Standing Up to Sore Feet

[vonnor]

Years ago, @Rikismynameposted a tip about standing on one of those Anti-Fatigue rubber mats while playing. I'm at the point where a 3-4 hour gig has me limping in pain during load-out and the whole next day. Any of you "Stand-up" guys or ladies use one of those? How does it work for you? Is it worth it? Do you have a recommended brand? (Amazon has a hundred different types).

 

Thanks!

 

~ vonnor

[timwat]

I have found that any type of rubber padding helps for a gig with long periods of standing (all of my non-straight-jazz-piano gigs).

 

I don't use the heavily cushy mats, as I want some degree of stability (rather than standing on a waterbed). I use an outdoor floor mat and find it provides good relief over time.

 

Also, pay attention to the type of shoes you gig in. I found very good looking dress shoes with an unobtrusive foam sole (NOT one of those "dress sneaker" styles). This makes a big differences as well, although for my full tux gigs I still wear formal dress shoes.

 

Be mindful that extended periods of time riding the sustain pedal turns you into a flamingo and your left leg will suffer. All that stuff your piano teacher told you (or should have told you) about not abusing the sustain pedal? Remember that discipline.

 

Some more little things: Always load in / load out in comfortable athletic shoes. Yes it's faster to wear the pants / shoes you're going to gig in for this...but I've found the comfort is most needed for schlepping the heavy in and out. Also, during the set make sure you sway and dance a little to keep shifting the center of gravity, even if unobtrusively. Use a tall stool to lean your butt on in between tunes. The tall ones don't make it look like your sitting, but any periodic relief from your full weight on your feet will cumulatively help over the length of the gig. Drink lots of water and stay hydrated. Bring a 9 iron in the car and swing it in the parking lot between sets; don't let your shoulders and upper back freeze up from standing either.

 

Eat more vegetables, and use the sunscreen. Be careful with that hot 22-year-old named Britney that tells you, "You play like you have the wind in your hair". Be even more careful with the even-hotter beauty contestant Nicole who wants to kiss your hands during the set breaks.

 

Oh, and maybe bring a change of socks in between sets.

[EricBarker]

8 minutes ago, timwat said:

Be mindful that extended periods of time riding the sustain pedal turns you into a flamingo and your left leg will suffer. All that stuff your piano teacher told you (or should have told you) about not abusing the sustain pedal? Remember that discipline.

Absolutely true. I once had a sustain go out on me during a gig. I just adjusted and dealt with it. My feet never felt better the next day! For me though, I use the pedal for momentary Leslie speed, so I'm often on it with one foot, and swell on the other, doing a little balancing act. Funny thing is, at the end of the day, both my feet get about the same amount of strain, where-as a piano-only gig leaves my left foot achy.

[vonnor]

Good suggestions, thank you guys. My main issue is lots of pain in the balls of my feet and part way down the tarsal arch towards the heel. Never really have any issues with the sustain pedal since I double route both sustain pedals through Cantabile on the laptop to the Piano sound source for a given song, then I just switch off left foot to right foot on the damper if needed.

 

~ vonnor

[Leroy C]

Whew, I hear you.  And it's not getting any easier with each passing year ...

 

Until the last few years, I was giggin on upright bass semi-regularly, and having the same issue.  I bought one of these:

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001Q3KT4M/

 

I removed the back part, set the seat nice and high, so I could sit back on the edge of it, but still be in more or less a standing position.  Sometimes people would even say later, "Oh, I didn't even realize you were sitting down."  I could even put a foot at a time up on the little footrest bar at the bottom to give my sole a break.  Not sure if this would work for you, but might be worth a shot.

[AUSSIEKEYS]

34 minutes ago, timwat said:

Be careful with that hot 22-year-old named Britney that tells you, "You play like you have the wind in your hair".

 

I think for many on the forum Britney would be saying 

 

"You play like you have hair"

[vonnor]

22 hours ago, TheophilusCarter said:

Not sure if this would work for you, but might be worth a shot.

Nah. The day I have to sit to play rock keyboards live is the day I hang it up.

