Poll: keyboard with the best stock sounds

[locture]

1 hour ago, retrokeys said:

I don't know why this is true but it is.  Years ago I had an Electro 2. I got it primarily because it was reliable.  The sounds were certainly serviceable but nothing to write home about. Still, on gigs, other musicians were commenting on what a great piano sound I was getting. The amp was (and is) the stationary speaker of a Leslie 21 system.   All I could figure was that somehow, Nord had done something to these sounds so that they worked better when some distance was added. I have since updated to an  Electro 6 and while I think the sounds are much better, no one seems to be drawing attention to them. Maybe every other brand has upped its game?  I don't know but the Piano Man's observation is right on the money.

I think it's because Nord keyboards generally are made with very rich and punchy tones so they can cut thru the mix really well and can still sound huge in PA. I think Nord takes a lot of their samples from Sampletekk. I have a couple of their piano VIs and they do have the same character.

 

As a classical trained person I don't really like that tone a lot. My Nautilus has more authentic Steinway sound. But I can definitely see Nord's use in pop songs or bands.

[Coker]

13 hours ago, JoJoB3 said:
And if you think we haven't pulled their scat patches up once in a blue moon you'd be dead wrong. That's some terrible-funny shiz right there.
Every Nord should come with a swedish scat section.

Too funny… when I had a Roland, this customer always wanted me to play an intro to Blue Moon using the scat voices, which I always had to end with “Yow”.

[stoken6]

15 hours ago, MathOfInsects said:

12,000 saws, some swirly pads, and three of those jazz "doh" patches.

What more do you need for a gig?

4 hours ago, The Piano Man said:

Nord pianos sound really good to everyone apart from the actual performer

I agree - stereo monitoring seems to fix it. I use IEMs and it's a huge difference.

 

Cheers, Mike.

[The Piano Man]

6 minutes ago, stoken6 said:

What more do you need for a gig?

I agree - stereo monitoring seems to fix it. I use IEMs and it's a huge difference.

 

Cheers, Mike.

Yes, absolutely. Quality in ears is the way to go for Nord pianos.

[Al Quinn]

Acoustic Piano: Yamaha (CP4, P515, YC73)

Rhodes: Yamaha (CP4, YC73)

B3: Hammond SK Pro, HX3 Expander Module

 

The only all in one keyboard I've had that has worked for me is the YC73. AP and EP are great and the B3 is very good.

 

I agree with the previous comments about Nord APs sounding great to everyone but the performer. I sold my Stage 3 HA88 and Electro 4D a few years ago and don't miss them at all. Although they sounded really good I found the playing experience distracting which impacted my playing in a negative way (i.e., interfered with getting in the zone).

 

I played a Montage at GC and thought it was awesome. But, as I recall, it was heavy and very expensive which made it less appealing. Also, I didn't try the organs (which Yamaha has notoriously sucked at until their CP/YC products)

[time4jazz]

For an isolated AP sound, I really like those on my ES520 and CP73 (though the action on the later is not ideal for AP). For isolated Rhodes, the CP73 is great - both the samples and the effects. 
 

I also have an Electro 5D and don’t find the isolated APs and EPs to be as great, but like others have said, they have worked well in a band. In this context, the 5D’s B3 sounds good too. 

[CEB]

4 hours ago, locture said:

I think it's because Nord keyboards generally are made with very rich and punchy tones so they can cut thru the mix really well and can still sound huge in PA. I think Nord takes a lot of their samples from Sampletekk. I have a couple of their piano VIs and they do have the same character.

 

As a classical trained person I don't really like that tone a lot. My Nautilus has more authentic Steinway sound. But I can definitely see Nord's use in pop songs or bands.

Perhaps it is this.  I also think a big factor is also how pristine clean the audio output is on the Nord stuff.  Their stuff sounds great through FOH. I sort of regret not getting a Nord Piano instead of the PC4. 

[AnotherScott]

Having commented only on the piano question earlier in this thread, here's a good recent thread on Rhodes which includes my thoughts on that along with of course input from many others...

 

https://forums.musicplayer.com/topic/186010-rhodes-clone-inquiry/

 

though to my own list of serious considerations, I'd add Grandstage as another strong Rhodes board, which I hadn't yet played at the time of that earlier post.

