Crumar Seven

[kenheeter]

I'd love to hear your impressions of the modeled acoustic piano.

[KorgyPorky]

The new piano model and the vibraphone model are not on my Gemini rack.

 

I like the tempo at which GSI is improving and developing new vitual models.

 

And they are not the only italian company thats very innovative, if GSI would cooperate with a company like Ketron and unite their strengths my dream instrument would be close to being born.

 

 

[Delaware Dave]

I like the tempo at which GSI is improving and developing new vitual models

I'll be in the minority here but this is where I disagree. It is probably the right speed for a two man operation but as a consumer of one of their products I get frustrated at the speed of which things are brought to market and continued development. They introduced the burn pedal, four years later it is discontinued. They introduced the Gemini and other than one wave table expansion haven't added anything new. Yes they improved the clav (because it was out of tune and shouldn't have been to begin with), have yet to improve the acoustic piano, have yet to put the leslie improvement and other upgrades the Mojo has received into the Gemini (promised for March but not delivered), have yet to add a 73/76 key controller with the Gemini included that many have asked for, instead came out with the Seven that no one really asked for. If the electro 5/6 sounded the same I would have already purchased one and moved on. Kurzweil is also a small company although admittedly much more resourceful than GSI. It takes them years to develop a new product but once it is introduced they continue to upgrade the product. Look where the Forte is now compared to when it was introduced. Look where the Gemini is .... I feel like the Gemini is being abandoned.

[MojoGuyPan]

I'm sorry Dave but I don't get the disappointment. You should be buying an instrument on the basis for what it can do at the time of purchase. Not in the hopes that things will be made perfect in the future.

 

If you looked at the Gemini and the Clav sucked, then why buy it if you are going to be using it for Clav? I bought a Mojo 61 for organ. Then the easter egg piano came out then the clav. That's just lagniappe. Now everyone wants the modelled piano and vibes spread across the Crumar line up.

 

You've got the desktop Gemini, buy a SL73 for $500 and call it a day. I didn't want another variation of the Gemini. I think the Seven makes much more sense, a piano centric board with a piano action. I've got the Mojo with the waterfall keys.

 

GSI probably hasn't sold many of the Gemini and Dual Manuals so updates for it are likely to be low priority. The Burn discontinued, so what? You have one, it does what it does when you bought it, now you're crying that it'll get no more updates. I'm sorry but you've got to put on your big girl panties.

 

When Korg discontinues the SV-1 are people going to be crying that no more updates are coming out? You buy an instrument for what it can do. That's it end of story. I have a piano at the house. The mfg now cranks them out overseas, do I cry? No. It is still a great sounding piano, I don't expect updates. That's the way it should be with your boards. Don't count on any updates or fixes, buy a board for what it is now, not what it has the potential to be.

 

And to think GSI/Crumar is on the same scale as Kurzweil is a little bit optimistic. There's no reason to beat them up.

[Delaware Dave]

You're drinking too much kool aid for me ....

[AnotherScott]

Although there are some exceptions, most boards from Roland, Korg, Yamaha, Casio, Numa, Kawai get somewhere between zero and two upgrades over their lifetimes (and those generally only within the first year or two). And even then, they are likely to be at least as much for fixes as enhancements. I would not buy any board in anticipation of it ever being any more than it is on the day I buy it, except maybe Nord.

[ElmerJFudd]

Unfortunately developers of all sizes push out silicon with unfinished business. They pretty much all need to fix bugs without exception. However some are better than others at addressing issues, and some actually continue development (new OS, user requested features, new sounds, etc.). Although sales is typically the key ingredient to updates. If theyve sold enough of them, its going to get extended support. If they havent, development gets the axe. And thats how it goes.

 

I guess thats one reason to select a tride and true instrument like a PC3 or something after its been out for a while. Being first in line for the latest and greatest makes us beta testers. And if the developer doesnt have a hit on their hands - who knows if bugs will ever get fixed or promised features implemented?

[ProfD]

When Korg discontinues the SV-1 are people going to be crying that no more updates are coming out?

Nope. Definitely not this SV-1 user.

 

I wish Crumar much success but I'll be staying the course and playing my SV-1 "as is" all the way.

[Delaware Dave]

"...However some are better than others at addressing issues, and some actually continue development (new OS, user requested features, new sounds, etc.)...

Yes EJF, that's precisely my point. I thought that with the Gemini Guido would continue expanding it, i.e. being better than the others, but it appears that I was wrong. This is why I made my disagree comment in my previous post. I don't like the tempo of how things are moving and I get that he is only a two man operation.