 

...maybe... 😎

 

~ vonnor

[Stokely]

I use a couple different standard rugs (different sizes, a bigger one if I have room, smaller one if I don't).  They keep my pedals from moving and look cool too.  They also help level uneven stages a bit.   As Tim said I don't like the real thick ones as those would feel unstable.  I put my stand on it, which leaves 3 feet or so for me to stand on.

I get leg swelling due to a circulation issue but standing or sitting makes no difference (standing might actually be better as I move a bit).

I usually wear converse chuck 70s at gigs which have a lot more sole padding than regular chucks--shoes can make a big difference.  

Our bass player has an indoor/outdoor industrial carpeted mat, it's 3x5 or so and quite thick.  

 

[Synthaholic]

23 hours ago, TheophilusCarter said:

I bought one of these:

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001Q3KT4M/

I stood while playing 5 or 6 nights a week for 30 years. Awful for your hips, especially your left, as you need to shift weight a lot to work sustain pedals. Then I got one of these, although the On Stage version. I loved it for 5 or 6 years until it started giving me back and hip issues. I'm 5'10" and couldn't sit completely level on it while also using pedals, so I was always at an angle with my left foot on the footrest. I brought it into both my chiropractor and massage therapist's offices and both told me to stop using it once they saw me sitting on it. They said I was just asking for trouble, and to switch to a piano bench. But it may be fine for a taller, bigger guy.

[CEB]

I tried one but it was too soft and killed my ankles instead.  A thinner mat may have been better. 

[Leroy C]

On 2/16/2023 at 12:45 PM, vonnor said:

Nah. The day I have to sit to play rock keyboards live is the day I hang it up.

 

But you say that like it's a good thing ...   🥲

[KuruPrionz]

Spend some time every day stretching your hamstrings. Go one leg at a time for some gradually extended stretches and then go for both legs. 

Safest to sit on the floor with your legs extended, toe touch style. Take it slow, work your way up. 

 

I play guitar and autistic so rocking back and forth is normal behavior. The green on top, yellow on the bottom Dr. Schol's heavy duty shoe pads are worth the money. 

[Bill H.]

On 2/15/2023 at 10:35 AM, vonnor said:

Years ago, @Rikismynameposted a tip about standing on one of those Anti-Fatigue rubber mats while playing. I'm at the point where a 3-4 hour gig has me limping in pain during load-out and the whole next day. Any of you "Stand-up" guys or ladies use one of those? How does it work for you? Is it worth it? Do you have a recommended brand? (Amazon has a hundred different types).

 

Thanks!

 

~ vonnor

I used rubber mats for years with mixed results. What works far better for me are maximum cushion foam athletic shoes. I started running and hiking in them a few years ago, and once I felt their advantages with that, it didn't take me too long to start wearing them in clubs. I've been dealing with plantar fasciitis for years, and they are the only thing that keeps it at bay. 

 

I go with the brand that started the whole max shoe movement: Hoka (specifically their Bondi), but every brand has their own take on max cushion shoes now. 

 

 

[Charleston]

On 2/15/2023 at 3:06 PM, vonnor said:

Good suggestions, thank you guys. My main issue is lots of pain in the balls of my feet and part way down the tarsal arch towards the heel. Never really have any issues with the sustain pedal since I double route both sustain pedals through Cantabile on the laptop to the Piano sound source for a given song, then I just switch off left foot to right foot on the damper if needed.

 

~ vonnor

Sound like you are wearing shoes that put your weight on the balls of your feet, and probably have arch "support" (which btw makes the arch weaker). They also probably have tight toe boxes and don't allow your toes to spread out ( spread toes creates a proper natural arch). 

If you aren't already, the 1st thing to try is flatter shoes with wider toe boxes. Watch SquatUniversity YT videos on the topic if needed.

Also, if you're calves/hams are tight, and/or your knees stay bent too much and further over your toes, etc... that can also contribute (or be the cause).

Also, toe spacers (with wider toe boxes) can help.

But yeah, standing on one foot playing keyboards in that position for long periods of time can get cha in the feet, knees, hips, back, etc...

[mate stubb]

I had (have) painful plantar fasciitis and can barely walk a big concrete box store floor.

