Do I Want to Put Together a Live Act?

[Anderton]

I've wanted to do a one-off act for Halloween called "The Deadful Great." It would consist only of songs that were done by rock stars who are now deceased, and be a combination of music, stories, and some humor. Every time I've mentioned the concept, people say they'd travel and/or pay to see it. 

 

I love live performance, and this would be fun. I wouldn't have to write any songs, and could pick crowd-pleaser covers. But...

 

Do I use backing tracks? That seems like cheating to my old school way of thinking about live performance. Or, I could limit backing tracks to drums. I can get a zillion guitar sounds out of two Helix paths (including a sort of faux bass that pulls out the chord's root), and cool vocal sounds (including harmonies) from the other two paths.

 

But then what plays back the backing tracks? Maybe it's time to dust off the Minidisc. Or maybe bite the bullet and use a laptop?

 

Or I could do the whole thing live with guitar, Helix, and Beat Buddy to provide a drum track - no backing tracks, no computer. But Beat Buddy doesn't sound as good as loops from an acoustic drummer. And then there would be the footswitch tap dance where it would be difficult to turn on the drums AND change Helix presets at the same time.

 

Or I could use a Digitech Vocalist for the vocals, which would let me exploit the Helix further...but now I need a mixer for the drums, vocals, and Helix...

 

Putting the result on YouTube would be fraught due to copyright clearance if I was just doing covers. And putting together an act would take time away from doing my original music...not to mention finding a venue and promoting the gig, which sounds like it would be a time sink.

 

Any advice from the collective Musicplayer.com savants of live performance? What option hits the sweet spot of minimum hassles and maximum impact?

[Philbo King]

It seems do-able.  Personally I try to do solo shows,well, solo; one guy playing/singing on maybe 3 or 4 instruments at once (harmonica, guitar, kick drum, high hat).  Not even a looper pedal.  But I play blues, which adapts itself well to stripped down instrumentation.  Other styles may not fare as well in stripped-down mode...

[GovernorSilver]

I did my cover set with a Roland MC-101 playing the backing parts and me playing the melody part on electric violin.

 

I used the probability features so that the MC-101 didn't play exactly the same drum pattern on every bar.  Nothing too fancy - an extra hit or two on the snare here, extra tom there, extra high hat here, etc. with probability for each hit set to about 30-40% range. 

 

One compromise I accepted was the MC-101 drums being sample based.  If one doesn't like the drums, then one has to some editing of drum layers, envelopes, filter, etc. and/or load one's own samples and subject those to editing.  All I learned from my attempts to customize drum sounds on the MC-101 and its big brother MC-707 - where I did the actual work of programming the drum parts and other sequences - was how little I enjoy working with sample based drum kits.  I've been finding working with synthesized drums to be much more enjoyable.

 

If I had a better singing voice, I'd consider doing gigs with just a mic and arranger keyboard as that is the type of keyboard that is well suited for one person band gigs.  I do understand there are some cons to this approach, including obvious ones like you're a multi-instrumentalist and would rather play guitar for certain songs, but then you won't have enough hands free to rearrange the song on the fly which arranger keyboards are so well suited for.

[RABid]

If I were doing my approach would probably be to record my own backing tracks. That way it is still all me. Keep it simple: drums, bass, rhythm and pads. Recorded music is much easier to deal with than a sequencer and sound sources. 

[Philbo King]

30 minutes ago, RABid said:

If I were doing my approach would probably be to record my own backing tracks. That way it is still all me. Keep it simple: drums, bass, rhythm and pads. Recorded music is much easier to deal with than a sequencer and sound sources. 

I had a friend, Birddog, who did shows exactly this way.  (He passed away last Christmas day).  He was a regular at Honolulu gigs for years.

His shows sounded great!

[Anderton]

7 hours ago, Philbo King said:

But I play blues, which adapts itself well to stripped down instrumentation.  Other styles may not fare as well in stripped-down mode...

 

What I'm finding in my initial forays is song selection really matters with a stripped-down setup. I tried doing "Free Fallin'" with just vocal, Helix for vocals+faux harmony and guitar, and Beat Buddy drums. Surprisingly, it actually sounded pretty good. More complex tunes didn't, uh, fare so well. "Donna" also worked. So that's two dead guys down, maybe 20 more to go once I finalize my setup. I bet "My Sharona" would go over well but I doubt any canned rhythm would be compatible. 

