Yamaha CP88 and 73 - Deserve their own thread

[dazzjazz]

I’m late to this party - Dave did you end up disliking the CP4? I still love mine. Is the CP88 that much better? Keen to hear your thoughts and those of others who have owned both. 

[Doerfler]

Dave Ferris Yamaha Dealership 

[ElmerJFudd]

22 minutes ago, Doerfler said:

Dave Ferris Yamaha Dealership 

😊 

 

Most of the other guys have to figure out how to design a decent digital piano action.  Although quite a few now have some really nice sounding Yamaha, Steinway and various other sample libraries.  Some almost as detailed as the better software ones.  😉

[Nordude]

Sort of being a late convert. I've owned a CP73 for 9 months now, and like some of the Rhodes EPs and its portability factor. But: bad organs, and decent though less inspiring APs than the Nords Piano Library offerings.

But now, I've discovered the possibilities of having an USB midi and audio interface. For EUR 45, I bought both the iOS versions of VB3m by GSI and MKSensation Extreme, put them onto my iPad Pro (2018) which always accompanies me on gigs (mainly jazz, sometimes pop/soul/funk covers) because of ForScore. Using a simple USB-C to USB-A-adapter (Apple brand, EUR 25) and a simple printer USB-A to USB-B cable, I upgraded the CP73 with lots of useful sounds. Now, Grandpa has entered the iPerformance domain, and this offers a huge plus for every master keyboard instrument that has USB-audio/MIDI-interface. 1 (adapter + ) cable, no hassle. Whohooh!
Especially cool on a pretty portable instrument which has good to great APs and EPs as well. And fine master keyboard features, for instance pitch bend and modulation levers. (Would have preferred wheels, though).

Studiologic (Numa Piano X) and Yamaha (and some newer Rolands?) have hit a spot for me, by including such USB midi+audio interface functionality.
If I were Clavia/Nord, I'd introduce MIDI ánd audio over USB as well...

Let the iExploration commence! :)

(does anyone know of a double manual organ (controller) which offers MIDI and audio over USB as well?)

[D. Gauss]

Question for those of you with a CP73 or CP88...   is the output level the same from the 1/4 puts vs the XLR outs? i.e. is the XLR hotter in level (+4), or are they the same? thanks in advance.

[AnotherScott]

33 minutes ago, D. Gauss said:

Question for those of you with a CP73 or CP88...   is the output level the same from the 1/4 puts vs the XLR outs? i.e. is the XLR hotter in level (+4), or are they the same? 

I can't answer the +4 aspect, but the XLRs are balanced while the 1/4 are not, so you would pick up some increased level from the XLRs just by virtue of that (assuming that you're making a balanced connection on the other side).

[Doerfler]

I have not used the balance outs on my CP73, but I did use them on my CP4.  Assuming they (CP4, CP88, CP73) are the same, the balanced outs on my CP4 were "hotter", which I found to be more clear and pronounced. I really try not to use the word better, as it is subjective, but it might be used here.

[D. Gauss]

hotter.  thanks.

[time4jazz]

2 hours ago, AnotherScott said:

…the XLRs are balanced while the 1/4 are not, so you would pick up some increased level from the XLRs just by virtue of that (assuming that you're making a balanced connection on the other side).

Please excuse my ignorance, but why is this the case?  Thanks

[CyberGene]

1 hour ago, time4jazz said:

Please excuse my ignorance, but why is this the case?  Thanks

Balanced output carries the same signal twice (inverted polarity on one of the lines). The receiving end then inverts one of them to make them both with the same polarity and sums them. So you end up with doubled signal. In the process, any noise would be eliminated because it would negate itself (since noise caused by interference would present itself with the same polarity at both lines and when you invert one of them, the summing will double the signal and subtract the noise). 

[CyberGene]

Jeff Lorber’s way of Rhodes soloing has always been one of my favorites (after Herbie Hancock). It speaks a lot to me that he chose the CP88 for piano and Rhodes duties 👍🏻

[SamuelBLupowitz]

35 minutes ago, CyberGene said:

Jeff Lorber’s way of Rhodes soloing has always been one of my favorites (after Herbie Hancock). It speaks a lot to me that he chose the CP88 for piano and Rhodes duties 👍🏻

I gotta say, I’m generally more of a Wurli guy in my music, but the Rhodes on the CP88 really speaks to me. I use it for electric piano sounds on a gig whenever I can.

[1203]

1 hour ago, CyberGene said:

Jeff Lorber’s way of Rhodes soloing has always been one of my favorites (after Herbie Hancock). It speaks a lot to me that he chose the CP88 for piano and Rhodes duties 👍🏻

Would be interesting to know, which Rhodes sample from the CP88 he plays…?

