Joe Muscara Posted December 25, 2013 Share Posted December 25, 2013 There are thousands of expert, classically-based musicians who are not one bit famous. There is no connection between musical expertise and fame, and this is especially true in popular culture. What do you want to be: famous, or an expert performer, (engineer, composer, etc)? One of the things that annoys me about a very few "frequent contributors" to this forum is that they clearly are not high achieving performers, but they pretend they are. Why are any of us entitled to be famous? What have we created? Sorry, Jordan Rudess is not famous: poll your everyday friends. So why do people buy more hardware or software that will improve their capacity only 2% on what their existing gear will allow? Do they want to buy fame? The shame of it all, Dave, is that after just about all of us have not looked at your videos, of those who have, practically none will write their own practice schedule around one particular goal, build on your teaching, and so begin playing better. It seems like someone is upset that they didn't get all they wanted for Christmas this year. "I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck "The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EscapeRocks Posted December 25, 2013 Share Posted December 25, 2013 The shame of it all, Dave, is that after just about all of us have not looked at your videos, of those who have, practically none will write their own practice schedule around one particular goal, build on your teaching, and so begin playing better. It seems like someone is upset that they didn't get all they wanted for Christmas this year. David Gig Rig:Depends on the day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I-missRichardTee Posted December 25, 2013 Share Posted December 25, 2013 One of the things that annoys me about a very few "frequent contributors" to this forum is that they clearly are not high achieving performers, but they pretend they are. Wow. I wasn't aware that there were prerequisites to posting here. Guess I'll be leaving now. p.s. I don't care if you're Liberace or a Rank Beginner: we all have a voice and something to say. If you're performing in Carnegie Hall or Clem's BBQ Shack: chances are you're the best keyboard player in the room, and that's enough. Ha ha Hey my friend from Maine, have you heard Trappers playing, by any chance? So a Trapper, who might you be referring to? Who do you deem to be faking "high achievement"? You don't have ideas, ideas have you We see the world, not as it is, but as we are. "One mans food is another mans poison". I defend your right to speak hate. Tolerance to a point, not agreement Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timwat Posted December 25, 2013 Share Posted December 25, 2013 One of the things that annoys me about a very few "frequent contributors" to this forum is that they clearly are not high achieving performers, but they pretend they are. Even if you have first-hand experience listening to these "frequent contributors" play (of which I am one, maybe you're referring to me), that's just an elitist, judgmental statement. I'm not calling you an elitist or judgmental person - I don't know you at all - but this statement is provocative enough that I wonder where it's coming from. Care to elaborate? Tim .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrapperJack Posted December 25, 2013 Share Posted December 25, 2013 I propose a prerequisite: honesty and respect for others. If you haven't made a chair, don't have a clear understanding of the craft of building chairs based on years of chair building, and sometimes don't even recognise a chair, don't pretend you are the chairman, invent a resume, and a history, and tell everybody everything about chairs. If you want to know, or have an idea to discuss, ask away, regardless of how well you play. I propose that prerequisite. And I think it is fair and reasonable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I-missRichardTee Posted December 25, 2013 Share Posted December 25, 2013 don't even recognise a chair, don't pretend you are the chairman, invent a resume, and a history, and tell everybody everything about chairs" But but, to whom are you referring, my good man? You don't have ideas, ideas have you We see the world, not as it is, but as we are. "One mans food is another mans poison". I defend your right to speak hate. Tolerance to a point, not agreement Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Muscara Posted December 25, 2013 Share Posted December 25, 2013 If you are going to say people here are being dishonest, if you are saying there are people who are disrespectful, come out and say it and whom. Don't play games. It is insulting and leaves people wondering about whom you are speaking, and some will wonder if you're talking about them as you can see above. Better still, keep such thoughts to yourself and be a force for good here. Personally, I disliked your judgemental comment in the Dave Frank thread. With the amount of material Mr. Frank is giving us, there is more than most anyone can digest at once. Different people will get different things from it. "I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck "The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Alfredson Posted December 25, 2013 Share Posted December 25, 2013 I think what the article is trying to articulate is simply to be thankful and aware of the power that you have under your fingertips. Yes, mics are important but you can get great sound out of mics that cost a mere fraction of what you had to pay 20 years ago for similar results. Any modern DAW has far more flexibility and power than any studio in the 60s or 70s. But like anything else with music, it takes expertise, knowledge, and a fascinating combination