Vicount Legends '70 - Nord Grand killer ?

[DannyKeys2]

I believe the Nord Piano 4 only had the triple action in its 88 key version. The 73 key did not have the triple action.

 

The Piano 5 73-key apparently remedies this. You can see Jack demonstrate the triple sensor at about 2:30 here

[AnotherScott]

I believe the Nord Piano 4 only had the triple action in its 88 key version. The 73 key did not have the triple action.

The NP4 didn't come in a 73. But there was an earlier 73, and it used the "HP" (TP100) action instead of the "HA" (TP40) action that the 88s and the new 73 use.

[bjosko]

MexKeys talked a lot, and plays the new synth module from ca. 37 min. If you open the video in the YouTube app itself, you can get subtitles.

He is demonstrating the Artis W model. It seems like this has more snappy keys than mine Compact, perhaps the triple sensor are working better in this model ?

[video:youtube]

[DannyKeys2]

If I"m getting an EP in this price range, for me it"s going to be the Seven. But I have to admit those synth sounds sound really, really good.

[pawelsz]

Does somebody exactly know that the actions are in Compact, Artist and Artist-W? I presume TP100, TP40, and TP40WOOD (or TP400W). Could somebody provide confirmed info?

[francesco verni]

Hello Pawelsz,

 

The Legend'70s Compact (73 keys) and Artist (88 keys) have the TP100LR form Fatar while the Artist-W (88 wooden keys) has a customized korean keyboard optimized here in Italy (it works great!).

 

 

Ciao! From Italy

 

www.legend70s.com

[drawback]

I’m sold on the concept, very much like what I’ve heard on demo videos, but have vowed never again to compromise with a TP100. Has anyone played a Legend ‘70 with the Korean wood action? How does it compare with more accessible upscale wood actions from Fatar, Yamaha, etc? I've seen about all the videos available, but they're not specific.

[drawback]

Bump. I was just reading through Kraft’s description, where it’s noted “Modules use Dexibell's Physical Modeling and High-Definition Sampling technologies.” That’s pretty inspiring, based on what I’ve heard online from Dexibell. 

 

[ElmerJFudd]

5 hours ago, drawback said:

Bump. I was just reading through Kraft’s description, where it’s noted “Modules use Dexibell's Physical Modeling and High-Definition Sampling technologies.” That’s pretty inspiring, based on what I’ve heard online from Dexibell. 

 

hmmm Dexibell - definitely uses samples (notably long samples) in their acoustic piano engine. Their T2L combination of samples, synthesis and modeling seems to be very similar to Roland’s supernatural pianos.  This means, smooth transitions between velocity layers, changes in timbre depending on how you strike the key and a natural sounding decay on held notes.  
 

Unique features from Dexibell -  Their engine runs at 24bit/48k.  Their board has a quad core processor which allows for high - what they refer to as “virtually unlimited” polyphony and they seem to have picked a quality DAC. 
 

https://www.dexibell.com/t2l-modeling/?lang=en

 

https://www.reidys.com/blog/roland-supernatural-an-overview/

I too am in the camp that’s not interested in a TP100 instrument for playing acoustic piano.  The Crumar Seven is fun for Rhodes - but very disappointing (to me) for APs.  Anyone found a showroom with the 88k Legend 70s variant in the greater NYC area?  

[Brad Kaenel]

I've had a Compact 73 for almost a year now -- my daily driver; play it every week at church.  I have the EPiano, APiano, and SoundCollection modules.  I've had several TP100 boards (mostly Nord), and a TP40 board (Kurz Forte).  I find Viscount's implementation very comfortable and unfatiguing; of course, everyone has their preferences.  I will be very interested to compare my L70 side-by-side with the Numa X 73 (when it arrives) with it's new TP110 keybed.

[ElmerJFudd]

3 minutes ago, Brad Kaenel said:

I've had a Compact 73 for almost a year now -- my daily driver; play it every week at church.  I have the EPiano, APiano, and SoundCollection modules.  I've had several TP100 boards (mostly Nord), and a TP40 board (Kurz Forte).  I find Viscount's implementation very comfortable and unfatiguing; of course, everyone has their preferences.  I will be very interested to compare my L70 side-by-side with the Numa X 73 (when it arrives) with it's new TP110 keybed.

