OT: The changing face of Malls and Retail

[Outkaster]

I dont post much off-topic stuff but I wondered if this is happening in other parts of the country? A local mall is becoming an Outlet Center. We talk sometimes here on the loss of the brick and mortar store so I thought this was kind of interesting:

 

Mall

[Synthoid]

Some malls have closed down. Quite sad.

 

 

 

http://petapixel.com/assets/uploads/2015/02/untitled.jpg

[RABid]

At one point Lexington, KY had three prosperous malls. Only one remains. It had to do a major renovation when the central anchor store closed and they could not find a new tenant. It is attracting restaurants like the Cheesecake Factory. Large restaurants seem to do better there than large stores. There is a large shopping area that helped put the two malls out of business. I hate going there because the layout is a mess. You drive from store to store and traffic can be a mess.

 

That seems to be the new trend. Create a large shopping area with multiple sections of outdoor shopping centers, lay out a road system that causes backups, and watch people stay at home and use Amazon.

[Synthoid]

That seems to be the new trend. Create a large shopping area with multiple sections of outdoor shopping centers, lay out a road system that causes backups, and watch people stay at home and use Amazon.

 

One of the malls in Delaware is like that. Ridiculous trying to navigate the parking lot. Fortunately, even after loosing a large anchor store (Strawbridge & Clothier) they found another and totally renovated the mall. Quite impressive.

 

Many new restaurants there as well in the last 5 years.

[The Real MC]

I travel a lot around the country. Malls are surviving better in some states. NY is not one of the better ones. In the past fifteen years I have seen entire malls and anchor stores close around the state. Macys just closed their store in the local mall, where the number of vacant storefronts is growing. You know a mall is in dire straits when one of the stores sells headstones.

 

It's not just the economy, it's the target market. Frankly there are way too many commodities in malls that appeal to women. The biggest retail profits are earned from impulse items. Women (esp teenagers) tend to be better impulse buyers so that is what the stores stock up on. A good 95% of the stores have no appeal to men at all, small wonder that men hate shopping. When men no longer enjoy accompanying their SOs to malls, patronage will go down.

 

And the new stores and plaza owners need to include some civil engineering to design parking lots and roads that are not hostile to vehicles. WalMart has been guilty of this many times. I refuse to patronize businesses that are too difficult to navigate in traffic. In a city near me, there is a two mile stretch of road with waaaaaaay too many traffic lights for the major retail stores and plazas. One plaza has three traffic lights alone! During rush hour I avoid that section like the plague, it is stop-crawl-stop-crawl-stop all the way. Due to the topology of the area (Ithaca NY) there is no place to build an alternate route for through traffic.

[bennyray]

I remember back in my younger days the mall was where alot of young people hung out or in some malls there was a club that had live entertainment in Atlanta, GA. Alot of malls are closed now. Changing times like music stores are closing and online shopping is becoming very popular.

[Threadslayer]

I remember back in my younger days the mall was where a lot of young people hung out or in some malls

They still do this in Southern California, except now they're called gangbangers.

[Lindaru]

The malls that do best around where I am are ones with multi-plex cinemas and large food courts attached to them.

 

Since we have to go 100 miles to get to the nearest one, we do our shopping locally or on line.

 

I have never wished for a large mall to be up here but I would not mind a Wal-Mart super store {dodging bricks}.

 

I remember that in addition for teenagers hanging out there, some people used to power walk for exercise before the malls got crowded later in the day.

 

 

[16251]

The way Amazon is going they will have a mall soon. First they loose tons of money at start up, now they have their own fleet delivering packages in Massachusetts. Next it will be a storefront, followed by bankruptcy.

[Daniel Wade]

I'm pretty sure my wife is doing her best to keep the Macey's at our mall going strong. Lol

 

As far as parking I've discovered the are usually two trains of thought. One is for convience and the other is to put as many spaces as possible in the area available.

 

A church I was attending at one time added a small triangular shaped parking area to the drop off area of the church and asked me to layout the striping for it. So I marked everything for angled parking. You pull in drop off someone and then just pull in as you drove one way around the parking area.

 

The pastor wanted more spaces and said straight parking would provide that, to which I replied "but how are you going to back out at the corners?" So they put in the angled parking and everyone was cool with it.

 

A few years later they restriped the lot and changed it to straight parking. (It added about 3 or 4 more spaces that way) Within a month it was changed back to the angled parking. The women at the church had become upset with the difficult straight layout, and needless to say, it was changed back.

 

So I guess some people just look at numbers, and other look at it logically, but not often.

[eric]

In my city (Richmond, VA), indoor malls are going the way of the dinosaur in favor of upscale outdoor venues that have pricey anchor tenants that attract a lot of attention. A few of the indoor malls in my area that were vibrant in the '70s-'80s have since been demolished or completed converted to outdoor settings.

 

I still think we have too much retail space per capita and it is sad to see when a relatively new mall starts to fall out of favor as it is being crowded out by trendier spots in the urban sprawl.

 

I avoid malls as much as possible.

