A new digital accordion by Korg

[MPN21]

A new digital accordion by Korg for $8,000 at Kraft Music. https://kraftmusic.com/products/korg-fisa-suprema-digital-accordion

I think it's time Casio built one.  

A few videos on Youtube. 

 

[Ivan May]

Roland is pretty much the undisputed innovator of the electronic accordion. Why Hohner never got around to it is beyond me, tho.

[J.F.N.]

The big question is why KORG out of nowhere decides to piss on Roland's turf...

 

Seeing KORG blindly releasing products the last years, revamps, repackaging, downscaling (Nautilus vs Kronos) etc. and now this, tells that for sure they fired the entire Marketing Dept. a couple of years ago...

 

What's next, a recorder flute with USB?

[CyberGene]

A gentleman is someone who knows how to play the accordion and doesn’t. 

[ProfD]

4 minutes ago, J.F.N. said:

The big question is why KORG out of nowhere decides to piss on Roland's turf...

 

Seeing KORG blindly releasing products the last years, revamps, repackaging, downscaling (Nautilus vs Kronos) etc. and now this, tells that for sure they fired the entire Marketing Dept. a couple of years ago...

Maybe they have brought in the Behr guy as a consultant.🤣😎

[Stokely]

Today's the day I learned that someone has, at any point in history, made a "digital accordion"

[Mighty Motif Max]

I saw the news from this in one of my accordionist groups. I think it's a rather exciting development! Basically this is a collab between Korg and Dexibell (aka former Roland Europe), and the gentlemen who patented some of the technology used in the Roland V-Accordion and subsequently worked with Roland was involved with this new development (he was part of the Roland Europe team that was let go, which became Dexibell). So on paper this should be an evolution of the Roland FR-8x, which was released in 2013. I am looking forward to seeing where the last 11 years of tech improvements have gone! The Roland models had a few shortcomings that were never addressed (lo and behold, because they let the guy go that helped design their instruments - go figure).

 

For the people who are perhaps annoyed about this product, Roland left a gap in the market by not updating their V-Accordion series in years (other than the scaled-down FR-4x). A few smaller companies have tried to fill the gap in the meantime, but not been very successful (at least in the US). So this isn't necessarily a case of Korg firing the marketing department at all...it's them seizing an opportunity left wide open by Roland. Would I like to see a new Kronos? 1000% - however, keep in mind this accordion was a collaboration project with Dexibell, so it's not like they poured all their resources into this project. If anything, as someone on another forum mentioned, this might be an indicator that Korg is doing well financially, since they can dip their toes into this smaller market.

 

It seems expensive until you realize that a nice acoustic accordion is around double that price now...now, whether or not it should actually be that high for a digital instrument is another question entirely. Up until very recently Roland had jacked the price of their FR-8x up to just under $10,000, which was insane (it used to be around $6,000). Looks like they recently backed that price down to around the old price, which is interesting timing.

 

There's some very cool performance features they've added, which I think will make it more expressive and more like an acoustic than the Roland models. I'm also liking what I'm hearing for the acoustic accordion sounds (physically modeled) - they seem to be a significant improvement over the Roland models (more natural sounding).

 

 

[Brad Kaenel]

I'm naive and an uncultured swine, but why does a digitally-modelled accordion need a bellows?  I presume it's to complete the illusion and the "feel" for the player, but what does it control?  Is it sustain? Volume?

[Mighty Motif Max]

55 minutes ago, Brad Kaenel said:

I'm naive and an uncultured swine, but why does a digitally-modelled accordion need a bellows?  I presume it's to complete the illusion and the "feel" for the player, but what does it control?  Is it sustain? Volume?

Dynamics and vibrato/tremolo on an acoustic accordion are entirely controlled by air pressure through the bellows. Basically all your expressive capabilities beyond simple reed combination changes are via the bellows and/or manipulating air pressure in various ways. Accordion keybeds are not touch sensitive. Now, these digital models do often add touch sensitivity for non-accordion sounds like piano that we'd expect to play with velocity, but it's not used for the accordion parts. Not having bellows would be like a Hammond organ with no drawbars (just tabs) and no volume pedal. All you'd get would be some extremely static sound combinations. So for a digital instrument, that behavior has to be replicated and modeled. Obviously there are no physical reeds for the bellows to force air through, as there would be on an acoustic instrument, so that feel and control has to be created electronically.

 

Interestingly enough, one of the most problematic aspects of digital accordions in the past has been the way they respond to bellows technique. If that part isn't working just right, it ruins the entire experience for anyone used to an acoustic instrument. I remember playing a small Roland model about a decade ago and even with adjusting the airflow stiffness, it just had a sense of being disconnected and fake. It's a make it or break it thing for most accordionists.

