Need some help choosing a Keyboard Amp

[Mr. Nightime]

Lack of power has been a sticking point for me for a very long time.Many of the better players around here use Rolad amps, and you can hear the midrange nasal honk out of them coupled with the distortion from not enough power. Completely unacceptable to me. ANY distortion AT ALL is a reason to not use this rig. The only acceptable distortion is the overdrive from the Hammond, and that's intentional.

 

I've made up my mind, and I'll pull the trigger early next week. I'd like to have it in time for my first gig with the "new" band next weekend. (We fired our bass player by all quitting at once, finding a new bass player, then forming a new band.)

[ITGITC]

(We fired our bass player by all quitting at once, finding a new bass player, then forming a new band.)

 

Ouch.

 

Exactly which straw wazzit that broke the camel's back?

 

 

[Mr. Nightime]

Well, to start off....

 

We were going very strong through New Years, with solid bookings into June. Then out of the blue, he announced that he would have to stop playing, and canceled everything, with no explaination.

 

He had some health problems, and wouldn't tell us what they were. So, we took a sabbatical.

 

Came back, and our Slide player, whose only source of income is playing, had found some other work. The bass palyer told him that he would either have to be exclusive, or he was out. The slide player couldn't do that, so he was out. But, all of the rest of us could do whatever we wanted, and he even set up a calendar so we could enter the dates we were busy so he could book around that.

 

Then he got to where he would complain to the lead player about everyone, behind their backs. His ego got where he wanted it to be the "Scott Robinson" show, and not the band that we were known for.

 

After one particular gig where this was worse than normal, the guitar player said he'd had enough. The drummer followed, then me.

 

So, we decided to talk to the slide player, who was a very important part of our sound. He very much wanted to play with us, so the lead player, drummer, slide player, and I are back together. We talked with a bass player that we all have worked with in the past, a guy that's just as fearless musically as the rest of us, and here we are back.

 

So now, he's showing a new line up as the "New Faces of the OldMen Brothers" on SpaceCoastLive.com. To counter, I put on my personal SCL site that there was big news coming from the "Old Faces of the OldMen Brothers". We're probably going to be known as "The Original Brothers Band"

 

Reminds me. Gotta kill the site. I own the domain name and the site.

[MikeT156]

This is a common problem with bands. One guy's head gets big and he ruins the band on everyone, including himself. It really sucks when one or more players are depending on the band's income in order to survive. I'm sure he didn't give that any consideration, his only concern is for himself.

 

 

Mike T.

[ITGITC]

Good on ya, Ronnie.

 

My best to you!

 

Tom

 

[ITGITC]

...the warmth and transparency of the HPR122i (with its real birch cabinet) compared to the K12 (with its plastic cabinet) was stunningly apparent.

 

Noah

 

That's what I assumed.

 

Thanks Noah! I hope you're doing well.

 

Tom

 

It just dawned on me...

 

I've NEVER seen a plastic guitar amp. They're all made of wood.

 

Gotta be a reason for that, huh?

 

 

[Mr. Nightime]

I wonder why I bother with local stores.

 

I called my friend that owns a music store to get a price for the K10 and the Tote. He quoted me the same price I'd get it through the online stores, I'd have to pay sales tax, and he says that QSC told him they were backordered for the next 2 months.

 

But Sweetwater says they have them in stock with free shipping, and there's a TON of them new in box on E-Bay, same price.

 

So much for keeping my business local.

 

[Synthoid]

So much for keeping my business local.

 

Hey... at least you tried!

 

 

[MikeT156]

Generally, you can get a lower price than MAP on name brands once they get caught up on their orders and have inventory ready to rock. Sweetwater won't cut you very much slack on the price, but you will have the gear brand new and in your hands usually within 48 hours unless you live over 1500 miles from Sweetwater.

 

Its a trade off. If you wait, you can find the stuff cheaper. If you want it now, your choice is obvious.

 

My regional dealer cuts me some slack on the price but they are not a HUGE volume dealer so he has to wait 'til the major chains get their inventory before he gets his. In that case, I can wait.

