Can Motion Sound KP series "compete" with loud drums and guitar amps?

[CharlieLosGatos]

Has anyone tried the 610S versus the 408 side by side?  I am playing in jazz combos almost all AP, some Rhodes, always a bass player and drummer, often outside but never at rock volumes.   I see there is only 3 lbs difference between the boxes but I think it will be easier to transport the smaller amp.  What matters to me is that the piano sounds good without the boxiness that is so hard to get rid off, but I don't think necessarily larger speakers will sound better. 

[AnotherScott]

6 hours ago, CharlieLosGatos said:

Has anyone tried the 610S versus the 408 side by side?...What matters to me is that the piano sounds good without the boxiness that is so hard to get rid off

I thought piano sounded pretty good (and not boxy) through the 408. I can't speak to whether the 610 is any better for piano, but I would not consider piano to be a problem with the 408.

[ABECK]

I decided to go with the KP612s.  Definitely a bit bigger than I anticipated, but seems easy enough to carry.   So far I'm very happy with what I'm hearing.  Hammond and Rhodes are of course excellent, but I was really impressed with strings and synth.  Those have always been a struggle in the past.  The expand feature is awesome, but I've found you definitely need to back off on reverb when using it.  The other pleasant surprise, it sounds amazing on electric guitar!   I'm running a line 6 HX Stomp in direct mode (as if I were going into a FRFF system) and it is killer!!!

I was a little confused too see ports on the back, as I thought this model was changed to a front facing port.  Perhaps they changed the design, but the pics on sweetwater show a closed back.

Anywho, looking forward to my next gig in a few weeks to see how it holds up in the mix with a loud band.  

 

[stoken6]

6 minutes ago, ABECK said:

I decided to go with the KP612s.  Definitely a bit bigger than I anticipated, but seems easy enough to carry.   So far I'm very happy with what I'm hearing.  Hammond and Rhodes are of course excellent, but I was really impressed with strings and synth.  Those have always been a struggle in the past.  The expand feature is awesome, but I've found you definitely need to back off on reverb when using it.  The other pleasant surprise, it sounds amazing on electric guitar!   I'm running a line 6 HX Stomp in direct mode (as if I were going into a FRFF system) and it is killer!!!

I was a little confused too see ports on the back, as I thought this model was changed to a front facing port.  Perhaps they changed the design, but the pics on sweetwater show a closed back.

Anywho, looking forward to my next gig in a few weeks to see how it holds up in the mix with a loud band.  

 

Nice, it does look quite the beast! I'm not in the market, but I think the 408 would be more in my comfort zone.

 

Good luck.

 

Cheers, Mike.

[jpgxk3]

Nice, I put my 500 on an amp stand with loud bands, just a suggestion. 

[ABECK]

4 minutes ago, jpgxk3 said:

Nice, I put my 500 on an amp stand with loud bands, just a suggestion. 

How high is it?  Seems like many amp stands are only a foot or so off the ground, but tilted.  I was thinking a simple milk crate, or maybe making something myself out of wood.

[drawback]

2 hours ago, ABECK said:

How high is it?  Seems like many amp stands are only a foot or so off the ground, but tilted.  I was thinking a simple milk crate, or maybe making something myself out of wood.

You could use this as a hand cart and platform for your amp, stow your cords & pedals in the crate, or just fold it up if you don’t need that feature.

 

https://www.staples.com/bazic-17-72-h-x-17-24-w-assorted-materials-folding-cart-on-wheels-with-lid-cover-gray-black-baz2196/product_24424251

 

[Delaware Dave]

6 hours ago, ABECK said:

How high is it?  Seems like many amp stands are only a foot or so off the ground, but tilted.  I was thinking a simple milk crate, or maybe making something myself out of wood.

 

Funny you mentioned this, I use a milk crate.  I noticed my wife bought this for our 3 year old granddaughter.  She puts it up so that she can reach the bathroom sink.  It folds up to 1" thick and actually fits in my monitor case.  The monitor sits nicely on it and raises it 9 inches off the ground (the milkcrate I use raises it 11 inches off the ground);  it hold 300 pounds.  I'm going to try it at my next gig this Friday:    https://www.amazon.com/Totally-Living-Lightweight-Anti-Skid-Collapsible/dp/B088BC1S59

[ABECK]

That's a nice option.  Price is right too!