Brad, you get yours through Kraft?

[Brad Kaenel]

22 minutes ago, ElmerJFudd said:

Brad, you get yours through Kraft?

I don't believe Kraft was a distributor yet when I purchased mine, nor PianoManChuck.  Viscount put me in touch with HammondCentral.com (Cliff Unruh); he was the only West Coast distributor then who could get the Compact 73, and we hit it off. 

[drawback]

B3 Guys in Nashville are distributors. There are two sellers in Canada – one in Calgary. I'll be heading there first week of June and am planning to stop in to see a Legend 70 Artist if it's still on the floor. It'll have TP100 but at least I'll have some verification of the sound quality.

[ElmerJFudd]

[HammondDave]

The TP100 would be a deal killer for me. The TP110 is so much better. Love it on my Piano X.

[benj2017]

Hi all,

 

Since the new Montage M8X is still pretty heavy, I am going to be getting an M7 and find myself needing an 88 key digital piano.

 

I really like the form factor, weight and features of the Legend 70s Artist-W and the sound seems pretty good based on the online videos.  I'd be using it for practicing piano at home sometimes and jazz/blues/rock gigs. A big plus are the two sets of outputs and the easy to use iPad editor.

 

Other boards I like and am considering are the Yamaha CP88/YC88 (no assignable outputs) or Nord Stage 4 88 (expensive).  The Numa Piano X GT, the Korg Grandstage, and Kawaii MP7SE are all possibilities as well, but I am looking to stay at around 40 to 43 pounds in weight. 

 

Curious to know if anyone has any new feedback to add for this board as of 2023? 

[ProfD]

On 10/22/2023 at 12:47 PM, benj2017 said:

Curious to know if anyone has any new feedback to add for this board as of 2023? 

Bump. I'm also curious to know if anyone around here is using this KB.  Dish.😁😎

[ElmerJFudd]

Apparently a few months ago Kraft music did a video on the 1.09 firmware update and the iPad editor.  
 

Aside from editing the sounds setups, details about each engine.  It also has set list function.  So, when wired to the Legend 70s in a live situation you can use the iPad to move through your setlist.  
 

 

[AnotherScott]

16 hours ago, ElmerJFudd said:

 It also has set list function.  So, when wired to the Legend 70s in a live situation you can use the iPad to move through your setlist.  

 

That's great. I'm surprised this is such a rare thing, it's obviously so useful on any board that doesn't have a built in touchscreen with that function. Yes, there are set list apps for the iPad that will let you create something, but the initial set up requires entering all the patch names and Program Change numbers, which is a pain. This is something MIDI 2.0 should be able to address, as an app will be able to ask the keyboard for that info. In theory. 🙂

[jason88]

I have had mine since January of this year. Enjoy it for the most part, despite some minor annoyances. Look and feel of the overall package is still excellent and it really is just fun to sit at and touch. The flat top and angled front panel, along with the cool built-in stand, impart a sense of quality and style that indeed makes it feel special. The keybed on the Artist W is pretty nice overall, not too heavy or light and I am able to repeat notes easily. I have all available modules for it, but I mainly use it as a piano. The acoustic piano sounds are good, maybe very good once you spend some time with EQ and other settings available in the editor app. But not as good as I would like, and I wish there were even more options to tweak them. Lately I've been using the Pianoteq iPad app since the pianos are superb. The Synth 8 module is actually pretty slick, a really nice VA at its price point of only a couple hundred bucks, and the ipad editor (same interface on the computer version) is super easy to understand and use.

 

For the demerits, the headphone output is woefully bad. Noise floor is so high as to be unusable. Sadly, the main outputs also suffer from a slightly elevated noise floor. Not absurd, but definitely worse than any other modern board I've used. In the real world it's not an issue, but even knowing that it's there is a bummer. Also, on occasion the editor app won't connect to the device unless I unplug and replug the usb cable. The three-pedal pedal unit that came with it is decent, though mine is noisy and I've tried to lube and dampen it where possible. One final wish is that the keybed had aftertouch; yes, I know not everyone cares about it but it seems like a missed opportunity. As a workaround, I use an extra pedal that I have set to trigger the AT so I can access it via my feet instead of my hands. Oh well, first world problem I guess.