 

 

[brenner13]

Ever closer to a midi melodica

[Radagast]

11 hours ago, Mighty Motif Max said:

I saw the news from this in one of my accordionist groups. I think it's a rather exciting development! Basically this is a collab between Korg and Dexibell (aka former Roland Europe), and the gentlemen who patented some of the technology used in the Roland V-Accordion and subsequently worked with Roland was involved with this new development (he was part of the Roland Europe team that was let go, which became Dexibell). 

 

Would I like to see a new Kronos? 1000% - however, keep in mind this accordion was a collaboration project with Dexibell, so it's not like they poured all their resources into this project.

I think Dexibell would be the perfect company for Korg to collaborate with, in creating a successor to the OASYS/Kronos.

[mauriziodececco]

11 hours ago, Mighty Motif Max said:

I saw the news from this in one of my accordionist groups. I think it's a rather exciting development! Basically this is a collab between Korg and Dexibell

 

And may be the fact that the italian Korg lab and Dexibell are fundamentally in the italian accordion region can help.

 

Maurizio

[Garubi]

13 hours ago, Mighty Motif Max said:

I saw the news from this in one of my accordionist groups. I think it's a rather exciting development! Basically this is a collab between Korg and Dexibell (aka former Roland Europe), and the gentlemen who patented some of the technology used in the Roland V-Accordion and subsequently worked with Roland was involved with this new development (he was part of the Roland Europe team that was let go, which became Dexibell). So on paper this should be an evolution of the Roland FR-8x, which was released in 2013. I am looking forward to seeing where the last 11 years of tech improvements have gone! The Roland models had a few shortcomings that were never addressed (lo and behold, because they let the guy go that helped design their instruments - go figure).

 

For the people who are perhaps annoyed about this product, Roland left a gap in the market by not updating their V-Accordion series in years (other than the scaled-down FR-4x). A few smaller companies have tried to fill the gap in the meantime, but not been very successful (at least in the US). So this isn't necessarily a case of Korg firing the marketing department at all...it's them seizing an opportunity left wide open by Roland. Would I like to see a new Kronos? 1000% - however, keep in mind this accordion was a collaboration project with Dexibell, so it's not like they poured all their resources into this project. If anything, as someone on another forum mentioned, this might be an indicator that Korg is doing well financially, since they can dip their toes into this smaller market.

 

It seems expensive until you realize that a nice acoustic accordion is around double that price now...now, whether or not it should actually be that high for a digital instrument is another question entirely. Up until very recently Roland had jacked the price of their FR-8x up to just under $10,000, which was insane (it used to be around $6,000). Looks like they recently backed that price down to around the old price, which is interesting timing.

 

There's some very cool performance features they've added, which I think will make it more expressive and more like an acoustic than the Roland models. I'm also liking what I'm hearing for the acoustic accordion sounds (physically modeled) - they seem to be a significant improvement over the Roland models (more natural sounding).

 

 

12 hours ago, Mighty Motif Max said:

Dynamics and vibrato/tremolo on an acoustic accordion are entirely controlled by air pressure through the bellows. Basically all your expressive capabilities beyond simple reed combination changes are via the bellows and/or manipulating air pressure in various ways.

[...]

Not having bellows would be like a Hammond organ with no drawbars (just tabs) and no volume pedal. All you'd get would be some extremely static sound combinations. So for a digital instrument, that behavior has to be replicated and modeled. 

 

 

Interestingly enough, one of the most problematic aspects of digital accordions in the past has been the way they respond to bellows technique. If that part isn't working just right, it ruins the entire experience for anyone used to an acoustic instrument. 

 

 

2 hours ago, mauriziodececco said:

 

And may be the fact that the italian Korg lab and Dexibell are fundamentally in the italian accordion region can help.

 

Maurizio

 

I totally quote @mauriziodececco and @Mighty Motif Max

 

[stoken6]

18 hours ago, J.F.N. said:

What's next, a recorder flute with USB?

Melodica, but it's a MIDI controller with breath CC. Price it right, and it would sell like anything.

 

Cheers, Mike.

[Shamanzarek]

Perhaps the greatest feature of this accordion is that you can play it through headphones so nobody else hears it.

[JamPro]

19 hours ago, Stokely said:

Today's the day I learned that someone has, at any point in history, made a "digital accordion"

Yes there is a digital accordion.  My friends tell me it's nice but the sound is too clean, and lacks the "warmth" and "crunch" of the analog accordions. 

[miden]

It might be interesting to some that a lot of this tech is borrowed (under licence) from Roland. Also this thing will be over $11,000 (yes that is thousand) down here.

 

I appreciate the tech involved in getting these to market but they are really pricing themselves OUT of the market for any low to middle  (or perhaps even high) income earners.

[The Piano Man]

20 hours ago, J.F.N. said:

The big question is why KORG out of nowhere decides to piss on Roland's turf...

 

Seeing KORG blindly releasing products the last years, revamps, repackaging, downscaling (Nautilus vs Kronos) etc. and now this, tells that for sure they fired the entire Marketing Dept. a couple of years ago...

