How do YOU deal with LOUD stage volume vs. your ears?

[MuzikTeechur]

More specifically, are you doing anything to preserve your hearing?

 

My band plays several clubs where we don't have a sound man, and often times the stage volume gets out of hand. OK, the stage volume ALWAYS gets out of hand. Nothing I can do about it - I don't run the sound.

 

I usually set up to the right side, with the drummer to my immediate left and slightly behind. Which means one of his cymbals is about 2' from my head.

The guitarist uses a "Class A" amplifier, which is guitarspeak for "it'll cut your freakin' head off." Bass player uses a 400W head into a Hartke Cab. The US Geological Survey can tell where we're playing on any given night.

 

But I digress. I've gone from custom made ear plugs to foam plugs to Etymotic Research 15db and 20db plugs... and am now using plain old cotton.

Really.

It's the best thing I've found so far (other than unplugging everyone!). I wad up a small portion - not enough to block my ear, but enough to sit in the ear canal and cut down some of the highs. It really works (and is cheap, too).

 

For some reason, cotton just cuts the sound down, but doesn't muffle it. The Etymotic Research plugs are great, but they seem to only cut certain frequencies (although they advertise that they cut 10, 15, or 20db equally across the spectrum). The result is that it might cut the cymbals and guitar, and a good portion of the bass, and our shrieking vocalist, but all of a sudden my keys sound like they're WAY loud and I self-mix and cut them way back. They give a false sense of what the sound really is. Foam ear plugs just completely muffle the sound and give you an out-of-the-room listening experience.

Other problem with full-sound blockers (foam, or other plugs) is when I sing or play my sax I'm hearing the sound through my skull, rather than through both my ears and my skull. Makes for a freaky sounding sax, I can tell you.

 

Are you dealing with excessive sound on the stage? Are you trying to preserve what's left of your hearing? How so? What works for you?

[FJR]

IEM's. I only wish they would have had them years ago, I might not have any tinnitus now!

[Joe Muscara]

http://www.westone.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/product/style49musiciansplug.jpg

 

I use these, this exact color design in fact. Over the years at shows or at gigs, I've tried nearly everything, and these are the best. Completely flat attenuation, so much so I sometimes wonder if they're doing anything.

 

http://www.westone.com/hearing-protection-products/custom-fit-hearing-protection-products-4

[MonksDream]

I get them to turn down or turn their amps away from me. Failing that I use plugs and/or stop gigging with them. I also do lots of live sound and stage production work so I always have plugs handy.

[theGman]

I use strips of Starbucks napkins; they don't fall apart, are adjustable density and flesh colored, kind of.

[Skinny]

Are you dealing with excessive sound on the stage? Are you trying to preserve what's left of your hearing? How so? What works for you?

 

We got a new drummer now, who knows about DYNAMICS , but our old drummer was very loud.

 

Either way, I use Shure SCL5 in-ear monitors. I'll never go back to slowly ruining my hearing every night by not protecting my ears. In-ears took a while to get used to, but I'll sacrifice a little sound quality and the "live" sound, knowing I'll still be able to hear in 30 years.

[Mike Warren]

The US Geological Survey can tell where we're playing on any given night.

 

Perhaps you should do what the band Disaster Area from The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy do. They are so loud that they have to play their instruments from a spaceship orbiting the planet, or sometimes a completely different planet.

 

[Josh Paxton]

I've recently adopted what may be an unusual solution, but it works for me. I use custom-molded IEMs with only my vocals and keys going into them nothing else. (I control the mix myself, independently of what I send to the house, with one of these, which works great.) Between the low frequencies that the IEMs let through, and the mids and highs that bleed through my vocal mic, I actually get a pretty decent overall mix.

