Damn. I pedal too much.

[CEB]

Grrrrrrrrrrr. It"s subconscious error. I"m not thinking. Not in control.

 

Another reason to play Bach. No pedal.

 

I need to play something. My hands way out of shape. 3-4 hour gig would kill me. Thought I would revisit Grieg"s Lyric Pieces.

[Dave Bryce]

Spend some time working on your organ chops. That helps me.

 

Every once in a while, I spend a bit of time playing a few tunes (different styles) on the piano while consciously keeping my foot entirely off the sustain pedal. Talk about something that'll make you pay attention pretty quick.

 

dB

[CEB]

Yes. Great post.

 

I"m a toe tapper by nature. You can guess what one of my biggest issues was when I started playing organ. ð. Those rhythmic volume swells were not cool.

[16251]

This thread reminds me of a "remember when story," (Tony Soprano's least favorite thing to do.)

 

I was enrolled at Berklee and was in a big band ensemble run by Bob Rose. After many weeks, we went into studio to record. Without any warning Bob was in control room and right before we recorded first song, he spoke into mike and called it "Peter's, tie my legs to the piano stool blues." because he often had to remind me I was pedal crazy. Good times.

[Adan]

A couple years ago the piano in one of the bars I play lost it's sustain pedal function and it took them about 4 months to get it fixed. That's happened in other places I've played (which tells you something about my level of performance). Having zero pedal is definitely not good, but I'd argue that being forced to compensate in that situation makes you a better piano player.

[Mr. Nightime]

Another way to help with your pedal usage. Disconnect it. Forces you to use your hands for legato passages rather than rely on the pedal.

 

I'm really bad about the pedal as well. I just got Pianoteq working on my new computer, and was watching the graphic of the pedals while it played a piece that I had recently recorded.

 

The sustain pedal was pressed probably 90% of the time. Time for me to take my own advice.

[Markyboard]

Funny, I have the opposite problem when I switch over to organ. I often forget to use the pedal in the midst of trying to play the keys, drawbars, Leslie switch and bass pedals. I'll eventually catch myself but It's still a conscious effort where as with piano the sustain pedal comes natural.

[EscapeRocks]

My pure piano playing technique improved by chance a couple years ago after a gig.

 

My trusty sustain pedal went south after the 4th song. For once I did not have my backup. it showed me I relied too much on the pedal instead of good technique on the keys.

 

I made it thru that gig then immediately started practicing at home without a sustain plugged in. Of course many songs make use of sustain, but not the the way I was using it. I had to retrain my ear a bit. After a while, and listening to recordings, my piano sound were much better defined.

 

Interesting thought: I do not have the issue of over use of sustain when playing my Steinway at home. Perhaps the natural vibrations and hall feeling of the big open lid are the reason.

That also taught me to go and really dial in the "color" and "hall space" parameters in my VST pianos. My pianos were too dry....perhaps another cause of my overuse of sustain.

[Markyboard]

One of my pet peeves is hearing synths played using too long envelope release times. I wonder if the underlying cause is related.

[Doc Tonewheel]

Grrrrrrrrrrr. It"s subconscious error. I"m not thinking. Not in control.

 

Another reason to play Bach. No pedal.

 

I need to play something. My hands way out of shape. 3-4 hour gig would kill me. Thought I would revisit Grieg"s Lyric Pieces.

 

My teacher says, "A sustain pedal often hides a multitude of sins." She always has me practicing a Bach piece in my repertoire (no pedal ever!). Inventions and the WTC are invaluable, and when I do play other pieces that use the pedal, I find I am much more restrained and the pieces don't sound muddied.

[Throbert]

yea I can get pretty muddy if I don't keep my foot to myself.

Just have to keep depedaling more consistent than otherwise.

[Dave Bryce]

A couple years ago the piano in one of the bars I play lost it's sustain pedal function and it took them about 4 months to get it fixed.

Okay, get this:

 

I went to Boston University as a threatre performance major. Julianne Moore (then Julie Smith) was in my classes, but that's another story.

 

BU School of Fine Arts policy dictated that freshmen were not allowed to be cast in shows...but one of the grad students wanted to direct a musical called Piano Bar and he felt I was the best piano playing student at SFA, so they got me permission to do the show. They put the show on at a bar in Allston, MA called the Silhouette Lounge. Opening night, the bar was packed, my parents even came up from Philly to see it (the piano player is a starring role).