 

If the voice+faux harmonies/Helix/Beat Buddy combination works, that's simple and doable. Getting a harmonica holder would help, too. But with backing tracks, I could have great-sounding drums...and then I start thinking hmmm, a keyboard could store the drum loops I need, and then I could play keyboards too...

 

Keep those ideas coming! 

[GovernorSilver]

7 hours ago, GovernorSilver said:

 some cons to this approach, including obvious ones like you're a multi-instrumentalist and would rather play guitar for certain songs

 

I forgot one counterexample - multi-instrumentalist Eric Johnson (best known as a guitarist) chose to cover a guitar-based tune on piano.

 

 

[Greg Mein]

For years I've used DP on MBP's with MOTU interfaces and external keyboards. It's always been a solid setup and I'd always created my own tracks. I was originally inspired by articles in Keyboard magazine where Mike McKnight and others used that same basic setup on large world tours with world renown artists and groups.

 

The last band I was in was undoubtedly the most popular in the area and certainly the most lucrative with sound company on hire and a minimum $2000 fee. Pretty good for a regional act. My primary function was keyboards along with some vocal and guitar. I even introduced some sequencing into the group which wasn't much of a problem, they were top notch musicians who quickly adjusted to a click and we already used in-ear monitors.

 

I'd used the same basic system live before joining that group and after I left I continued to use it as my wife and I put together a duo act.

 

Your idea sounds like a great big load of fun, I'd love to be a part of it!

[Notes_Norton]

Great idea. I'd steal it, but every Halloween we play private parties, and they are going to want more recent music as well as oldies.

If it were a small venue - and - if I could do a good enough job as a soloist playing guitar or piano, I'd do it that way. But alas, sax is my main instrument.

The advantage is looseness, and a more intimate conversation with the audience.

For a big venue, I'd do backing tracks. I am a believer that if you can't talk to the audience, you need to wow them more.

 

Good luck!

 

Notes ♫

[Anderton]

2 hours ago, Notes_Norton said:

If it were a small venue - and - if I could do a good enough job as a soloist playing guitar or piano, I'd do it that way. But alas, sax is my main instrument.

The advantage is looseness, and a more intimate conversation with the audience.

 

Agreed, I expect to play more intimate settings so your comments make sense. The more I think about it, the more I think it needs to be a real time production. The drums/ hex guitar duo I did with Brian from Public Enemy several years back was incredibly liberating because I didn't have to follow anything - no bass, no keyboards, no backing tracks. If I wanted the solo to go another eight measures or cut it out altogether, no problem. We could also do tempo variations based on how we felt at any given moment, not what was programmed into a backing track. We did play a festival gig with that approach and pulled it off because it sounded big.

[Garubi]

27 minutes ago, Anderton said:

 

Agreed, I expect to play more intimate settings so your comments make sense. The more I think about it, the more I think it needs to be a real time production. The drums/ hex guitar duo I did with Brian from Public Enemy several years back was incredibly liberating because I didn't have to follow anything - no bass, no keyboards, no backing tracks. If I wanted the solo to go another eight measures or cut it out altogether, no problem. We could also do tempo variations based on how we felt at any given moment, not what was programmed into a backing track. We did play a festival gig with that approach and pulled it off because it sounded big.

I often play a duo with me at electric piano and accordion and a singer/guitarist. We play mostly original song in singer-songwriter style.

It's really liberating having just to follow the mood of the moment, in connection with the small, intimate audience.

I'll go as real-time as possible... maybe adding a loopstation for some "boom" "chick" "tac" rhythm. Very acoustic, very live, very connected to the audience 

[Anderton]

3 hours ago, Garubi said:

I often play a duo with me at electric piano and accordion and a singer/guitarist. We play mostly original song in singer-songwriter style.

It's really liberating having just to follow the mood of the moment, in connection with the small, intimate audience.

 

I could easily see that as working well with audiences. Thanks for the comment!

