Forum is SO Darn Slow

[cnegrad]

Oooookay.

[soundscape]

Originally posted by Dave Bryce:

Also, to be perfectly honest, I question whether the people who own the forums see the same value in them that we do. Despite what you some of you guys may think, my inclination is that they don't really generate much positive revenue at all (even with the banner ads), so my thinking on the subject is that it may not be the best idea to be trying to put any pressure on New Bay to spend any money here.

Yeah, I can just imagine "forums, what forums?" and shutting them down as part of an "organizational streamlining."

 

Originally posted by Dave Bryce:

What I want is for them to leave us alone. Sorry if that's out of sync with what you want, and I'm sorry if that disappoints you.

Under the circumstances, I'm inclined to agree. I've been using forums for many years now, and I've seen the "real owners" be all but oblivious to the value of the forum, and in the worst case, shut them down apparently without further thought. It's the online equivalent of a pub with no drinks to sell. (Then again, you could always rebrand it as a "social networking site leveraging the possibilities of Web 2.0 technology." )

 

The only remaining issue relates to Sven's comments above (the use of flat text files for storage rather than a properly structured database); hopefully, it won't buckle under the strain. I guess all we can do is keep an eye on it; (gross data corruption would be obvious)--but it certainly seems faster today.

 

(Time taken to post this message: nearly 20 seconds. Hmm, so much for faster...)

[steadyb]

I can't believe Dave still hasn't done anything to make this forum faster.

 

C'mon Dave, you're the mod, don't you care about us?

[cnegrad]

SteadyB,

 

Where's all this mocking sarcasm coming from? I didn't know how things worked behind the scenes here at KC (and I doubt many others here did either), so I asked a question. Why the attitude?

[meccajay]

I wouldn't be afraid of approaching the owners, as long as we "come correct", so to speak.

 

In other words, we have some more knowledgable members research the costs involved in needed upgrades, then we can do a poll to see if most members think it would be worth it to pay to upgrade.

 

If that goes well, then we discuss this with the owners, THEN we have a fund raiser(paypal?) and support the hell out of it!

 

Others may have better ideas, but the point is that we thought it up, we supported it, and we paid for it. I think the owners would be pleased as long as we run it all by them.

[cnegrad]

If I understand Dave correctly, even reminding these people that we exist on their server might not be such a good idea.

[ProfD]

Let sleeping dogs lie and enjoy the free show on the low.

 

Would the better investment be a contingency plan for keeping in touch should they decide to turn out the lights?

[HomeAmateur]

I agree with Dave Bryce 100%.

 

The forum is fun, informative and FREE. Why would anyone want to chance etiher losing it, due to 'corporate streamlinig' or having to pay money just for maybe a couple of second faster response time ?

 

A couple of sayings come to mind:

 

"don't look a gift horse in the mouth"

 

and

 

"outa site, outa mind" - can sometimes be a blessing in disquise

[HomeAmateur]

Seems to me a simple contingency plan, upon finding one day that this site no longer loads due to being taken down would be to (at least temporairily) 'move-over' to any number of free boards on the net.

 

The sninety.com or motifactor.com forums for just one example. Say the 'lounge'. That forum is nowhere near as active as this one. Probably plenty of bandwidth available.

 

Just a thought....

[keynote]

Originally posted by cnegrad:

SteadyB,

 

Where's all this mocking sarcasm coming from? I didn't know how things worked behind the scenes here at KC (and I doubt many others here did either), so I asked a question. Why the attitude?

I don't think SteadyB is being sarcastic with anyone cnegrad. I think he's just making a joke and dB just happens to be the brunt of it. Since he's the man in charge and we've no one else to blame, and since the other bigwigs have nothing to do with this place apparently, we therefore have to take out our frustration on someone.. right? . Dave just happens to be the MOD and who actually reads these posts and once in a while actually replies to them.

 

Sorry dB. Luv ya' Bro..

 

The site does seem to be getting slower but hopefully that will be corrected once the new software is set up next year.

 

Hopefully next year means January 2007 instead of December 2007.

 

PS: If MP continues to be this slow we may start to lose some members who simply aren't willing to tolerate the lag time. In fact we may have lost some already.

 

And contrary to what dB has said about the ads not generating much revenue I tend to think otherwise. Also, one of the biggest generators of profit for MP is you and me and everyone else who frequents this site who discuss keyboards and generate interest in other music related gear and point people in the direction of purchasing that gear. We are the ones buying the gear and putting oil in the mechanism of the music industry - Music Player included. When you look at the big picture I think CMP should be very happy that KC and MP exist and if they're wise they should do everything in their power to improve upon that 'good thing' whether software or hardware or both and/or everything in between.

 

My 2 cents worth..

[Dave Bryce]

Originally posted by keynote:

And contrary to what dB has said about the ads not generating much revenue I tend to think otherwise.

You wanna think that, go right ahead.

I'm basing what I said on what I've been told over the years...more than once.

