Yamaha CP4 - first impressions

[Michiel]

Yeah, the CP1 was different, I liked it much better than the 5 and 4. But price and weight kept it out of my gravitational field.

 

Why did you like it better, if I may ask?

[podmed]

Need to chime in here....

I am a Rock keyboard player, but our band plays just about everything from "Piano Man," to "Don't Stop Believin" to [ahem] "Roar".

When I started playing with these people, I had a Yamaha CP-300 which (for me) was amazing for Piano. Needed something to cover the other genres. Sold it.

Bought a Nord Piano 2, which did the trick for AP,Eps and occasional Synth stuff.

 

However, here is where my adventure began:

Tried to use the Piano 2 with a Microkorg on top. Microkeys didn't do it.

Sold both.

Bought a Kronos 73. Keybed to me sucked. Sold it.

Bought an Electro 4 73. Couldn't live without Layering. Sold it.

Bought a Kronos 61 AND a 88-key Weighted Controller. Controller too heavy. Sold it.

Bought a Nord Stage 2 73. Not bad, but no weighted action for Piano. Sold it.

Bought the CP4 - and I'm in Heaven. Weight is lighter than the CP-300 Sherman tank.

I'll use the Kronos 61 on top.

Hopefully this madness is over.

If not - well - you only live once. (or twice if you are 007).

Rock on.

 

 

[Moonglow]

Hopefully this madness is over.

That's some good signature material!

[zephonic]

Yeah, the CP1 was different, I liked it much better than the 5 and 4. But price and weight kept it out of my gravitational field.

 

Why did you like it better, if I may ask?

 

It just felt like an all-around more natural and effortless experience. I tried them in very different circumstances and that may be a factor to consider, too. The CP1 had been set up on a proper stand at the proper height with a proper bench, the CP5 and CP4 not so much.

 

The action felt better to me on the CP1, and it was easy to adjust the "hammer hardness" which worked really well for me (I like them a little softer). The CP5 was said to have the same action and sound, but it didn't give me the same connection and vibe.

 

The CP4 sounds better than what I remember of the older models, but the action is a little harder than I prefer.

 

[Dana.]

Hopefully this madness is over.

You ain't kiddin'. Me, I would've kept the Nord Piano 2 and ditched the microKORG for a small synth with full size keys. Plenty of options.

[allan_evett]

Hopefully this madness is over.

That's some good signature material!

 

Notice though that " If not - well...." followed. The OP's gear timeline looks like a small slice of my gear list from 1979 - 2013 (which is under 'lock and key' - as my family will have me committed should it be released). Looks like podmed, Tony, and I could be triplet children of different mothers..

[Aidan]

Quads, if you count me in too...!

[Kawai James]

You ain't kiddin'. Me, I would've kept the Nord Piano 2 and ditched the microKORG for a small synth with full size keys.

 

This.

[allan_evett]

Quads, if you count me in too...!

 

Certainly, I think you well qualify for the 'horse traders' sub-group here

[stoken6]

Bought a Nord Piano 2, which did the trick for AP,Eps and occasional Synth stuff.

[...]

Tried to use the Piano 2 with a Microkorg on top. Microkeys didn't do it.

Sold both.

[...]

Bought a Nord Stage 2 73. Not bad, but no weighted action for Piano.

 

Glad this has a happy ending, but... it sounds like you were happy with the Nord pianos, and the NP action. Why didn't you keep the NP88 and add e.g. a little MOX6 or similar? Or try an NS2/88?

 

(Most here say the CP4 action beats the NP88 for similar weight, but all those repeated sales and purchases must have cost you?)

 

Cheers. Mike.

[podmed]

Weight was a big issue for me. The Piano 2 and Stage 88 were too heavy.

The CP4 action is what I learned piano on - and now all my chops and tricks "work" again.

 

[Dana.]

Weight was a big issue for me. The Piano 2 and Stage 88 were too heavy.

The Piano 2 is 40 pounds. The CP4 is 38.5 pounds.