[Strays Dave]

Two years ago on a vacation visit to Montreal, I heard an excellent solo act in a pub/bar.  He appeared to me to be veteran band player/musician. He played an acoustic electric guitar and used a looper pedal.  He would play in real time for the looper pedal, creating  a backing foundation riff first. Then he'd start the song playing the rhythm chords and singing against the backing track he'd just created. When he wanted to solo on guitar, he used a wah wah pedal.  It sounded full and satisfying.  But I can't recall if he used electronic rhythm.  

 

We're going to Montreal again this late June, two years after the previous visit. .  He was playing in a nice pub on St. Hubert  street, blocked off from traffic with some Cirque Du Soleil related street performers. I'm hoping maybe he'll playing again in the same pub. 

 

I attempted to share a photo of this guy  from my Google photos but couldn't pull it off. 

[Notes_Norton]

One of the other folks at a club we gig at thrice a week works the looper quite well. He will sing and play, and unless you are paying attention, you won't know when he engages the looper. All of a sudden, he is playing fills in the holes between vocal lines, and/or playing a nice guitar solo as the comping plays without interruption. 

A very good act, and I have a tone of respect for him.

Me? Guitar is my 7th instrument, picked it up seriously in my 60s, so I consider myself a student and a hack (the audience doesn't kow because I only play what I'm good at on that instrument). If I accidentally turn the looper on by hitting the wrong button on my amp-sim/fx pedal, I can't turn it off quickly enough.

 

Another guy has two footpedals, one for MIDI bass drum, the other for snare. What's amazing about him is he sings and although it looks like he is simply strumming the guitar, he's also playing bass notes and fills. I don't know how he does it. As closely as I watch, I can't see it, but I certainly can hear it. I asked him about it, and he said that he's been doing it for years, and it gets easier with time.

Opposite end of the spectrum.

In the late 1980s, early 1990s I spent 3 years on cruise ships (on a 3-week contract with options). In that time, I saw many piano bar performers. 

There was a gal who played jazz, all the musicians loved her, but she was the wrong act for the ship. She didn't last long.

Another guy was mostly a singer, and learning how to play cocktail piano. He only knew how to play in a few keys. If he got to a part of the song where he didn't know the chords, he'd take his hand off the keys, keep on singing, and come in with a flourish where he knew how to play it. If he couldn't sing parts of it in one of the keys he knew how to play in, he'd talk the line or dramatically change the melody. He did these with such confidence and bravado, that it actually worked.

 

What he did well, was work the crowd. By mid-week he knew the patron's names, where they were from, what their requests were, facts they shared with him in conversation and so on. Example: He'd see a couple come in while playing a song, say, "Hello Bill and Alice (or whatever their names are) from Galveston", and switch right into Glenn Campbell's Galveston or a song they requested a day or two ago. Amazing talent for that. And he had the biggest, fullest tip jar of any piano bar player I've ever seen. He talked with them about 1/4 of the time and actually played and sang the other 3/4.

I'd go in to watch in amazement and learn some pointers on dealing with an audience.

 

In conversation with us, he admitted he was lacking piano skills, and he brought a small electronic piano on board and would practice with earphones every day. I've got a lot of respect for that.

 

Another option … 

We use backing tracks, as my dominant instrument is sax/wind-synhthesizer-vocals. I make my own tracks, and for the majority of them, I try to cover the essential parts of the famous recording. I also play drums, bass, and mostly one-handed keyboards (can't do the left-and-right piano thing) and that helps me make my MIDI backing tracks. 

 

I make the tracks similar to the recording enough for the audience to recognize. Then Mrs. Notes and I play our instruments and/or sing the parts I don't put on the track. I save the fun parts for us to do live over the tracks. She plays guitar and synth, and I play sax, flute, wind synth, and/or guitar on stage.

There are a number of different ways to make a buck playing music, you have to consider your own strong points, and use them to your advantage.

Sorry about dragging this so far on a tangent, but I think by evaluating what you are good at, always helps you make decisions about how to connect with an audience.

Insights and incites by Notes ♫

[Thethirdapple]

@Notes_Norton Thank you for posting your experience and perspective, in such wonderful detail. Great insight!

