fjzingo Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 Had a jazzgig last week, I am a little out of practice so I played way over the shape Im in . Result: pain in fingers and wrists. Ibuprofen seems to help. Have had the tendency to get problem with my fingers when working with an ipad or the macbook touchpad, in particular the index and middle finger. Any tips or tricks to get better quick apart from rest and painkillers? Any exercises to avoid it happen again? /Fred Cantaloop Soulfetch Soulbox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazz+ Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 You need to rest after a gig or any extended practice. That is normal. Yes, Ibuprofen will speed up recovery. I am also dealing with the a shoulder thing currently and had wrist tendon inflammation (tenosynovitis ) my entire life . There are no exercises, rest is best. But try to play with a light touch, don't overplay, keep your wrist loose and flexible (up and down) but avoid side twisting the wrist. Warm cool soaking can help and self massage the pressure points. An Ibuprofen in the morning when you wake up stiff and sore can work wonders. Slowly warm up the muscles each day. Smile, breathe and go slowly. Pro baseball pitchers all need around 5-7 days of rest after to heal after each real game they pitch. Humans were not built for repetitive stress. And each person has a different physicaltolerance. Harry Likas was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book." Find 700 of Harry’s piano arrangements of standards for educational purposes and jazz piano tutorials at www.Patreon.com/HarryLikas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Song80s Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 Had a jazzgig last week, I am a little out of practice so I played way over the shape Im in . Result: pain in fingers and wrists. Ibuprofen seems to help. Have had the tendency to get problem with my fingers when working with an ipad or the macbook touchpad, in particular the index and middle finger. Any tips or tricks to get better quick apart from rest and painkillers? Any exercises to avoid it happen again? this is also more Doctor territory for advice. See what your doc advises. He knows you best. I also alternate warm pads and ice to my hands. Why fit in, when you were born to stand out ? My Soundcloud with many originals: [70's Songwriter] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazz+ Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 Doctor will tell you what's on any website for tendinitis. Harry Likas was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book." Find 700 of Harry’s piano arrangements of standards for educational purposes and jazz piano tutorials at www.Patreon.com/HarryLikas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazz+ Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 Moving any gear can be a big cause of hand/arm/shoulder/back injury too. Harry Likas was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book." Find 700 of Harry’s piano arrangements of standards for educational purposes and jazz piano tutorials at www.Patreon.com/HarryLikas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tnelson Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 Pain (inflammation) in wrist and fingers should not be a consequence of keyboard playing, even if you haven't played for a while....It suggests your keyboard technique needs to change, to generate most force and motion from your arms, not your wrists and fingers. Classical piano guys get lots of training and guidance on this, not just for good technique, but because once inflammation starts, it is only made worse by more playing and can take weeks or months to subside. Have a look at some of the piano "methods" like the Taubman Approach (there are many alternatives), with plenty of videos on the web. Don't ignore pain in the hands and wrists! It's telling you something is wrong with your technique that could cripple your playing for a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldwin Funster Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 Warm up and get your hands and fingers loose before you do difficult passages. Your doing damage if you dont. Make the first songs in the set high energy where someone else like the drummer has all the flashy parts and youre just banging a few chords. Later do the hard playing. FunMachine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazz+ Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 Pain is a normal response to keyboard playing in many professional players. We are human beings, we are fragile. We were not designed for long hours of repetitive stress: friction and percussion impact. Harry Likas was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book." Find 700 of Harry’s piano arrangements of standards for educational purposes and jazz piano tutorials at www.Patreon.com/HarryLikas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timwat Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 "Are you playing with the least amount of effort? Two things to check - if there's tension, pain, whatever in your top forearm muscles you're using the wrong set of muscles; if you do not pass the fly-away-wrist test, you're using the wrong set of muscles." Dave Horne, 2008 .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjzingo Posted October 5, 2016 Author Share Posted October 5, 2016 Thanks for the advice Jazz+ Can you enlighten me on what the pressure points is? You need to rest after a gig or any extended practice. That is normal. Yes, Ibuprofen will speed up recovery. I am also dealing with the a shoulder thing currently and had wrist tendon inflammation (tenosynovitis ) my entire life . There are no exercises, rest is best. But try to play with a light touch, don't overplay, keep your wrist loose and flexible (up and down) but avoid side twisting the wrist. Warm cool soaking can help and self massage the pressure points. An Ibuprofen in the morning when you wake up stiff and sore can work wonders. Slowly warm up the muscles each day. Smile, breathe and go slowly. Pro baseball pitchers all need around 5-7 days of rest after to heal after each real game they pitch. Humans were not built for repetitive stress. And each person has a different physicaltolerance. You need to rest after a gig or any extended practice. That is normal. Yes, Ibuprofen will speed up recovery. I am also dealing with the a shoulder thing currently and had wrist tendon inflammation (tenosynovitis ) my entire life . There are no exercises, rest is best. But try to play with a light touch, don't overplay, keep your wrist loose and flexible (up and down) but avoid side twisting the wrist. Warm cool soaking can help and self massage the pressure points. An Ibuprofen in the morning when you wake up stiff and sore can work wonders. Slowly warm up the muscles each day. Smile, breathe and go slowly. Pro baseball pitchers all need around 5-7 days of rest after to heal after each real game they pitch. Humans were not built for repetitive stress. And each person has a different physicaltolerance. /Fred Cantaloop Soulfetch Soulbox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjzingo Posted October 5, 2016 Author Share Posted October 5, 2016 Good comments and advice on technique, probably something I need to work on. Try to pick up some during my kids Suzukipiano lessons. Unfortunately i was pretty sore in my fingers prior to the gig. Also had a rehearsal last weekend, Used my nord electro with hammond keys to lessen the pain. Will continue the rest until sunday, have a gig in 1.5 weeks time and another rehearsal sunday.....not good. /Fred Cantaloop Soulfetch Soulbox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mate stubb Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 I couldn't hear myself very well at the last gig as we were under an extreme volume constraint, and my forearm was sore for several days. Moe --- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Song80s Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 Doctor will tell you what's on any website for tendinitis. I have a hunch that a trained doctor has more skill and ability than a web site. An annual checkup is always a good practice. Why fit in, when you were born to stand out ? My Soundcloud with many originals: [70's Songwriter] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cphollis Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 What follows is no substitute for professional medical advice, just what I do. The other advice here is good as well. I frequently get hand pain as a result of overplaying a four-hour gig with insufficient practice. Sort of my after-gig hangover for having too much fun. I take ibuprofen *before* the gig to nip any inflammation in the bud. Works great. If I have minor pain afterwards, I do deep self-massage (a) between the bones in my palm, and (b) between the bones in my forearms. My GP conversation went as follows: "Doctor, it really hurts when I play the piano long and hard". "Stop doing it". OK, that was helpful Want to make your band better? Check out "A Guide To Starting (Or Improving!) Your Own Local Band" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazz+ Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 My doctors (plural) said "don't per-cuss (lighten up)". "Don't practice more than 30 minutes a day", "let's take full x rays" , "take Ibuprofen", "soak in warm then cool water, back and forth ", "massage the joints" etc .... and these doctors were orthopedic specialists for a famous symphony orchestra. It's up to you to take care of yourself. There is plenty of web info on how to. Harry Likas was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book." Find 700 of Harry’s piano arrangements of standards for educational purposes and jazz piano tutorials at www.Patreon.com/HarryLikas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldwin Funster Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 When you have pain in the middle of a song make a guitar face. It helps. FunMachine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cedar Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 I just came down with "golfer's elbow" (which generally refers to pain on the inside of the elbow, running down the forearm - as opposed to tennis elbow, which refers to pain on the outside of the elbow). From various activities - piano, computer, tennis, other exercises - I've endured a number of issues over the past ten years. Generally, a little rest does the trick. I've had physical therapy occasionally, but I'm not convinced it helped more than just rest. A few years ago my tennis elbow was bad enough that it stopped me from tennis (though not piano) for up to a year. This is not uncommon among my tennis-playing friends. Some people who have never had a problem inexplicably wake up one day with a severe problem. Seems completely random when this type of repetitive stress injury becomes serious. In this case, I'm pretty sure my latest issue did arise because of one week when I was doing a heavy dose or music + typing on a computer. It's quite possible that I lapsed into some poor technique, but I think it could also be a function of age too. As Bette Davis reportedly said, "getting old isn't for sissies." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MathOfInsects Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 When it comes to producing pain from my playing, I'm usually a carrier. Now out! "Mind the Gap," a 24-song album of new material. www.joshweinstein.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Song80s Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 What follows is no substitute for professional medical advice, just what I do. The other advice here is good as well. I frequently get hand pain as a result of overplaying a four-hour gig with insufficient practice. Sort of my after-gig hangover for having too much fun. I take ibuprofen *before* the gig to nip any inflammation in the bud. Works great. If I have minor pain afterwards, I do deep self-massage (a) between the bones in my palm, and (b) between the bones in my forearms. My GP conversation went as follows: "Doctor, it really hurts when I play the piano long and hard". "Stop doing it". OK, that was helpful A decent doctor will listen to you and then refer you to a specialist assuming you are not 22 years old and whining. Why fit in, when you were born to stand out ? My Soundcloud with many originals: [70's Songwriter] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
