Lightweight stage piano - RD88, MODX8 or SP6/PC4

[AnotherScott]

Love the action on the Yamaha CP88 though. Nice weighted swing and fast. Very piano-like.

That's one I haven't played yet. That and the CP73 and the P515 are ones I'd like to get my fingers on.

[dickiefunk]

I've been listening to lots of online demos of all the recommendations and from what I can tell I think I prefer the sound of the Ravenscroft 275 app?

[allan_evett]

I've been listening to lots of online demos of all the recommendations and from what I can tell I think I prefer the sound of the Ravenscroft 275 app?

 

 

Ravenscroft 275 is my go-to piano for home studio. I also have the iOS app, and have played it from the RD-88. Connecting the 1/8" out from my iPad Air 2 to the RD-88's 1/8" audio input works fine and sounds good. That could be a great option for you.

[dickiefunk]

Yes I"m would like to try the RD88 when possible again as I am keen to audition all the sounds myself and hear how editable they are. There are certain things I really like about the built in piano sound on the RD and some things I really don"t like! My main issues with the piano sound is the middle couple of octaves sound quite boxy and the highest velocity layers sound very harsh. This may well be possible to improve with tweaking. Also, I"ve only heard one of the Rhodes sound examples and this was voiced with a lot of bark and sounded thin but there could well be some more mellow ones. As these are not samples but modelled using Rolands Supernatural engine it might be possible to edit how the Rhodes and Acoustic Pianos are voiced?

The best Rhodes sound that I"ve played is the Pianoteq Rhodes in their Electric Piano add on. This is a really outstanding sound and in my opinion sounds and plays better than all the large Rhodes sample libraries I"ve tried at my studio. If the acoustic piano, Rhodes and clavinets offer some of the voicing tweak ability that Pianoteq offers, it would be very interesting to really hear what the RD88 is capable of.

[Fleer]

Yeah, those Pianoteq electric pianos are pretty, pretty good.

[Docbop]

Anderton's Jack did a video on stage pianos today.....

 

[video:youtube]

[dickiefunk]

Yes I saw this yesterday. The YC88 would be a strong temptation if it wasn"t for the weight and price! I"m really enjoying the YC61 a lot.

Really I need something lighter than my RD300gx though!

[stoken6]

Yes I saw this yesterday. The YC88 would be a strong temptation if it wasn"t for the weight and price! I"m really enjoying the YC61 a lot.

Really I need something lighter than my RD300gx though!

YC73 is a lighter hammer-action (13kg/29lb), and cheaper, if you can manage the restricted compass. (It has the same action as CP73, YC88 has the premium wooden CP88 action).

 

Cheers, Mike.

[dickiefunk]

I have considered the YC73 but really need 88.

[dickiefunk]

I've been reading the manual for the RD88 and there doesn't appear to be a lot of options for editing the piano sound apart from EQ and velocity!? My old RD300 GX has the Roland Piano Designer feature which allows you to edit the piano sound a lot! On the RD300 GX you can edit :-

 

- Opening / Closing the piano lid

- Damper Noise

- Adjusting the Resonance of the Aliquot Strings (Duplex Scale)

- Adjusting the Resonant Sounds when the Keys are Pressed (String Resonance)

- Adjusting the String Resonance Produced when a Key is Released (Key Off Reso.)

- Adjusting the Sound of the Hammer Strike (Hammer Noise)

 

I was hoping for something similar for the RD88 but can't find anything like this in the manual!?

 

Listening to the examples of the RD88 I think I actually prefer the samples used in the RD300 GX to the Supernatural engine used in the newer Roland pianos!

[stoken6]

I have considered the YC73 but really need 88.

Get a cheap slab piano or controller and throw the YC61 on top?

 

Cheers, Mike.

[dickiefunk]

One keyboard that I hadn"t considered is the Dexibell S7 Pro M. I"ve had a very quick listen to the demos and it sounds quite good. The pianos sound better than the RD88 along with some of the other voices. It has built in speakers and is slightly lighter than my RD300GX (though still heavier than I"d ideally like). There are also additional downloadable voices available from their website. I"m remember playing one of the first keyboards dexibell made a few years ago and remember being quite impressed with some aspects of the instrument and less convinced about other aspects.