 

Prior to that, I was using the Westone custom plugs and dealing with the (none too great) house wedge for a monitor. It did the job, but the new setup is much better. Now I have a lower overall volume, I hear myself a lot more clearly, and I have instant, autonomous control over my mix. (And I'm now the sound guy's favorite band member because I never, ever bug him. )

[Steve LeBlanc]

I tell everyone to turn the hell down, if it's too loud on stage, it's too loud

[Moonglow]

Another vote for IEMs here. They take a little while to get used to, but I would not even consider going back to the "old way" now. It's like being in a recording studio at every job in that (depending on the sophistication of your monitor mixer) you can have every instrument in the band set the way you want it.....and the beauty is that your mix will largely stay the same at every gig! It is important to note that the whole band must use them. For example, if your guitar player isn't using them (or suddenly stops using them in the middle of the job.....), it can confound everyone's mix and the defeat the whole purpose of playing at low volume.

[Steve LeBlanc]

I've avoided IEMs whenever possible but I've still been blasted twice and by pro monitor guys who "knew" what they were doing.

 

I hate them. but of course, ymmv

[Botch]

IEM's. I only wish they would have had them years ago, I might not have any tinnitus now!

Ditto!

[Jamie Finstad]

+1 on the IEMs. I have a pair of custom molded IEMs from Ultimate Ears. Very good isolation. On the rare occasion when I've taken one out for a moment, I've been assaulted by the stage volume - back in it goes! As mentioned earlier they take some getting used to. The drummer and I are the only ones that use them. We both have the luxury of getting our own mixes which makes things much better. I also have the ability to control the amount of keys that I get and to control the overall volume. Wouldn't go any other way.

 

Jamie

[jarrell]

I use the Westone 49's as well, with the 25 dB filters. Wish I had them years ago.

[jimtheswede]

What? Did you say something? I can't hear you!

[marino]

After years of researches, I've found a perfect solution: I play almost exclusively acoustic jazz these days!

 

 

[bloodyMary]

most of the time I dont have the luctury to use iems. So earplugs it is. Once I forgot mine at home - it led to discovery that toilet paper works, too.

[JeffLearman]

If stage levels are over 110 dB SPL C for any length of time, I'm not playing. I've left the stage at blues jams for that reason. And I'd quit a band if it was a recurring problem.

 

Currently the worst case is cymbal crescendos at song endings on small stages where I'm too close to the drummer. I put a hand up to block that ear when necessary.

 

I have Emotycs earplugs and I think they're good, but I can't play Hammond clone and adjust drawbars to suit the moment -- I can't hear the top 4 drawbars well enough with them in. Emotycs says they're flat to 8K, but my ears aren't and for whatever reason, I just don't get the highs. I'd wear them otherwise (i.e., if I'm not playing hammond).

 

... and STOP MENTIONING TINNITUS! I only notice it when you bozos bring it up. I first noticed it in my early 20's when I was listening hard to do mixing and testing my own ability to hear high frequencies. I don't think it's changed much since then. I wish there was a way to block posts containing that word.

[ITGITC]

Currently the worst case is cymbal crescendos at song endings on small stages where I'm too close to the drummer. I put a hand up to block that ear when necessary.

 

Drummerz.

 

 

[MuzikTeechur]

A few drummers back our percussion man used an electronic set. This was great because it kept his portion of the stage volume down to whatever he dialed up through the monitor.

Although he had top-of-the-line stuff, it still sounded "electronic" and we're playing Motown. So, he brings his ginormous acoustic set to a gig. These were the biggest drums I've ever seen outside of a marching band.

And he proceeds to play them with the same level of abandon with which he approached the electronic set. Holy Mother of God was it loud. By the end of the first set I was suffering Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome. I told the band leader that if this was the stage volume from now on, I freaking QUIT.

It got better - when that drummer left the band about 3 months later.

 

Oh, and I just have to add ... TINNITUS!

[DanL]

Lonnie, your post could have been mine word for word regarding th setup, cymbals, and stage volume. The jam band I play with is just like that. The snare drum would actually make my ear itch inside- can't be good! I got the Etymotics, they work great for me. Cut out the harshness, and almost compress the sound. I had the same experience with the full foam plugs, you go to sing and it's all you can hear.

 

The other band I play with isn't that loud so I don't use them with those guys.

[JeffLearman]

I use strips of Starbucks napkins; they don't fall apart, are adjustable density and flesh colored, kind of.

I thought I read here that doctors warn against this, because bits can be left in your ear and cause infections that can really hurt your hearing. Toilet paper would be even worse in that regard.

