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#2895475 - 12/12/17 02:43 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: sosho]
Joe Muscara Offline
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Quote:
Hurry up! Go update your Mojo61 now! This is the new firmware with the new Rotary Sim refinements (same as Mojo VB3CE2 v2.4)!

Enjoy your Crumar instrument!

http://www.crumar.it/?a=support&b=34
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#2895559 - 12/12/17 10:54 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Joe Muscara]
Jazz+ Offline
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I have updated to version 1.3. (Dec 2017) and am most pleased with the improvements to the Leslie sim. Before the update I was using it mostly in Stopped Cabinet mode, but now I am digging it with slow rotary on. Before it made me almost a little queasy, like a digital effect, but now it is quite pleasant. And the top octave shrillness has been mellowed, which is what I was hoping for. Excellent! I donít need a Vent smile
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Mojo 61 organ, Casio PX-360 digital piano, Fender Tele & Strat, Epiphone Casino Coupe, Hofner Beatle Bass, Vox Adio Air, 2 EV SxA360 powered speakers, 1966 Mason & Hamlin piano.

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#2895893 - 12/14/17 08:34 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Jazz+]
davedoerfler Online   confused
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anyone with a single manual Mojo install the latest update besides Jazz+? It's being discussed on the dual manual thread but I haven't seen any comments here other than his. Guido says it's exactly the same for both and I'm wondering what others think.
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#2895896 - 12/14/17 08:38 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: davedoerfler]
Joe Muscara Offline
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I have installed it but I haven't had time to dig into it.
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#2895920 - 12/14/17 09:55 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Jazz+]
Delaware Dave Offline
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Registered: 04/21/11
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Originally Posted By: Jazz+
I have updated to version 1.3. (Dec 2017) and am most pleased with the improvements to the Leslie sim. Before the update I was using it mostly in Stopped Cabinet mode, but now I am digging it with slow rotary on. Before it made me almost a little queasy, like a digital effect, but now it is quite pleasant. And the top octave shrillness has been mellowed, which is what I was hoping for. Excellent! I donít need a Vent smile

Hmmm, I'm now a little perplexed. Al Quinn wrote (in the Crumar Mojo (Dual Manual) Update v.2.4 thread ):

".. I installed v.2.4 and wanted to love it, but am sorry to report I do not. In particular, the upper octave of 888000000 with the sim on Fast is not pleasing to my ears: there's something electronic / shrill in the sound that causes me to not want to hold notes in that register for long. I tried it through my studio monitors and then the SS V3.."

So we have one person indicating that the leslie now has a shrillness in the top octave that it didn't have before and another person saying that there was a shrillness in the top octave that has now mellowed. One is a Mojo 61 and the other is a Mojo dual manual. Perhaps they are using different organ models or perhaps it is differences in the two instruments. HeadPop

I hope for the Gemini module there is an allowance to choose between the two leslies, so that you don't have to go back to a prior firmware version if you don't like the newest leslie. Just allow both versions. I'm assuming that additional improvements or new features will be added to the Gemini and if you like the original leslie it becomes lost with further upgrades as I'm sure the newer upgrades will have the newest leslie but it might not be the leslie that the user prefers.
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#2895945 - 12/14/17 11:54 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Delaware Dave]
mate stubb Offline
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People should know by now that organ updates cause wildly divergent opinions, often diametrically opposed.

I vehemently disagree with many things others have written and find myself thinking "have they ever even played a real tonewheel?" Meanwhile, they are probably thinking the same about what I said.

Bottom line: clones are now so good that we are screaming about subtle details. You must try it yourself - that's the only way to be sure. And prepare to go back to a previous version if you prefer it. There was once a Mojo update years ago that I thought was heinous. I went back to my previous version and waited for them to correct the offense, which they did.

It's all good! These are great days we are living in bruh!
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#2895956 - 12/14/17 12:27 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: mate stubb]
davedoerfler Online   confused
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Originally Posted By: Delaware Dave

So we have one person indicating that the leslie now has a shrillness in the top octave that it didn't have before and another person saying that there was a shrillness in the top octave that has now mellowed.

Originally Posted By: mate stubb
People should know by now that organ updates cause wildly divergent opinions, often diametrically opposed.

I would surmise that unless everyone uses the same amplification, which of course they don't, this would also factor in to what people are hearing. I did not hear what others heard until using expensive headphones. So now I don't play through those head phones and I'm good. laugh

Originally Posted By: mate stubb
Bottom line: clones are now so good that we are screaming about subtle details.

