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#2884395 - 10/11/17 08:19 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: AndreaAgnoletto]
Kurt W Offline
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Registered: 02/02/12
Posts: 204
Having both a Mojo 61 and a Legend Live I must say I find the tone excellent on both. To me it boils down to ergonomics, number of drawbars and Leslie interface. I am often using a Leslie 3300, sometimes a Ventilator cabled for the 11 pins Leslie interface, the lack of this on the Mojo is annoying. Have been thinking about switching the Mojo with a Legend Solo. Very confusing with just a single set of drawbars when playing dual manual organ from a bottom controller/piano. Solving this with an Ocean Beach drawbar controller. Give a little plus to the Legend leslie sim, maybe the C3 on the Mojo is slightly more authentic. Marginal differences, hard for me to prefer one above the other.

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#2884398 - 10/11/17 08:42 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: AndreaAgnoletto]
Delaware Dave Offline
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Originally Posted By: AndreaAgnoletto
AP is sampled. We will improve cool
IMHO the sustain pedal feature is too wet; the Harp control does little to alleviate it, otherwise it is not that bad but definitely the weakest of all of the instruments in the Gemini. Why wasn't the AP start point trim not moved to the Gemini in the latest update?
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#2884430 - 10/11/17 10:53 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: AndreaAgnoletto]
Joe BrokeIt Offline
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Originally Posted By: FunkKeyStuff
Originally Posted By: Bone Muskeleton
You mentioned some of these items while you were trying both, but I didn't realized you had covered so much ground.


I was having Beth distract you with jokes while I poked around under the hood. A jazz chord! grin
roll

Originally Posted By: AndreaAgnoletto
This makes me happy! This tells me that we are in the right way with physical modeling... you, as customer, easily recognize how better is this kind of approach in sound design VS sampling. Indeed Rhodes, Wurly and Clav on Mojo61 are modeled, AP is sampled. We will improve cool
love

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#2884434 - 10/11/17 11:12 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: AndreaAgnoletto]
mate stubb Offline
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Originally Posted By: AndreaAgnoletto

This makes me happy! This tells me that we are in the right way with physical modeling... you, as customer, easily recognize how better is this kind of approach in sound design VS sampling. Indeed Rhodes, Wurly and Clav on Mojo61 are modeled, AP is sampled. We will improve cool


Agree absolutely. Ever since back in the infant days of modelling-like behavior with my Roland MKS-20, modelled instruments have always impressed me with an instant player connection. While their authenticity has not always been the best, it gets better every day (see Pianoteq.)
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#2884441 - 10/11/17 11:45 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: mate stubb]
Joe P Offline
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Registered: 01/24/05
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Does the Mojo have user slots and if so how many and to what extent (like can you save an EP+ Chorus and an EP+Reverb etc..)?

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#2884442 - 10/11/17 11:58 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: Joe P]
Mitch Towne Offline
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Registered: 01/26/07
Posts: 946
Yes it does. I don't recall how many but at least 10. Each slot is loadable via the WIFI editor. Each slot saves the entire set up (organ, EPs).

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#2884443 - 10/11/17 12:01 PM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: Mitch Towne]
Joe P Offline
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Registered: 01/24/05
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Loc: Long Valley, NJ
Originally Posted By: Mitch Towne
Yes it does. I don't recall how many but at least 10. Each slot is loadable via the WIFI editor. Each slot saves the entire set up (organ, EPs).


Thanks, Mitch. I saw something called "Snapshots" in the PDF manual, accessed via the editor, maybe that's it.

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#2884448 - 10/11/17 12:23 PM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: Joe P]
mate stubb Offline
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Yes, Snapshots are a complete state of the instrument, minus things like drawbars which are controlled directly via the panel.
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#2884474 - 10/11/17 01:21 PM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: mate stubb]
Joe P Offline
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Registered: 01/24/05
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Originally Posted By: matted stump
Yes, Snapshots are a complete state of the instrument, minus things like drawbars which are controlled directly via the panel.


Thanks, and there are only 8 of them. Is that correct?

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#2884481 - 10/11/17 01:49 PM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: Joe P]
mate stubb Offline
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Originally Posted By: Joe P
Originally Posted By: matted stump
Yes, Snapshots are a complete state of the instrument, minus things like drawbars which are controlled directly via the panel.


Thanks, and there are only 8 of them. Is that correct?


Yes.
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#2884908 - 10/13/17 05:19 PM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: mate stubb]
LX88 Offline
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Registered: 10/16/10
Posts: 1756
The more time I spend evaluating Hammond clones, the more I realize one thing -

Everyone seeks something different. Almost no two people hear things the same or do things the same way.

After all the positive feedback and even meeting Guido and Andrea at NAMM , I lusted for a Crumar Mojo for many years. At NAMM I barely got a chance to hear what it could do.