 

It sounds like you need to hook up with a different dealer that will cut you some slack on MAP and actually have inventory of what you want.

 

 

Mike T.

[Mr. Nightime]

Well, I may have changed my mind. My guitar player, whose opinion I trust, went to Sam Ash today, and A/B'd the QSC K10 and the EV SxA 100+. The EV is $20 cheaper, a bit bigger, but sonically, according to him, was the hands down winner. Said it wasn't even close. Clearer highs, smoother mids, tighter bass, and overall cleaner. They had them cranked, running some Piano/Organ jazz through them, and the EV was much batter.

 

I guess a trip to Orlando is required.

[MoodyBluesKeys]

I own a pair of K10's and a pair of SXA100+ - The EV's are bigger and heavier (and have one mic in and one line in) - but they are fine sounding speakers.

The QSC's are easier to haul around, have one line in + a switchable mic/line in (so I don't need a separate mixer for 2 boards).

Sound wise - the QSC can get louder (but I've never wanted them that much louder) - but the 12" speaker in the EV does get down a bit lower.

 

My suggestion is to visit Orlando, and try them both out for yourself - feed them either with your own board, or a board of very similar characteristics that the store may have. They are both good.

 

I didn't buy the totes for either pair - got slip-over covers from an EBay vendor, seem to work just fine. I'm using one of the JBL 10" totes for hauling pedals, cables, Direct box, etc.

[theGman]

Reading this thread, let me think out loud so you guys can correct any errors; I use a K4 keyboard amp now, usually as a monitor, plugging the XLR output to PA system into it. For me, it is heavy for this use. I've gotten to the point of using a KC350 when it is just going to be used as a monitor, since it is lighter and has the XLR output (via 1/4" jack).

 

Can I buy one of the above mentioned power speakers, such as the K10 or the EV ZX, both much lighter, to do pretty much the same job? Do they have XLR outputs?

 

I'm too far from a dealer to check them live. If this would work, it seems that I would have a better sound than the Roland at less weight?

 

Thanks, Paul

[Mr. Nightime]

Since starting this this topic, I've been doing a lot of research. Since I've always been a small PA advocate, I'm still going to stay that way. It's down to 3 choices now, and all of them have an XLR out, and ALL would sound much better than the K4 or the KC350, and are a lot lighter.

 

My current possibles...

 

QSC K10 - still want to hear this bad boy.

 

EV SxA100+ - I've always liked EV

 

Mackie SRM450 v2 - Looks really nice, and the time correction could be a good thing. Plus I like the groovin' guy logo.

 

What I hear and what my guitar player hears could be two very different things. He listens with the guitar slant, where I know what type of sound I need to sound good, and stay on top of the mix without being overbearing.

 

I'm probably only a week or so away from pulling the trigger. It's actually been fun to have GAS knowing that it won't have to just dissapate.

 

On the other topic that was brought up, the firing of the bass player by quitting, we had our first meeting for the new band. The band name we decided on is "Familiar Faces"

[MoodyBluesKeys]

Reading this thread, let me think out loud so you guys can correct any errors; I use a K4 keyboard amp now, usually as a monitor, plugging the XLR output to PA system into it. For me, it is heavy for this use. I've gotten to the point of using a KC350 when it is just going to be used as a monitor, since it is lighter and has the XLR output (via 1/4" jack).

 

Can I buy one of the above mentioned power speakers, such as the K10 or the EV ZX, both much lighter, to do pretty much the same job? Do they have XLR outputs?

 

I'm too far from a dealer to check them live. If this would work, it seems that I would have a better sound than the Roland at less weight?

 

Thanks, Paul

 

The K10 does indeed have an XLR out, EV SxA 100+ does also, don't know about the new EV (haven't seen one). I've used the XLR out before as a feed to house sound when playing a large venue - worked with no problem at all. I do have a Radial stereo DI as well - I've used it in a couple of other cases to feed house sound - either when I needed padding or ground lift, or when I wanted to be able to tweak the K10 as my monitor without disturbing what I was sending to the house. Another cool use for it is to feed my Les Paul into the K10 - the DI gives me a very high impedance input, which the LP likes.