 

So, about two songs into the first set, I feel the sustain pedal stop working in the middle of the song (not one I was singing, thank goodness). As soon as the song stops, I try to check out what's going on with the (upright) piano I'm playing as discreetly as possible while there's a show happeniong all around me, and I can sort of see the pedal is disconnected from the mechanism inside the piano that lifts the dampers. I realize there's no way to fix it until intermission without stopping the show, and do the rest of the first act (including accompanying myself in an introspective solo tune ) with no freaking sustain pedal, trying as hard as I could to stay in character while basically being the only instrument accompanying everybody.

 

That was all kinds of fun.

 

dB

[Joe P]

I went to a small concert in a museum featuring an old local jazzer on baby grand piano, along with an ac. bass player and sax player. I was talking to him afterwards, he was in his mid 80's, great player, dressed kind of like Donald Fagen. I remarked how I noticed he rarely, if ever, used the sustain pedal. His reply: "Aw man, a sustain pedal can kill a groove, man".

 

Ever since, in a rock band context I use very little sustain. It's made me a more percussive player and I think clearer in the mix.

 

Joe

[Baldwin Funster]

Said the lazy unicyclist.

[MAJUSCULE]

I'm almost happy now when I forget a sustain for solo gigs.

[Mark Schmieder]

It's funny to read this, as my fault is that I rarely use the sustain pedal at all! I've been trying to think of ways to get myself to use it more, but I tend to use it more on staccato passages (such as my contribution to the Quarantunes Volume I) as a way of tightly controlling the relationship between neighbouring chords and stacked notes, than on legato melodic passages, where I am more inclined to use my hands alone.

 

To be clear, the pedaling I'm talking about here is half-damper and VERY quick vs. long pedaling for sustain.

 

I asked my Mom about this before she died, and she said that few composers marked the pedaling because they felt that was up to interpretation, with the exception of a lot of the impressionistic composers who had very specific pedaling in mind, and possibly some of the 20th century composers as well (I hadn't thought about Grieg as my Mom played LOTS of Grieg but used the pedal more on staccato passages).

 

Regardless of "pedal too much" or "pedal too little", my rule on all things musical is to think like a singer (and/or drummer), and let that inform my decisions.

[ElmerJFudd]

Depends on the music, no? Pedal is important for solo piano playing especially - not just for sustain but the timbre of the piano changes when the dampers are off. Much more rich sounding.

 

Upbeat songs, dance tracks, rhythm patterns - pedal off ya? or it gets muddy sounding and the attack is lost in the mix.

When I hear, I pedal too much - it brings sounds of chords/harmonies bleeding into each other because the pedal isn't getting a lift when it needs to.

Is there another definition of pedaling too much?

[cedar]

I think it's over-pedaling is extremely common, for whatever reason. I know I'm often guilty of it.

[Markyboard]

Is there another definition of pedaling too much?

 

Well yeah since I initially thought the op was talking B3 type organ.

 

And of course there"s always these guys:

 

[ElmerJFudd]

That's a lot of pedals!

[MAJUSCULE]

I haven't watered the flowers in a few days and now there are less petals.

[ElmerJFudd]

In college I pedaled/peddled encyclopedias door to door. My pop told me it would build character.

 

[pinkfloydcramer]

I have resolved to do way less piano pedaling (worst offender status) and way more organ pedaling. Simple stuff like Pomp and Circumstance, Whiter Shade etc. Whoops, wrong thread...

[TommyRude]

A little late to this thread. I recalled a performance on the Stern show, Burton Cummings came on and played some of his hits. It sounded like to me the sustain got stuck on, and Burton just powered through without blinking. I'm not sure if it was stuck or if he was just riding it?

[video:youtube]

[Mark Schmieder]

Hah; it was probably the notorious polarity mismatch between a Yamaha sustain pedal and a Roland keyboard. :-)

 

Thanks for posting that; Burton Cummings is one of my heroes, and he did my favourite two Guess Who songs, "Undun" and "Share the Land".

[Adan]

No mention so far about use of piano sustain in hard rock . . .

 

. . . aka Pedal to the Metal.

[Mark Schmieder]

Aw man, did you have to do that? That's on my list of songs that I haven't written yet (I keep a list in reserve).

[Mark Schmieder]

Aren't there laws against people who are pedalphiles?

[pianomike]

What type of piano is that , I have seen Burton Cummings on YouTube playing newer pianos , and that old one sounds a lot better than the newer one's . I just have to say , he is an amazing talent .

[vonnor]

I sat in on Drift Away with a local band a while back, the guy had a Rhodes with no pedal. It was quite an adjustment for me. The guy had very fast fingers.

 

~ vonnor