of art and science to really take advantage of it. I'll always remember something my late father said to me only a few months before he died. I was playing him some music I had recorded (organissimo's Groovadelphia - the first CD I recorded completely in my home studio) and he said, "If I had all of this when I was your age..." and then trailed off. A few seconds later he said, "There's no excuse. Make your music." I remember the struggles he went through on a VERY limited budget to try and emulate his heroes. Indeed, I owe him my own knowledge of recording techniques due to his incessant quest to improve his own recordings on almost no budget. He spent years tracking all the songs he wrote (over 1500) late at night after we had all gone to bed, using a really basic mixer to track his guitar (direct), vocal (cheap Shure mic) and a rhythm box (direct) into a stereo cassette deck. I have all those recordings and they sound remarkably good for the technology. It cost a fortune to have a decent home studio in the 80s. Now, even when you factor in mics, it is readily attainable and at a level of professionalism and sophistication that they never dreamed possible 30 years ago. Keep it greazy! B3tles - Soul Jazz THEO - Prog Rock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Muscara Posted December 25, 2013 Share Posted December 25, 2013 I have all those recordings and they sound remarkably good for the technology. Have you ever considered sharing these in some form, something like a SoundCloud account? "I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck "The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Alfredson Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Yes, but they are very personal. He wrote songs for us kids, for my mom, for his religion, for his demons, for his failures, for his dreams, etc. I don't know that he ever intended any of them to be released. Some day I might go through a find the best ones and perhaps re-record them. Keep it greazy! B3tles - Soul Jazz THEO - Prog Rock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Muscara Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 I bet there is a (figurative) gold mine of material in there for you. "I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck "The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I-missRichardTee Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Jim, sorry about your loss. You don't have ideas, ideas have you We see the world, not as it is, but as we are. "One mans food is another mans poison". I defend your right to speak hate. Tolerance to a point, not agreement Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael W Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Personally, I disliked your judgemental comment in the Dave Frank thread. With the amount of material Mr. Frank is giving us, there is more than most anyone can digest at once. Different people will get different things from it. I didn't get that, either. Anytime someone is willing to invest their time in making videos and sharing knowledge and information - especially for free - isn't this to be applauded and encouraged? Perhaps I missed something. Michael Montage 8, Logic Pro X, Omnisphere, Diva, Zebra 2, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrapperJack Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 I propose a prerequisite: honesty and respect for others, who have done the work. I will not tell lies, John. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Muscara Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 I propose a prerequisite: honesty and respect for others, who have done the work. I will not tell lies, John. You said that already. I replied to it already. You ignored what I said. I've made my point, do what you will. "I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck "The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allan_evett Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Appears an exercise in futility, Joe. But you have options: As ye have been ignored... 'Someday, we'll look back on these days and laugh; likely a maniacal laugh from our padded cells, but a laugh nonetheless' - Mr. Boffo. We need a barfing cat emoticon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Muscara Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Appears an exercise in futility, Joe. But you have options: As ye have been ignored... Yeah, Allan. I'm done, and have already done what you suggested. "I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck "The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrapperJack Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Sorry, Joe, it is not my intention to ignore anyone. The accumulation of contributions speak for themselves, and it is my experience that most people just need a gentle reminder to make them sensitive to their impact. It is deeply disrespectful to continue claiming achievements which are "not real". In a bar, you can say "good night", and leave people to spin their webs. As for my comments about the uptake of Dave Frank's offerings, I wish I was wrong. I deplore the lack of work ethic among too many musicians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrapperJack Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 "It seems like someone is upset that they didn't get all they wanted for Christmas this year." Did you want a response to this, Joe? I had a good Christmas. No disappointments. What I wrote was both insightful and highly defendable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wmp Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 What you seem to be saying is that some unnamed folks around here aren't up to your standards and you've made it your mission in life to school 'em. With all due respect, who (tf) are