 

I haven't heard a K4 - but the QSC compared to a KC350 sound wise is like comparing a BMW to a Yugo.

 

[Mr. Nightime]

I think Ive decided what Im getting. My Budget is $1000, and the total for these items @ Sweetwater is $1001.96. Ill give up my Sunday Morning 7-11 Coffee to make up the difference.

 

Mackie SRM450v2 Always been a big fan of Mackie.

 

Mackie SRM150 to replace my rather wonky Galaxy PASx140 that works if and when it wants to.

 

Mackie SRM450 bag to protect the SRM450v2

 

Gator G-Mix B-1212 Mixer Bag The Zipper is busted and there are tears in the case for the Mackie 1202 VLZ. My wife insists I get a replacement.

 

I think Im only going to have to play once more with the old rig. Either gigging or rehearsing Saturday. The funds for the GAS wont be available until Thursday at the absolute soonest, and might extend into next week, depending on if my sister got the paperwork signed and sent today.

 

[HAMEGZ]

I think Ive decided what Im getting. My Budget is $1000,

 

Mackie SRM150 to replace my rather wonky Galaxy PASx140 that works if and when it wants to.

 

 

I actually used the SRM150 as a Keyboard monitor! for a while when we were a 4 piece group and on a SMALL stage where I could hear the other amps and the vocal monitors. Nice sound but not loud enough, kept hitting the clip light.

 

I am one of the unwashed masses using a Traynor K4,(what do I know?). This is for the main band with horns. However I ordered a QSC K10 for another gig I am doing with a pop country group where I am using one board and drug a K2 (not enough volume) and a KC500 (not enough anything).So the K10 will be ideal for this gig.

 

Yea,, I am thinking how I will rewire my stereo boards to run through the K10 .I am running an SV1,Electro 3, Fantom XR and monitoring my TC Helicon Voice Live 1 thru the K4, and running the Lo-Z outs to the PA. Doing this with a few line ,mixers I have laying around.

 

 

[Mr. Nightime]

 

I actually used the SRM150 as a Keyboard monitor! for a while when we were a 4 piece group and on a SMALL stage where I could hear the other amps and the vocal monitors. Nice sound but not loud enough, kept hitting the clip light.

 

I'll be using the SRM150 strictly for a vocal monitor. the way we'll be setting up, the only thing goinf through the PA besides the vocals will be a little bass drum. I have a hard time with vocal monitors because I can never hear myself well enough, causing me to push harder, and sometimes blow my throat out. I want to be able to fully control what I hear, and I like my Galaxy, it just doesn't work all the time. It's old and in need of repair, but if I get it fixed, I'll still have an old and potentally unreliable monitor. Unacceptable.

 

Having a powered monitor that I can place in the perfect spot is the solution to my vocal monitoring woes. It's worth it to me, as when I hear myself well, I can put more subtle nuance into my singing, just like when I can hear me keys well, I can put more subtle finesse into the songs.

[HammondDave]

Do yourself a favor a buy two EV360's.

[Dave Ferris]

Do yourself a favor a buy two EV360's.

+1...I'm glad someone finally mentioned these. The second best plastic box 12" two way active speaker I've heard.

 

A bit over your budget of $1000 but I believe a pair can be had for under $1200.

 

 

[Mr. Nightime]

I'm still not fully decided. Kanker will love this, but I'm going mono. So I would only need one. I'll look into the EV360. You are meaning the EV SxA360, right?

 

BTW - what's the best plastic box 12" two way active you've heard?

 

[Dave Ferris]

You are meaning the EV SxA360, right?

 

BTW - what's the best plastic box 12" two way active you've heard?

 

Yes, the SXA360.

 

The best I've heard would be

http://www.rcf.it/products/pro-speaker-systems/art-series/art-522-a

Unfortunately they've been discontinued but have been replaced by

http://www.rcf.it/en_US/products/pro-speaker-systems/art-7-series/art-722-a

 

[octa]

QSC K12's have been the best all-around keyboard amp I've used so far. A lot of times I use just one of them, with a mic preamp, for outdoor shows even. I used the kc-500 for years and hated every minute of it. I finally switched to a K4 & the tone improved but the lack of headroom was disappointing. I used the Accugrooves/QSC for a couple of years but kept blowing the speakers, & it cost about $300 each time I blew them. Tone-wise the accugrooves sounded incredible but the K12's are not that far behind. The K10's may be just as good or even better. . I'd like to compare the K12's to the Hpr122i's & see how much difference the wooden cab makes.