In May of this year I got my hands on a Mojo 61.

I really wanted this to work out for me, but after having a Numa for many years and recently an HX3 I could not get the Mojo to give me what I needed.

I have already posted as to why that was back when I had the Mojo. I also thought that having the pianos would be a decider for me, but that was also not the case.

The big reason is I am just used to hearing something else.

As far as the Key B is concerned I really like the bass capabilities and the leslie sim. I think the CV is also outstanding on this....as is the new overdrive. As far as key click, all of the digital stuff sounds artificial to me and I don't even like too much click on a real console.

Right now my clone is an HX3 with a Hammond XK2 controller. Great key feel on the Hammond, and I have the HX3 CV about 98 percent dialed in.I think they still need to address the top 2 or 3 notes on 888000000 3rd harmonic. Otherwise so far so good.

In the future I will have a Key B or we will see what happens if Crumar does an update.

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#2884936 - 10/13/17 09:04 PM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: FunkKeyStuff]
teashea Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/24/17
Posts: 51
Very interesting comments on these two great clones. I have had a Legend and Legend Live for a while and just received a Mojo. Actually t was my second Mojo. First one was DOA and it took me a few weeks to decide to try again. This new Mojo is excellent. The build quality is very good - about as good as a Legend. The sounds seem very close to me. A little different but I cannot say one is better than another.

I do not hear any latency in the Mojo, which was an issue mentioned by Jim A in his comments. The Leslie simulations are very comparable. I cannot really tell a difference between them. I can tell a difference between these digital simulations and my 3300. However I think that much of this difference has to do with the interaction with room acoustics and the actual rotational swirling of the sounds.

The quality of the drawbars on the Mojo is very good. They seem even more substantial than other clones, including the Legend and XK5.

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#2884937 - 10/13/17 09:17 PM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: teashea]
davedoerfler Offline
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Registered: 12/27/12
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Loc: thin ice
welcome to the forum. thanks for your insight. thu
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#2884953 - 10/14/17 03:38 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: davedoerfler]
sosho Offline
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Registered: 05/02/08
Posts: 49
Loc: germany
I think the mojo might have some small latency . But I only had the feeling in the first seconds after having played a hammond sk 1 ( it was apparently broken , produced hanging notes ) in a store . Brain adjusts immediately , no problem for me. The viscount legend in the store had some problems, too. Halfmoon had a contact problem , tremolo only worked slightly bending it. The C/V dial was not showing the setting you were hearing.
I really liked the percussion on the viscount and that you can tweak it with dials . On YouTube videos I thought it sounded a bit synthetic but I did not have that impression in the store . And I like the soft/ normal switch . The mojo does not seem to have that (?) . Both sounded and felt good . I did not find the EP on the mojo , how do you dial that in ?

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#2884962 - 10/14/17 05:12 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: sosho]
Joe BrokeIt Offline
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Originally Posted By: sosho
I did not find the EP on the mojo , how do you dial that in ?
Mojo or Mojo 61? They are different. On the 61 you change the Type (far right) to EP and then switch between them using the A/B preset buttons on either side of the drawbars (Left to right they are Rhodes, Wurly, Clav, and acoustic piano).

I'm sure whatever EPs are in the original Mojo are documented in the manual as well.

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#2884970 - 10/14/17 07:05 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: Joe BrokeIt]
Al Quinn Offline
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Registered: 08/13/14
Posts: 884
Loc: Center Moriches, NY
FWIW, I don't feel any latency with my dual manual Mojo. I think I'm pretty sensitive to latency, but apparently not as much as others.
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#2884976 - 10/14/17 07:54 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: Joe BrokeIt]
sosho Offline
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Registered: 05/02/08
Posts: 49
Loc: germany
Originally Posted By: Bone Muskeleton
Originally Posted By: sosho
I did not find the EP on the mojo , how do you dial that in ?
Mojo or Mojo 61?

Sorry , forgot to mention , in the store they only had the original mojo dual manual . That one did already have the updated keybed which does feel nice.


Edited by sosho (10/14/17 07:56 AM)

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#2885021 - 10/14/17 01:13 PM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: sosho]
Jazz+ Offline
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Registered: 05/15/04
Posts: 5509
The modeled sounds in the mojo 61 do not suffer from latency, they are very quick to respond. You can run at high speed. The acoustic piano is its only non-modeled sound, it is sample based, and it feels late when I play it. It has been said that there will be an update for it. Hopefully it will become modeled too.


Edited by Jazz+ (10/14/17 03:32 PM)
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#2885027 - 10/14/17 02:19 PM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: Jazz+]
tfort Offline
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Registered: 05/06/16
Posts: 99
I would think modelling an acoustic piano is far more difficult than modelling Rhodes, Wurli, etc. Modartt and Roland have been working on it for years and still there are people who don't like the sound.