 

[drawback]

1 hour ago, Delaware Dave said:

 

Funny you mentioned this, I use a milk crate.  I noticed my wife bought this for our 3 year old granddaughter.  She puts it up so that she can reach the bathroom sink.  It folds up to 1" thick and actually fits in my monitor case.  The monitor sits nicely on it and raises it 9 inches off the ground (the milkcrate I use raises it 11 inches off the ground);  it hold 300 pounds.  I'm going to try it at my next gig this Friday:    https://www.amazon.com/Totally-Living-Lightweight-Anti-Skid-Collapsible/dp/B088BC1S59

 

IIRC Reezekeys uses these for his QSC speakers.

 

Just realized my suggestion couldn't work because of the depth of the Motion Sound amp, and the amp is too front-heavy.

[jpgxk3]

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/AmpStd--on-stage-stands-rs7000-tiltback-amp-stand    I went with this; got a deal on it a couple years back. 

[zxcvbnm098]

Although I purchased it a few months ago, I finally reconfigured our rehearsal space and brought in my MS 610 last night for band practice. Super pleased with the clarity on everything (AP's, strings, Hammond), and loving the punch and volume. Two guitar band with each guitar player using combo tube amps (Vox and Marshall) and bass player with Ashdown head and Ampeg cabs in a small space, so although everyone is respectful we do tend to get loud. No problems keeping up and plenty of headroom to spare. The others were complimentary on how good the keys (Nord E5, Kurz Artis 7) sounded. 

 

We're opening for a national act early next month so that will be my first stage experience. Really looking forward to it, and will probably pick up that taller amp stand...

 

I should also mention that the amp, although listed at 43 lbs., is deceptively compact and decently ergonomic to carry. 

[ABECK]

I found a Pro Line amp stand that works really well.  It has multiple height options, without too much of a tilt angle.

As for the amp - after the first gig, I can say I've never heard myself better.  And the sound quality was excellent.  Very happy with this decision 

[Calumet]

As everyone else in this thread has said, the Motion Sound amps finally allow us to not only be heard on stage, but to be heard in full range stereo, all out of one cabinet. 
 

I have played through all of the models. I think the 408 is a good amp if you really don’t need a bunch of bass response. However, I’d go with the 610 instead just for the extra punch when needed. (I actually use the 612 because I play organ and pedals. I’ve never needed a sub with that amp. Plenty of bass for an organ trio situation.)

[dazzjazz]

2 hours ago, ABECK said:

I found a Pro Line amp stand that works really well.  It has multiple height options, without too much of a tilt angle.

As for the amp - after the first gig, I can say I've never heard myself better.  And the sound quality was excellent.  Very happy with this decision 

ABECK what is the amp like with acoustic piano please? And what are the ergonomics like? Easy to carry or do you need a trolley?

[BluesB3]

On 9/12/2022 at 2:22 PM, Delaware Dave said:

 

Funny you mentioned this, I use a milk crate.  I noticed my wife bought this for our 3 year old granddaughter.  She puts it up so that she can reach the bathroom sink.  It folds up to 1" thick and actually fits in my monitor case.  The monitor sits nicely on it and raises it 9 inches off the ground (the milkcrate I use raises it 11 inches off the ground);  it hold 300 pounds.  I'm going to try it at my next gig this Friday:    https://www.amazon.com/Totally-Living-Lightweight-Anti-Skid-Collapsible/dp/B088BC1S59

I have two of these. One in the pantry to reach high shelves and one in the Chevy 3500 hd 4wd dually to check the oil and add DEF. Very handy and folds flat.

[ABECK]

On 9/24/2022 at 6:51 PM, dazzjazz said:

ABECK what is the amp like with acoustic piano please? And what are the ergonomics like? Easy to carry or do you need a trolley?

Unfortunately there were no songs with AP at this gig, but from what I've heard at home, the response is pleasantly even.  I didn't like how the expand feature sounds with reverb on the piano sound, but dry, or minimal verb sounded best.

I didn't require a trolley.  In fact, even though I installed the casters, i just carried it into the gig without needing to roll it.  I wouldn't want anything heavier, but it was not bad loading in and out of the car.  There's a handle on top, and on the sides, so there are a few options for carrying.  Definitely didn't need any assistance.

[Brad Kaenel]

Rare for me: I got to sit and listen to my own gear for several hours, from audience distance and perspective.  I was attending a conference, and the hired keyboardist was using my rig.  Solo piano, only -- StudioLogic Numa X Piano 73 (Japanese Grand) into Motion Sound KP-610S amp; nothing else in the signal chain.

 

Wow; those two pieces of kit sounded great  together.  Full-bodied, undistorted, focused projection from the amp, at high-volume (and the dude was bangin' hard; "hey, easy on my gear, man!" )  AP resonance, velocity, dynamics -- all top-drawer.