 

 

 

PEACE

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[zeronyne]

I am always a fan of assistive technologies to play out solo.

 

But...

 

This idea and use case seems just ripe for a band, if only to have more people in costume and for more foils for your inter-song patter.

[David Emm]

The brief period during which I played live a few times was a mini-high-wire act. "Loopers" were dubious types who spent many evenings laboring over a splicing block, not performance assistants. My whole act depended on shoveling disks in and out of a Korg 01Wfd. I could deliver some patter while things loaded and I naturally played a few solo piano/organ/drum pieces so my chops showed, but the rest was me playing one track while the orchestra of my home-brewed work came out of the sequencer. If that drive had died, I would have been SOL. I greatly admire the stainless steel spine it takes to play live, at any level.

[Anderton]

At the turn of the century I had a solo act that was really complex - two Ensoniq ASRs, all hardware, guitar, voice, mixer, keyboard, etc. It needed split second timing and sometimes I didn't get it right. BUT I had a safety net - a Minidisc with some really funny recordings, like excerpts from "Hoe to Speak Hip." I could cue those up and the audience thought it was part of the act, while I sorted out what went wrong.

[Bill H.]

On 3/28/2024 at 9:16 AM, Anderton said:

 

Agreed, I expect to play more intimate settings so your comments make sense. The more I think about it, the more I think it needs to be a real time production. The drums/ hex guitar duo I did with Brian from Public Enemy several years back was incredibly liberating because I didn't have to follow anything - no bass, no keyboards, no backing tracks. If I wanted the solo to go another eight measures or cut it out altogether, no problem. We could also do tempo variations based on how we felt at any given moment, not what was programmed into a backing track. We did play a festival gig with that approach and pulled it off because it sounded big.

 

I had the opposite feeling when I switched to backing tracks. It was liberating to not have to do setup between songs, and do what I was getting paid to do - entertain. But I was about as far from festival gigs as you can get - low key lounges. But it was a huge relief to just double click on a file in Windows Media Player and go. 

 

No one cared that I added a big clunky laptop to my gear, and that was 20 years ago. And now it's so common. It sounds like you already know what you're going to do Craig, but if it's a difficult track to pull off manually you could keep the door open for those tracks. 

 

And no one even bats an eye anymore. I think I told this story before, but I was blown away when a very popular regional band flew in the piano part to Don't Stop Believin'. They didn't have a keyboard player that night, and no one seemed to even notice! The only thing they cared about was that the lead singer nail Steve Perry's range and timbre, which he did splendidly.

 

And why this band gets paid in the thousands per gig instead of hundreds. 

[Anderton]

Some of the parallel discussions in other threads made me realize that there are two different types of gigs. The one I'm thinking of is more like something that would happen in a theater, where people are there specifically to see the act. But if I was gigging in a bar or place where the music wasn't the primary focus, then I can understand where backing tracks would be essential so you have a full sound going on, with complete control over volume.

 

Hmmm...maybe I need to do my one-off Halloween gig, but then come up with a different act for other venues...assuming I want to play other venues. Oddly enough, I've never played a gig where the music wasn't the primary, if not only, reason people were there. I've been lucky.

[Bill H.]

My gigs can lean one way or another for sure, but practically all of them have been a combination of listeners and non-listeners. I've played dinner piano where I didn't think anyone was listening - only to be surprised when a couple would come over and thank me for the wonderful music. And I've played in bands where I thought everyone was listening, and have someone come up and request a song we just did.

 

But basically if there's a song you really want to do and the best solution would be a backing track, don't let what people may think hold you back - because no one even thinks about that stuff anymore. In my experience anyway. 

[Notes_Norton]

Whichever way you choose, I hope it's successful.

 

Slightly OT. 

When gigging on the cruise ships at the end of the 20th century, San Juan, PR, was our long port. I got to know a few of the PR musicians, and we traded tips on each other's music styles.

 

Perhaps the best one-person act I ever saw was a musician who sadly didn't speak any more English than I do Spanish, so only the most basic conversation took place.