 

As a side note my band celebrated its 15 year anniversary last night so I decided to play alot of vintage instruments from the Gemini ( I used the Vent for Leslie). The damn thing sounds phenomenal, the Rhodes, Wurli, Clav and VB3 through the Vent sound nuts on. Even the acoustic piano sounds good in a rock situation. Without a doubt this the best sounding rig that I have ever owned. If Guido would put the Gemini in a 7x key controller it would definitely be an Electro killer.

[sosho]

Agree , I had my first gigs using it this weekend . Sounds great !! I brought an hx3 to compare but the gemini sounded better out of the box for my taste( no vent), . Rhodes and clav are better than any other keyboard I tried except the real deal ( which I own ) Even the sampled CP70 is usable when the sampled grand is not percussive enough .The JC ampsim reduces the artificial flavour a bit. I have it inside a DMC ( which is very good as well ). Should have bought the external to use with different keyboards .

[ZioGuido]

I'm working to fit the new AP model into the Gemini, for this reason I had to delay the new update... Otherwise it was ready by the 12th of March but wasn't released for this very reason.

 

I doubt that a bigger enterprise can work faster... Yes, more people mean more work done, but doesn't mean that it's done faster. Here... it's sunday evening and I'm talking about job in a public forum. If I was an employee of a bigger company I'd be doing something else right now. And I would probably hate my boss

 

 

[stoken6]

That Gemini module gets more interesting every time I look at it.

 

Cheers, Mike.

[sosho]

Go for it ! Yesterday I heard it in bandcontext with some nice meyersound monitors . The very same ones which made me ditch the clavia . And I did some recordings before . For me the first impression is very important , I think it is great . And people kept coming to me asking what keyboard I played . Last time this happened to me was when I bought the electro 1

[sosho]

I'm working to fit the new AP model into the Gemini, for this reason I had to delay the new update... Otherwise it was ready by the 12th of March but wasn't released for this very reason.

 

[ElmerJFudd]

I'm working to fit the new AP model into the Gemini, for this reason I had to delay the new update... Otherwise it was ready by the 12th of March but wasn't released for this very reason.

 

I doubt that a bigger enterprise can work faster... Yes, more people mean more work done, but doesn't mean that it's done faster. Here... it's sunday evening and I'm talking about job in a public forum. If I was an employee of a bigger company I'd be doing something else right now. And I would probably hate my boss

 

 

You wouldnt have to stay up so late, Guido if you moved to the states.

But youre right, even if you didnt hate your boss 20 years ago you would have learned to by now.

 

I think things have moved quickly since finishing the Gemini hardware and moving your instruments to DSP. That was perhaps the biggest task, I can imagine. Also, the Seven seemed to come out of nowhere, very much a surprise in design and concept. Not for everyone but definitely for the EP fan that wants to go digital. Would love to see the Gemini in a 73/76k synth action with waterfall keys just as long as you dont forget pitch and mod wheels for the synth engine. If thats not something on the radar then the desktop/rack hopefully is selling well enough to stay in production and get updates.

[AnotherScott]

Would love to see the Gemini in a 73/76k synth action with waterfall keys just as long as you dont forget pitch and mod wheels for the synth engine

Yeah, that would be pretty cool (esp. if it had aftertouch). And then, just as the Mojo61 has an optional "nothing but keys" lower manual, a similar lower "nothing but keys" attachment with 7x nice hammer action keys would probably give quite a few people exactly what they're looking for.

[Delaware Dave]

Guido, thanks for attempting to put the new piano in the gemini. Worth the update wait. Please consider adding a saxophone (which I use alot) and also consider a 7x key controller (w/ drawbars) with a built-in Gemini so that there are enough keys to play acoustic and EP's. Pick an action that allows a player to play both Organ and piano (i.e. semi-weighted). I have cash waiting for that board and I'm sure there are many others like me anxiously waiting for it.

[ChazKeys]

I'm working to fit the new AP model into the Gemini, for this reason I had to delay the new update... Otherwise it was ready by the 12th of March but wasn't released for this very reason.

 

 

Thank you Guido!

 

 

[kenheeter]

Guido,

We all really appreciate your efforts. The Gemini is already a monster module and you're going to make it even better!

 

 

[Jazz+]

Love to see the modeled AP as an option to replace the Combo Organs or the Pipe Organ in the Mojo 61 . Apparently there isnt room for it where the current dead AP occupies space.

[Jazz+]

Or a completely different acoustic piano sampled in Mono for live playing would be a great replacement for the current Mojo 61 AP resident.