[timwat]

Like many institutions that are long-in-the-tooth, retail shopping in aggregated malls represents a distribution model that has long history, cultural acceptance...and gross inefficiencies. They're the stockbroker of retail shopping. And eventually, they'll end up like stockbrokers, travel agents, bookstores, record stores...

 

Will it be immediate? Probably not. Will a handful remain? Sure. Geographic markets where real estate square footage opportunity cost is a premium is where the shopping mall may die first, but the death knell has already been sounded. The generation that will inherit the mantle of the dominant retail market force already accepts online as the preferred distribution channel for the two reasons that matter most: 1) cost and, 2) convenience.

 

RIP Shopping Mall. We loved thee long time.

[The Real MC]

Malls and modern plazas have become too homogenized. Traveling around the country, with few exceptions if you have seen one you have seen them all. Georgetown VA has a mall with a wonderfully different atmosphere and selection of stores. Syracuse NY has the Destiny USA Mall which is a huge expansion of what was formerly the Carousel Mall.

 

Shoppers don't have the disposable income due to the state of the economy so most of the store closures have been from disappointing holiday sales. The non-retail employment picture is so uncertain that citizens are piling up savings in case they lose their jobs.

[Synthoid]

I remember back in my younger days the mall was where alot of young people hung out

 

Back in the mid-70's we enjoyed hanging out at a huge mall near Lancaster, PA. There were (still are) four anchor stores and hundreds of other shops upstairs to keep the customers busy, plus its own internal TV station. But in the 70's, the real fun was downstairs with plenty of entertainment.

 

It's the only mall I've seen to offer theaters, an arcade, ice skating rink, miniature golf, bumper cars, and for a short time... go-karts on a wooden track. Quite impressive.

 

Unfortunately, all the fun stuff is gone today except for the arcade.

[Outkaster]

Malls and modern plazas have become too homogenized. Traveling around the country, with few exceptions if you have seen one you have seen them all. Georgetown VA has a mall with a wonderfully different atmosphere and selection of stores. Syracuse NY has the Destiny USA Mall which is a huge expansion of what was formerly the Carousel Mall.

 

Shoppers don't have the disposable income due to the state of the economy so most of the store closures have been from disappointing holiday sales. The non-retail employment picture is so uncertain that citizens are piling up savings in case they lose their jobs.

 

My nephew graduated from SU this year. I was there last year though for a gig and we went to Destiny which is one of the largest in the US. The place is huge. People come from all around to see that mall but I always wonder how sustainable it is. It seems most malls can't figure out how to change their business model.

[mate stubb]

I can't remember the last time I was in a mall willingly. Now that my wife has converted her retail shopping sport to Craigslist, even she avoids them now.

[lightbg]

I remember back in my younger days the mall was where alot of young people hung out

 

Back in the mid-70's we enjoyed hanging out at a huge mall near Lancaster, PA. There were (still are) four anchor stores and hundreds of other shops upstairs to keep the customers busy, plus its own internal TV station. But in the 70's, the real fun was downstairs with plenty of entertainment.

 

It's the only mall I've seen to offer theaters, an arcade, ice skating rink, miniature golf, bumper cars, and for a short time... go-karts on a wooden track. Quite impressive.

 

Unfortunately, all the fun stuff is gone today except for the arcade.

 

That wasn't Park City, was it? The wives used to go to the outlet stores and after we toured the PRR museum I seem to recall a mall that was laid out almost like a 5 pointed star - each hallway was huge and had anchor stores at the outer end.

 

I could be fuzzy on the details, but I thought it was just outside of Lancaster

 

Jake

 

Jake

[ksoper]

They've repurposed a couple of malls around Nashville. One is now a medical plaza owned by Vanderbilt. The other has been divided up into a public library, an ice rink, and a community college. This is a wonderful use of the space that had seen dramatic decline in the last 15 years. Glad to see people thinking outside the big box.

[Doerfler]

Malls are surviving better in some states.

I guess it depends on the demographics.

Tyson's Corner Center is the first Billion Dollar Property in the Washington DC area. Now that Markyboard has retired you can find him admiring the accessories in the Louis Vuitton store.

[Synthoid]

Back in the mid-70's we enjoyed hanging out at a huge mall near Lancaster, PA. There were (still are) four anchor stores and hundreds of other shops upstairs to keep the customers busy, plus its own internal TV station. But in the 70's, the real fun was downstairs with plenty of entertainment.

 

It's the only mall I've seen to offer theaters, an arcade, ice skating rink, miniature golf, bumper cars, and for a short time... go-karts on a wooden track. Quite impressive.

 

Unfortunately, all the fun stuff is gone today except for the arcade.

 

That wasn't Park City, was it? The wives used to go to the outlet stores and after we toured the PRR museum I seem to recall a mall that was laid out almost like a 5 pointed star - each hallway was huge and had anchor stores at the outer end.

 

We have a winner. Yes, it's Park City... but it's a "four-pointed star."