 

I learned to wear high quality shoes with gel inserts always, even around the house. A pair of Keen Austins with Dr. Scholls inserts helps me immensely.

[Bill H.]

27 minutes ago, Dave Ferris said:

 I haven't worn a shoe, running, walking/hiking, working or even casual, other then Hoka Bondi 10 2E, in probably seven years.

 

They make them in Black, so I can use them on a gig. Do a search, people that spend 8-10 hours a day on their feet- nurses, retail, etc., wear them. They are simply the sh!t, I wouldn't consider wearing any other shoe, ever, for anything. There is a period of adjustment for your foot because of the low heel drop. They might feel weird at first. But I've had  plantar many times over my running career, and have had stage 4 Hallux Rigidus, which is severe stiffing of the big toe in both feet since 52, I'm 69 now. No more plantar, I do still have big toe pain but the Hoka Bondis have helped immensely. Haven't needed a Spenco insole in 7 years either. Can't recommend them enough.

 

You could try a pair with no hassle/cost return from Running warehouse. In Black but many assorted colors.

https://www.runningwarehouse.com/HOKA_Bondi_8/descpage-HOB8M07.html

Yeah Bondis  do take some getting used to because all that foam puts you up in the air, and their rocker design kind of makes me fall forward if I'm standing for awhile. They are designed for movement, but the rocker is (for me) an important component because it keeps me from pulling on my plantar.

 

I've been on Bondis (and their sister trail shoe Stinsons) for at least five years now. I bought a pair of Brooks Calderas on sale a couple of years back - another maximum cushion shoe - and loved them at first because they are more nimble and lower to the ground. But after my first big trail hike with them, my plantar flared up big time. I had to deal with it that entire summer. So lesson learned on my part.

 

Edit: Another recommendation for Running Warehouse. Fast shipment, and their return policy is aces. 

[Ed A.]

My podiatrist recommended Hokas and I’m glad I got them even though they’re the most expensive shoes I’ve ever bought. He also recommended a Theragun Mini for my plantar fasciitis that also really helps.

 

https://www.therabody.com/us/en-us/mini-blk-us.html

[o0Ampy0o]

I find cushiony mats work against me. They may be soft on the bottoms of your feet but they cause my muscles to flex and work harder. This even goes up into my back.  I’d rather stand on concrete. It feels more efficient. In my experience standing as much as 10-11 hours 4 days a week finding the right shoes is the best way to go. Like many things it is subjective and depends on your body. 
 

Looking at potential recommendations I suspect the models which have a protruding heel would be problematic for an activity pivoting on the heel, even driving. I have to adjust the car seat when wearing some shoes and I am not speaking of heeled shoes which I never wear.

 

I have tried ECCO shoes. Initially they were great. I bought 4 pair to rotate. Then after a 3 month break I could no longer wear them. They were uncomfortable and also seemed too heavy. My calves were killing me.

[EscapeRocks]

In my travels thru hardware store years ago I stumbled upon the Craftsman anti-fatigue mat.

 

On gigs where I'm standing and not using the piano shell, it has really made a difference.   Another thing I find interesting.   When I wear my old cowboy boots my back and legs feel good at the end of the night.  Perhaps it's the raised heel.

No amount of shoes with built in foam/gel or Dr Scholls inserts eve made a difference.

Now with my mat and boots for standing gigs, I'm fine

 

 

[EricBarker]

48 minutes ago, EscapeRocks said:

On gigs where I'm standing and not using the piano shell, it has really made a difference.   Another thing I find interesting.   When I wear my old cowboy boots my back and legs feel good at the end of the night.  Perhaps it's the raised heel.

Maybe I need to invest in some nice cherry red pumps for my glam rock band. 🤣 all kidding aside, one of the greatest bass players I’ve ever heard is a local guy, literally a lumberjack by trade, commonly walks on stage in 4in platform heals.

[o0Ampy0o]

To clarify, when I spoke of shoes with protruding heels I mean parallel to the floor as in the sole atypically extending quite a bit backwards past the vertical plumb line of the heel as opposed to boot heels. In many cases boot heels are tapering forward perhaps facilitating a heel pivot. That is not what I was referring to.