Roland RD-2000

[RandyFF]

Wow, the MK80 first came out in '89! 76 pounds! So all the sounds, not just the pianos, were modeled? Sounds like a great in-studio or living room keyboard

[Al Coda]

Wow, the MK80 first came out in '89! 76 pounds! So all the sounds, not just the pianos, were modeled?

 

It uses some kind of early model of a tine piano "engine", there are no velocity jumps and it served me well for Rhodes sounds in the past.

The vibes are excellent and the clav is very usable in a band context or playback scenario.

For the Rhodes it needed a lot of tweaks for the sound I wanted, but today´s sample libraries are far more "authentic".

Nonetheless it works great because the finger to ear experience/ key to tone generator connectivity is very good.

 

Sounds like a great in-studio or living room keyboard

 

probably not because the acoustic piano patches sound , well ... mediocre at best.

Typical SA synthesis like MKS20 and RD1000.

But they have some charme when tweaked (and layered w/ other sounds).

I´d say all these SA sounds were overbrilliant and thin always, but w/ some time investment it´s tameable to some degree.

 

I expect the RD-2000 to be WAY better soundwise and I´d hate if the action is not that good as the action in the MK80 is.

 

B.t.w., most of the weight from MK80 comes from the action only.

The bottom is solid (ply-?)wood, sides are plastic, all the other in the middle is aluminium.

 

No really lightweight keyboards w/ good weighted actions.

Lightweight is compromize always.

 

Finally, the MK80´s service friendlyness is top notch !

PSU, output-terminals and 2 boards inside on the bottom, you lift the top and you have access.

1 digital board, 1 analog FX board.

DAC is on the digital board, so in theory, it would be easy modding a mono FX-loop to use a overdrive, wah and ringmod inserted before the analog modulation FX make all stereo which runs to the outputs then.

I think I´ll do that once I have another keyboard, just because I like modding my old gear being out of warranty.

 

Another smaller board for display and tact switches under the small tilted "front-panel".

 

A.C.

[burningbusch]

Well, I still own & use a MK-80 (Roland's previous last & IMHO greatest SA Synthesis Digital Piano), and I can attest that the sounds of the SA synthesis bank of voice are indeed authentic and respond like those of my MK-80, which I still play regularly. The SA synthesis voices sound very good live and have a character all of their own which is much more pleasing to my ears than straight sampled voices. I am seriously finally considering selling my MK-80, although the wooden key action on my MK-80 is still better (and faster) than the action of the 3 RD-2000's that I have played thus far.

 

Interesting observation !

 

I too own a MK80 in great condition (tact switches, key landing felts and some keys replaced) and play it all day.

In fact I have it midied up to my KurzPC361 which sits on it´s flat top.

The MK80´s action is great IMO,- but you´re wrong w/ the keys ... there´s not a single piece of wood in those keys,- it´s all plastic, which I know since we had it apart completely !

The white keys are all hollow and their edges cut the key landing felts sooner or later.

The black keys are massive where they land,- that´s why it makes a different louder noise while playing.

But I don´t care,- the action is heavy but fast and it´s "balanced" not "graded", which I prefer when controlling a multi-keyboard rig incl. modules.

 

OTOH, the RD2000 is also so much interesting because it is much more a fully fledged masterkeyboard controller than the MK80 w/ only 1 ext. zone is and the RD2000 is multitimbral in addition.

I really hope they nailed the chorus- and phaser FX in the RD2000 ´cause the ones in the MK80 are real analog (the complete FX-board inside is !) and sound good.

 

I really think about keeping the MK80 for the home studio´s weighted keys MIDI controller and buy the RD-2000 in addition.

 

A.C.

 

You're right on the plastic. I had an MK-80 recently, though I sold it. Had it apart to fix something with the action (replacement keys are still available). The action is severely heavy by itself and you come to understand the overall weight of the instrument. I found a MKS-20 and prefer its sound. The chorus on my MKS-20 is wonderful, while on the MK-80 it was lacking, possibly out of adjustment or some other issue, being analog and all.

