selling gear on craigslist rant

[BillWelcome Home Studios]

Okay, so I'm selling some gear. Fair enough, I don't really expect a smooth road. But gee.....

 

I offered some vintage AKG C-451 mics with CK-1 capsules at $225. They typically sell for $400 on ebay. I get offers of $150. One guy offered $75.

 

I offered a $9500 Mark Levinson Cello Duet 350 amplifier for $4700. I get some shmoe with .audiosomethingorother as his email address wanting to see pictures of the amp. Now, I don't have any idea what one would expect to see from amp photographs. It's an AMP. In a rack. It will look just like the stock photos of the amp. When I asked him what he wanted to know and why he didn't come to see the amp for himself, I got an, "for my email address it should be obvious that I know something about audio...blahblahblah...." another b^ll$hitter.

 

I offered a couple of 414s for sale at about $150 less than the ebay asking price. I get a guy who says, "I'll take them." Next day, ".... uh, do those have the brass capsules...?" Yeah, and I'm stupid enough to sell them for such a low price, because I know nothing about studio mics.

 

Same with a black studio rack. Can I take pictures of it. No. It is a black rack? What do you figure to see in a picture? Are you too lazy to come see it? Why are you looking on cragslist? I'm asking a whole $40, take a f$%king chance.

 

It would be different if it was only an isolated incident. However:Item after item, I get lowballers and lookie-lous.

 

And: I posted the Cello Duet 350 on cragislist in electronics because they do not have a stereo/hifi section, and a pair of Cello "Stings" which is the high end interconnect cables for Cello equipment... the connectors alone cost almost $90 each. Both were flagged and removed by users who did not know what they were...so the ignorance of some know-nothing bonehead who decides to be the craigslist police cause my ad to be pulled.

 

 

ahhhhhhhhhhH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Thank goodness I don't need the money or have to sell anything. I'm putting it all away, and I'll sell it on another five years or so. But wow, what a bunch of as%&^$$oles. Does craigslist work in -your- town?

 

[mcgoo]

I'll give you $100.00 for all of it if you ship it to me!

 

sorry, couldn't resist. (running to duck & hide now).

[Dave Horne]

I've had the same experience over here. I go to sell something at a very reasonable price and you get guys offering so much less that's it's annoying.

 

I sold my P250 to a guy over here about three years ago and keep in touch with him to sell him my CP300 when its replacement comes out. I'll sell him my CP300 at a fair price and everyone's happy.

 

Note to the Jefferview - no forum members were insulted or belittled. Also, no guitar players were harmed in the making of this response.

[Mogut]

I dont even respond to anyone when im selling thru craigslist unless their inquiry interests me. I've had great craigslist experience as a seller.

 

There are morons though, just ignore them.

[Meisenhower]

Bill:

 

The Levenson Cello Duet has no place on Craigslist, and Audiogon (a high end audio forum and selling service) would be a far better place to list it. It's akin to listing a Ferrari F430 on Craigslist and not expect the tirekickers to come out of the woodwork.

 

As far as the other items go, I've had mixed results in selling gear on Craigslist, but most often I've done ok and gotten at or very near my asking price.

 

Ignore the idiots who want something for nothing,

[BillWelcome Home Studios]

"The Levenson Cello Duet has no place on Craigslist, and Audiogon (a high end audio forum and selling service) would be a far better place to list it."

 

Probably. But as I don't want to ship it... it IS 105 pounds.

[Martin Hines]

Bill,

 

I don't think requesting pictures is that unreasonable. I would recommend posting at least one picture with any online ad.

 

A picture (1) ensures you aren't lying about the specific product, and (2) might show the general condition of the item.

 

Even though people are local, they may not want to spend time going to your house without some confirmation.

 

I wasted time once on a Craigslist item where the seller stated the item was in great condition. He and I definitely had a completely different definition of the word "great".

 

I tend to avoid Craigslist since most people ask way too much for items they are selling, and on the flip side, buyers want to buy for super low prices.

[B3bluesman59]

I have had great success selling on Craig's list. The key when posting price is the word "firm"....as in $250 FIRM. The lookie-lou/lowballers get the message. And I always post a pic no matter what I am selling....many people scanning Craig's List adds (including myself) just won't click on anything without a pic.

[BillWelcome Home Studios]

"

I don't think requesting pictures is that unreasonable. I would recommend posting at least one picture with any online ad.

 

A picture (1) ensures you aren't lying about the specific product, and (2) might show the general condition of the item."