 

But I can't find any authorative reference. Perhaps someone can SVENGLE it better than I did?

 

 

[MikeT156]

by learjeff:

 

If stage levels are over 110 dB SPL C for any length of time, I'm not playing. I've left the stage at blues jams for that reason. And I'd quit a band if it was a recurring problem.

 

I agree. I was in bands for years and we always had volume wars. Only one band I was ever in decided to go with small stage amps and let the PA reach the crowd. The stage volume was reduced and then the drummer played at a lower level too.

 

The Marshall stack and other big, loud, stage amps have to go. Guitar players can get a great sound through a small amp and just mic it to FOH.

 

However, as with all bands, with different levels of commitment to the band among members, personality conflicts, and some members that came and went, I got tired of all the hassle.

 

Solo is the only way to go. I have no one to compete with for stage volume, I control everything. That has helped me get more gigs because I don't play loud. If people tell me its too loud, I turn it down.

 

Mike T.

[JeffLearman]

Oh, and I just have to add ... TINNITUS!

AAAAAIIIIIEEEEE !!!

[Mr. B.]

I absolutely agree with turn the hell down. If the on stage volume gets over 95 decibes that is way too loud. I used regular very expensive headphones before the inear monitors came to be. Every time I had my ears checked the doc asked if I worked in a noisy place? Loud sound no matter how it gets to your ears will damage them. I was using the $1500 custom inear monitors, talk about clear, you hear only what you want to. Before those I've told plenty of bands to turn down and quit plenty that would not. I don't miss the loud band thing but do miss jamming with others. Everyone should consider yourselves lucky you are still easily able to play with others.

[Cadmann]

I've been so inconsistent on ear protection over the past 25 years. I have the constant ringing in my ears, although its not maddening yet, and really not that noticeable except moments like this, when the TV and AC is off and I'm sitting in front of the computer and reading things that make me think about my hearing.

 

About 15 years ago I bought a pair of custom-molded earplugs that came with about 10 different filters you could plug into the earplugs to customize your frequency blocking. But to me they just muffled the sound, even with the filters that allowed the most highs. They're still in my gig bag, and I whip them out probably only about once out of every 20 gigs, even though I should use some protection probably 18 out of 20 gigs. Years ago, I came home from gigs complaining about how loud my ears were ringing. Now I don't notice the ringing being that much louder than before the gig. Bad sign, I'd say.

 

I think I still hear fine, but I'm seeing some good advice here about IEMs and other things that I need to start looking into, to preserve what I have left -- before I end up moving next door to a commercial slaughter house just for the white noise.

 

Stuff to think about.

[MikeT156]

An ear doctor told me that as you age your hearing gets worse. If you have lost a lot of frequencies from noise when you were younger, your hearing will be worse at age 70 than a person that has not had a lot of exposure to noise when he/she was younger.

 

Hearing damage does not discriminate. Running a lawn mower for 45 minutes without hearing protection damages your hearing too. When operating any kind of power equipment, wear hearing protection.

 

I've damaged my hearing from my lawn mower because when I was younger I didn't think it mattered; it does.

 

 

Mike T.

[B3_borne]

I get them to turn down or turn their amps away from me. Failing that I use plugs and/or stop gigging with them. I also do lots of live sound and stage production work so I always have plugs handy.

 

+10000000

 

I never wear ear plugs when I play ... I'm a bear when it comes to stage volume. Like Monk I stop gigging with them if I have to put plugs in.

 

[Chris Link]

I use strips of Starbucks napkins; they don't fall apart, are adjustable density and flesh colored, kind of.

I thought I read here that doctors warn against this, because bits can be left in your ear and cause infections that can really hurt your hearing. Toilet paper would be even worse in that regard.

 

I'm an anesthesiologist, not an ENT, but I would bet any kind of paper could be a problem. Toilet paper wouldn't seem to be worse than any other.

 

Assuming, of course, that it's unused toilet paper.

[Dave Ferris]

After years of researches, I've found a perfect solution: I play almost exclusively acoustic jazz these days!

 

+100!!

 

I'm trying my best but unfortunately I have to take a detour like tonight.