 

Busch.

[Al Coda]

... I had an MK-80 recently, (replacement keys are still available).

 

Yep,- Syntaur.

Also got the key return felts from Roland, but the key landing felts were unavailable.

Had to look for others elsewhere.

 

Why did I do all that ?

 

Well, the flat-top ... it makes it so easy to use a simple K&M stand w/o the need of any top-tier accessories, then put a 2nd keyboard directly on top of the MK80.

Kurz PC361 fits well and doesn´t need any additional support,- something bigger like the Yammi KX76 fits well too.

I don´t understand all the companies use the design w/ all the controls on top leaving no room for a 2nd keyboard.

It´s so much better having both the keybeds (weighted and synth action so close together.

 

If there weren´t the action and the flat-top, I had something new since many years.

 

I found a MKS-20 and prefer its sound. The chorus on my MKS-20 is wonderful, while on the MK-80 it was lacking, possibly out of adjustment or some other issue, being analog and all.

 

Busch.

 

I used a MKS20 for a long time, bought one in a minute when it was released.

Great module !

There´s a real Roland SDD-320 Dimension-D inside which is hard to beat.

Dunno what it really is on the analog FX board in the MK80 ... needs some investigation, but I doubt it´s the same compared to what´s inside the MKS20.

MKS20 and MK80 sound different,- and it´s not only because of the chorus alone.

 

A.C.

 

 

[ProfD]

Among DPs, I was already impressed with the RD-800. Last Friday, I had a chance to demo the RD-2000. I am even more impressed with it.

 

I'm curious to see, hear and play the Korg GrandStage. If it combines the best of the SV-1 and Kronos, it is a winner.

 

Otherwise, as it stands right now today, if I were in the market for a DP, I would buy the RD-2000 immediately.

 

IMO, KB players are living in wonderful times as it relates to the gear available to us.

[RABid]

How good is the RD2000 at controlling an Integra 7?

[allan_evett]

How good is the RD2000 at controlling an Integra 7?

 

Don't know anyone that's tried to do that yet, but I suspect it would be stellar. From studying the manuals and watching a few tutorials, the depth of controller capability reminds me a lot of the A90.

 

As mentioned in a concurrent thread, I just picked one of these up; and I think it's going to be around for quite awhile. I got the RD-2000 a week ago, on Thursday, and had it set up with a dozen scenes in time for a weekend gig. It's super-easy to work with, and appears to be quite the toolbox for stage. I'll post more as I get further in, but based on last Friday's gig: Plenty of variety among the pianos (string/pad layers are gorgeous, btw..), Rhodes sounds are great - and nicely varied - right from the box, and Wurlis and clavs are solid (though I want to dial in both of those even more to my liking). Best added benefit: An actual clonewheel-style engine with 9-sliders. Though there's no dedicated CV, and the rotary sim. is slightly dated, it makes this one a no-brainer for single keyboard gigs.

[b3plyr]

I got to play the RD2000 for a little while and thought it sounded great. The keybed with escapement is very nice. However, is it true that you can only have one split point? I'm not sure as I have not read the user manual. It was easy to get a single split, though.

[EscapeRocks]

I got to play the RD2000 for a little while and thought it sounded great. The keybed with escapement is very nice. However, is it true that you can only have one split point? I'm not sure as I have not read the user manual. It was easy to get a single split, though.

 

I believe it has one assignable split point.

 

However, it does have 4 zones that can be layered, and the range of each tone can be assigned. AT least that's what I see with a brief overview of the manual

[allan_evett]

I got to play the RD2000 for a little while and thought it sounded great. The keybed with escapement is very nice. However, is it true that you can only have one split point? I'm not sure as I have not read the user manual. It was easy to get a single split, though.

 

I believe it has one assignable split point.

 

That's correct, for doing basic, quick splits from the front panel - as detailed in the owner's manual.