[jazzpiano88]

12 hours ago, Dave Ferris said:

Jeff is playing great too these days, always was a fan. I only wish "smooth jazz" would've continued in the direction of the pioneers like Jeff, The Crusaders, Joe Sample, Bob James, Grover Washington, Stanley Turrentine and others, instead of veering off the path and becoming instrumental pop music with calculated eight bar solos.

 

I've also always been a major fan and agree with your comments about smooth jazz at the time.  I was first exposed to Jeff when a band I was in played a couple of his tunes in the 80s -- Rain Dance and Lava Lands.  Talk about a gas!!

 

Rain Dance with Freddie Hubbard Flugelhorn is just killer and Jeff's piano solo is so sweet:  

[ewall08530]

I’ve been a big fan of Jeff Lorber since the early 90’s and seen him live a few times. He always had some version of a Yamaha Motif. An upgrade to a CP88 seems pretty logical to me.  

[Mills Dude]

20 hours ago, Dave Ferris said:

Jeff is playing great too these days, always was a fan. I only wish "smooth jazz" would've continued in the direction of the pioneers like Jeff, The Crusaders, Joe Sample, Bob James, Dave Grusin, Grover Washington, Stanley Turrentine and others, instead of veering off the path and becoming instrumental pop music with calculated eight bar solos.

Amen to that.  I was lucky when I was young, my older sister (not a player) was into that 70's early "smooth" jazz.  I grew up hearing a lot of Jeff Lorber, Spyrogyra, etc.  Then the drum machines took over and squashed all the life out of it. Tom Schuman is another great Rhodes player.

 

6 hours ago, ewall08530 said:

I’ve been a big fan of Jeff Lorber since the early 90’s and seen him live a few times. He always had some version of a Yamaha Motif. An upgrade to a CP88 seems pretty logical to me.  

Something about that original Motif that made it great for his style.  Jeff likes to hit it hard when he gets going and pull a lot of bark out of the Rhodes.  The action on the Motif could really bring that out.  But like we say with all great players, he could probably sit down at a $100 keyboard and you'd instantly know it was him.

[Sergievsky]

Does anyone know if the powersupply in a CP88 (usa) is autovolt? It’s 110, but so was my Korg Triton & turns out it was autovolt even thoughit wasnt labeled that way. I have it hooked up to a small transformer now, but dread the day someone accidently plugs it to 220 w/o the transformer. I’d rather not open it up and look,

[ElmerJFudd]

11 hours ago, Dave Ferris said:

I am SO tempted to get #3 after a gig on Monday night where it was difficult getting the P-515 in the Soundwear case (that fit the CP4 & CP88 like a glove). Plus there were some steps involved with the stage and the new bionic replacement knee felt a little dicey going down. It didn't help that it was late and I was tired.

 

Of course I could just get a larger case but....48 lbs. and I'm just 102 days out from the big Seven Zero. Sh!t ain't getting any easier, even being in great shape.

 

Sort waiting to see if Yamaha  comes out with anything at NAMM. In the meantime.....

That’s why I keep a PX560 handy for situations w where I’ll have to drag the piano  around multiple times in one venue.  The other one I’d consider is the ES120.  The actions are responsive enough and if not satisfied with the samples - stick Keyscape’s Yamaha C7 or the Garritan CFX on a Laptop. 

[ProfD]

On 12/19/2022 at 12:54 PM, Mills Dude said:

Jeff likes to hit it hard when he gets going and pull a lot of bark out of the Rhodes.  The action on the Motif could really bring that out.  But like we say with all great players, he could probably sit down at a $100 keyboard and you'd instantly know it was him.

True. Jeff Lorber is one of those musicians with a signature playing style. Upon hearing it, you know it's him or somebody else copping his flavor. The KB instrument he chooses to play doesn't matter when it's in his hands.😎

[Coker]

Dave, we all appreciate how you are keeping the market for CP88s liquid.  If you keep buying and selling them, you’re going to have to get a retail license!

[jazzpiano88]

34 minutes ago, Dave Ferris said:

RE: JazzPiano88 said: 

    Rain Dance with Freddie Hubbard Flugelhorn is just killer and Jeff's piano solo is so sweet:  

 

 

34 minutes ago, Dave Ferris said:

While it could certainly be Freddie, for the record it's actually Randy Brecker here on Flugel.

 

Yes fantastic track, great solos by Randy and Jeff. And cool vocal too.

 

Thanks for the catch Dave!    Listening the the above track again, I realize it was just a little too modern sounding for 1979  .

The above track is from the 2010 Now Is the Time (I think), and you are correct has Randy playing flugelhorn.

Thanks!