 

What's next, a recorder flute with USB?

This period has also heralded the finest stage pianos Korg has ever produced.

 

Grandstage X

SV2

SV2s

Grandstage 88

 

Also, the very reasonably priced XE20 and Liano. 
 

But yeh, the Accordion was unexpected. 

[brenner13]

20 hours ago, J.F.N. said:

What's next, a recorder flute with USB?

Ya mean like this?

I’ve got one, but I’m a crappy recorder player. 
Artinoise Re.Corder:

[J.F.N.]

40 minutes ago, The Piano Man said:

This period has also heralded the finest stage pianos Korg has ever produced.

 

Grandstage X

SV2

SV2s

Grandstage 88

 

Also, the very reasonably priced XE20 and Liano. 
 

But yeh, the Accordion was unexpected. 

 

Great with the pianos, on the synth side it's been about as interesting as mashed potatoes with different types of food colouring in...

[Radagast]

2 hours ago, JamPro said:

Yes there is a digital accordion.  My friends tell me it's nice but the sound is too clean, and lacks the "warmth" and "crunch" of the analog accordions. 

😆

[J.F.N.]

1 hour ago, Radagast said:

😆

 

Next thing, Accordion saturation and warmth pedal! I bet there's already a plugin doing this...

 

[JoJoB3]

This would be f***in great if it had motorized faders

[jerrythek]

4 hours ago, J.F.N. said:

 

Great with the pianos, on the synth side it's been about as interesting as mashed potatoes with different types of food colouring in...

Really? The Wavestate, Modwave, King Korg, OpSix... not that long ago the Prologue, Minilogue and a few others I'm forgetting... like all the analog reissues such as the ARP stuff and the PS-3300. Seems to be a harsh dismissal in my humble opinion. To each their own...

[miden]

26 minutes ago, jerrythek said:

Really? The Wavestate, Modwave, King Korg, OpSix... not that long ago the Prologue, Minilogue and a few others I'm forgetting... like all the analog reissues such as the ARP stuff and the PS-3300. Seems to be a harsh dismissal in my humble opinion. To each their own...

 

yeah agree! tbh if I had the 11k i'd buy one tomorrow

[Mark Schmieder]

I tried the Roland ones a few years in a row when they were new; button and keyboard models for contrast. They're well-done overall, but super pricey, as is the new one from Korg. I can't imagine spending that kind of dough just to be able to use an accordion as a controller, unless accordion is your main/only instrument.

 

I wish I could afford a low-end model from a intermediate to pro acoustic accordion manufacturer, but home repairs keep getting in the way. I've been upset how pricey they are, but I'll stop complaining now because they're well less than half the price of a digital model!

[Tom Williams]

The venerable Farfisa company was originally a conglomerate of accordion manufacturers.  They continued to make electronic accordions for a while.

[J.F.N.]

9 hours ago, jerrythek said:

Really? The Wavestate, Modwave, King Korg, OpSix... not that long ago the Prologue, Minilogue and a few others I'm forgetting... like all the analog reissues such as the ARP stuff and the PS-3300. Seems to be a harsh dismissal in my humble opinion. To each their own...

 

You mean the rehash of the original versions of the ones you mentioned, and the $1000 extra for a non poly AT 5 octave board for them, and the color scheme versions and DIY with higher prices than the actual versions...

 

And the mysterious discontinuation of the flagship machines, Kronos and Prologue...

[mauriziodececco]

6 hours ago, Tom Williams said:

The venerable Farfisa company was originally a conglomerate of accordion manufacturers.  They continued to make electronic accordions for a while.

 

'Fisa' is short for 'Fisarmonica', Accordeon in Italian

 

If you visit Marche in Italy, make a tour in Castelfidardo, you can also visit Guido and Crumar

 

Maurizio

[jerrythek]

5 hours ago, J.F.N. said:

 

You mean the rehash of the original versions of the ones you mentioned, and the $1000 extra for a non poly AT 5 octave board for them, and the color scheme versions and DIY with higher prices than the actual versions...

 

And the mysterious discontinuation of the flagship machines, Kronos and Prologue...

Well the OP was going further back in time, to the SV2 and others, so that was what I was reacting to. Sadly, after Korg does major products, they do fall into these slight variations of features and colors. I am not talking about that.

 

Sales (and the lack thereof) often cause products to fall out of production. It's a sad reality of running a business. I do agree that discontinuing the Kronos (the last project I worked on at Korg) and following it up with a scaled-down product never intended to be a Kronos replacement was a bad decision. Had the Kronos remained, then the Nautilus could have been seen as what it really is, a lower-level Kronos. I think the Prologue was a "could have been great" synth, but Korg did not support it well, and really mishandled customer support and communication with its problems. But I assume that sales were not good.

 

But step back a little further than the last year or so, and I still feel that Korg remains the boldest of the big manufacturers, and is doing a lot of interesting things in both the hardware and software space.