 

However, it does have 4 zones that can be layered, and the range of each tone can be assigned. AT least that's what I see with a brief overview of the manual

 

That's also correct, for doing quick layers from the front panel.

The Parameter Guide also indicates that eight internal, or external zones can be range assigned. That indicates to me that one could do up to an 8-way split - if no external zone control was needed in a particular Program. I'll test that out tomorrow, when I'm at the keyboard next.

[Al Coda]

That indicates to me that one could do up to an 8-way split - if no external zone control was needed in a particular Program. I'll test that out tomorrow, when I'm at the keyboard next.

 

Would be great to know since it could be 4 int. and 4 ext. zones as a fixed configuration too.

Means,- not using external zones doesn´t mean MORE internal ones.

But it would be awesome when it were fully user selectable though !

 

A.C.

[HSFlik]

Each of the keyboard's 8 zones can only be used for either internal or external, but not both. You can set all 8 to internal or external if you want. The configuration is not fixed.

 

In fact, it's a little weird that the keyboard does not transmit any data via MIDI OUT unless you have an active external zone.

 

While I haven't done it myself, theoretically, an 8 way split is possible.

 

I would also like to add that the keyboard technically has 16 zones, but 9-16 are only accessible via an external controller. These also correspond to MIDI channels (and 10 is of course, percussion). You can issue patch changes / volume / any other MIDI command and the RD-2000 will respond accordingly.

 

Here is a video I made of the Roland A-49 (controller only) being mapped to channel 9, plugged into the RD-2000's MIDI IN. The RD-2000 is plugged into my tablet via USB, and recognized as an external MIDI device. I am sending preprogrammed patch changes (LSB/MSB/PC) to channel 9 from my tablet to the RD-2000, and controlling with an external keyboard.

 

[Markyboard]

In fact, it's a little weird that the keyboard does not transmit any data via MIDI OUT unless you have an active external zone.

 

 

How is this weird? Seems pretty logical to me.

:idk

[HSFlik]

In fact, it's a little weird that the keyboard does not transmit any data via MIDI OUT unless you have an active external zone.

 

 

How is this weird? Seems pretty logical to me.

:idk

 

I think I'm just used to keyboards where I don't have to press a button to turn on "MIDI OUT". All my previous keyboards were wimps compared to the RD-2000.

 

From the perspective of controlling external layers / zones in MainStage or similar though, yeah, it makes perfect sense.

[ElmerJFudd]

Bit brutal comparison vid between the timbre of the RD2000 and the NP3. Creators say they tried to be fair. However they recorded it, neither sounds amazing. But in some of the back and forth the NP3 samples come off more convincing and more pleasant than the RD's model. I think they did a shoddy job making this vid. But it's out there, so here it is.

 

[video:youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=folEzGHQBjU

[Markyboard]

In fact, it's a little weird that the keyboard does not transmit any data via MIDI OUT unless you have an active external zone.

 

 

How is this weird? Seems pretty logical to me.

:idk

 

I think I'm just used to keyboards where I don't have to press a button to turn on "MIDI OUT". All my previous keyboards were wimps compared to the RD-2000.

 

From the perspective of controlling external layers / zones in MainStage or similar though, yeah, it makes perfect sense.

 

Understood - I think this is fairly typical for keyboards with "external zones". IIRC the Yamaha S90ES and Kurzweil PC3x behave this way to mention a couple. I assume the RD2000 receives midi data independently on each of its internal zones?

[Ashville.Guru]

In fact, it's a little weird that the keyboard does not transmit any data via MIDI OUT unless you have an active external zone.

 

 

How is this weird? Seems pretty logical to me.

:idk

 

I think I'm just used to keyboards where I don't have to press a button to turn on "MIDI OUT". All my previous keyboards were wimps compared to the RD-2000.

 

From the perspective of controlling external layers / zones in MainStage or similar though, yeah, it makes perfect sense.