 

dB

 

PS: If MP continues to be this slow we may start to lose some members who simply aren't willing to tolerate the lag time. In fact we may have lost some already.

P.S. if we're losing members because they can't tolerate the fact that sometimes a page takes more than 10 seconds to load, that's the way it goes.

[ProfD]

Originally posted by HomeAmateur:

Seems to me a simple contingency plan, upon finding one day that this site no longer loads due to being taken down would be to (at least temporairily) 'move-over' to any number of free boards on the net.

 

The sninety.com or motifactor.com forums for just one example. Say the 'lounge'. That forum is nowhere near as active as this one. Probably plenty of bandwidth available.

 

Just a thought....

I'm not that kind of patient. I enjoy this particular asylum. Besides, I've seen the others. They are not as good as this one.

[HomeAmateur]

ProfD,

 

My point, which perhaps you missed, was simply a 'meeting-place' in the case of when/if you click on this forum and you get 'page can not be found' from your browser. And as many times as you refresh, you continue to get that message.

 

If you would prefer to just sit there staring at that message frantically hitting your refresh button in the hopes that the keyboard gods will miracoulsly bring the page back instead of meeting at a place (temporilarly) that may not be your first choice then that is your call.

 

Once there, plans for a more permanant home could be made.

 

In fact, this plan is really the only logical one.

 

Of course if this site did go down, hopefully, it would be done in such a way as a page coming up that would direct you 'where to go'. However, that is actually unlikley to happen unless there is an agreed upon transisition from this site to another in place at the time the powers that be were 'pulling the plug'.

[Ernie Rideout]

Hey Forum Friends,

 

Here's the official word, from me, the official.

 

As to the value of the KC, we at Keyboard consider you as important as the magazine itself. As you've seen in the mag over the past year or so, we've been regularly printing excerpts of groovy topic discussions so that non-KC-member readers can realize what an insanely great resource the KC is. The Forum would only go away over my dead body.

 

The reason the site is hosted in the UK is that we used to be owned by CMP Information, which is based in the UK. And like many good Englishmen and women, they believe that they are the caretakers of Western Civilization and plus they know more about web hosting than any of us in the colonies. Apologies to the many very groovy UK residents and descendants of such residents, but our CMP Information managers were dedicated to their Empire and nothing else. They were pieces of work, I must say.

 

Just last month, we (Keyboard, Guitar Player, Bass Player, EQ, DV magazine, Pro Sound News, and few other titles) were sold by CMP. We are now a separate (and much smaller) company, we run ourselves, and we set our own goals. We're also right in the middle of trying to figure out our benefits, our accounts payable systems, and all our other infrastructure. And we're moving our offices about ten miles away, in December. We're figuring out how to construct a new studio in the rather technically hampered new office. We're busier than a one-legged man at a . . . you get the idea. Our company name is now New Bay Media. No, the name wasn't our idea, but thanks for asking.

 

One of the infrastructure items we're working on now is setting up new servers here in the good old U.S. of A, maybe even in this very time zone. We are planning to port all of our sites over, including the forums. I don't have a timetable for that, nor can I promise we'll upgrade the software immediately. But we are planning to.

 

We will, we will port you.

 

We were totally blindsided by that service outage last Friday. Blindsided and pissed off. We had no warning until the sites just went away. That's because CMP Information no longer feels they must communicate with us, even though the terms of the sale clearly state that they must provide this service to us through the end of this year.

 

The bottom line: You guys are extremely important to us. And don't even get me started about how important Dave Bryce is to us, and to me personally. I'd go on for days.

 

Our transition to the new corporate entity is not going smoothly. I apologize for the bumps, slow uploads, all of it.

 

But we'll take care of it. Hang in there.

 

Drop me a line directly any old time if you have questions, or if anything sucks.

 

Thanks!!!

 

Ernie

[soundscape]

Originally posted by keynote:

And contrary to what dB has said about the ads not generating much revenue I tend to think otherwise. Also, one of the biggest generators of profit for MP is you and me and everyone else who frequents this site who discuss keyboards and generate interest in other music related gear and point people in the direction of purchasing that gear. We are the ones buying the gear and putting oil in the mechanism of the music industry - Music Player included. When you look at the big picture I think CMP should be very happy that KC and MP exist and if they're wise they should do everything in their power to improve upon that 'good thing' whether software or hardware or both and/or everything in between.

While I may not disagree with all you say, let's put things in context:

 

http://www.jegi.com/docs/Press_09-13-06.pdf

 

United Business Media Has Sold CMP Entertainment Media to The Wicks Group of Companies

New York, NY September 13, 2006 United Business Media has sold CMP Entertainment Media to The Wicks Group of Companies, L.L.C. (Wicks), a New York-based private equity firm, through its affiliate NewBay Media LLC (NewBay), for up to $50 million $47 million cash at closing and $3 million in an earn-out.

[Steve Force]

Thanks for your message, Ernie!

 

I think you really Get It.

 

[ProfD]

Originally posted by HomeAmateur:

My point, which perhaps you missed, was simply a 'meeting-place' in the case of when/if you click on this forum and you get 'page can not be found' from your browser.