A few weeks ago while visiting a follow forum member we ending up having a conversation about this while auditioning Hammond VSTi's. I left it at, "If it needs to be better than this I'll just have to play my A 100 through my 142." Life is good. thu
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The lack of insight in musically interesting progress displayed in this thread is ugly and mind numbing.
TV
Quite simply - If you can't play Jump on it, you don't want it.
MojoGuyPan

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#2895977 - 12/14/17 02:04 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: davedoerfler]
Jazz+ Offline
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Registered: 05/15/04
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I played the updated 1.3 Leslie sim a lot today and it is smooth in the top octave, itís a fine improvement. I use the 1965 B3 tone set, it is the mellowest of the lot. I believe that the developer knows what he is doing and keeps making improvements; i am fairly sure he runs updates past his hand picked circle of experts and would not make the sim anything but improved.. I have run out of any criticisms at this point... well there is always work to be done on the Acoustic piano, smile
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Mojo 61 organ, Casio PX-360 digital piano, Fender Tele & Strat, Epiphone Casino Coupe, Hofner Beatle Bass, Vox Adio Air, 2 EV SxA360 powered speakers, 1966 Mason & Hamlin piano.

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#2896016 - 12/14/17 06:52 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Jazz+]
LX88 Offline
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Registered: 10/16/10
Posts: 1901
I am very glad to hear of the Crumar Mojo leslie sim update.

When I was demoing the Mojo 61 in March, I just didn't get it. Nobody that I knew about had said much of anything regarding not liking it, but to me the sim was a real deal breaker - then.

So I am hoping for better things because I know how committed the people at Crumar are.

I wanted to like it, but at that time.... there were other things I liked more.

Too bad, because it can be a while before I get anywhere near these things.

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#2896033 - 12/15/17 12:23 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: LX88]
AndreaAgnoletto Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/20/11
Posts: 46
Hi Guys,
I want to point out some few things about the new update both for mojo and for mojo61.
This update changes basic settings of rotary simulation, the Algo for it is different (you can see details in the txt file together with the update).
But, rotary simulation is an important, maybe one of the most important part of tonewheel sound... but it's not the only one!
Switch to a new version of rotary simulation, changes drastically the "sound" result and this means that tonewheels setting the before could give one particulare result, now give another result.
Luckily mojo and mojo61 are adjustable in the settings "pre-rotary" is such a deep way that will be easy to find out a new and improved "sound" result... starting from the 20 (22) different tonewheels, scaling, resistor wires... really a lot of different shades there for you to play around.
At the end, such level of details, are there exactly for find the right sound for you...
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#2896038 - 12/15/17 02:23 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Delaware Dave]
Al Quinn Offline
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Registered: 08/13/14
Posts: 1119
Loc: Center Moriches, NY
Originally Posted By: Delaware Dave
Hmmm, I'm now a little perplexed. Al Quinn wrote (in the Crumar Mojo (Dual Manual) Update v.2.4 thread ):

".. I installed v.2.4 and wanted to love it, but am sorry to report I do not. In particular, the upper octave of 888000000 with the sim on Fast is not pleasing to my ears: there's something electronic / shrill in the sound that causes me to not want to hold notes in that register for long. I tried it through my studio monitors and then the SS V3.."

So we have one person indicating that the leslie now has a shrillness in the top octave that it didn't have before and another person saying that there was a shrillness in the top octave that has now mellowed. One is a Mojo 61 and the other is a Mojo dual manual. Perhaps they are using different organ models or perhaps it is differences in the two instru

I'd like to clarify as it seems that while I was correctly quoted, I've been misunderstood. I did not say that the new rotary sim "has a shrillness in the top octave that it didn't have before." Also, as I reread what I wrote I see nothing in what I said that should cause someone to think that I have that opinion. As a matter of fact, I did not compare the new rotary sim with the previous rotary sim. I was only commenting on the new rotary sim. I compared the new rotary sim to the Vent 2 and in a later test to my A100 / Leslie 145. I just wanted to know if I could stop bringing the Vent 2 to gigs. I feel no need to go back to the previous version of software. I'll continue to bring the Vent 2 to gigs (which to me isn't a big deal) and am loving my Mojo!
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#2896045 - 12/15/17 03:27 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Al Quinn]
Six-string-man Offline
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Registered: 08/06/13
Posts: 1457
Loc: U.K.
I imagined that Mitch Towne might have chimed in with his view of the update by now. Waiting (im)patiently for his thoughts.
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#2896132 - 12/15/17 12:16 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Six-string-man]
mate stubb Offline
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I don't know how often Mitch uses internal sims.
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Moe
---
Kawai Novus: "Please feel surprised even more."

http://www.hotrodmotm.com

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#2896134 - 12/15/17 12:38 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: mate stubb]
keyman27 Offline
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Registered: 08/23/10
Posts: 453
Loc: United States
Not sure if this question fits here or in the dual manual Mojo thread but here it is.