Maybe if Guido and Andrea focused on modelling a piano solely for live use, intended to sacrifice some harmonic complexity to be able to cut through a mix better, it would be easier to get a decent one done quickly and with relatively low computer resources required.

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#2885029 - 10/14/17 02:31 PM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: tfort]
aellison62 Offline
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Registered: 03/18/09
Posts: 314
Loc: Ohio
Isn’t Roland’s supernatural piano modeled?
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#2885058 - 10/14/17 05:35 PM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: aellison62]
tfort Offline
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Registered: 05/06/16
Posts: 99
Roland doesn’t really try to clarify the technology behind its piano engines, but the way I think of it is that SuperNatural refers to modelling built on top of samples, while their V-Piano is more fully modelled.

My original point, though, is that Roland and Modartt’s modelled pianos are considered the best around at the moment, and still many seem to prefer the big sampled piano libraries. It may be a long while, then, for Guido and Andrea to come out with a very good modelled acoustic piano sound. I hope they have an innovative approach and are coding geniuses so the new Mojo73 has a great modelled AP. But logic would dictate we should keep our expectations low and hope for a well-modelled “live” piano rather than something to compete with Pianoteq and the V-Piano.

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#2885064 - 10/14/17 05:57 PM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: tfort]
OB Dave Offline
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Registered: 04/25/09
Posts: 947
Loc: San Diego CA, US
The line between modeled and sampled is so blurry as to be meaningless. I honestly don't get why people get so hung up on the distinction.

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#2885104 - 10/15/17 01:07 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: tfort]
TomKittel Offline
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Registered: 07/09/13
Posts: 459
Originally Posted By: tfort
My original point, though, is that Roland and Modartt’s modelled pianos are considered the best around at the moment, and still many seem to prefer the big sampled piano libraries.


OT: I prefer Pianoteq 6 to any sampled piano library. It was a real game changer for me.

JMTC. Back to topic. ;-)

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#2885117 - 10/15/17 06:07 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: TomKittel]
jeffinpghpa Offline
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Registered: 05/22/07
Posts: 354
Loc: Charlotte, NC
What is Mojo73? Is that their announcement?
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#2885120 - 10/15/17 06:19 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: jeffinpghpa]
Joe BrokeIt Offline
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Originally Posted By: jeffinpghpa
What is Mojo73? Is that their announcement?
No, just some including FKS' wish.

If anyone would suddenly make a killer modeled acoustic piano, it would be Guido.

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#2885137 - 10/15/17 08:29 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: Joe BrokeIt]
ap297 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/28/14
Posts: 33
My wish; 76 or 88 note with pitch and mod wheels. Maybe based off the DMC-122 form factor. The ultimate "take one board to the gig solution". Would sell like hotcakes!

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#2885141 - 10/15/17 08:55 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: ap297]
Cybersoniq Offline
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Registered: 01/24/12
Posts: 322
Originally Posted By: ap297
My wish; 76 or 88 note with pitch and mod wheels. Maybe based off the DMC-122 form factor. The ultimate "take one board to the gig solution". Would sell like hotcakes!

Well we will just have to standby for the news from GSI:
https://www.facebook.com/GenuineSoundwar...e=3&theater

With the combo 73-key/waterfall key form factor competition heating up with the Vox Continental ($2199) and the Roland VR-730 ($1499)...maybe a DMC-73/Mojo 73 can slide in between in price with its top class tone-wheel organ models/rotary sim and growing stable of modeled and sampled-based instruments. What does Guido have cooking in the lab??? rockit


Edited by Cybersoniq (10/15/17 08:58 AM)

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#2885144 - 10/15/17 09:04 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: Cybersoniq]
AnotherScott Online   content
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Registered: 10/19/09
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Originally Posted By: Cybersoniq
With the combo 73-key/waterfall key form factor competition heating up with the Vox Continental ($2199) and the Roland VR-730 ($1499)

there's also this...
http://www.dexibell.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=80
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#2885151 - 10/15/17 10:02 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: AnotherScott]
Cybersoniq Offline
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Registered: 01/24/12
Posts: 322
Originally Posted By: AnotherScott
Originally Posted By: Cybersoniq
With the combo 73-key/waterfall key form factor competition heating up with the Vox Continental ($2199) and the Roland VR-730 ($1499)

there's also this...
http://www.dexibell.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=80

Thanks AS! Lost this on the latest radar. This certainly fits the bill & Hoedown covers too(see at 3:30):



Edited by Cybersoniq (10/15/17 11:49 AM)

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#2885161 - 10/15/17 10:56 AM Re: Totally unofficial Mojo 61/Viscount Legend shootout [Re: Cybersoniq]
ElmerJFudd Online   content
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