Actually, I think it's the opposite. Many of us let the laptop do the zoning, so you can just hook it up to any keyboard that's available and you have all your splits and layers instantly ready.

 

This works when all keys transmit MIDI by default on Ch. 1. Correct me if I'm mistaken, but isn't this what most keyboards do?

 

For those of us travel with only laptops to use backline boards at the venue, Roland's "feature" is an unnecessary hoop to jump through. I do wish manufacturers stick to the MIDI by default standard.

 

- Guru

[AnotherScott]

The most disappointing thing this year at a Musik exhibition was the Roland RD-2000 at NAMM 2017.

 

Roland took the OLD TECH from their previous-previous semi-supernatural RD's and NX's along with the PHA 1, 2, 3, 4 etc and threw in the new -old ?V-Piano? then put some racing strips on the sides to pretend that it is souped up. Souped up? More like re-heated Mulligan Stew.

What I was hoping for was

While it may not be what you were hoping for, for those who like the modeled V-Piano, the RD2000 drops the price of that technology from about $7k to about $2,500 and drops the travel weight a whole bunch, too. And adds a whole bunch of other functionality that the V-Piano didn't have (rompler sounds, clonewheel, MIDI controller functionality). It's kind of the way the Kronos brought the OASYS tech and a bunch more to the much cheaper Kronos. Not a bad deal if it's what you're looking for.

 

Bit brutal comparison vid between the timbre of the RD2000 and the NP3. Creators say they tried to be fair. ... in some of the back and forth the NP3 samples come off more convincing and more pleasant than the RD's model.

I agree, I'd choose the Nord piano, personally.

 

And I'd even say this isn't the fairest comparison, despite your description, because as he says, he just used the default piano sound when you turn them on. That's arguably a fair starting point for most boards, which presumably put what they think is--at least technically--their "best" sound first, whether it's something that uses their biggest/newest sample set, or in the case of Roland, they're most sophisticated modeling technology. But Nord is a little different because they have numerous high quality sample sets, often in no way technically better than another, merely different... but they still have to choose something to put in the first preset. In this case, it's the Fazioli, but that's certainly not universally considered the best piano Nord has to offer, it's just an essentially random choice from among numerous high quality piano sets. I'm also not even sure whether, by default, the Fazioli is installed in its best ("XL") sample size, maybe someone else can confirm whether or not that's the case.

 

The Roland offers more total functionality for less money (they're closer in price in Europe than they are here in the U.S.), and I know a lot of people really do like the Roland piano sounds and/or actions, so I would not be surprised if it were the bigger seller, but the Nord piano sounds continue to just work better for me personally. Though I'd be curious to hear some EP comparisons, since there have been some good reports on the Roland there, and I don't find the Nord's to be first rate. The SV1 is still my reference there.

 

I'm curious to see, hear and play the Korg GrandStage. If it combines the best of the SV-1 and Kronos, it is a winner.

I don't think there's anything SV1-like about it beyond the look/interface similarities. Sonically, I think it's strictly Kronos-based. I think it will still be a really nice board, but won't have the SV1-specific technologies or sound sets.

[Markyboard]

Actually, I think it's the opposite. Many of us let the laptop do the zoning, so you can just hook it up to any keyboard that's available and you have all your splits and layers instantly ready.

 

This works when all keys transmit MIDI by default on Ch. 1. Correct me if I'm mistaken, but isn't this what most keyboards do?

 

For those of us travel with only laptops to use backline boards at the venue, Roland's "feature" is an unnecessary hoop to jump through. I do wish manufacturers stick to the MIDI by default standard.

 

- Guru

 

 

Eh, you may be right. I don't know what default means because I set up my own defaults. But every keyboard should be able to do what you describe, and most can. You may however have to be in a particular mode (Voice vs Performance vs Master for example).