you? Rhetorical question. I don't want an answer. I don't care. You're the dude I've nicknamed Preacher Jack. --wmp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richforman Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Anyway, I always figure that improved tech makes it easier and more convenient for all music-makers, both aspiring and actual, at whatever level of skill, talent and accomplishment, to realize their musical ideas (however much or little merit or originality those ideas have) and turn them into sound that can be heard by others - without making those ideas or the resultant sounds any better, necessarily. The technology very democratically benefits musicians or people who fancy themselves such, without regard to whether the resultant music really needs or deserves to be made, but not the end listener (that is not its purpose), whose results do still depend on the quality of the ideas. Rich Forman Yamaha MOXF8, Korg Kronos 2-61, Roland Fantom X7, Ferrofish B4000+ organ module, Roland VR-09, EV ZLX12P, K&M Spider Pro stand, Yamaha S80, Korg Trinity Plus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
area51recording Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Is it me or is this place getting more...."contentious" lately?.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synthoid Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Is it me or is this place getting more...."contentious" lately?.... An unfortunate side-effect of the holidays I imagine... When an eel hits your eye like a big pizza pie, that's a Moray. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outkaster Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Contentious sometimes. It happens here and there. Nothing like Harmony Central was in the early 2000's though. "Danny, ci manchi a tutti. La E-Street Band non e' la stessa senza di te. Riposa in pace, fratello" noblevibes.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Muscara Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Is it me or is this place getting more...."contentious" lately?.... Nah, this place is cool. Sometimes a person or a few stir the pot but overall it tends to settle down quickly. "I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck "The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Muscara Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 "It seems like someone is upset that they didn't get all they wanted for Christmas this year." Did you want a response to this, Joe? I had a good Christmas. No disappointments. Good. I'm honestly glad to read that. "I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck "The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
area51recording Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Contentious sometimes. It happens here and there. Nothing like Harmony Central was in the early 2000's though. True that! I seem also to remember one forum (Pro Sound Web maybe) Where first time posters were savagely raked over the coals, just for being first time posters....some kind of idiotic initiation by a group of "internet badasses I guess..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Loving Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 "I propose a prerequisite: honesty and respect for others, who have done the work. I will not tell lies, John." Most posters on the internet are anonymous. Is that dishonest? Pulling back the curtain hiding Oz is a lofty expectation for the internet where anonymous names abound. The KC has a lot of members who cite their true names. The web is full of posers, but I don't believe we have any here that are not smoked out pretty quick. Maybe we should impose grades like the Royal College of Music. Anybody who wants to conduct auditions, OK by me. I have enjoyed the Dave Frank lessons, although I probably use them wrong, as suggested. I'm still working on the left hand bass technique, a lifetime task for me. I just enjoy the discourse, gig stories and the occasional tip from professionals, like Mike Martin, Steve Nathan and Jim Alfredson. So far the forum is OK in my book. "Forget it, Jake. It's Chinatown." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrapperJack Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 Hi David, I appreciate the humour and innovative approach of forum members with their avatars, etc. And in an internet world where we don't want people choosing how and when to bother us, I support the anonymity, and, indeed, I "hide" behind that myself. I want a quiet life. But I don't mislead people about my interest, experience, qualifications, and achievements in playing and writing music, in teaching music, in what I've done, or where I've been. Whether you think I know anything about what I say can be readily assessed from my contributions ... as it can be for all of us. I have certainly reacted to some blatant contortionist postings, just like I would if someone applied to my faculty with false degrees and false resumes. At the very least, in the context of this forum, it is deeply disrespectful. If I discourage people from doing this misrepresentation, distinct to having fun, and being clever, then I think our whole community is better off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrapperJack Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 Hi wmp. "You're the dude I've nicknamed Preacher Jack." I like it. From the Church of Support, Dialogue, Musical Ideas and Honest Sharing Between All Players and Listeners. Did I say Straight Shooting, Helpfulness, Broad Taste and Hard Work Not Fiction? Look back through my "less than 200" postings, and you will see I am a committed member of the Church. Thanks for the mention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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