A few things I don"t like about it are -

 

1: The appearance

2: No audio interface

3: No knobs/sliders for adjusting the levels of different sound layers

[dickiefunk]

Im still quite keen to hear the RD88 personally as it still ticks a lot of boxes. I noticed in the manual that you can adjust the maximum and minimum velocity"s so I"m wondering if I could take away the highest spikey velocity layers to key the sound smoother when playing fortissimo? Also, I could potentially notch out the boxiness of the middle couple of octaves with the built in EQ. One thing I did read one review is Roland still have noticeable volume jumps between some of the voices (most notably between acoustic and Rhodes pianos). I would have thought they would have sorted this out over the past 10+ years!?

 

As none of the keyboards in this thread really tick all the boxes for what I"m looking for I"m going to need to compromise somewhere.

The things that matter most are :-

 

- Size and weight

- Feel of keybed

- Piano, Pads, E.Pianos, Clavinet, Strings plus a wide range of other voices for functions

 

The RD88 ticks the first box. Also, I"m really used to the action of my RD300GX and prefer it over many stage pianos I"ve played. If I like the keybed of the RD88 as much as my RD300GX then that could potentially be another tick. Regarding the voices, I could use the Ravenscroft 275 piano app which is arguably better than the piano samples from any of the keyboards mentioned in this thread!? So it really comes down to the extra voices.

For the majority of the time I will just be using this piano by itself for just Acoustic Piano, Pads and Rhodes. I already have the Ravenscroft for acoustic piano and I heard a demo of some of the Rhodes patches and I heard one that I prefer to the sound I"m using from the RD300GX. I haven"t heard much in the way of pads from the RD88 so can"t really comment on those.

When it comes to function gigs I will be bringing the YC61 as well. This keyboard has some wonderful voices on it. Obviously the Hammond sound is on a completely different level. But, pretty much ALL the other voices are also on a different level to my RD300GX! For the majority of my function gigs the YC61 covers all the regular sounds I need. There is the odd occasions where I need a more obscure voice which I"ve always been able to find on my RD300GX. The RD88 has 3000 voices so I"d be very surprised if I couldn"t find them on that!?

 

I will try to check out the RD88 at some point to hear how it compares to my RD300GX.

[pawelsz]

You will probably not be pleased with Dexibell S7 Pro M action. They use Fatar TP40GH on S7 Pro but in S7 Pro M they use Fatar TP100(LR) just like in S3 Pro, which is inferior action with short pivot.

 

When I read what you need you seem to need workstation.

[ewall08530]

One keyboard that I hadn"t considered is the Dexibell S7 Pro M. I"ve had a very quick listen to the demos and it sounds quite good. The pianos sound better than the RD88 along with some of the other voices. It has built in speakers and is slightly lighter than my RD300GX (though still heavier than I"d ideally like). There are also additional downloadable voices available from their website. I"m remember playing one of the first keyboards dexibell made a few years ago and remember being quite impressed with some aspects of the instrument and less convinced about other aspects.

A few things I don"t like about it are -

 

1: The appearance

2: No audio interface

3: No knobs/sliders for adjusting the levels of different sound layers

 

I too owned an RD 300GX and was interested in the RD88 but turned off by the reports of short decay on the pianos as well as not impressed with some of the additional sounds.

I decided to order and try pairing the Dexibell V7 module and play it from my Casio PX S3000. So far I"m happy. The velocity setting adjustments on the module are deep and while it can be edited and controlled from the front panel without much frustration it works easily with the Dexibell iOS app.

I"m very pleased with the stock sounds. On the Casio I missed not having a decent Upright piano or Wurly EP sound and the Dexibell is a step up. There is also the ability to load the Platinum Pianos to take advantage of the best Acoustic Pianos from Dexibell.

The true test comes in a few months when I"m able to do outside gigs again.

