New: Casio PX 7000/6000

[franky64]

22 hours ago, ElmerJFudd said:

They’ll be interested in a 5S again at some point I hope.  Get that action quieter and remove the jiggle without wrecking how it plays and that’s a win.  
 

Shoot me a message with the editor you’re using.  I took the VR out for a gig last week.  I’d be interested to see what’s possible.  👍

doubt 5S '2.0' is on Casios marketing plans for the near future, apparently they dropped the 'classic stage key' segment (personally no grieve about, it's their decision and 5S will serve for many more years ...) 

VR700: funny - weeks ago I took it to rehearsal instead of VR09 and it kicked in - organ sound, drawbars - but also acoustic piano: after some work on the 'hacked' sympathetic resonance MFX playing on parameters like semi-graphical 3-band EQ, lid opening, etc - the initially thin and boxy Grand transformed into a decent and full sounding AP   The actual editor version is marked 'beta' (e.g. the integrated html-manual is not yet updated) but the functionality is stable.
All settings of 'free Cosm MFX hack' save to Favorites, so there's unlimited possibilties for sound creation, e.g. adding amp/speakers models (guitar stacks, JazzChorus etc) to EPs or 'double-layer' a synth sound, detune each layer aka 'oscillator' like in analog synths and add MFX ... etc etc  etc. 

Yeah, and maybe there'll be a redesign next year to make the editor more user-friendly  
https://v-combo.webspace.rocks/roland-vr700-v-combo-editor 

[ElmerJFudd]

5 minutes ago, franky64 said:

doubt 5S '2.0' is on Casios marketing plans for the near future, apparently they dropped the 'classic stage key' segment (personally no grieve about, it's their decision and 5S will serve for many more years ...) 

VR700: funny - weeks ago I took it to rehearsal instead of VR09 and it kicked in - organ sound, drawbars - but also acoustic piano: after some work on the 'hacked' sympathetic resonance MFX playing on parameters like semi-graphical 3-band EQ, lid opening, etc - the initially thin and boxy Grand transformed into a decent and full sounding AP   The actual editor version is marked 'beta' (e.g. the integrated html-manual is not yet updated) but the functionality is stable.
All settings of 'free Cosm MFX hack' save to Favorites, so there's unlimited possibilties for sound creation, e.g. adding amp/speakers models (guitar stacks, JazzChorus etc) to EPs or 'double-layer' a synth sound, detune each layer aka 'oscillator' like in analog synths and add MFX ... etc etc  etc. 

Yeah, and maybe there'll be a redesign next year to make the editor more user-friendly  
https://v-combo.webspace.rocks/roland-vr700-v-combo-editor 

Great info… I stumbled on this as well same software I believe. 

 

https://ctrlr.org/roland-vr09-vr730-v-combo-editor/

[franky64]

2 hours ago, ElmerJFudd said:

Great info… I stumbled on this as well same software I believe. 

 

https://ctrlr.org/roland-vr09-vr730-v-combo-editor/

korrrrekt unfortunately ctrlr.org has been abandonned by its owner and we, the 'panel developpers', cannot upload new panels anymore. For this reason CTRLR based editors for VR09/730 and VR700 are continued at  https://v-combo.webspace.rocks
Once made a 'on-the-run' (excuse timing-messed playing) demo of a layered, 'detuned' and slightly MFXed synth patch. Dunno if it's the DACs or the waveforms, but 700 is capable of deep retro Marillion style sounds *love*.

[ElmerJFudd]

1 minute ago, franky64 said:

korrrrekt unfortunately ctrlr.org has been abandonned by its owner and we, the 'panel developpers', cannot upload new panels anymore. For this reason CTRLR based editors for VR09/730 and VR700 are continued at  https://v-combo.webspace.rocks
Once made a 'on-the-run' (excuse timing-messed playing) demo of a layered, 'detuned' and slightly MFXed synth patch. Dunno if it's the DACs or the waveforms, but 700 is capable of deep retro Marillion style sounds *love*.

That, sir is a highly useful poly synth patch!  Thanks for filling me in!  

[SonicKeysII]

Can anyone who bought the PXS 6000 comment on using it on the stage with a band?