HA, I got ya know. Sounds like a good contingency if things go awry.

 

ER has just chimed in with great news.

 

All is well at KC--for now.

[Max Sidman]

Hi All,

 

We are in fact working on upgrading at this time. The mighty Jim Quinn and one of our web development team guys have been looking into and pricing new forum software, and we will be moving the forums to a server with more free range space on it. Hopefully, upgrading and moving will alleviate the slowness, as well as add a few new features and just bring us to up to date around here.

 

Please stay tuned for more details.

[Sven Golly]

Originally posted by keynote:

The site does seem to be getting slower but hopefully that will be corrected once the new software is set up next year.

Who said the site was being updated with new software?

 

*** EDIT: I hadn't seen Ernie's and Max's messages when I posted this... ignore this point. ***

 

And contrary to what dB has said about the ads not generating much revenue I tend to think otherwise.

Based on what, exactly? Just curious as to what background you have in Internet advertising revenues...

 

Also, one of the biggest generators of profit for MP is you and me and everyone else who frequents this site who discuss keyboards and generate interest in other music related gear and point people in the direction of purchasing that gear.

Ummmm... is MP getting royalties on gear purchases now?

 

I think you may be drawing lines where none exist...

 

We are the ones buying the gear and putting oil in the mechanism of the music industry - Music Player included.

Are you currently a subscriber to any of the MP family of magazines?

 

When you look at the big picture I think CMP should be very happy that KC and MP exist and if they're wise they should do everything in their power to improve upon that 'good thing' whether software or hardware or both and/or everything in between.

So you advise a capital expenditure for a section of a company that has little to no appreciable impact on the bottom line. An interesting approach... not exactly Keynesian, is it?

[soundscape]

Originally posted by Max Sidman:

The mighty Jim Quinn and one of our web development team guys have been looking into and pricing new forum software, and we will be moving the forums to a server with more free range space on it. Hopefully, upgrading and moving will alleviate the slowness, as well as add a few new features and just bring us to up to date around here.

[Jazzwee]

Ernie and Max,

 

All I can say is I appreciate what you guys are doing. . Ernie thanks for those nice words of reassurance.

 

I will very patiently await this transition. May I just hope that in the transfer, you retain the old forum messages. Lots of resource there. I would rather stick to old software if changing means losing old messages.

 

And yes, I subscribe to Keyboard Mag.

[cnegrad]

Great news Ernie; thanks for the update about the upgrade!

[steadyb]

Well, I'm glad whatever I said got Ernie to finally do something about this slow forum.

 

It seems like we've been discussing this thing for minutes....

[jackpine]

Originally posted by steadyb:

Well, I'm glad whatever I said got Ernie to finally do something about this slow forum.

 

It seems like we've been discussing this thing for minutes....

Post of the day.

[Dave Bryce]

Ernie (and Max) -

 

I can't begin to tell you how much your presence is appreciated, and how much I (and I'm sure the others who hang out here) appreciate you taking the time to enlighten and explain to us what's going on.

 

It's really great to know how much this forum is a part of the mag, and I join you in wishing CMP best wishes in whatever endeavors they may pursue...far away from us.

 

You guys rawk.

 

dB

[Sven Golly]

Originally posted by Dave Bryce:

I can't begin to tell you how much your presence is appreciated, and how much I (and I'm sure the others who hang out here) appreciate you taking the time to enlighten and explain to us what's going on.

+1000

[kanker.]

Originally posted by Ernie Rideout:

Drop me a line directly any old time if you have questions, or if anything sucks.

My playing sucks. Any ideas?

 

 

Thanks for the clarifications and the place to hang.

 

 

Now where'd that sheep go...

[Dave Pierce]

Ernie, and the Keyboard Mag guys,

 

Glad to hear that you're going to have more control over your company now, that's great!

 

My day job is Chief Engineer for a company that builds web infrastructure for startups. I've got a dozen or so Web 2.0 clients in data centers around the Valley and in The City, so I've got a pretty good handle on the colo and hosting space here. I'd be delighted to chat with your sysadmins over lunch or coffee or something if that's useful at all.

 

I'm not shilling for business here, just offering some advice and direction if you need it. This place has helped me a lot, and I'd be delighted to give a little something back. If you've already picked a colo or otherwise have it under control, then cool.

 

PM me if you want any help.

 

--Dave

[Ernie Rideout]

Kanker,

 

Suck is just an expression. Try blowing.

 

 

Dave Pierce,

 

Thanks! will do!

 

Best,

 

Ernie

[nursers]

Originally posted by Dave Bryce:

Ernie (and Max) -

 

I can't begin to tell you how much your presence is appreciated, and how much I (and I'm sure the others who hang out here) appreciate you taking the time to enlighten and explain to us what's going on.

 

It's really great to know how much this forum is a part of the mag, and I join you in wishing CMP best wishes in whatever endeavors they may pursue...far away from us.

 

You guys rawk.

 

dB

+1000