The newer dual manual Mojos and all of the Mojo61s have an action (or key response/ trigger point) that is different from the older Mojos. Is that correct? And if so, how does one determine if a particular dual manual Mojo has the newer action?

I'm wondering about this because I get the feeling that the Hammond sim / Leslie sim is getting so good (for all clones out there) that it's the finger-to-sound connection that can really make the difference. So that sways me toward a Mojo. My next thought is which one, dual or single. With the new update for the dual, and if I can get a used one that has the newer action, I'm tempted to go for that one.

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#2896192 - 12/15/17 06:20 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: mate stubb]
teashea Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/24/17
Posts: 196
Originally Posted By: mate stubb
People should know by now that organ updates cause wildly divergent opinions, often diametrically opposed.

I vehemently disagree with many things others have written and find myself thinking "have they ever even played a real tonewheel?" Meanwhile, they are probably thinking the same about what I said.

Bottom line: clones are now so good that we are screaming about subtle details. You must try it yourself - that's the only way to be sure. And prepare to go back to a previous version if you prefer it. There was once a Mojo update years ago that I thought was heinous. I went back to my previous version and waited for them to correct the offense, which they did.

It's all good! These are great days we are living in bruh!


You are so correct. The current state of the best digital organs is so good that subjectivity takes over the evaluation.
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#2902281 - 01/15/18 11:57 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: teashea]
Jazz+ Offline
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Registered: 05/15/04
Posts: 5844
What are the default settings for the updated rotary sim? I have mine still tweaked for the older rotary sim and canít remember the default settings.
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Mojo 61 organ, Casio PX-360 digital piano, Fender Tele & Strat, Epiphone Casino Coupe, Hofner Beatle Bass, Vox Adio Air, 2 EV SxA360 powered speakers, 1966 Mason & Hamlin piano.

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#2908353 - 02/09/18 12:36 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Jazz+]
tfort Online   content
Senior Member

Registered: 05/06/16
Posts: 246
New firmware announced this afternoon:
Mojo61 new firmware release v.1.31
Version 1.31 - February 2018
- Added: New parameter for the Reed EP that adjusts the amount of resonances
- Added: The FX1 Depth parameter can now also adjust the range of the Wha-Wha effect
- Changed: Sends MIDI CC#64 events when Sustain is applied to VB3 for either upper, lower or both manuals
- Changed: the web-app editor switches to idle mode when the browser loses focus, thus reducing the battery consumption when accessing from a mobile device

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#2908377 - 02/09/18 01:31 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: tfort]
Jazz+ Offline
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Registered: 05/15/04
Posts: 5844
Thank you I love that Crumar keeps making my beloved Mojo 61 even better.
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Mojo 61 organ, Casio PX-360 digital piano, Fender Tele & Strat, Epiphone Casino Coupe, Hofner Beatle Bass, Vox Adio Air, 2 EV SxA360 powered speakers, 1966 Mason & Hamlin piano.

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#2908576 - 02/10/18 02:30 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Six-string-man]
Mitch Towne Offline
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Registered: 01/26/07
Posts: 1022
Originally Posted By: Six-string-man
I imagined that Mitch Towne might have chimed in with his view of the update by now. Waiting (im)patiently for his thoughts.


I didn't see my name invoked in this thread until now! Sorry for the delay! laugh

But, I am glad I waited to comment on the leslie sim update until I had a chance to really test it out.

In short: I love it. Major improvement over the original Mojo simulation. Being predominantly a jazz player, I am most concerned with how a simulation sounds on "stop." The new simulation sounds much more full and open on stop. The percussion snaps more and the whole thing just sounds more "live." I usually use my Motion Sound KP500 with it, so I am used to a stereo field. But at a rehearsal this week, I ran mono through a PA speaker and was really surprised at how good it sounded mono. It still had that roomy clarity, which was surprising to me.

I am one of the rare people who isn't in love with the Ventilator. I have tried it with so many clones and real organs with a variety of amplification systems. It definitely has some good points and it is probably the best outboard leslie sim. That being said, it always left me flat. With the new Mojo update, I definitely won't consider bringing it out. It isn't needed and the Mojo sim, for me, does a better job overall. The Vent might sound a bit more realistic at fast speeds, but I haven't spent any time tweaking the speed parameters of the Mojo sim yet.

Something else I want to add...a few posts up, Andrea commented that a new leslie sim will greatly effect the tone of the overall instrument and that experimentation should be done to re-dial in your sound. I agree with this and I highly suggest experimenting with the different tonewheel sets. I think that is one of the most underrated aspect of the Mojo - there are literally 22 different organs in it! (The Legend has 3, and they aren't that vastly different.) Each of the 22 organs has a different character and that can really make a difference depending on your amplification system. Add in the 6 different generator shaping modes, and you have a TON of options for getting as close to what you are looking for as possible.