He had an A-Frame rack with 3 keyboards and two drum machines, plus bass pedals on the floor. He played Salsa music. He'd play the piano figure with one hand, horn stabs on another synth, one drum machine played the rhythm, he'd hit the other for drum rolls, and kicked bass. On top of this he would sing. Salsa music is complex, this is not his recording, but pretty much the kind of music he was doing at the time.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmolrpquXU0
 

Notes ♫

 

[Mighty Motif Max]

Popping into this thread a bit late, but if you want a reasonably solid and not insanely expensive setup to run some backing tracks, I just wrapped up a weekend gig where I had some supplementary tracks running from the Loop Community Prime iPad app. It's originally designed for worship bands, but you can import your own tracks via uploading to the cloud and downloading to your device (which stays offline) and generate a click that matches, if necessary. In theory you can run all sorts of channels so long as your audio interface supports it. I ran my rig with an older iPad 5th generation and a Roland Rubix 22 (click left, track mix right out), with no issues. But I could have split out instruments independently with a bigger audio interface. The app itself is free and you get some cloud storage free as well. https://loopcommunity.com/en-us/prime

 

In the past, I've done solo gigs where I sequenced some parts (usually drums and bass) to play keys along with, mostly for modern pop tunes. I just sequenced those on my keyboard and played them back. However, if I was to do it again, I would definitely just use audio tracks from another device, so as to not run up against polyphony issues. The other fun thing you could look into is using an electronic kick pedal to trigger a kick drum, and maybe another foot pedal of some type to trigger other percussion stuff. I've done that as well - run the accordion through a Line6 M13 for effects (or just use the keys for some songs), use a kick pedal, and Bob's yer uncle. It helps that I'm also a drummer of course, but I was doing that gig setup before I actually started gigging on drums or had a practice kit.

 

 

 

[Anderton]

Thanks! I see a lot of acts using tablets, and it's not just for the lyrics. I do think I'll just work on the theater gig for now, that way I don't have to learn a zillion cover songs that people want to hear. Still, even though I want to do it live/real time, I'm  starting to think that using backing tracks from time to time would add another dimension to the show - like switching instruments or something similar.  

[ProfD]

As I've mentioned in other threads mainly regarding AI, I believe the future of music lies in live performance. 

 

Any band configuration (solo, duo, quartet, etc.) and combination of technologies will suffice in the paradigm I envision. 

 

The audience expectation won't be predicated on hearing *hit* songs replayed in a cover band style. 

 

The end goal will be a fulfilling musical experience delivered by musicians creatively making organized noise.

 

On 3/25/2024 at 12:00 PM, Anderton said:

I've wanted to do a one-off act for Halloween called "The Deadful Great." It would consist only of songs that were done by rock stars who are now deceased, and be a combination of music, stories, and some humor. Every time I've mentioned the concept, people say they'd travel and/or pay to see it. 

 

Brotha Craig, it is a natural tendency for some of us  musicians and/or technical types aka nerds to overthink it.  F8ck that. 🤣

 

Build and they will follow.  Just do it mayne.😎

[Anderton]

I'm definitely going to keep it as simple as possible. But, I want to be able to improvise and have LOTS of interaction with the audience. So if  I can avoid backing tracks, I will.

 

Right now the setup is Helix for guitar, VoiceLive for voice, and a Beat Buddy for drums. I don't see it changing much unless I upgrade to the next-level Beat Buddy. Oh, and a bag of kazoos to hand out the audience so they can do the ocarina solo in "Wild Thing."

[Mighty Motif Max]

There's also the new Sheeran Looper units...the cheaper one is still pretty capable. If I were ever to get a looper, I like the set of features these have.

 

https://www.sheeranloopers.com/

 

 

[Notes_Norton]

A have a friend who uses a looper. He's amazing. He'll be singing a song while playing his guitar, and before you know it, he's also playing answer parts, or adding background parts, and then playing a solo. When he turns the looper on or off, it's not detectable, no matter how hard you are listening. It's seamless. 
 

Me, if I accidentally turn the amp-sim/fx pedal looper on, I can't get it off fast enough.

 

Everybody has their own set of skills, use what you have to the best of your ability, and work on the ones you don't have that well.

 

I'm sure whatever you choose, Craig, will work out fine. You have the experience and the chops.

 

Notes ♫