'm in Cincinnati.

I think it looks nicer "backwards". 

The tubes for the tiers are roughly 47" long and 1.5" in diameter. Thank you!

[Jim Alfredson]

4 hours ago, Al Coda said:

 

Please double check if Jaspers System Parts might help.

 

 

It appears they are the same! 37.8mm diameter is roughly 1.5in which is what I measured just now.

[Al Coda]

1 hour ago, Jim Alfredson said:

I think it looks nicer "backwards". 

The tubes for the tiers are roughly 47" long and 1.5" in diameter. Thank you!

 

 

Perfect,- good to know.

 

thx too !

 

Unfortunately Jaspers doesn´t offer a swivel joint like the USS SJT-150,- which is what I´m looking for.

So, when someone has 1 and doesn´t need anymore, I´d buy it.

 

☺️

 

A.C.

[linwood]

17 hours ago, The Real MC said:

Twice those damn tiers dumped my Memorymoog to the floor when they slipped.

Same thing happened to me in the '80's. I had the Memorymoog on top and the drummer ran into it and knocked off and onto the floor. Told me he was sorry. lol

[Al Coda]

On 8/22/2022 at 7:26 PM, linwood said:

Same thing happened to me in the '80's. I had the Memorymoog on top and the drummer ran into it and knocked off and onto the floor. Told me he was sorry. lol

 

In your example I don´t recognize a failure of the stand.

Anyway ...

I experienced the same on a tour in 1984,-

 

a roadie was on his knees at the back of the stand, plugin´ in cables into CV pedals.

When he got up again, he knocked the Prophet-5 from top tier w/ his head.

I recognized how rugged and well built a Prophet-5 was ´cause there was no damage except a small dent in one of the wooden side panels,- and it worked as before.

But also not a keyboard stand failure.

 

☺️

 

A.C.

[konaboy]

i happen to know that gibralter drum rack tubes and clamps are 1.5".

[timwat]

I've had clamp failures on my old USS A frame (which I still have, and don't use) - I mentioned that over in the other stand thread. Had it happen with both heavier and lighter boards, and I agree when you design friction between smooth plastic and smooth aluminum as the force to prevent rotational torque from dumping an expensive board...well, I had enough problems that I went another way. Back in the late 80's, it was all that was available (and we all saw nothing but those things in every Guitar Center. 

 

Jim, if you're going to use yours in a static studio placement, I might suggest a solution. For heavier boards, I ended up rigging a "rear" horizontal tube across the back legs back when it was possible to buy extra clamps and tubes from them. Having both front and rear support for heavy or deep boards solved all my issues, but it's an additional setup step if it was moved a lot.

[RedKey]

28 minutes ago, timwat said:

I've had clamp failures on my old USS A frame

 

For heavier boards, I ended up rigging a "rear" horizontal tube across the back legs.

Having both front and rear support for heavy or deep boards solved all my issues, but it's an additional setup step if it was moved a lot.

This and This.  

Gibraltar 1.5" hardware is compatible... and metal... hint hint.

I've used PVC in a pinch.  Grab a 2" rotary cutter at you local hardware store and cut your tubes to needed length. 

[AWkeys]

A friend gave me an old A-frame stand, presumably from the 80s. This thing has no badge on it so I have no idea the make, but all tubing is square and steel(!), heavy and built like a brick s***house. Ugly brown with chrome wings for the keyboards. It's in storage, so no pics right now. Anyone heard of anything like this?

[hourglass]

If you're still looking, I have a new tier in the box for one of these A-frame stands.  It's black, however, and yours looks silver.

 

Ryan

[Synthaholic]

Use auto hose clamps to secure the tiers. You can see how mine are old and cracked. Of course, mine are now over 40 years old, bought in 1980.

 

[Jim Alfredson]

6 hours ago, hourglass said:

If you're still looking, I have a new tier in the box for one of these A-frame stands.  It's black, however, and yours looks silver.

 

Ryan

 

I am! Shoot me a message!

[Floyd Tatum]

I don't know the answer to your tube diameter question, but I can say that I never had any clamps crack on me during the couple of years I used one.   I can see how that might be a weak point, though.    But they worked for me, and I never had a slipping problem, either.   I found them quite adjustable, and strong.

 

I constructed a plywood music stand that was about 4 or 5 feet wide, 1.5 feet high, and with a 1.5 inch "lip" (right word?) at the bottom to hold charts (made from a strip of baseboard).  I painted it flat black.  It was 1/4" plywood, so not that heavy.  Whole thing resembled that upper front board of an upright, the kind that pulls out a bit at the bottom, and functions as a music stand.   For gigs that used a lot of long charts, it was ideal.  I think I've got a picture of that setup somewhere.

[Al Coda]

4 hours ago, Floyd Tatum said:

I never had any clamps crack on me during the couple of years I used one.   I can see how that might be a weak point, though.    But they worked for me, and I never had a slipping problem, either.   I found them quite adjustable, and strong.

 

My experience too.

I construct stands from USS tubing since decades and started w/ 3 silver USS Apache A-frame stands somewhere late 70s.

Never a problem even roadies set up the rig.

I sold the silver A-frames when I got access to black tubing to build my own,- and I still do from USS parts I bought in then 80s !

 

☺️

 

A.C.