 

Martin,

 

I agree with you about practical items, and I post pictures of guitars, amps, etc. But I could have abused the hell out of a rack mounted amplifier and you would never see that in any picture, unless I dropped it off of a truck or spraypainted it, or hit the faceplate with a hammer. Same with a black studio rack....if I say that it is in decent condition, no abuse, and there are no stripped threads in the rails, that should tell you what you need to know to decide if you want to come and see it. After all, the big deal about craigslist is that it is local, you get to SEE what you buy before you buy it. If you are a serious buyer, and you are a thinking person, you'll know that you can see nothing important about an amp in a picture if I've said that it is in good condition. You now need to hear it to see if I ran 220 through it or something.

[SpaceNorman]

I not sure I get the OP's issue. If I'm understanding it correctly - he's trying to sell something - and is offended by the questions he gets from potential customers? As a regular "customer" in the market, I view it as my right to ask pretty much any questions that I feel I need answered to make a purchasing decision - even if they are really STUPID questions.

 

Obviously, the seller has the right to decline to answer anything he doesn't feel like answering.

 

If you want to sell - answer, otherwise plan on keeping your stuff.

[Mark Zeger]

Bill, what I know about audiophile gear wouldn't fill a thimble, but here's a thought: is there a hi-end audio retailer near you? Would they sell your used ML amp on consignment? If you're looking for $4700, could a retailer sell a $9500 amp for $6000 and take 15-20% commission?

 

Something like that would also keep strangers out of your house/studio. Some potential thief could be looking at CL for high end items and think "if this guy has expensive audio equipment for sale, maybe I can check it out and case his house".

 

[Floyd Tatum]

Bill, I would tend to agree with SpaceNorman. Putting a photo up is a good idea. Even if you say in your description that it's in good condition, etc, the thing is, people lie. I'm not accusing you of lying, I'm just saying there are plenty of liars out there. That's where a photo helps. I remember going to look at a keyboard once. There was no picture. I talked to the seller, asked him what kind of condition it's in, he said 'mint condition'. I drove a long way to look at it, it turned out to be beat to hell.

 

As for lowballers, etc, again, it's their right to make lowball offers, and ask stupid quesitons. Just ignore them. Or, if their offer is not too ridiculous, you could barter. It could be that they consider their lowball offer a starting point, and are actually willing to pay more after bartering. I know, bartering is a pain, but might be a necessary evil.

 

[raddtunes]

In Vegas, I haven't been able to sell anything on Craigslist - - and I'm really just trying to get rid of it. A PC in a nice rack case, cables, racks, anvil cases - - very few calls at all. Couldn't even move a nice bedroom set for $400.00 - - or even get more than 2 semi serious calls.

 

I have a HUGE box of studio cables (1/4", RCA, etc.) I'd sell for anything if someone would just call and come pick it up - - I can't even think of who I could donate this to. Oh well.

[Jonathan Hughes]

I've had pretty good luck selling things on craigslist. I don't think it is at all unusual or out of line to want to see a photo. I wouldn't buy anything without seeing a picture, regardless of what condition the seller says its in. The fact that it's rackmounted and not _likely_ to get damaged is meaningless. I also wouldn't consider selling anything without putting up a picture. It literally takes less than five minutes for me to take a couple pictures, load them into the computer, resize them, and upload them

 

As far as the lowballers, dealing with them is the price of admission. I generally price things I'm selling a little high knowing that people will want to negotiate on the price. People like to think they're getting a deal, no matter what they're buying.

[Dave Pierce]

I've also had great luck with craigslist, but from what I've heard it's a different thing here where it started than it is in other towns.

 

However, I have a couple of rules and assumptions that might be helpful.

 

RULE 1: If someone seems like a scammer, they are a scammer.

 

RULE 2: If you're thinking maybe this guys isn't *really* a scammer because of blah blah blah, see Rule 1.

 

General tips:

 

* There are LOTS of scammers on both the buying and selling end. Everyone who is both clueful and not a scammer will have filters in place. One of my filters is a picture. No matter what it is. If there's a picture that looks like an amp in your well-used rack case, and not like marketing photos you got online, then there's a much better chance that you are a real guy selling real stuff that you own. I would be extremely unlikely to purchase something where the seller was reluctant to post a picture, since I would simply assume the seller was a scammer, no matter how reasonable his justification might seem. If he doesn't have time to snap a photo with his cell phone and post the results, it's probably because he has 417 "bait" ads up and can't even keep them straight in his head, let alone take pictures for all of them.

 

* If a person's tone in email seems like I wouldn't want to deal with them, I don't reply. Period. I probably miss some opportunities this way, but I don't care, I'm not making a living selling stuff.

 

* If a person's email seems like a clueful human being, who is just testing my lowball resistance, I will reply with something like, "No thanks, I'm holding out for my asking price. Good luck to you!" A lot of times they'll come back with a reasonable offer a few days later.