[aellison62]

Dickiefunk, if you are gonna use Ravenscroft Piano with the RD88 than I would expect you to really be happy with everything else the RD88 will give you as far as ticking the other boxes. The Rhodes is not bad at all but I can say the Wurlie sucks on the RD88. Other than that, everything else is quite nice as far as additional sounds and you have TONS to choose from.

[AnotherScott]

One keyboard that I hadn"t considered is the Dexibell S7 Pro M...I"m remember playing one of the first keyboards dexibell made a few years ago and remember being quite impressed with some aspects of the instrument and less convinced about other aspects.

A few things I don"t like about it are -

 

1: The appearance

2: No audio interface

I'm pretty sure all the current Dexibells run the update that let them receive audio over USB... however on the model I tried, there was more latency than when using the line input. But it's not impossible that that could have had something to do with the particular app/settings on the iPad.

 

You will probably not be pleased with Dexibell S7 Pro M action. They use Fatar TP40GH on S7 Pro but in S7 Pro M they use Fatar TP100(LR) j

Boards with TP100s do vary in feel, While I still wouldn't call it one of my favorite actions, the TP100 I played in a Dexibel P3 felt much better than others I've played. It's possible that the dexibell dickiefunk played years ago might have had that action as well, so depending on what model he played, he might already have gotten a sense of its playability.

 

As none of the keyboards in this thread really tick all the boxes for what I"m looking for I"m going to need to compromise somewhere.

The things that matter most are :-

 

- Size and weight

- Feel of keybed

- Piano, Pads, E.Pianos, Clavinet, Strings plus a wide range of other voices for functions

...

Regarding the voices, I could use the Ravenscroft 275 piano app which is arguably better than the piano samples from any of the keyboards mentioned in this thread!? So it really comes down to the extra voices.

If you're considering using Ravenscroft for your piano sound, then you can also use apps for any of the other extra voices that you may find inadequate in whatever board you get, no?

 

For the "size and weight" and "feel of keybed" criteria, I end up right back at the Casios I mentioned earlier. 24 lbs for the PX5S, and good MIDI functionality, including the ability to call up and switch among any combination of internal and external sounds from the board's own conveniently located patch select buttons. You can hear some of its EPs in my comparison at https://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/3078353/re-scotts-big-rhodes-test-1 - I think they're better than any of the Roland EPs I've heard. That link happnes to only have Rhodes, but it has nice Wurli, too.

[pawelsz]

The Rhodes is not bad at all but I can say the Wurlie sucks on the RD88. Other than that, everything else is quite nice as far as additional sounds and you have TONS to choose from.

 

Wurlie sucks on Roland boards, generally. OTOH Yamaha is excellent in emulating Wurlie.

[allan_evett]

Dickiefunk, if you are gonna use Ravenscroft Piano with the RD88 than I would expect you to really be happy with everything else the RD88 will give you as far as ticking the other boxes. The Rhodes is not bad at all but I can say the Wurlie sucks on the RD88. Other than that, everything else is quite nice as far as additional sounds and you have TONS to choose from.

 

 

I agree with this. The RD-88 is a very capable 3-zone controller, and would work well with externally controlled piano models/samples. And beyond its own pianos - of which I agree that the Wurlies are rough, and Rhodes better - the additional sound library is extensive: it's essentially the Z-Core Tone set from the Fantom. I've already set up several 3-Tone synth/sample-based Scenes in the RD-88; those types of combinations can be quite complex and massive when needed (considering that each Z-core Tone can have up to four partials active). The sound quality and clarity are first-rate. The only area lacking is a fully editable drawbar-style interface for TW organ Tones. But if the second keyboard in use is a YC-61, that becomes a moot point. I've set up a couple of splits/layers using TW organ Tones; with one of the rotary speaker effects Zone-assigned; the organ part is more than usable for a single-keyboard gig.

[dickiefunk]

I've been doing a little but more research before I'm able to go and try out a few of these. One thing I've noticed is that Yamaha make a softcase with wheels which weighs around 8-9kg less than my current Gator case I have for my RD300GX!