 

I prefer to set up each keyboard/synth on its own unique channel. Why? Because I don't want to mouse around to enable one keyboard vs another. I often leave all the tracks in my DAW enabled and hit any one of 16 physical buttons on my controller (or combination of buttons) to switch from controlling one synth(or set of synths) to another. Like I said, just my preference.

[ElmerJFudd]

The most disappointing thing this year at a Musik exhibition was the Roland RD-2000 at NAMM 2017.

 

Roland took the OLD TECH from their previous-previous semi-supernatural RD's and NX's along with the PHA 1, 2, 3, 4 etc and threw in the new -old ?V-Piano? then put some racing strips on the sides to pretend that it is souped up. Souped up? More like re-heated Mulligan Stew.

What I was hoping for was

While it may not be what you were hoping for, for those who like the modeled V-Piano, the RD2000 drops the price of that technology from about $7k to about $2,500 and drops the travel weight a whole bunch, too. And adds a whole bunch of other functionality that the V-Piano didn't have (rompler sounds, clonewheel, MIDI controller functionality). It's kind of the way the Kronos brought the OASYS tech and a bunch more to the much cheaper Kronos. Not a bad deal if it's what you're looking for.

 

Bit brutal comparison vid between the timbre of the RD2000 and the NP3. Creators say they tried to be fair. ... in some of the back and forth the NP3 samples come off more convincing and more pleasant than the RD's model.

I agree, I'd choose the Nord piano, personally.

 

And I'd even say this isn't the fairest comparison, despite your description, because as he says, he just used the default piano sound when you turn them on. That's arguably a fair starting point for most boards, which presumably put what they think is--at least technically--their "best" sound first, whether it's something that uses their biggest/newest sample set, or in the case of Roland, they're most sophisticated modeling technology. But Nord is a little different because they have numerous high quality sample sets, often in no way technically better than another, merely different... but they still have to choose something to put in the first preset. In this case, it's the Fazioli, but that's certainly not universally considered the best piano Nord has to offer, it's just an essentially random choice from among numerous high quality piano sets. I'm also not even sure whether, by default, the Fazioli is installed in its best ("XL") sample size, maybe someone else can confirm whether or not that's the case.

 

The Roland offers more total functionality for less money (they're closer in price in Europe than they are here in the U.S.), and I know a lot of people really do like the Roland piano sounds and/or actions, so I would not be surprised if it were the bigger seller, but the Nord piano sounds continue to just work better for me personally. Though I'd be curious to hear some EP comparisons, since there have been some good reports on the Roland there, and I don't find the Nord's to be first rate. The SV1 is still my reference there.

 

I'm curious to see, hear and play the Korg GrandStage. If it combines the best of the SV-1 and Kronos, it is a winner.

I don't think there's anything SV1-like about it beyond the look/interface similarities. Sonically, I think it's strictly Kronos-based. I think it will still be a really nice board, but won't have the SV1-specific technologies or sound sets.

 

Good points overall. I'll tell you what though, not sure if you're saying the base NP3 sound is their XL - or if it's action related, but when he does the middle C velocity game, that NP3 comes up short. I hear maybe 3 velocity layers at best, transition isn't seemless and 0 to 127 comes up fast, too fast and once you're there that's it.

[AnotherScott]

but when he does the middle C velocity game, that NP3 comes up short. I hear maybe 3 velocity layers at best, transition isn't seemless and 0 to 127 comes up fast, too fast and once you're there that's it.

Technically, I would expect modeling to out-perform samples when it comes to 0-to-127 smoothness. Honestly, I didn't even really pay attention to that part of the video. My impression was based on an overall sense of musicality and realism when he played full passages... because to me, that's what matters. To my ears, the Nord just "sings" in a way that the Roland doesn't, the Roland somehow seems somewhat sterile by comparison. And actually, it sometimes reminded me of what doesn't thrill me about some of the Korg pianos, something I would describe as a kind of "hollowness" to it. But this is strictly a subjective personal response, and I would not be surprised to find that others disagree with my assessment... we don't all prefer the same kinds of piano sound, even when it comes to real acoustic pianos!