 

 

[ElmerJFudd]

14 hours ago, Dave Ferris said:

So the CP88 came yesterday and I plug it into my system in my studio. Right off I notice an overly loud buzz coming from the speakers, which are the Yamaha DXR8 mk2s, in literally new condition. 

 

So I first changed out the instrument cords from the Monster cables to another set. Then tried different mic/xlr cords from my JMK Audio JM-110 di/pre amp to the DXR8s. Even tried a different extension box from the rock solid Furman SS-6B-PRO 6 I have.

 

Buzz is still there, very irritating. It sounds like a common noise I always associate when something doesn’t sound grounded, or maybe a cord is bad. Added edit- I also forgot to mention I thought that maybe it's something to do with the new LED lights I recently had installed in my studio that are much brighter. I turned them off and no change.

 

But here’s the kicker— when I hook my Yamaha P-515 back up to my system, with the same cords, speakers, pre/di, there’s no buzz whatsoever. That’s why I noticed the noise right away because the P515 is totally dead quiet. 

 

I then switched out the JMK preamp to my ABP Dynasonics ProSpec 2U6M2S. It might not be a Speck X.Sum but it's a high quality analog mixer. Nothing changed, buzz is even more pronounced. Finally I removed the di/pre /mixer altogether and just went directly into the instrument inputs on the back of the Yamaha DXR8s. Input level was set to line, turn it on, still there. Even tried just one speaker at a time, swapped CP88 outputs, same noise in both speakers, coming out of both outputs on the keyboard.
 

Playing the CP88 with phones, it’s fine, no buzz. It sounds like a defect in the outputs or ground. In its current condition, it’s unusable coming through my speakers. Sent my Sweetwater rep this email and he said service would get back to me within 24-48 on how to proceed.

 

I'd really don't want to be schlepping this to a local service center. I'd prefer to box it up, have FedEx pick it up, and just have a new keyboard sent. But right now they are out of stock on it and said "maybe" July or August.

 

Frustrating. Sounds great playing it with my Senn HD650s, just like I remember it.

 

I have not run into this issue in any electrical environment I’ve used the board in. 
 

Not at home through studio monitors.  
 

Not through EV or Mackie PA speakers in venues with both the CP and the monitor on the same power strip.  
 

Send it back. Let them know the unit has a noise issue at the 1/4” main outs.  
 

🤷‍♂️

 

 

[ProfD]

1 hour ago, Dave Ferris said:

Yes a definite first for me. And yes, it's getting picked up tomorrow. Sadly as mentioned, they are out of stock and it could be July or August.

Bummer the CP88 has to go back.  Time flies. July/August will be here soon enough.  Hang in there.

 

But, I missed the rationale for getting CP88 #3 especially considering there is a P-515 on the premises.😎

[pawelsz]

16 minutes ago, Dave Ferris said:

 

To save 7.5 lbs. on the gig schlep. It might seem that it's not enough weight to bother with, but when I put both in the case for comparison, I notice a big difference.

 

I highly considered the P-125, as that seems to be the gig piano of choice now for the aging jazz people here in town, but it was too much a compromise from both the P515 and CP88. I'll suck it up on the 41 lbs. and pretty certain I'll be ok with it, at least for the time being. In a couple years, maybe not..

 

What about Kawai ES-520? 

[CHarrell]

1 hour ago, Dave Ferris said:

Unfortunately my Sweetwater rep wasn't able to track a CP88 down at their new Phoenix hub, so my defective one was sent back and I guess I'll wait until they are re-stocked.

 

Sorry to hear that! I lived in AZ for a year and a half, the only thing you can count on is it letting you down. 😉

[CHarrell]

Yay! 

 

Also, I played a P515 last week, I can see why you have that one in your arsenal!

[CHarrell]

Sounds like this time was the charm!

[Coker]

Looks like my 35 year old Quick-loc bench, butt indentations and all!

[OrpheusNY]

On 8/1/2022 at 11:44 AM, ElmerJFudd said:

August - 2022, Yamaha is prepping the next OS update for the CP73/88 and will be including a new CP80 sample library.  I’m eager to see what other features and sounds get added based on all the user feedback. 

Long prep time, if it is indeed coming! What do we think, CP88/73 owners, are there going to be any more OS updates, or was 1.5 the last one? Coming up on two years now since an update.

[ElmerJFudd]

26 minutes ago, OrpheusNY said:

Long prep time, if it is indeed coming! What do we think, CP88/73 owners, are there going to be any more OS updates, or was 1.5 the last one? Coming up on two years now since an update.

Via a pole conducted by Yamaha more than a year ago it seemed as if they were planning another sound update for the CP line.  I think firmware updates are always directly related to sales figures.  Has Yamaha sold more YCs than CPs?  Are both selling well well enough for continued development dollars or is Yamaha already spending that money on what replaces the current CP and YC models?