 

https://uk.yamaha.com/en/products/music_production/accessories/sc-cp88/index.html#product-tabs

 

This has me a lot more tempted by both the MODX8 and CP88 (despite the CP88 weighing 2kg more than my current RD!). If I went with the CP88 or MODX 8 and the matching Yamaha case I could save between 7-12kg in weight to what I'm already carrying around with me on gigs!

 

I will be interested to see how the keybed between the MODX8 and CP88 compare! Also, the build quality of the CP88 seems to be more solid having a metal case compared the plastic on the MODX. I already own the YC61 which I love and the hands on workflow is excellent! However, the MODX has a built in audio interface which would make it more future proof. It also weighs over 5kg less. I've also seen there are some quite good soundpacks you can buy and install on the MODX. This acoustic piano library sounds pretty good

 

https://fb.watch/4jgPn_5oSa/

 

Is it possible to install these libraries on the CP88?

 

If I went with the MODX I could also take advantage of using my iPad and run apps like the RavensCroft 275 and iK B3X. Also, AcousticSamples has just released VTines which is one of the best Rhodes VST's available anywhere!! This makes me wondering if AcousticSamples will port more of their libraries to the iOS format. B5v3 is the best and most realistic/authentic Hammond library I've heard. Being able to use these easily from the MODX would be seriously tempting! However, I'm not keen on the plastic case or the less discrete flashy appearance.

 

I was all set to pull the trigger on the RD88 but I can't find a wheeled case that's lighter than what I already own! If I could I would probably still go the RD88 route. Does anyone know if such a case is available for the RD88?

 

I wish the CP88 had a built in audio interface! If it did, I think I would go this route!

[AnotherScott]

I wish the CP88 had a built in audio interface! If it did, I think I would go this route!

It does. (Same as your YC61.)

 

Is it possible to install these libraries on the CP88?

You cannot install 3rd-party libraries in the CP.

[dickiefunk]

I wish the CP88 had a built in audio interface! If it did, I think I would go this route!

It does. (Same as your YC61.)

 

Is it possible to install these libraries on the CP88?

You cannot install 3rd-party libraries in the CP.

 

Thanks. This is very helpful. From the demos I've heard, I think I prefer the sounds built into the CP88 and MODX to the RD88. Add the fact that the case will add another 7+kg makes me lean pretty heavily towards the Yamaha boards. It will be interesting to feel how the keybeds compare!

[jeffincltnc]

I have considered all of the above for a stage piano under 41 pounds and in the $1,500 range or less. I've considered RD88, MODX8, SP6 and PC4 (can get a B-stock in my budget)....

 

I'm 99% sure I am going to go with the Kawai ES920 for my needs. It's 38 pounds and has the Kawai RHIII action that I really like. Counterweights for the return. Acoustic pianos are very, very good.

 

Maybe doesn't have quite the finger-to-ear connection of the Yamaha CP88 for $1,000 more, but my needs can be met in the digital/portable piano category and I'm pretty keen and ready to order the Kawai right now.

[AnotherScott]

Under 40 lbs and moderate in price, my choice in an 88 might also well be the ES920, though I haven't played one myself yet. If 73 is a possibility, I'd also look at SV2, and some others I haven't had a chance to play yet... Grandstage, CP73/YC63. The Yamahas are nicely especially light, but they also have the deepest control surface, which counters my desire to keep the keys of a board above close. The ES920 is not feature-competitive with the boards listed in this thread's subject line, but I don't necessarily need all that functionality in my bottom board, if that's how I'm looking at it. If I just wanted the best piano/EP sound-and-feel in an 88-key sub-40, I would definitely put the ES920 high on my eval list.

[dickiefunk]

That Kawai does sound great. Does this have a built in audio interface?

[jeffincltnc]

It has MIDI but not a built in class compliant interface like RD88 or MODX8. I believe it does have audio input and Bluetooth audio in as far as I know.

[dickiefunk]

Ah that's a shame!