For example, I have been using my 1956 B3 tonewheel set (#4 in the software) for a long time. However, that set is really aggressive and mid-range heavy. It always seemed like a little much with the Motion Sound amp which is also strong in the mids. So, recently, I have been using one of the A102 tonewheel sets which is a bit less pushy over all, and it sounds fantastic!

So, the bottom line is that Guido has once again make a fantastic upgrade and has made it free to all Mojo users. (And I know the update is coming for the Gemini as well.)

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#2908577 - 02/10/18 02:37 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Mitch Towne]
Six-string-man Offline
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Loc: U.K.
I knew you'd answer if I waited long enough Mitch!
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#2908591 - 02/10/18 03:58 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Six-string-man]
Mighty Ferguson Offline
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Registered: 12/02/14
Posts: 304
Loc: Massachusetts
I really hope the updated Leslie sim (along with the other updates the Mojo 61 has been getting lately) comes out for the Gemini soon.
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#2908597 - 02/10/18 04:44 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Mighty Ferguson]
Jazz+ Offline
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Registered: 05/15/04
Posts: 5844
Note: I use the 1965 B3 set because it is the least aggressive in the top octave. With the Ď65 I donít always have to back off the volume when I play those top notes like I do with other sets. And the updated Leslie sim makes them even smoother up there too. It sure sounds good through a pair of EV SXa 360 powered speakers.
_________________________
Mojo 61 organ, Casio PX-360 digital piano, Fender Tele & Strat, Epiphone Casino Coupe, Hofner Beatle Bass, Vox Adio Air, 2 EV SxA360 powered speakers, 1966 Mason & Hamlin piano.

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#2909050 - 02/12/18 01:26 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Jazz+]
Mitch Towne Offline
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Registered: 01/26/07
Posts: 1022
The 1965 B3 is very mellow, as is the 1969 C3. A couple of the A102s are as well. Itís great to have options!

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#2909055 - 02/12/18 01:46 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Mitch Towne]
OB Dave Offline
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Registered: 04/25/09
Posts: 1146
Loc: San Diego CA, US
The new Leslie sim also added the ability to tame the high frequency content. A real Leslie is pretty bandwidth limited, and in the previous versions too much high frequency content was being passed through for my tastes. I could especially hear it in stuff like keyclick or the upper drawbars. The new parameter allows you to dial this back for a much more authentic simulation. I found that slowing down the horn on fast/tremolo helps a lot too.

I'm loving my Mojo 61 and recently doubled down and purchased a second one for the rehearsal space.

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#2909077 - 02/12/18 02:39 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: OB Dave]
Mitch Towne Offline
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Registered: 01/26/07
Posts: 1022
What parameter are you using for that?

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#2909084 - 02/12/18 03:06 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Mitch Towne]
OB Dave Offline
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Registered: 04/25/09
Posts: 1146
Loc: San Diego CA, US
It's called Horn EQ and Guido added it in the 3.1 release.

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#2909182 - 02/13/18 02:41 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: OB Dave]
ZioGuido Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/19/05
Posts: 286
Originally Posted By: OB Dave
It's called Horn EQ and Guido added it in the 3.1 release.

Actually, the "Horn EQ" parameter has been there since day 1.

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#2909291 - 02/13/18 10:56 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: ZioGuido]
OB Dave Offline
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Registered: 04/25/09
Posts: 1146
Loc: San Diego CA, US
Really? My mistake!

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#2909311 - 02/13/18 11:53 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: OB Dave]
Joe Muscara Offline
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Registered: 02/21/05
Posts: 19792
Loc: Heaven, Hell, or Houston
One of the unintended consequences of software updates is exactly this, isn't it? You poke around looking for what's new, and think you've found something that actually has been there a while. grin thu
_________________________
We are the music makers, and we are the dreamers of dreams ó Willy Wonka

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1M0eMkcc91E

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#2909312 - 02/13/18 11:57 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Joe Muscara]
Delaware Dave Offline
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Registered: 04/21/11
Posts: 3063
Loc: Take a guess ....
I adjusted the Horn EQ and it did take some of the shrillness out of the top end. The other was the balance, i.e. slightly more drum that horn. Between the two and the EQ this is how I was able to get a better balance up and down the keybed so that the top end is mildly rather than significantly louder.
_________________________
57 Hammond B3; 69 Hammond L100P; 68 Leslie 122; Kurzweil PC3; GEM Equinox; Voce V5+; Neo Vent; EV ELX112P; GSI Gemini Desktop Module; dyinbreedband.com; thewildthingsrock.webs.com

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