[bill5]

I have no thoughts on this topic, I'm just trying to bump the parody jokey threads down   

[Sam CA]

Unboxing/assembling the S7000 & Demoing Various Presets - By Leon

 

 

 

 

[SonicKeysII]

I keep hearing solo playing (mostly piano) but am interested in what it can do in a band context.  Why replace my PX-560 or my Yamaha P125 for that matter? Has no one taken this board for a test ride in a jazz trio or wedding band yet?  The silence is deafening.  Perhaps, the board has not really made it into the hands of too many players yet.        

[Dockeys]

3 hours ago, SonicKeysII said:

I keep hearing solo playing (mostly piano) but am interested in what it can do in a band context.  Why replace my PX-560 or my Yamaha P125 for that matter? Has no one taken this board for a test ride in a jazz trio or wedding band yet?  The silence is deafening.  Perhaps, the board has not really made it into the hands of too many players yet.        

It’s still a very new keyboard. I’m not sure many places are even stocking it to be honest? Most of the reviews I see these days are solo piano oriented with possibly the exception of Mexkeys? Italian guy who does excellent reviews. He frequently reviews keyboards in a band context….while playing all the other instruments too. Maybe he’ll have a demo soon?

[JDBlackhawk]

I own and play three very different hammer action boards, and have played quite a few others over the years. an RH-2 Korg (which is really a modified graded TP-40 Fatar) A Casio PX560 and 575, and 2 TP-40 Fusions.  I trained on Steinways, and have played many gigs-organ and piano parts (always 2 keys for this-hammer and spring-action otherwise I'd have been totally drippled by now) and have recently started rekindling my classical chops as I don't anticipate doing much gigging real soon, but maybe if this pandemic ever really goes away-I just had Covid when i least expected it would happen this past December crap!

 

One thing that concerns me, the reason I've stayed with the older boards-is durability-and for me keythrow is critical. I like to feel "depth" in a key like a real grand, and a long-throw for classical-although yes it requires alot more attention to using your arms, hands wrists and fingers more carefully with any digital than even with the best grands IMO if I don't want to cripple my chops. If i had to play 3-4 sets a night 70-80 songs or more in a gig-no question I would prefer more key "depth' for hard repetitive playing, and i have carpal tunnel from digitals-all of them.

 

The durability issue-these TP40s are over 15 years old, and the action on these has never deteriorated, never changed. Not a grand piano sensation completely, but I can sink my fingers into these better than others. Nothing worse than slamming my fingers and hands into a rock-solid keybed bottom. That's what i miss most transitioning from a true acoustic grand to any digital. I will wait to see if these newest Casios hold up-I still don't trust the engineering plastic alot of the manufacturers seem to favor in designing lightweight boards-including the newest Kurzweil 88s if I'm not mistaken. I like the concept of wooden keys, but unless the action is rock-solid and drop-dead quiet and has an escapement like the Casio GPs or a few others which I have yet to try, ansd will hold up over at least a year or two, I'm not too excited about these Casios yet. I like yellow mustard on my German frankfurters, not on my German piano.

[Nathanael_I]

The Nord Grand has the action you seek, JDBlackhawk.  

[stoken6]

also @JDBlackhawk TP40s are available on newer boards. Nord uses them in its 88s (except the Grand) and the Piano 73. Kurzweil K2700. Plus recently-discontinued boards from Studiologic (and others I can't think of). So it's still in use despite the age of the design.

 

What is your concern with sticking with your existing boards, and why are you looking to try the Casios?

 

@Nathanael_I's Nord Grand suggestion is a good one. I would point you at the TP/400 action in Studiologic Numa X Piano GT (and others?), plus mid-upper Kawais. Yamaha p515 is also highly rated. 

 

Cheers, Mike.

[Nathanael_I]

The Nord Grand does not have aftertouch.  It bottoms exactly like an acoustic piano.  That was the reason for my recommendation.   The P515 has a springy bottom, like a synth with monophonic aftertouch.  The P515 is excellent (has better samples than the Nord Grand, though not as varied).  I find the Kawai and Yamaha actions far ahead of all variants of the TP/40, but this is all preference at some level. 

[b3plyr]

16 hours ago, Nathanael_I said:

The Nord Grand has the action you seek, JDBlackhawk.  