 

 

http://www.discoverlancaster.com/uploads/members/parkcity_center/park-city-center.jpg

 

[Markyboard]

Malls are surviving better in some states.

I guess it depends on the demographics.

Tyson's Corner Center is the first Billion Dollar Property in the Washington DC area. Now that Markyboard has retired you can find him admiring the accessories in the Louis Vuitton store.

 

Too funny! I almost posted early on how much I despise malls and shopping in general although I do understand and am concerned with the economic aspect....did I mention I hate malls?

 

My wife and I went to the Louis Vuitton Museum in Paris last year after finding the museum we intended to go to closed. I think I said something like let's see if this place has a handbag that matches my outfit . It's actually a very cool museum especially if you're into modern art.They had an asynchronous metronome exhibit that was very (cough) unique. The architecture is fabulous. See, I even talk like them now.

 

http://www.thefashionspot.com/assets/uploads/2014/06/louis-vuitton-institute.jpg

 

[ProfD]

Yep. Around these parts, it seems malls are being replaced with Town Centers. IIRC, that's kinda how they started out in the first place.

 

Regardless, younger people still like to hang out there especially for the movie theater and food court.

[J Graul]

At one point Lexington, KY had three prosperous malls. Only one remains. It had to do a major renovation when the central anchor store closed and they could not find a new tenant. It is attracting restaurants like the Cheesecake Factory. Large restaurants seem to do better there than large stores. There is a large shopping area that helped put the two malls out of business. I hate going there because the layout is a mess. You drive from store to store and traffic can be a mess.

 

That seems to be the new trend. Create a large shopping area with multiple sections of outdoor shopping centers, lay out a road system that causes backups, and watch people stay at home and use Amazon.

 

I would disagree that all three malls were that prosperous. Richmond Mall was hardly ever busy. In fact it kind of sucked. But I agree that the days of those indoor malls are coming to an end and the shopping messes like Hamburg are trending. Who are those idiot planners and engineers???

[Stokely]

The Florida trend seems to be outdoor malls...which I dislike. We have blazing sun following by a monsoon out of nowhere, plus driving and parking around them is dangerous.

 

I like malls for an indoor place to walk mostly...I can't say I have bought much from a mall recently. The exception is Dillards dept store--my wife goes berserk when they have clearance sales and in truth has gotten some insane deals. She used to do this thing where she'd buy a ton of stuff when it was "x% off, take x% more" clearance, then take it home...she'd say "don't touch this!" and wait for the final "take 40% additional" get-rid-of-it sale. She'd take all that stuff back in, return it and re-buy it. I have some leather jackets that were $400 that I got for about $35...LOL except it's Florida and I don't get to wear them much

 

Anyway, our small-ish mall is on life support. Movies and food court are the only busy areas, and if you go there on a weeknight it's pretty much empty of customers.

[Synthoid]

I like malls for an indoor place to walk mostly...

 

Park City Mall is great for this. Four long corridors and practically empty during the day. I stop in for the exercise when I'm in Lancaster. Avoiding the junk food is another matter, however.

[BenWaB3]

I remember back in my younger days the mall was where alot of young people hung out

 

Back in the mid-70's we enjoyed hanging out at a huge mall near Lancaster, PA. There were (still are) four anchor stores and hundreds of other shops upstairs to keep the customers busy, plus its own internal TV station. But in the 70's, the real fun was downstairs with plenty of entertainment.

 

It's the only mall I've seen to offer theaters, an arcade, ice skating rink, miniature golf, bumper cars, and for a short time... go-karts on a wooden track. Quite impressive.

 

Unfortunately, all the fun stuff is gone today except for the arcade.

 

I moved to Lancaster in 1979 & remember that lower level (it's still there but is a food court, Kohl's dept. store & a few sundry small shops). What I remember most though is that they had 2 theaters in that level, a regular one & one that showed, GASP IN HORROR, the pornos!! Not that I, ahem, ever, ummm, frequented that establishment, harrumph. Yeah, I guess you can say all the fun stuff is gone

[jazzpiano88]

Some malls have closed down. Quite sad.

 

Yes. This is happening to the Vallco Mall in Cupertino, CA.

 

It is sad in a way. I grew up with them, but when you think back, they were so tacky and over the top. When I think of indoor shopping malls, I think of the Blues Brothers, Redstone Movie Theaters, Karmelcorn, Musicland, Waldenbooks, Merry go Round, and Sears ("Hey is that a Sears Poncho?").

 

Some were quite the destinations like "Old Chicago" and "Mall of America"

I remember riding the indoor amusement park inside Old Chicago as a kid.

 

http://www.mallofmemphis.org/images//karmelkornfront.jpg

[Synthoid]

 

http://www.mallofmemphis.org/images//karmelkornfront.jpg

 

Must be a German business.

[The Real MC]

 

http://www.mallofmemphis.org/images//karmelkornfront.jpg

 

Must be a German business.

 

Based in Syracuse NY, and reeeeeeally good popcorn.

[Synthoid]

I was referring to the spelling.