In n Out, Billion dollar Co- asks bands to pay for gig and no pay

[Floyd Tatum]

It seems that some rich people, the richer they get, the bigger a$$holes they become.   I mean, come on.  Ok, you became a billionaire - we're all very impressed.    Now, how's about spreading some of the cheese around a little.   You'll feel better, try it!

 

[Artomas]

If the crowd was going to be snooty enough, it would almost be... I'd definitely want to get my money's worth. If I'm paying $75, I'd want somebody good playing after me in a crowded general admission, so the people in front would be reluctant to leave. And I'd want a confederate on the sound board. I should probably have some lyrics prepared in case tgis type of opportunity arises around here. The problem is, it's the type of thing where I would cancel if I thought about it, at all, so it would need to happen quick, like maybe if I subbed for someone last minute, and agreed to split the fee and reimburse them $37.50 after the gig 

[CHarrell]

21 minutes ago, Floyd Tatum said:

It seems that some rich people, the richer they get, the bigger a$$holes they become.   I mean, come on.  Ok, you became a billionaire - we're all very impressed.    Now, how's about spreading some of the cheese around a little.   You'll feel better, try it!

 

 

Well, chances are they didn't exactly become billionaires through the most ethical means.

[Adan]

I didn't realize, when I made my previous comment, that this is an ONLINE battle of the bands.  This just makes me think of the old saying, there's a sucker born every minute . . .

[JohnH]

Other than the storied history of the NHRA dragstrip, (I am a fan ) of which In N Out is now the official sponsor of the strip itself, I was telling a band member last night, the place is really kind of a dump! It's just a huge parking lot and there's not one thing special about it, it's just a dated facility. 

[TommyRude]

I remember the 1980s era of "pay to play" on the Sunset Strip in Hollywood.  In order to play places like The Roxy, The Whiskey, The Troubadour - you had to purchase a block of tickets.  You then could/would sell those tickets to your friends and family and whoever, and attempt to recoup the $$.  I don't recall the exact numbers, but it was something like 100-200 tickets (I think we paid $10/ticket?), maybe more.  They would pile 3-5 bands on a show, each of the bands purchasing and selling tickets.  The specific band fans may or may not stick around to see the other bands.  Usually there was a headliner, which would generally be the band selling the most tickets.  So, this in essence was a way for the club owners to rake in $$ without having to advertise.  The bands themselves often purchased advertising, i.e. buying a thousand posters and slapping them up on telephone poles around the city, and buying ads in local magazines and periodicals such as BAM and Music Connection.

 

The bands - desperate for exposure and record deals - were glad to pay to play (or not).  We did it, as did every other band at that time.  We actually did reasonably well, easily selling the tickets we purchased, and rising to headline shows, and getting to the point where we started to get paid by the venues.  In the end, the band I was with didn't get a deal.  Notable bands coming out of this world were Poison, Guns & Roses, Warrant.  The positive side was there was a camaraderie of sorts amongst most of the bands, we'd go to their shows, they'd come to ours, it was a struggle but a labor of love.  I did make a lot of friends, and the exposure I got paid off later on (to a minor extent).

 

In hindsight, it was a shitty machine, exploiting many of the struggling musicians, playing off their hopes and dreams.  As the pay to play world unfolded, it rapidly spread across the rock 'n roll clubs in Hollywood.  I don't know if it persists, I hope not.

[JohnH]

Wow !   I was a huge fan of you and your band, and actually sent you an email a few years ago that you kindly responded to. I am friends with John Pratt on Facebook, who I ran into at a concert about five years ago and he was so cool to meet and talk to about the band. I was at a lot of the shows you mention and the band and music was great. And was sorry to hear about the bass player also, another great player.

[TommyRude]

13 minutes ago, JohnH said:

Wow !   I was a huge fan of you and your band, and actually sent you an email a few years ago that you kindly responded to. I am friends with John Pratt on Facebook, who I ran into at a concert about five years ago and he was so cool to meet and talk to about the band. I was at a lot of the shows you mention and the band and music was great. And was sorry to hear about the bass player also, another great player.

wowow that's cool John! It was a crazy wild time.  I would do it again, but a bit differently (wouldn't we all 😂

[zxcvbnm098]

3 minutes ago, TommyRude said:

wowow that's cool John! It was a crazy wild time.  I would do it again, but a bit differently (wouldn't we all 😂

I played in that circuit as well as that time, and it still does exist as far as I know. 

 

Back in the heyday of the late 1960's and early 70's, you knew if you went to the Roxy or the Troubadour or any number of clubs in and around Sunset you'd be seeing the best bands in the area. The people booking the clubs wanted the best and that's what brought people in. There was healthy competition between clubs to get good talent, and the bookers worked hard to get good acts. No one was coming to see one act and then leaving when they were done. ALL the bands were good, and worth staying for. 

 

When they started the pay-to-play BS, they essentially cut their own throats. No one goes out to those clubs anymore, and when they do, they're there for a drink and a 40 minute set and then adios. A total shame....

[CHarrell]

As a musician who started getting on the scene about ten years ago at the tender age of 19, I can say with assurance that the pay-to-play model is very much alive and well. I refuse to engage in it for principle reasons, but a number of my peers have gotten swept up in it: "C'mon, playing this venue is gonna be a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity!" That's how the venue would advertise it, too. Of course, you also have the Facebook etc. alternatives, where bands have to get the most likes or something, which is stupid on a number of levels.

 

From what I've seen, these kinds of schemes really bring out the worst, this gross, competitive frenzied rush in the desperate hope that THIS show will take us to the top, THIS is gonna be our breakthrough!

 

No thanks.

[Docbop]

Back in my day 60's things weren't that different, we did get paid but it many of the name clubs paid next to nothing.   Gazzarri's on Sunset is where many bands got their start Doors, Buffalo Springfield,  and well know Van Halen played there a long time honing there skills.   There were lots of bands that never made it I knew that played all the time with Van Halen and others.    Gazzarri's was always packed with people wanting to dance and hear music so the money was flowing for Bill the owner.    Bands played usually three to four sets a night alternating with one or two other bands set on two small stages so the music never stopped.   Gazzarri's would pay a $150 to maybe up to $250 for the WHOLE band for a WEEK.    So you did get paid but barely enough to pay for gas and food for the band.   Bands would play months some a year or more again because "the exposure" and many bands that came out of Gazzarri's did get signed.     

 

Bands I knew that played Gazzarri's all the time because very good at hustling girls at the club for meals,  place to live,  clothes,  and etc to it was a trickle down economy.   Clubs screwed the bands the bands screwed the women to live all saying "Your gonna be or I'm gonna be a Rockstar".     I was playing bars then and many times making more than friends playing the Hollywood clubs.  So back then next to no pay, versus Pay to Play.    Another pain in the ass back then was the Musician Union was trying to keep to force clubs to be union and would hassle musicians for playing in non-union clubs like Gazzarri's.    Bill Gazzarri used to talk about how the Door's still owed him a couple more days on their contact when their album came out and they were supposed to play the Whiskey then a union club.   Bill would say how cool he was for letting them out of their contract so they could play the Whiskey two block down the street. 

 

Fun times in Hollywood back in the 60's and early 70's.    

[El Lobo]

41 minutes ago, Docbop said:

Bands I knew that played Gazzarri's all the time because very good at hustling girls at the club for meals,  place to live,  clothes,  and etc

Old joke:

Q. What do you call a guitar player without a girlfriend?

A. Homeless.

[Pa Gherkin]

On 6/27/2023 at 8:33 PM, AUSSIEKEYS said:

They can get stuffed.

Perfect response. Concise and on point.