Piano action midi controllers for studio?

[Tusker]

Looking for something that doesn’t need to be moved frequently but has a very pianistic action and also have studio friendly pedal-inputs, sliders and knobs. Ideally would have transport control too.

 

Is there such a thing?

[Justin Havu]

What's your budget?  Also, how picky are you about the keybed itself?

 

Three that come to mind right away would be:

 

Arturia Keylab 88 MkII - $999 USD

NI Komplete Kontrol S88 Mk2 - $999 USD

M-Audio Hammer 88 Pro - $799 USD

 

[Stokely]

Keep in mind that if you find something with great action but lacking great controls, you can always get a separate controller unit.  I have a korg nanokontrol and it's a bit small for my liking, but I'm sure there are others out there.

[AnotherScott]

Kind of combining the ideas in the two previous posts, the Studiologic SL88 Grand has a higher end Fatar action than the ones I believe are in the Arturi and NI, and while it doesn't have a control surface, they have the optional Mixface accessory which is designed to be easily placed and cosmetically matched on the SL. If you need more pedal control, you can also look into the audiofront adapters.

 

Another possibility could be the Roland A-88 MKII.

 

If you can keep the controls surface issue separate, by reputation, one of the best actions would be the Kawai VPC1.

[Tusker]

43 minutes ago, justin_havu said:

What's your budget?  Also, how picky are you about the keybed itself?

 

Scanning at the 2-3k range and eyeing a Kawaii VPC. But wouldn’t it be great if it had a ton of controllers?

[Stokely]

For that price range, you might also consider getting a simpler great action weighted board and a smaller keyboard with controls   Just putting it out there, because I noticed proaudiostar had a couple arturia keylab mark IIs on sale (less than 300 for the 49 key I believe.)  Then you'd have something to play synths/organ on a bit easier.  That's of course if you need that, and if you had space

I happen to really like the tp-40 type actions that I think was mentioned by AnotherScott above--mainly because I used a Studiologic sl990pro for decades so I got very used to it.  I'm not sure it's considered a "high end" action or not but I do like it.

[Jose EB5AGV]

8 minutes ago, Tusker said:

Scanning at the 2-3k range and eyeing a Kawaii VPC. But wouldn’t it be great if it had a ton of controllers?

 

I have a VPC1 and fully recommend it. My setup includes several items over it (the slightly curved surface is not a problem with some ingenuity, can elaborate if needed) and the good thing is that you can customize what you add to it and evolve over time (this is what I have done). If interested, can post some pictures.

 

Jose

 

[SteveNathan]

Arturia Keylab?

Do folks here like that action?

[drawback]

1 minute ago, SteveNathan said:

Arturia Keylab?

Do folks here like that action?

No! 

[CEB]

There isn’t any.  You can roll the dice and hopefully find something clean and pristine like a Peavey DPM C8 for very little money.  Most were studio pieces due to their weight.  … if 8 zones are enough. 
 

Maybe a Roland A-80 but they have some maintenance issues. But the market for real controllers with proper pedal I/O is dead. 

[SteveNathan]

1 minute ago, CEB said:

There isn’t any.  You can roll the dice and hopefully find something clean and pristine like a Peavey DPM C8 for very little money.  Most were studio pieces any due to their weight. 

I used Peaveys for years & loved the action at the time, but I didn’t have to lift them. I also had an Elka MKII that was awesome. Now I keep a CME UF80 in one space & use my Casio in the other. All except the Casio are hard to come by, but I’d recommend you get the best action you can & if you need more controllers, add a small second unit.  I still keep a cheap M-Audio something or other above the CME, ‘cause sometimes it’s just easier to grab a knob or slider on it. 

[AnotherScott]

If you can find one, a Viscount Physis K4 could be another option. Great MIDI controller capabilities, and one of the higher end Fatar actions.

[Justin Havu]

I was thinking about all-in-one solutions, but I agree--the action in the Arturia is horrible.  If it's a studio piece, than a VPC1 paired with a control surface might be the way to go.  Or grab a Keylab 49 or 61 if you don't mind having an additional synth action keyboard with plenty of control options.

 

[Mighty Motif Max]

Check out this old thread I had, if you haven’t already. Specifically this comment has some info on ways to get all sorts of controller capabilities when paired with virtually any keyboard, meaning you could use a VPC1 and still have all the capabilities you wanted. The only catch would be an expression pedal input if using the VPC, but there’s a midi expression box for that as well if that’s a need.

 

Me personally, I might go with options 5 or 6 from the linked thread, if the piano-playing experience was a priority. However, like I said, the beauty of this is that you could use pretty much any base keyboard for this and use the listed accessories to get what you needed.

 

 

[stoken6]

My suggestion: consider the action and the controllers separately. That filters away all the products designed for "bedroom DJs", and lets you focus on products for players. My first choice (based on @Al Quinn's recent post in another thread) is a Yamaha P515, with a separate control surface for sliders knobs and transport

 

My second choice would be a Yamaha YC88 - do the drawbars and controllers transmit over MIDI?

 

Cheers, Mike.

[Paul Woodward]

I have seen the KORG D1 going used for as little as £200 and that's a full 88 RH3 keybed same as the Grandstage and Kronos. It's only got midi but adaptors are cheap enough. 

[Motif88]

Hello?…RD-2000 has a much better action and plenty of controls than most mentioned here.

[RABid]

Roland Fantom 8 is a great controller for MainStage and Logic.

[drawback]

1 hour ago, Paul Woodward said:

I have seen the KORG D1 going used for as little as £200 and that's a full 88 RH3 keybed same as the Grandstage and Kronos. It's only got midi but adaptors are cheap enough. 