 

Tangentially, for me, evaluating a board for Rhodes also means evaluating it for Wurli. IMO, that knocks the Yamaha CP/YC options down a bit. I really enjoy their Rhodes, but the Wurli to me is just okay, which is why I might lean toward one of the other models mentioned, where I think highly of both the Rhodes and Wurly sounds.

[Jazz+]

Piano: Kawai MP11SE

[locture]

18 hours ago, AnotherScott said:

Having commented only on the piano question earlier in this thread, here's a good recent thread on Rhodes which includes my thoughts on that along with of course input from many others...

 

https://forums.musicplayer.com/topic/186010-rhodes-clone-inquiry/

 

though to my own list of serious considerations, I'd add Grandstage as another strong Rhodes board, which I hadn't yet played at the time of that earlier post.

 

Tangentially, for me, evaluating a board for Rhodes also means evaluating it for Wurli. IMO, that knocks the Yamaha CP/YC options down a bit. I really enjoy their Rhodes, but the Wurli to me is just okay, which is why I might lean toward one of the other models mentioned, where I think highly of both the Rhodes and Wurly sounds.

For one thing which I don't really understand: Yamaha's real EPs are sample-based, Korg mostly modelded EP-1, but I have never fully got the idea of how Roland does their EP. The supernatural thing sounds almost like a mystery.

 

But I don't like the Roland EP presets anyway. They all feel a bit too harsh. Maybe savable by some clever EQ but by default they just don't get my beloved warm sound from actual Fender Rhodes.

[J.F.N.]

It seems the Kawai MP11SE/7SE are strong contenders here, anyone here has any input on the keybed on the MP11SE? I remember reading some 2-3 years ago that there were some kind of trouble with these, is that something anyone has experienced here, if so, what is there to do about it?

[Reezekeys]

On 8/3/2024 at 7:41 PM, Dave Ferris said:

P515 has a thicker, richer and less-digital sounding piano, with superior action but the CP88 sounds better live with a rhythm section.

 

In a general sense this sums up the sampled piano world, imo. My concern is a sampled piano that sounds good and feels good to play on a gig. My NI "Grandeur" sounds fantastic at home through studio monitors and headphones and I've used it on recording projects. One gig I did, I loaded it along with my trusty old NI "New York" and set up a button on my controller to switch between the two. I couldn't get through four bars of playing the Grandeur - it was a visceral feeling of "this is not right." Hard to explain, but that was the case. I've been happily playing the New York piano (originally part of NI's "Akoustik Piano" plugin, released almost twenty years ago!), first in my laptop and now, as Elmer mentioned, sampled into VirSyn's Audio Layer on my iPad and iPhone. I can walk into any venue that has a keyboard with my tiny iPhone SE 2016, along with a CCK and USB cable, and play my favorite piano. I also have a small 5-pin to USB 1x1 midi  interface in case the keyboard is really old or has non-class-compliant USB.

[The_Star_Guy]

I actually like this thread as this is useful info for all of us!

 

Piano:  Kawai ES-920 -Kawai Harmonic Imaging XL process just seems to emulate "vibrating string" harmonics more naturally than other sample-based systems

Electric EP:  Yamaha YC73/CP4/40 & Kawai ES-920 (tied)....love the dynamics on the Yamahas for EP, but the Kawai is cleaner & has superb AMP/FX engines

Organ: Hammond SK Pro barely edges out the YC73 which is finally an Organ "win" for Yamaha and surprisingly tweakable as well

 

Bonus category:  best "all-in-one"  goes to YC73...just wish that this was a tad stronger in synth voices to own this category

[The Piano Man]

19 minutes ago, The_Star_Guy said:

I actually like this thread as this is useful info for all of us!