 

* A lot of actual human beings who you would be happy to do business with use craigslist. But the signal-to-noise ratio is not good. If you want to use craigslist, invest in some noise filters and you'll be fine. If you can't figure out noise filters that work for you, then craigslist is not a good place for you to do business. Simple as that.

 

Hope that helps!

 

--Dave

[Tonysounds]

Photos are a must. Sure, they dont guarantee the quality or conditino of the item but they give more of an assurance that what you are listing actually exists and might be in good condition than just your ad's proclamations.

 

Would you have the same opinions of ad photos if you were a buyer?

[BillWelcome Home Studios]

Photos are a must.

Would you have the same opinions of ad photos if you were a buyer?

 

Yes. I would. I do. I don't need to see a picture of an amp... I'll see it in person when I go to buy it. As a person who has worked on the pro end of the sound industry for an awfully long time, I know that a picture of an amp is not worth anything.

 

Never mind, I see that you guys are all absolutely putting your faith in photos, which i do not understand.... do you want to see me in the window of the Whitehouse, or the Kremlin? I can make that happen.

 

In the end, it is more time consuming than the items are worth to photo, transfer, crop, and upload many of these items, so they'll just go to the landfill and the hell with it. Obviously, I'll not trash the amp. But anyone considering ownership of such an amp would want to come and look at it, so I figure anyone serious will ask to see it. They are incredibly rare to start with. And at 105 pounds, it isn't likely that I tossed it around much.

[The Real MC]

If I saw the ad for a rack, I'd be asking for a picture too.

 

Some people want the open frame racks, some people want a enclosed rack case. There's an important difference.

 

Lighten up.

[frogmonkey]

I turn my idiot filters all the way up when dealing on craigslist, which means I ignore about 80% of all responses.

[Tonysounds]

Never mind, I see that you guys are all absolutely putting your faith in photos, which i do not understand.... do you want to see me in the window of the Whitehouse, or the Kremlin? I can make that happen.

 

And The OZ has spoken.

 

Way to listen to what's being said!

 

 

Nobody is putting "all their faith:" in a picture of you in the Kremlin. However, since the internet is rife with scammers and worse, before making an arrangement to come to your house to look at a $10K amp and end up bound and gagged and the victim of some horrid twisted sex crime, rather than take you, a complete stranger, at his word (cuz after all, you're Bill from Craigslist), yeah, I'll take that photo as a sign of good faith that you probably DO have a $10k amp for sale (especially if you invest a little more effort in the sale of said amp than to just put a stock photo up there). The common thought is if you can't be bothered to take a digital pic and load it onto your ad (no cropping or photshopping is ncessary), then your item is either bullshit, or the ad is bullshit, and it's a waste of time. It's not a leap of faith that all is good, only an indicator that things MIGHT be.

 

Same goes for $450 mics. But obviously we're wrong.

[Bobadohshe]

Photos are a must.

Would you have the same opinions of ad photos if you were a buyer?

 

Yes. I would. I do. I don't need to see a picture of an amp... I'll see it in person when I go to buy it. As a person who has worked on the pro end of the sound industry for an awfully long time, I know that a picture of an amp is not worth anything.

 

Never mind, I see that you guys are all absolutely putting your faith in photos, which i do not understand.... do you want to see me in the window of the Whitehouse, or the Kremlin? I can make that happen.

 

In the end, it is more time consuming than the items are worth to photo, transfer, crop, and upload many of these items, so they'll just go to the landfill and the hell with it. Obviously, I'll not trash the amp. But anyone considering ownership of such an amp would want to come and look at it, so I figure anyone serious will ask to see it. They are incredibly rare to start with. And at 105 pounds, it isn't likely that I tossed it around much.

 

Bill, I know by the tone of what you've previously posted that there's no talking you off practically any point. So what does that make you think of us when we are all telling you the same thing: that photos, even of a pile of bricks, are going to be wanted by anybody buying anything on Craigslist. Are we all idiots then? Dave Pierce expressed why extremely well: signal to noise of scammers to legit posters. You are annoyed by all the sleazy people on CL, but that's exactly what YOU look like when you don't post a photo. I'm don't care that it's just a piece of rack equipment. Listen to what we're saying. People want to see photos. You can NOT take photos and go ahead and take longer to sell you stuff, but do you want help, advice, useful knowledge from intelligent people? Then LISTEN TO WHAT WE'RE SAYING.

[BillWelcome Home Studios]

"And The OZ has spoken. Way to listen to what's being said!

Nobody is putting "all their faith:""

 

Very nice.