Maybe….. The problem I have with my Nord Grand is it does not have escapement. My Numa X GT does and also has a great (of course my opinion) feel.

[JDBlackhawk]

At this point-after...very carefully listening to so many acoustic piano simulations, demos, pianoteq, other large virtual piano libraries plus all the major workstation type stage pianos etc. I don't hear such a remarkable difference in the quality of the acoustic piano samples at the level of these workstations. Many are excellent and there are subtle improvements (but Gem had these piano models in their DRAKE designs years ago,  harmonic resonance, half-pedaling features are not totally new.

 

I seem to favor the Nord piano and the newest Kawai MP7SE because the attacks seem less "brittle". The Kawai seems to have a slightly different action than many of the other weighted designs-with a so-called semi "escapement" action that is supposed to improve the real feel of the key rebound, and can still be carted around-not too easily it is around 50 pounds.

 

i haven't found a big improvement with the "triple-strike" keyboard designs for playability. I have less trouble executing Chopin turns and trills with the older RH-II than the TP-40 in the Fusions or the Casio PX-560 but so much of these preferences are dependent upon each player's individual technique. Stevie Ray Vaughan loved heavy-gauge strings and a high action on his guitars-and he managed somehow😀 If i got a good Fatar without defects-I still favor a metal structure in a gigging board and so many of the newest workstations are now going over to plastic, for the bodies and keyframes too. Why the Kurzweil K2700 is more expensive than the PC4-suspiciously i till can't find a picture of the inside mechanism of the PC-4. I am thinking from reading other posts-the key action on the PC4 is definitely not as responsive as the K2700, and i believe it is a basically plastic-construction key assembly.

 

I'd just gotten info from a source I will not share but whose opinion I trust and who has demoed many of the keys I'm looking at (listening too more accurately) since i haven't had a chance to get to a live music retailer in years. The newest S-7000/6000 Casios are using the same compacted/shortened keythrow as the other slim-line Casios. Might not matter to some. With my carpal problems, I am staying away from that design.

[U.Honey]

On 1/30/2023 at 1:18 PM, b3plyr said:

Maybe….. The problem I have with my Nord Grand is it does not have escapement. My Numa X GT does and also has a great (of course my opinion) feel.

 

Is that true that Nord Grand does not have escapement? I though it has the same keyed as Kawai MP11SE and that one does have escapement.

[AnotherScott]

43 minutes ago, U.Honey said:

 

Is that true that Nord Grand does not have escapement? I though it has the same keyed as Kawai MP11SE and that one does have escapement.

It is a non-graded variant of the action in the MP7SE, not MP11SE (which presumably would have resulted in a much heavier board).

[U.Honey]

2 hours ago, AnotherScott said:

It is a non-graded variant of the action in the MP7SE, not MP11SE (which presumably would have resulted in a much heavier board).

Ok, thanks for clarifying.

[SonicKeysII]

This thread has gone quiet.  Anything anyone wants to add in light of Yammy's CK boards which just came out.  I would love to hear some comments from someone who is gigging with the Casio boards in a band as compared to a solo act, playing a diversity of sounds.  

[b3plyr]

On 2/23/2023 at 1:27 PM, AnotherScott said:

It is a non-graded variant of the action in the MP7SE, not MP11SE (which presumably would have resulted in a much heavier board).

Just saw this. I have a Nord Grand and it does not have escapement. Nord told me it was removed but would not tell me why. This is one reason I am getting rid of the Grand. I expected, as Scott initially surmised, that it would have escapement.

[AnotherScott]

Ah, so that's (at least) a second change made between the Nord and Kawai versions of that Kawai action. (I did not mean to imply  that the non-gradedness was necessarily the only difference, it was just  the only one I was definitely aware  of.)

[RDM]

 

[ElmerJFudd]

25 minutes ago, RDM said:

 

That’s interesting.  So he feels the Casio - though quite light feeling (where an actual piano would be more substantial) and perhaps not the best piano sample of the lot - there is an action to sound connection that he enjoyed to play. 👍

[AUSSIEKEYS]

Thanks RDM a great shootout. 

 

I found the Numa's piano sound  to my liking. To me it seemed more alive.

 

Having said that all sound great in his hands.