 

Piano:  Kawai ES-920 -Kawai Harmonic Imaging XL process just seems to emulate "vibrating string" harmonics more naturally than other sample-based systems

Electric EP:  Yamaha YC73/CP4/40 & Kawai ES-920 (tied)....love the dynamics on the Yamahas for EP, but the Kawai is cleaner & has superb AMP/FX engines

Organ: Hammond SK Pro barely edges out the YC73 which is finally an Organ "win" for Yamaha and surprisingly tweakable as well

 

Bonus category:  best "all-in-one"  goes to YC73...just wish that this was a tad stronger in synth voices to own this category

How’s the action on the YC73? Is it similar to the old balanced hammer on the S90/es/70xs/90xs etc? The same as on the CP73?

[The_Star_Guy]

24 minutes ago, The Piano Man said:

How’s the action on the YC73? Is it similar to the old balanced hammer on the S90/es/70xs/90xs etc? The same as on the CP73?

 I believe that it is the same action as the CP 73.    While the action is certainly playable i think that Yamaha marketing it as an Electric Piano action was wise as there are definitely better acoustic piano action simulations, such as the triple sensor action on my NumaX 73.   The bonus of the YC 73 package is that it is probably the best "Jack of all trades" boards that I have encountered as it is not *bad* as anything!   I just really wished that Yamaha had given us complete access to the full FM synth that is inside of it.

[stoken6]

1 minute ago, The_Star_Guy said:

 I believe that it is the same action as the CP 73.    While the action is certainly playable i think that Yamaha marketing it as an Electric Piano action was wise as there are definitely better acoustic piano action simulations, such as the triple sensor action on my NumaX 73.   The bonus of the YC 73 package is that it is probably the best "Jack of all trades" boards that I have encountered as it is not *bad* as anything!   I just really wished that Yamaha had given us complete access to the full FM synth that is inside of it.

The other advantage of the YC73/CP73 "not quite premium" action is that it's light. 29lb is heavier than the godawful TP100 boards, but lighter than anything else of the same quality. (Disclaimer I haven't tried the TP110 in the NumaX 73).

 

Cheers, Mike.

[Moonglow]

Piano: Nord Stage 3

 

I have not played a NS4 but love the liveliness of the Nord pianos, and agree that running stereo is the fix for enjoying it from the player’s perspective. I have also observed a similar degree of improvement with some of the Kronos pianos when running stereo. I have never gelled with Yamaha pianos but think they sound great when others play them.

Rhodes: Crumar Seven

 

I like the Kronos Rhodes a lot, but found the Seven to be truly special.

 

Organ: Crumar Mojo 61

 

The Mojo 61 sounds great out of the box, and can tear your head off in a rock setting. I have not tried a Hammond XK-4, but as brother Allan Evett once observed, there is a “greeziness” in the Hammond clones that is badass.

[Mighty Motif Max]

Sticking within the box of stage piano/workstation (so no SK Pro which would blow these out of the water for organ)…

 

Piano: Nord Stage 3/4 (Queen Upright/Royal Grand as preloaded on the 3, White Grand and Royal Grand as preloaded on the 4); second up would be the Kawai MP7SE, third the Yamaha Montage/MODX series.

 

Rhodes: Korg Nautilus/Kronos - even the sampled version of that modeled Rhodes that was in my Krome was excellent.

 

Organ: Roland Fantom/Fantom EX

 

[Delaware Dave]

[octa]

Nord has been my go-to for years and their samples seem to sound 'good enough' in every situation, especially their AP's. After 10+ years of good times, I sold NS2c and made a go with YC88/Sk Pro for a couple of years, but recently got the NS4c and will stick with that indefinitely. I got along with the B3 on the NS2 more than I am with NS4 so far but will continue getting to know it. Like others here, I like Yamaha Rhodes best, but like Nord's ancient Wurly and Clavinet samples more and their Stockholm, Nefertiti and other Rhodes samples 'ain't bad'. 

 

I'm trying to keep the Yamaha YC88, for certain gigs. It sounds and feels 'great' on jazzy solo, trio or vocal accompaniment gigs but sounds 'real bad' sometimes when I'm forced to battle guitars/drums and crank stage volume, esp. in mono. And it's a little too big for the size vans we travel in, I don't wanna be a space hog. 

 

I finally sold the Hammond Sk Pro the other day. Didn't want to, because its B3 and leslie sim are 'outstanding' and their virtual multi-contact system (higher-than-high trigger) alone is worth the price of admission. The Wurly and AP would sound good at practice, and then 'awful' on stage. Mono synth on SK-Pro doesn't approach NS flexibility but was 'pretty fun' to use on some gigs. My ranking on B3 would be Sk Pro > YC88 > NS4.