 

Afterwards, the fellow told me he had never played the TP-110 action, but liked it very much (after 20 minutes or so of acclimation), and was very pleased with the overall UX of the gear.  Also impressed with the build and portability of the Numa X 73.

 

Me: Ditto, ditto. 

[Mitch Towne]

I used my CP88 with my MS-612 last week, playing mostly piano sounds and it sounded fantastic. Not at all harsh. It’s a fantastic amp for piano sounds. 
 

(Full disclosure - I’m an endorsing artist for Motion Sound. But I’m also someone who wants to sound as good as possible on stage.)

[DanL]

After years of carting 2 PA speakers around, I wanted a smaller solution, and pulled the trigger on the 610 this week. It'll be here today. I mostly use IEM's, but there are gigs where they are not an option- either not everything is in the PA, or the venue doesn't have a wifi connection into the board to allow me to adjust my own mix.

 

I've been using a pair of EV ELX112p. One of them is starting to flake out on me, so I figured this was a good time to downsize to a single amp. It'll sit right on top of my Leslie when I bring that out too. 

 

Looking forward to testing it out today when it arrives!  

[ElmerJFudd]

2 hours ago, DanL said:

After years of carting 2 PA speakers around, I wanted a smaller solution, and pulled the trigger on the 610 this week. It'll be here today. I mostly use IEM's, but there are gigs where they are not an option- either not everything is in the PA, or the venue doesn't have a wifi connection into the board to allow me to adjust my own mix.

 

I've been using a pair of EV ELX112p. One of them is starting to flake out on me, so I figured this was a good time to downsize to a single amp. It'll sit right on top of my Leslie when I bring that out too. 

 

Looking forward to testing it out today when it arrives!  

Let us know what you think - especially on piano.  I’m inclined to go 610 - not significantly heavier/bulkier than the 408 and the extra umph from the amp and speaker size may come in handy. 

[MathOfInsects]

7 hours ago, ElmerJFudd said:

Let us know what you think - especially on piano.  I’m inclined to go 610 - not significantly heavier/bulkier than the 408 and the extra umph from the amp and speaker size may come in handy. 

For the minor difference in size I wouldn't even consider the 408, for a live-gigging context. The 610S is quite compact--much smaller than the pictures make it seem.

[zxcvbnm098]

49 minutes ago, MaskOfInsects said:

For the minor difference in size I wouldn't even consider the 408, for a live-gigging context. The 610S is quite compact--much smaller than the pictures make it seem.

I would concur. To put it in perspective, the 610 is very close (almost exactly) in size and weight to a Fender Deluxe Reverb guitar amp. 

[DanL]

21 hours ago, ElmerJFudd said:

Let us know what you think - especially on piano.  I’m inclined to go 610 - not significantly heavier/bulkier than the 408 and the extra umph from the amp and speaker size may come in handy. 

In my living room it sounds good. There is definitely a warmer sound than the ELX's. I should bring them inside and A/B them. But so far, the 610 is what I expected. It gets pretty loud and has decent bottom end. Unfortunately I don't have a gig til the 20th, at a blues jam, but that'll be good test for it. It's the kind of gig I got the amp for- no PA, just stage volume in a room that holds maybe 100 people. 

 

[Legatoboy]

I like them but they are not perfect sonically but having played in louder bands, for stage volume and beyond... I would have to say - Yes! 

Last go round I used a KP-500sn with a 12 " Berhinger sub ... synth heavy project....  

[ElmerJFudd]

28 minutes ago, Legatoboy said:

I like them but they are not perfect sonically but having played in louder bands, for stage volume and beyond... I would have to say - Yes! 

Last go round I used a KP-500sn with a 12 " Berhinger sub ... synth heavy project....  

thanks.  I’m mainly interested in stereo image without carrying two pa speakers and pole-ing/stand-ing the pair.    For solo piano or piano accompanist with singer or in duo/trio situations with sax, violin, etc.  no PA system. Replaces acoustic piano.  If mic’ing something, I’ll mix it into the 610S.  The amp goes on a single amp stand about 6” off the floor tilted up.    That’s the plan anyway.  
 

I’ve been using a single speaker with just R or L+R output from stereo or mono sample sets (there are vastly more stereo sample sets to choose from).  with band is of secondary concern. monitoring in that situation is mainly just to hear what I’m doing as everything sounds vastly different FOH anyway.  
 

- I’m with Dave on this topic.  Yamaha and Kawai are using multi speaker setups tuned to a specific and short list of sample sets on their hybrid pianos like the Avant Grand and Novus.  I know a KPS610S isn’t going to be as immersive as an acoustic or a 7.1 speaker system.  For me it just has to be an improvement over a single PA speaker with L+R output from the digital piano.