[Stokely]

I consider the Kurzweil pc3 (pc361 in my case) the best jack-of-all-trades board I've ever played, especially in the <$1000 used. I still need to dive in to the synth programming but it handles everything for me, and has a decent organ (the achilles heel of most of the competition).

 

Anyway, I guess if I want to try the CP4 I'll have to buy it and return it. It's crazy that a populated area like Orlando doesn't get one of these in...there's still a couple stores I haven't called but based on past experience if it isn't a Krome or Mox it probably isn't carried around here (an exaggeration but not much of one...)

[allan_evett]

Weight was a big issue for me. The Piano 2 and Stage 88 were too heavy.

The Piano 2 is 40 pounds. The CP4 is 38.5 pounds.

 

True, but the next sentence does refer to the CP4's great playability. Seems that's where the preference is. I prefer playing piano on my heavily tweaked S90XS to playing piano on my Stage 2, 76; and I suspect that I could 'dig in' more fully on the CP4. The Nord pianos are certainly playable, and can get me through a one keyboard gig. But the Stage 2 works out a lot better as a second tier organ / synth / misc. electro-mechanical sound source.

[bryanstern]

Just got the CP4 and yes indeed, the keyboard feel and playability are fantastic.

The cheap, utilitarian plastic body falls into the realm of "I don't really care that much" as the experience is with the keyboard is so primary.

 

I do have a question of CP4 owners. The S6 AP on my CP4 sounds crappy and synthetic, rather than warm, woody and beautiful. I have a few keys that sorta have a little synthetic-sounding buzz when playing this voice. I'd like to know what others experience has been with the S6.

 

Thanks.

[scales]

I haven't detected a buzz on mine but I agree with your assessment. I was a bit disappointed with the S6 in terms of "warmth" and "woodiness". But, I haven't taken the time to tweak it either. With a little work I think I can bring out the best in it. I just can't stop playing the CFX long enough to do anything else.

[Pale]

If the S6 sample is the same as in CP5, then yes, I do experience the same buzz. Altough, I think that buzz comes from real piano that's sampled, it sounds like a string buzz to me. It is most noticable when I play left hand bass, there are a few notes there that really have a pronounced buzz.

[Pale]

Forgot to say I actually like that. Gives it a bit of character.

[voxpops]

Mine arrived this morning. My thoughts so far? Not sure...

 

I dumped my NP88 for the CP4, and so my reaction is colored by that experience.

 

Action: much better on the Yamaha. Couldn't say yet whether I prefer it to Roland's PHAIII, but it's close.

 

AP sounds: nice, but I think the Nord is superior - more detailed. Where is the sympathetic resonance on the Yamaha??? IIRC, even the PX-5S has it, and it does make a difference to the overall emulation and feeling of immersion. Also, the stretching in the bottom octave is very obvious, and somewhat unattractive.

 

EP sounds: very good, and totally different to the Nord's. Are these actual models or samples of models? Whichever they are, they're very playable and characterful.

 

Others: good to so-so.

 

Bottom line: the CP4 is apparently the best Yamaha stage piano, yet. If that's true, the Casio PX-5S represents remarkable value. I'm not saying it's not a nice board - it is - but after owning Nords, I don't know whether it's a keeper for me or not. I need more time on it.

[bryanstern]

Thanks for S6 feedback. I have both the PX-5S and the CP4 (CP4 arrived yesterday). I love the action on both but the CP4 with its ivory feel keys feels amazing and I definitely prefer the CP4 in this area. It really is perfect to me.

 

I have several tweaked AP sounds on the PX-5S and (so far) i find the sound more warm, sweet and natural than the CP4. The CFIII is really my favorite on the CP4. The CFX is so dynamic. Not sure how much I'll use it. And S6, disappointedly never).

 

EP's on the CP4 are really nice and and some are unlike anything I have on the PX-5S or SK1. Some are really useable for me. But, they definitely need some tweaking for my needs if I were to use it on its own on a gig.

 

If I had to choose one keyboard (PX-5S or CP4), and yes, money counts (I paid $850 for the Casio and $2000 for the CP4), at this point I would choose the Casio.