[ElmerJFudd]

I feel similarly about Pianoteq. It actually is fun to play. Very capable dynamically, and when in the moment I enjoy the more realistic velocity range and seemless stages. But when listening in playback, it doesn't sound as good as a lot of sample libraries. I'm not sure yet if the Nord hardware and Piano engine really competes with the multigigabyte sample libraries on a computer with more velocity layers, higher polyphony, and all sorts of other parameters to tweak. But that's not the question in this thread. It seems if you need a controller and complex setups the RD is the tool even if you prefer sampled pianos. Roland is all in now on their V-piano engine and this PHA-50 action. So, no resolution here. There's still plenty reason to choose this or that stage piano.

[AnotherScott]

I feel similarly about Pianoteq. It actually is fun to play. Very capable dynamically, and when in the moment I enjoy the more realistic velocity range and seemless stages. But I when listening in playback, it doesn't sound as good as a lot of sample libraries.

Yup, that's another whole variable. If you asked the guy playing the two boards, he could conceivably tell you that the Roland felt more responsive to his intent while playing, even though, as listeners, some of us find the Nord sound more enjoyable. Without knowing how the player wanted it to sound in terms of expressivity, we can't know how accurate it felt to him, in terms of what he was trying to get out of the instruments. It is entirely possible that one could prefer playing X despite preferring the sound of Y.

[Moonglow]

Funny, but when the video compared just the low, mid, and upper registers separately I preferred the RD-2000, but when comparing entire passages, I preferred the NP3. Seems like these sections interacted better with each other on the NP3.

[rickzjamm]

Intersting and somewhat enlightening Dave.

[Al Quinn]

I think the RD2000 sounds great! I'd like to play one to see how it feels. I can't see myself buying one though because of the weight.

[RABid]

It never ceases to amaze me how people hear things differently.

 

...

 

I think a lot of it has to do with what type of sound you became accustom to when first playing piano. My home piano was dark and mellow. My first piano teacher had a bright sounding piano. I hated it. 50 years later I still prefer a dark, mellow piano.

[Mighty Motif Max]

I had the opportunity to play one today while I was in the metro. Sadly, it was running through a LARGE KC amp in mono, so sound quality tests were somewhat irrelevant. :-( I love the weight factor (16 lbs less than my 88).

 

Anyway, the action felt really weird. I wouldn't exactly say flimsy, but like the weights were off somehow. Honestly, I do not know if I could meld with one very well. The store had an RD-800 right next to it, which I have played before, and the RD-800's action seemed superior to the RD-2000's. I know this new action is supposed to be great, so I was surprised. The best word to describe it would be "unnatural". I have played many different brands of real pianos and keyboards, and never felt anything like it. Is it just me? Is it a time thing?

 

Any thoughts?

 

P.S. Why is the screen smaller then the RD-800's? Space factors? And there seems to be no tone remain, unlike the 800.

 

-Max

[HSFlik]

I've had my RD-2000 for about 3 months now, and I do agree that the action feels different than most pianos / keyboards. However, I don't necessarily see it as a bad thing - just different.

 

I didn't like the action on the RD-800. Something about how the keys reset back to normal position was bugging me, like it was just a little sluggish or something. However, it doesn't bug me on the RD-2000's keybed.

 

All I can really say about the RD-2000's action is that when I first started playing for extended peroids of time, I realized the keybed responded much better dynamically than all the Yamaha GH boards I've played on in the past, and in some ways nicer than my Baldwin upright. It felt like having much finer control over the sound.

 

I try not to compare the action of a digital piano to an acoustic piano though, because they are completely different instruments in their own right.

 

Re: Tone Remain - You can enable this in the menu.

 

As for the smaller screen... beats me.

 

Does anyone know if it's possible to route Zones 9-16 to the SUB OUT as opposed to MAIN OUT?

[RABid]

The RD2000 review in EM is the most positive review I have seen in years.