[TomKittel]

I like the tempo at which GSI is improving and developing new vitual models

I'll be in the minority here but this is where I disagree. It is probably the right speed for a two man operation but as a consumer of one of their products I get frustrated at the speed of which things are brought to market and continued development. They introduced the burn pedal, four years later it is discontinued. They introduced the Gemini and other than one wave table expansion haven't added anything new. Yes they improved the clav (because it was out of tune and shouldn't have been to begin with), have yet to improve the acoustic piano, have yet to put the leslie improvement and other upgrades the Mojo has received into the Gemini (promised for March but not delivered)

 

This post reminds me on the fact that Guido for years promised a VB3 2.0 update (VST) but never delivered...

 

 

[TomKittel]

I'm sorry Dave but I don't get the disappointment. You should be buying an instrument on the basis for what it can do at the time of purchase. Not in the hopes that things will be made perfect in the future..... don't count on any updates or fixes, buy a board for what it is now, not what it has the potential to be.

 

 

That's true. On the other hand in our digital age software updates are an essential part of nearly every technical product, be it digital instruments, cars, phones or whatsoever...

[ChazKeys]

Apart from functional updates rather than purely 'sound' updates it's interesting to note that Nord are still using the C2D organ model from 2012 in their current line up - 6 years on. Not to mention the Electric Piano and Clavinet samples that are even older. The point I'm making is that it seems unreasonable to expect any company to upgrade the basic sound engine of the current model apart from doing some minor tweaks or providing new sound libraries.

 

The SV-1 and Motif XF/MOXF have never had their 'raw sound engines' updated apart from new sound packs that are just better edits of the existing samples. We are now in the world of DSPs where there is the flexibility to reprogram the entire instrument but that shouldn't mean we make unreasonable demands of the developer. The Seven, Mojo 61 and the Gemini were released with a fixed number of sound engines.

 

But hats off to Guido for trying!

[jimkost2002]

Love to see the modeled AP as an option to replace the Combo Organs or the Pipe Organ in the Mojo 61 . Apparently there isnt room for it where the current dead AP occupies space.

 

Um, no. Some of us actually USE the Combo organs in the real world. I play with Nigerian musicians who require that sound for Afrobeat and Afropop.

[DanL]

Love to see the modeled AP as an option to replace the Combo Organs or the Pipe Organ in the Mojo 61 . Apparently there isnt room for it where the current dead AP occupies space.

 

Um, no. Some of us actually USE the Combo organs in the real world. I play with Nigerian musicians who require that sound for Afrobeat and Afropop.

 

Right, let's have him remove "organs" from an "organ" keyboard to put in a piano that was an afterthought to begin with. lol. Ask 10 people what they want and you get 10 different ideas of what should be in there.

[DanL]

Apart from functional updates rather than purely 'sound' updates it's interesting to note that Nord are still using the C2D organ model from 2012 in their current line up - 6 years on. Not to mention the Electric Piano and Clavinet samples that are even older. The point I'm making is that it seems unreasonable to expect any company to upgrade the basic sound engine of the current model apart from doing some minor tweaks or providing new sound libraries.

 

The SV-1 and Motif XF/MOXF have never had their 'raw sound engines' updated apart from new sound packs that are just better edits of the existing samples. We are now in the world of DSPs where there is the flexibility to reprogram the entire instrument but that shouldn't mean we make unreasonable demands of the developer. The Seven, Mojo 61 and the Gemini were released with a fixed number of sound engines.

 

But hats off to Guido for trying!

 

Nord has released numerous pianos as recently as Dec 2017. The organ engine got tweaks when the Electro 5 came out with enhancements to the Leslie settings.

[mountainjammer]

If the hardware and interface is quality, I'd be happy to pay for significant upgrades (not fixes) to sounds once in a while. Do we really expect ongoing improvements for free and keep these guys in business?

[mountainjammer]

Would love to see the Gemini in a 73/76k synth action with waterfall keys just as long as you dont forget pitch and mod wheels for the synth engine

Yeah, that would be pretty cool (esp. if it had aftertouch). And then, just as the Mojo61 has an optional "nothing but keys" lower manual, a similar lower "nothing but keys" attachment with 7x nice hammer action keys would probably give quite a few people exactly what they're looking for.

Couldn't agree more! A compact combo of a hammer action removable "nothing but keys" bottom 73k board nicely integrated with Mojo 73k with 2 sets drawbars and Gemini sound module. Take the top board only or also bring the piano board - here's where you can afford to the weight of a TP-40L. That's my dream rig!

 

[Delaware Dave]

That's my dream rig!

 

here you go, just purchase a gemini and here is your dream rig:

 

https://www.musiciansfriend.com/keyboards-midi/orla-jamkey-controller