 

Well, let me put it into more worldly terms.

Before the internet, people would place music instrument ads in the local paper. And other people would read these descriptions, go to see the pieces, and either buy them or not. Worked for about 200 years. Never seemed to be much white slave trade around here, I can't speak to where you live.

 

I bought four Neumann KM-84s, a couple of 83s, three AKG C-28s and a bunch of other vintage classic pieces from all over the world.. Australia, Austria, Germany, England... all from written descriptions. Never got ripped off.

 

And I agree with the basic premise, that much gear is worth a picture. But a well-described plain black studio rack? For $50? Four cymbal stands for a total of $65? The items in question don't rate a picture, and undoubtedly, whatever pictures I did take would not be the 'right' picture...a neighbor just said this to me.. she said that the responders always want some other view, can you take some more pictures, and then they never show up to buy anything anyway.

 

So anyway, you say, "And The OZ has spoken". Well, I can say this... the guy who owns the gear in question has spoken. That much is true. I'm trying to buy a new home (with all that this entails) and move my entire existence and everything we own across the country. This takes up a lot of time, I won't be posting any more to craigslist. I bet the stuff sells through the Pennysaver.

[Dave Pierce]

Bill, the Pennysaver probably is a good option for you, based on everything you've said here.

 

From my perspective as a buyer, when you place an ad in the Pennysaver you pass through a filter which is very similar to posting a picture on craigslist -- you paid money for the ad. Not a lot of money, certainly. And I definitely won't be buying something from you solely because you purchased an ad. But, I have a pretty good idea that you didn't purchase 1,000 ads, hoping that one of them would snare an unsuspecting mark. Just like when you post a clearly home-taken picture on craigslist, I have a pretty good idea that you didn't post 1,000 of them.

 

Apparently you extrapolated this to believe that I would immediately give you a large sum of money based on such a picture, and so would many others here. I suppose this is because the people who post here have such a well-demonstrated history of being gullible fools or something?

 

Whatever. I'm done answering questions now. Sorry it didn't help.

 

--Dave

[Jonathan Hughes]

"Before the internet, people would place music instrument ads in the local paper. And other people would read these descriptions, go to see the pieces, and either buy them or not. Worked for about 200 years."

 

It did work for about 200 years, but it also wasted a lot of people's time. The picture is a simple gatekeeper. Sure, it could be faked, but I'd bet there are a lot more faked ads _without_ pictures. Also, there are a lot of people who aren't necessarily trying to scam anyone -- they just don't know exactly what they're selling, and a picture saves potential buyers the time of e-mailing the seller and waiting for a response. I'd be intrigued if I saw an ad for a Fender Precision Bass for $200. I'd know not to waste my time if the picture clearly shows it's a Squier by Fender.

 

So keep trying to sell stuff without pictures if you don't think that people deserve to see pictures, but I think it's pretty safe to assume by the posts in this thread that you're not helping yourself.

[J. Dan]

Well, I guess now we know who placed this CL ad:

 

Click (warning - language)

 

Sorry, Bill - couldn't resist.

 

I actually agree with you for the most part. The stuff everyone has recommended is absolutely stupid, but par for the course on CL. The reason there were fewer scammers in the paper was because they had to pay money to put the ad in there. If you view the link I have above, the guy is obviously as frustrated as you (maybe more), but he DOES have a picture of the cinder blocks... yes, pictures of the cinder blocks (which are $1 ea). If you gotta have a picture of a $1 cinder block, then a picture of a $9000 amp (that admittedly tells you nothing), isn't a stretch. That's just the stupid world we live in.

 

[DanS]

Try Kijiji in your area. I sold my S80 within 24hrs, and besides the fact that the guy was in a Nightwish cover band, he was alright.

 

I posted a stock picture of the S80, buyer wrote back if I could send him a picture of my S80.

So I did.

[NewImprov]

Still got the AKG's for sale? I'm interested.

[BP3]

Gearslutz classifieds have been good so far.

[BillWelcome Home Studios]

Try Kijiji in your area. I sold my S80 within 24hrs, and besides the fact that the guy was in a Nightwish cover band, he was alright.

 

I posted a stock picture of the S80, buyer wrote back if I could send him a picture of my S80.

So I did.

 

Never heard of it, but I'll look into it. Thanks for the tip.

[BillWelcome Home Studios]

" I'd be intrigued if I saw an ad for a Fender Precision Bass for $200. I'd know not to waste my time if the picture clearly shows it's a Squier by Fender."

 

Did anyone in the room really think that this was an actual Fender, not a Squier? Raise your hands, please? Oh, you thought that you were going to be able to take advantage of someone? I see......