What do I charge?

[Gary75]

A friend of mine recently acquired a Wurlitzer 200A, and asked me to do some work to it as the action is stiff and needs let off adjusting as its not dynamic enough. Now I have in the past done some work on my Wurli, but it never required a total removal, only reed bar work and some let off adjustment. Anyway, I agreed, and upon inspection found it needed key easing and guide pin lubricant, as well as a complete strip out of the action to lubricate the whip assemblies/hammers.

 

I just finished the whip assemblies last night, but boy is a long tedious affair, as well as stressful because it's one thing to work on your own gear, but another to work on someone else's. I had never pulled out an entire Wurlitzer before, in fact I was so worried about attempting it when I got mine a few years ago, I got a company to do it. However I was charged £700 for the work (which I felt was grossly expensive considering that's what I paid for the piano) so much so I swore never again to let any company touch my gear and I would learn to maintain it myself. It's not rocket science, you just need common sense, patience etc. I just felt at the time, it looked a lot more involved than my Rhodes/Clavinet which are a piece of p*** to work on.

 

Anyway, I can't possibly charge £700. But, I know it has taken hours so far, and it's not reassembled yet.

 

How much do you guys think is reasonable to charge for complete removal of innards, full lubrication of each individual whip assembly/hammer and let off adjustments?

 

It's just I know I'm going to say some low price and lowball myself when I take it back then get annoyed with myself on the drive home!

 

I'm documenting some of my effort, so I can show him just how involved it has been.

 

[video:youtube]IJvZLWVKeU0

 

 

[Aidan]

Are you keeping an actual record of how many hours you're putting in? I think it's easier to come up with a reasonable hourly rate and do the maths. You can always give him a 'mates rate' discount after you've come up with the final sum. What are you worth per hour?

[nickd]

Or you could estimate how much a commercial company would charge for the work, and pick a suitable percentage (say 50%) as your rate?

 

Maybe do this and Aidan's hourly calculation, and see if the two numbers are anywhere near each other?

[Gary75]

I know I have spent around 9 hours so far. Obviously I am slower and more methodical than a company who does this stuff for a living all the time. Having said that, I paid £700 for the above job on my own Wurlitzer (not far from you Aidan) and the let off hadn't been adjusted anyway once I was familiar with factory settings.

 

I would estimate there's another 10 hours or so work. I'm not at it all the time, I'll do a couple of hours here and there. I'm enjoying it as I now know I can tackle a full strip out of it.

 

I was thinking around £350, I just don't want to offend anyone! I'd make a poor businessman!

 

 

[stoken6]

19 hours work total? I think £350 is a bit light, it's less than £20 per hour.

 

Cheers, Mike.

[MorayM]

Hourly rate is normally how I do things - as a finger in the air any work requiring specialist skills I'll charge at minimum £15ph, if I'm providing my own tools and workspace etc, £20+

 

Doing stuff for mates can be difficult though, so think of the hourly rate you'd like and play the conversation like this:

 

"It's been 19 hours work at £(slightly higher than what you'd like) per hour"

 

[see if they baulk!]

 

"... but as it's for you I'll do it for £(slightly less what you'd like) per hour"

 

They think they've got a good deal (which, to an extent, they have) and you haven't sold yourself short. Everybody wins!

[BluesKeys]

How much is the next toy you have your eye on? That sounds reasonable to me!!!

[MorayM]

How much is the next toy you have your eye on? That sounds reasonable to me!!!

 

I like your style.

[Gary75]

How much is the next toy you have your eye on? That sounds reasonable to me!!!

 

It's funny you should say that, it's an HX3 module for my BX3. I might have known I'd be rumbled by a fellow forumite.

[16251]

I owned two wurlizers and my recollection was just tuning it took forever, and was a pain in the butt.

[WesG]

I have experience as a service tech, but not as a Wurli tech.

 

Think about the job you just did, and how fast you could do it NEXT time, if you were hustling but working carefully.

 

Unless it is a very customer-specific job, THAT is the number of hours you should base your billing on. The difference between the two numbers represents tuition. You should pay that, not your customers.

 

Wes

[Threadslayer]

Think about the job you just did, and how fast you could do it NEXT time, if you were hustling but working carefully.

 

Unless it is a very customer-specific job, THAT is the number of hours you should base your billing on. The difference between the two numbers represents tuition. You should pay that, not your customers.

 

Wes

That's a pretty good way to look at it.

And now, from the 20-20 hindsight division, you really should establish the terms - hourly rate, not to exceed, etc. - up front. Particularly with friends.

[Bif_]

What you charge, what it's worth to you for your time and what it's worth to him to get it fixed could be three wildly different numbers.

 

I would let him know where you are so far, based on a reasonable hourly rate then see if he wants to invest in the full repair.

 

If not, you better put the brakes on now or you'll be wasting your time.

[Gary75]

I ended up charging £15 p/h. I haven't made much to be honest, but positives are I am now totally educated on complete strip out and repair of all the Wurlitzer parts.

 

And as he's extremely known in the industry, I may get more work, although I will make sure he knows it was mates rates!

[Baldwin Funster]

Can he fix your car? Sometimes a trade out is good.

[Gary75]

My cars done, new discs and pads!

 

This will pay for my dogs hydrotherapy. Of course, having done someone else's Wurli, I have now put mine on the bench and have started the same strip down as its now not as good as the other one!

 

I'm a glutton for punishment!

[AWkeys]

I have experience as a service tech, but not as a Wurli tech.

 

Think about the job you just did, and how fast you could do it NEXT time, if you were hustling but working carefully.

 

Unless it is a very customer-specific job, THAT is the number of hours you should base your billing on. The difference between the two numbers represents tuition. You should pay that, not your customers.

 

Wes

 

Wes, that is awesome advice for any type of work - thank you!

[Gary75]

I actually partially disassembled it last night after I told the chap it was ready. I wasn't happy with a couple of notes still slightly dragging. Basically the issue with it was the tip of the jacks. I coated them with a graphite pencil and that cured it. I lubrucated all the action parts, set the sustain pedal as there was too much lost motion. And also put some paper shims under some damper arms as they weren't lifting off uniformly.

 

I keep learning things, things that are very niche!

[J_tour]

What do they say, "perfect is the enemy of good"? You've already gotten the good advice from others, but my two cents is just you learned a lot, and assuming your friend is really a friend, get from him what you want (trade some gear, a few hundred euros [!], maybe some drinks with his sister, whatever).

 

If a "friend" rather than a friend, I'd just charge a flat rate and chalk whatever extra time it took me up to learning on the job.

 

Who knows, in ten years you might be scrabbling for performing jobs and have gained a rep as being "the man who knows how to do shit, who also plays keyboards like a beast." Anyway, it's music business, so anything you can do is better than mopping floors. It's a small world, so your work is going to pay off. Just don't do it for free, same as anything.

[kanker.]

I have experience as a service tech, but not as a Wurli tech.

 

Think about the job you just did, and how fast you could do it NEXT time, if you were hustling but working carefully.

 

Unless it is a very customer-specific job, THAT is the number of hours you should base your billing on. The difference between the two numbers represents tuition. You should pay that, not your customers.

 

Wes

 

Wes, that is awesome advice for any type of work - thank you!

Agreed. A great way of looking at the problem of billing. I've always hated the what would you charge question. I still hate it, but this is a great new perspective.