Wish it didn't look like a toy, but it is definitely not a toy and is a stunning value.

 

I was playing both keyboards back and forth for hours the last 2 days. Very different instruments. Both have pluses and negatives. But, it really affirmed how much I love the Casio. And the CP4 relationship is to be determined.

[lisome]

Regarding the S6 funny notes - check the D key and neighboring notes two octaves below middle C to see if you hear the resonance. If this is still an issue on the CP4 then I don't know what to think. Yamaha absolutely knows about this and was flooded with complaints when the S70/90XS came out.

[bryanstern]

Will check. Problem is definitely in lower octaves. But over S6 sound is disappointing.

[Nicky]

FWIW, my short take on the CP4. No love here, action is ok but I didn't really connect with the acoustic piano sounds, especially the newest one. For lower velocity/soft playing there's a weird "note turning on" effect as opposed to subtle tonal shadings. I think for the rock/boogie woogie style Chuck Leavell was playing on the promo video, it works great, but not for jazz or classical. Also the piano's still all suffer from that sameness/sterile factor, with too much sample stretching going on. The rhodes are much more playable as they are modeled, but they don't really sound like a rhodes to meI personally think the finger connection to sound on the PX5S is much better.

[voxpops]

I agree with you, Nicky.

 

I am actually a little surprised. After years of avoiding Yamaha DPs due to perceiving them as sterile and using dated techniques, I bought into the "best yet" marketing and now wonder what the fuss was about. It's competent, but lagging Roland in terms of AP sound technology, IMO. Given how good my little P-105 is for under $600, I was expecting much more from the CP4.

 

I was prepared to put up with cheap plastic for the weight reduction, better action and improved sounds but, on reflection, feel that I expect a little better for $2k. The Nord is only 1lb or so heavier and is built to withstand the rigors of the road.

 

My CP4 is going back. I shall await Kawai's expected announcement with interest...

[Dave Ferris]

My CP4 is going back. I shall await Kawai's expected announcement with interest...

 

Send it over here, I'll take it off your hands.

 

Interesting viewpoints guys. It is subjective to the player and really how can anyone say....hey whadda ya mean, it's no good ! ?

 

Again, I've spent little time with it and not in a live playing situation, but I'm fairly certain I'll prefer it over my Nord. It might not be as detailed sonically but it is an even sound with respect to not thinning out out on the top end or losing the low end (with the exception of the Bosendorfer sample). And the improved action goes without saying.

 

Myself & Roland pianos, for all their "character", have never gotten along live.

 

Kawai I think will always improve, but more for the home player then the gigging guy. Unless something drastically changes in their R&D, the sound just doesn't do it for me.

 

Granted, haven't played the PX-5, but the Casios for just straight piano aren't my thing at this time.

[voxpops]

I'm fairly certain I'll prefer it over my Nord. It might not be as detailed sonically but it is an even sound with respect to not thinning out out on the top end or losing the low end (with the exception of the Bosendorfer sample). And the improved action goes without saying.

 

All very valid points, Dave. I'd be really interested to hear how you get on with it live, compared to your old CP5.

[bryanstern]

Voxpops

I have also decided to return the CP4. But, with all the fuss, I wanted to check it out. I really wanted to love it. Just doesn't have the sound for me. Not with the PX-5S working for me.

[voxpops]

Glad to hear the PX is doing it for you, bryanstern.

 

I, too, really wanted to connect with the CP, but that's life!

[AnotherScott]

Kawai I think will always improve, but more for the home player then the gigging guy. Unless something drastically changes in their R&D, the sound just doesn't do it for me.

I've only played the MP6 and the MP10, and I really liked the sound of the MP10. But at 70+ pounds, it was a non-starter as a gigging board.

[Dave Ferris]

I liked the MP10 as well and was considering it for a moment, even with the weight. But I schlepped my CP5 down to Pierre's Fine Pianos in W. LA and A/B' d the two.

 

As usual, the CP5 won out for me..