 

And Id certainly not throw any of those 4 patches out of my (key)bed

[CHarrell]

I commented a few weeks ago about the PXS7000 that I got to try out; I want to clarify my remarks. The negativity I had towards them was only aimed at the price, as I don't think the upgrades from the previous generation warranted such a stark jump in cost. However, though the action is indeed very light, the action-sound connection was very well-aligned...I didn't have my iPad on me to try out how it felt as a controller, but even the lowly 1100 I tried in that setup was shockingly satisfying, so I can imagine worst case scenario 5/6/7000 feel just as good, best case it feels even better.

[CHarrell]

Got to try out the 7000 again, and uh...turns out it feels very nice 😅. I was surprised by the level of dynamics I was able to get from the samples too, not bad _at all_. Knowing the feature list of 6000, I came in with a good idea on how to operate the 7000, or so I thought...they really do consider the 7000 for a "typical" home player, 'cause features such as the DSP section are nowhere to be seen. If you're thinking of getting the 7000 because it has the most pianos, etc, be careful and make sure the features you'd sacrifice from a lower tier aren't dealbreakers.

 

My new CP88 has some jank-ish keys, as did my YC from a month-ish ago 🥲, so I think I'm gonna give Yamaha a rest and snag the 6000. I was gonna use it as a controller, but honestly the internal sounds might be good enough to play at a gig solo!

[pianomikeoct]

I agree with Aussie keys that the Numax piano sounds the most alive out of the bunch but I understand what Mike Patrick is saying about the action and the sound on the Numa X might feel a little off together but it is really an easy piano to play and you can get it to feel more comfortable playing when you tweak the sounds. One thing they did not go into was bang for your buck , and the Numa X is a great light weight gigging piano with a lot of usable sounds. I played out with mine this past summer with a guitar player that sings and the NumaX piano did great  making everything sound full with the ability to have three or four sounds playing together all at once which some of the songs called for, and for playing piano leads it was nice to have such a quick action. I wished they would have put the Crummier seventeen into the test because it has pretty nice piano sounds , talking about the Venice Grand , the Steinway is pretty nice also, but the Seventeen has beautiful electric piano sounds , I own the both of them and for just sitting down and playing the Crummier Seventeen is my favorite and the action is the tp 100 but it feels completely different then the tp100 action on the, the Dexibell that I had.

[Dockeys]

Reviving this thread as looking at some of these casio boards…maybe the 6000 or the updated 3100. Does anyone know is Bluetooth midi on these an ample substitute for an audio interface? I

 

I know previous comments from Mike Martin said they didn’t have an audio interface but if I was using AUM on my iPad and connected to the 6000 via the Bluetooth midi could i have the iPad sounds coming through the 6000 outputs/speakers? 
 

 

[D. Gauss]

12 minutes ago, Dockeys said:

Reviving this thread as looking at some of these casio boards…maybe the 6000 or the updated 3100. Does anyone know is Bluetooth midi on these an ample substitute for an audio interface? I

 

I know previous comments from Mike Martin said they didn’t have an audio interface but if I was using AUM on my iPad and connected to the 6000 via the Bluetooth midi could i have the iPad sounds coming through the 6000 outputs/speakers? 
 

 

Sub for an audio interface? no, not really. (Come on Casio, it's 2024 and Yamaha has had you beat for almost 10 years in this area.)

 

However, on the plus side, the Casio midi over bluetooth into an IPAD works great! (this is with the casio ct-s1000v but i'm sure it's the same with the 6000).

You just (annoyingly) have to get the IPAD audio out of the IPAD and back into the casio via a clusterf*ck that is dongles and wires, line in volumes, and hubs and stuff depending on your needs. (Thanks again,  Casio & Apple ).    i.e. I keep buying old IPhone 6's off craigslist just for the headphone jack out.

 

Meanwhile, i just use one usb cable out of my ipad or phone to turn my old yamaha p125 into a powerful little beast. 

[Dockeys]

Appreciate the quick reply. Yeah I thought it probably wouldn’t be as seamless. I’m working off the iPad Pro which is another one lacking the 3.5mm headphone out. USB C which I imagine involves dongle city. I have the CP73 and it works nicely with one cable like you have setup. Just looking to get an 88 note which is light ish and can connect to the iPad without buying another interface. 👍