16251 Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 Sorry to Quack-up this thread with the idea that 'it' can help. Last time I started a thread about 'it,' I was mocked and ridiculed. That's Ok, it IS quackery but the way I see it, the concept/idea of what it does seems as plausible as other things in life that people believe, without proof. Wearing a copper bracelet (it) can not possibly hurt you and it might even help, along with all the other great advise others have mentioned here. It's just another thing and there are many people who agree that wearing a copper bracelet helps. I was just reading some reviews at Amazon; there were some believers, including me. AvantGrand N2 | ES520 | Gallien-Krueger MK & MP | https://soundcloud.com/pete36251 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Song80s Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 Sorry to Quack-up this thread with the idea that 'it' can help. Last time I started a thread about 'it,' I was mocked and ridiculed. That's Ok, it IS quackery but the way I see it, the concept/idea of what it does seems as plausible as other things in life that people believe, without proof. Wearing a copper bracelet (it) can not possibly hurt you and it might even help, along with all the other great advise others have mentioned here. It's just another thing and there are many people who agree that wearing a copper bracelet helps. I was just reading some reviews at Amazon; there were some believers, including me. Yes, Mr Tommy Copper, I am 1 of your motivated product reviewers It does provide some relief. But its not a cure-all Why fit in, when you were born to stand out ? My Soundcloud with many originals: [70's Songwriter] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Quinn Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 Have had the tendency to get problem with my fingers when working with an ipad or the macbook touchpad, in particular the index and middle finger. ? I had severe hand pain in the mid-90's. I figured it was either from playing keyboards or working with computers. I switched from a mouse to a trackball and have been fine since. If you use your macbook a lot you might want to try using a trackball instead of the touchpad. https://alquinn.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunshadow Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 i had the tendency to attack the middle C octaves (with left hand) from a "head on" HAND angle, but your wrist is attacking from diagonal, so the more you try and attack this way it will create major discomfort in wrist(if you are playing like that for many hours straight), because of the really sharp angle you are cocking your wrist on need to have wrist and hand line up in the same attack angle... http://i.imgur.com/a8Mh66K.jpg http://i.imgur.com/7qYk47e.jpg NordPiano2 Roland A-49 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tusker Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 I was doing a lot of typing. I was also playing a lot of jazz gigs and perhaps over practicing. I developed tenosynovitis. I wouldn't say I have any significant hand posture or tension habits. Some of us are just more prone to RSI once we reach a certain age. Joints are an issue in my family. I took to wearing a wrist strap, which helped. OTC pain killers also helped, but you want to be careful not to over medicate and ruin your digestive tract. Finally, my orthopedic surgeon did a little procedure. Essentially he injected some anti inflammatory into the tendon sheath which reduced the swelling, but since he used a large-bore needle, it also made a good-sized vent in the sheath, giving the fluid an easier path to dissipation. I cut back the gig schedule, and am more cautious about practice intensity and posture. Sad, but I'd like to continue playing into my senior years and a little caution now won't hurt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WesG Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 I have the problem in sunshadow's pic sometimes. For me, it's cause by sitting too close to the piano, either from my bad eyesight combined with lousy charts, or a cramped stage. Hammond: L111, M100, M3, BC, CV, Franken CV, A100, D152, C3, B3 Leslie: 710, 760, 51C, 147, 145, 122, 22H, 31H Yamaha: CP4, DGX-620, DX7II-FD-E!, PF85, DX9 Roland: VR-09, RD-800 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outkaster Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 My problem is when we do Judo a lot of it is with the hands. CEB can attest to this as we grab the GI (uniform) with the hands so they tend to get worn out. I like the post above about the attack angle as it's true. "Danny, ci manchi a tutti. La E-Street Band non e' la stessa senza di te. Riposa in pace, fratello" noblevibes.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PianoMan51 Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 I couldn't hear myself very well at the last gig as we were under an extreme volume constraint, and my forearm was sore for several days. Ear-Hand coordination is everything for us. My best resource for keeping my touch light is to make sure that I hear myself loudly and cleanly enough. For jazz gigs I set up so the band and the audience can hear me, then I slip on a pair of stereo earbuds (not in-ear) and gradually turn up the headset volume until it sounds like I'm sitting in front of a 9 foot grand. When I hear myself this way it relaxes me and my playing. It makes the gig more fun, easier, and more musical. I also run my vocals through the earbuds and it helps me reduce vocal strain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outkaster Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 I couldn't hear myself very well at the last gig as we were under an extreme volume constraint, and my forearm was sore for several days. Yes because you have to play harder. Or playing with drummers that drag. Some gigs I sub in it's a "fight" to play with them. You constantly are adjusting for tempo. "Danny, ci manchi a tutti. La E-Street Band non e' la stessa senza di te. Riposa in pace, fratello" noblevibes.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunshadow Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 yea by being higher than the piano you can avoid alot of wrist angle problems...BUT....then you start to get back problems, if you are reaching down to far.... also, every seen an ergonomic keyboard for computers? why dont they make pianos like that. http://www.custom-build-computers.com/image-files/computer-ergonomic-keyboard.jpg NordPiano2 Roland A-49 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synthoid Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 also, every seen an ergonomic keyboard for computers? why dont they make pianos like that. http://www.custom-build-computers.com/image-files/computer-ergonomic-keyboard.jpg Good heavens, I hope not. When an eel hits your eye like a big pizza pie, that's a Moray. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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