 

Sometimes I run dual kb rig and bring the Roland RD-88 to use as a weighted midi controller for NS4c. Had the FP-10 before RD-88 and find Roland piano samples to be very 'playable', though haven't tried them on stage yet.  

 

[Outkaster]

Hammond: SK PRO 73

 

Piano:  Yamaha YC88

 

Two of the best boards I have ever owned, great out front and easily carried.  I'll put them up against anything out there.

[vonnor]

Considering only stock sounds in a workstation, or basing a purchase decision solely on that seems somewhat short-sighted.

 

When I look at a new do-it-all type board, I look more at the editing capabilities, sound engine(s), FX, etc. Try to get an idea whether I can build/tweak the sounds I need to recreate, how I might make the sounds better for what I need.

 

~ vonnor

[stoken6]

2 hours ago, octa said:

recently got the NS4c and will stick with that indefinitely

2 hours ago, octa said:

Sk Pro > YC88 > NS4

Vent to augment the Nord organ?

 

Cheers, Mike

[octa]

13 minutes ago, stoken6 said:

Vent to augment the Nord organ?

 

Cheers, Mike

Yep, toured without vent recently and mostly regretted it. Think I’ll use it this weekend, along with uad dream ‘65 deluxe pedal, which makes Nord EP’s and clav sound even better. 

[Zydecat]

Yamaha YC73 for me.  I really like most of the stock sounds.  There are a limited number of stock sounds for AP, EP, Organ, Flute, Strings, etc., but the ones there are really good in my opinion.  It matches up well with my SKPro and franken Leslie, but the YC73 organ sounds great on it's own.  I use the YC73 alone for one off gigs, jams, and the like.

[AnotherScott]

This thread has become a bit of a combination of "best piano board, best Rhodes board, best Organ" and "best single board if you want to do all three." For that latter, I think I'd agree with the recommendations of YC73, and maybe Nord Stage 4 (which I haven't had the opportunity to play yet).

[ProfD]

19 minutes ago, AnotherScott said:

This thread has become a bit of a combination of "best piano board, best Rhodes board, best Organ" and "best single board if you want to do all three." 

Brotha Scott, you've been around here long enough to know threads morph over time.😁

 

I read the OP as the best board for each sound type (piano, Rhodes, organ) excluding KBs dedicated to that particular sound.

 

Conceivably, for some users, one KB could cover all 3 sounds admirably.  That red KB was built to do it.😎

[AnotherScott]

8 minutes ago, ProfD said:

Brotha Scott, you've been around here long enough to know threads morph over time.😁

 

I read the OP as the best board for each sound type (piano, Rhodes, organ) excluding KBs dedicated to that particular sound.

Yes to all. But having morphed, I posted to comment on that alternate scenario as well!

 

Meanwhile, though I had previously posted on piano/rhodes... I had not mentioned organ. Again on the basis that we're talking about boards with some reasonable variety of sounds, I'd probably be in the SK Pro crowd for that one.

[Stokely]

Nord is one example, but there have been others that were less pleasing to me at home (at least at first) than when I heard recordings from shows.

I think some of that is that certain manufacturers drown their patches in verb and other effects.  Any of the stock Modx patches I used/modified I'd take those WAY down.   I'm finding the same on the Fantom.  Kurzweil seems on balance to be more on the dry side.

In plugin-land, it's the same.   I've demoed plugins that sound amazing and glorious but then I realize, a lot of that is effects.  In a busy tune that might not fly.  Others (Zebra 2 is one example that comes to mind) tend to be more dry and perhaps a bit underwhelming on their own.

[ProfD]

31 minutes ago, Stokely said:

I think some of that is that certain manufacturers drown their patches in verb and other effects. 

That is the ole trick of display KBs is to make them sound great in the music store.😁

 

Effects is the 1st thing I turn off when demoing any KB.  I want to hear the dry, real world sound. 

 

Of course, effects can be turned on/utilized as needed once familiar with the base sound.😎