Another (probably the only other 😆) fan of the Korg RH3. I think the D1 would make an excellent controller feel-wise, but too many workarounds are needed for full-featured. 

[Paul Woodward]

I have a Grandstage and love the action 😃

[Tusker]

18 hours ago, CEB said:

There isn’t any.  You can roll the dice and hopefully find something clean and pristine like a Peavey DPM C8 for very little money.  Most were studio pieces due to their weight.  … if 8 zones are enough. 
 

Maybe a Roland A-80 but they have some maintenance issues. But the market for real controllers with proper pedal I/O is dead. 

 

 

Right. Good to have that settled. 👍

 

So now it's just a matter of finding an action I like. I'll need to add a Mackie/Logic compliant controller like the Mixface AnotherScott mentioned. I'd need to position Touche and a trackpad for midi control. I might need a new desk and chair to get the heights right.

 

I am mostly trying to establish a rapid workflow, where with two hands I can play something then immediately lift my eyes to the screen and do some edits. Then play something more. Rinse repeat.

 

Thanks guys. I'll look around.

[Tusker]

19 hours ago, EB5AGV said:

 

I have a VPC1 and fully recommend it. My setup includes several items over it (the slightly curved surface is not a problem with some ingenuity, can elaborate if needed) and the good thing is that you can customize what you add to it and evolve over time (this is what I have done).

 

 

I had wondered if this was a possibility and am so happy to hear you mention it. Would you please elaborate?

 

19 hours ago, EB5AGV said:

If interested, can post some pictures.

 

I would love to see the pictures. 👍

 

[Adam Burgess]

21 hours ago, SteveNathan said:

Arturia Keylab?

Do folks here like that action?

 

 

No. I bought a 61 and an 88 a while ago. The 88 sees little playing! Just can’t get used to it! 

[DeltaJockey]

23 hours ago, drawback said:

Another (probably the only other 😆) fan of the Korg RH3. I think the D1 would make an excellent controller feel-wise, but too many workarounds are needed for full-featured. 

I have a D1 as a kind of backup. I bought it for the action. The MIDI interface is not a work around for me, as I have no problem using the DIN's on my USB audio interface.

Though it doesn't have mod wheels, (a stage PIANO in the true sense), I have a small external controller attached, so those external controllers again, not an issue for me.

The only problem I have with the D1, is that it only has attack velocity, no release, and of course no AT. It is only 2 sensor, but IMHO Korg do a pretty good job of getting sensitive responses out of it's RH3.

 

It is a dilemma trying to get a full controller with a really decent action. In my studio though, I use the MP11SE, as again, action is the priority over everything else.

It has the ability to externalise it's pots to the DAW, but other than mod wheels, I tend to be an onscreen tweaker, so controllers are less of an issue for me.

 

(I get overwhelmed when there are too many parallel choices for control)!

 

Surprisingly to me, the MP11SE being my choice for piano, because of it's action, the response works really well for other sounds, normally needing a synth keybed.

[skipeb3]

You might do a YouTube search for John Mike. He's a player/producer that does very informative reviews of MIDI controllers.

[Motif88]

On 11/21/2022 at 4:32 PM, RABid said:

Roland Fantom 8 is a great controller for MainStage and Logic.

Agreed…I dropped the workstation format after many years for software and Logic. If I were to go back, the Fantom8 or 08 are at the top of the list

[Motif88]

need to update my sig to include - 

 

Using: Roland RD-2000, Mac Studio, Studio Display, Logic Pro, Arturia:V Collection 9/Cherry Audio:GX-80,Dreamsynth,Polymode,Quadra,Sines/MemoryMoon/G-Force: OB-E, Oddity3, SEM/VPS Avenger/Korg:MS20,Triton/Native Instruments:Komplete 14/Roland Cloud Pro/Spectrasonics:Keyscape,Omnisphere/uhe:Diva,Hive,Zebra2/UVIWorkstation

 

Sold: Korg:Kronos 88,T3,MS20, Yamaha: Motif XS8, Motif ES8, Motif 8, KX88, TX802, Oberheim: Modular 8 Voice, OBXa, OB8, Prophet 5, Roland D50, Dyno-My-Rhodes, Crumar T2

[D. Gauss]

i bought  a used yamaha k88 for 100 bucks at sam ash...

[Jose EB5AGV]

On 11/22/2022 at 11:57 AM, Tusker said:

 

I had wondered if this was a possibility and am so happy to hear you mention it. Would you please elaborate?

 

 

I would love to see the pictures. 👍

 

 

@TuskerSorry for delay, the daily work has taken all the time this week 😢

 

Here you can see a general view of my Kawai VPC1 setup as is now. I have modified it several times, but this one is OK for me right now (note the speakers setup is an A/B comparison one and will probably be modified soon, leaving only the Adam AX7😞

 

 

This is a detail of the left side items, an iCON PLATFORM-M and an Steinberg CC-121 (an sturdy Cubase specific controller):

 

 

Then to the right an ElGato Stream Deck XL and a Mackie Big Knob Studio:

 

 

As you can see, there is plenty of space over the VPC1. And these items have just added some extra rear rubber bumpers. I hope you can see one here:

 

 

So, just adding some height on the rear side, using rubber bumpers, to any accessory you put over the VPC1, the curved surface is not a problem anymore.

 

Just for completeness, this is the real aspect with the top lighting off, which is how I use to have that setup. The other pictures needed more light!

 

 

Hope this helps!

 

Jose

[Steve Nathan]

Curious why no one seems to talk about the Studiologic SL88 Grand.  I don't think it has much in the way of controllers either, but the Fatar action appears to have many fans.  Am I missing something bad about it?