[kanker.]

I'm still not fully decided. Kanker will love this, but I'm going mono. So I would only need one. I'll look into the EV360. You are meaning the EV SxA360, right?

 

BTW - what's the best plastic box 12" two way active you've heard?

Winning 'em over one speaker at a time

 

Gotta give the K10 a look. Size/performance is incredible, and for piano and organ in particular, I can tell you it just simply rocks. I have a little line mixer I use to sum signals and boost my gain going to the pre, but if your boards send a hot enough signal, you should be fine with the 2 ins on the back.

[Ken Beaumont]

I guess everyone is making class D powered speakers these days. Somehow I'm not feeling the need to rush out and hear these:

 

M-Audio GSR 12

 

 

[Mr. Nightime]

I'm still not fully decided. Kanker will love this, but I'm going mono. So I would only need one. I'll look into the EV360. You are meaning the EV SxA360, right?

 

BTW - what's the best plastic box 12" two way active you've heard?

Winning 'em over one speaker at a time

 

Gotta give the K10 a look. Size/performance is incredible, and for piano and organ in particular, I can tell you it just simply rocks. I have a little line mixer I use to sum signals and boost my gain going to the pre, but if your boards send a hot enough signal, you should be fine with the 2 ins on the back.

 

I've actually gone into my cart from Sweetwater and removed the Mackie, and put the QSC K10 in there. Too many guys whose opinion I trust have spoken up in favor of the K10, like you and Sven just to mention a couple, that I'll probably go with that. Plus I like the much smaller size. It'll fit on one of my speaker stands, leaning back a bit, and I can have the Pro3TM right above it.

 

There's a good chance that the EV sounded better to my guitar player because the guy at the store didn't know about the Deep switch.

 

I just found out the the funds will be in my bank account either Friday or Monday, so I'm just about to pull the trigger.

[kanker.]

You will almost never use the DEEP setting, the thing generally has enough bottom, but every once in a while you'll run into a situation where it's needed, and it's a real nice thing to have.

 

The bag they sell for the K10 is very high quality and is worth getting IMO.

 

After 3 weeks of playing through monitor mixes, I can't wait to get back to playing through my K10 tonight.....

[mate stubb]

The Mackies I tested before I bought my AGs had a brittle high end that was uncomfortable to listen to. I think I listened to the 350 and 450.

[Mr. Nightime]

You will almost never use the DEEP setting, the thing generally has enough bottom, but every once in a while you'll run into a situation where it's needed, and it's a real nice thing to have.

 

The bag they sell for the K10 is very high quality and is worth getting IMO.

 

After 3 weeks of playing through monitor mixes, I can't wait to get back to playing through my K10 tonight.....

 

Nice to know there's enough bottom. Need it for the Hammond lows. And the bag is a given. I'm going to have this thing for a Long time, so I want to protect it.

 

Interesting to hear that the Makies were a bit brittle. The Pro3TM can be a bit brittle on its own, and since I run the internal mike through the cab as well, I don't need the cab adding more.

 

I'm not sure I could handle playing through monitor mixes. I like to actually hear myself. Have fun with your REAL sound tonight Kevin.

[kanker.]

Just so you know, I'll be walking organ bass on the K10 without the DEEP on tonight

[bhodaway10]

You are meaning the EV SxA360, right?

 

BTW - what's the best plastic box 12" two way active you've heard?

 

Yes, the SXA360.

 

The best I've heard would be

http://www.rcf.it/products/pro-speaker-systems/art-series/art-522-a

Unfortunately they've been discontinued but have been replaced by

http://www.rcf.it/en_US/products/pro-speaker-systems/art-7-series/art-722-a

 

+1 for the EV360's - thanks again Dave!

 

I usually use only in mono.