[ElmerJFudd]

1 hour ago, AnotherScott said:

 

That's great. I'm surprised this is such a rare thing, it's obviously so useful on any board that doesn't have a built in touchscreen with that function. Yes, there are set list apps for the iPad that will let you create something, but the initial set up requires entering all the patch names and Program Change numbers, which is a pain. This is something MIDI 2.0 should be able to address, as an app will be able to ask the keyboard for that info. In theory. 🙂

I think it is because iOS developers are in high demand so there is the cost of commissioning the editor and then maintaining it for apple’s rapid operating system, and hardware cycle. 
 

but yes, entirely any keyboard that lacks a touch, screen and direct access to features from its own panel benefits in a big way from being paired with an iPad. 

[ElmerJFudd]

1 hour ago, jason88 said:

I have had mine since January of this year. Enjoy it for the most part, despite some minor annoyances. Look and feel of the overall package is still excellent and it really is just fun to sit at and touch. The flat top and angled front panel, along with the cool built-in stand, impart a sense of quality and style that indeed makes it feel special. The keybed on the Artist W is pretty nice overall, not too heavy or light and I am able to repeat notes easily. I have all available modules for it, but I mainly use it as a piano. The acoustic piano sounds are good, maybe very good once you spend some time with EQ and other settings available in the editor app. But not as good as I would like, and I wish there were even more options to tweak them. Lately I've been using the Pianoteq iPad app since the pianos are superb. The Synth 8 module is actually pretty slick, a really nice VA at its price point of only a couple hundred bucks, and the ipad editor (same interface on the computer version) is super easy to understand and use.

 

For the demerits, the headphone output is woefully bad. Noise floor is so high as to be unusable. Sadly, the main outputs also suffer from a slightly elevated noise floor. Not absurd, but definitely worse than any other modern board I've used. In the real world it's not an issue, but even knowing that it's there is a bummer. Also, on occasion the editor app won't connect to the device unless I unplug and replug the usb cable. The three-pedal pedal unit that came with it is decent, though mine is noisy and I've tried to lube and dampen it where possible. One final wish is that the keybed had aftertouch; yes, I know not everyone cares about it but it seems like a missed opportunity. As a workaround, I use an extra pedal that I have set to trigger the AT so I can access it via my feet instead of my hands. Oh well, first world problem I guess.

Workarounds for demerits.   
 

hmmm. I Wonder if the headphone amp is its own component or on the main board.  if it can’t be swapped for a better component, I suppose I’d feed the audio outs to a mixer.  Given the comment about noise floor at the main outs - after checking that the power line is clean and that there aren’t any ground issues - see what works best when gain staging between the Legend 70s and the mixer and your amplification.  
 

Be sure to provide Viscount with this invaluable feedback so they can address in board revisions. 

[AnotherScott]

17 minutes ago, ElmerJFudd said:

I think it is because iOS developers are in high demand so there is the cost of commissioning the editor and then maintaining it for apple’s rapid operating system, and hardware cycle. 

 

Good point. But almost as good (if not as elegant as a dedicated app), manufacturers could at least offer templates that could be used in one or more other patch-selection apps, that would allow you to use those apps to change patches, again without having to type program names or PC/LSB/MSB numbers . In fact, Camelot Pro already builds in patch lists for a bunch of hardware, and there are Cubase patch scripts (which are also loadable into Keystage). But you have to know about and/or hunt for these things, which may or may not be available for a particular board. The manufacturers themselves should supply things like this, and have them as easy to find on their sites as their manuals and system updates are.

 

I just saw that Roland offer Cubase patch scripts at https://www.roland.com/us/support/patch_script_builder/ which is a step in the right direction. But to make use of those on an iPad for one of the supported keyboards, you have to know they're available (AFAIK, there's no reference to these things on the actual product pages for these keyboards, or links on the products' support pages), and you have to know there's an app on the iPad that can import that data (Keystage... maybe there are others?).

[jason88]

5 hours ago, ElmerJFudd said:

Workarounds for demerits.   
 

hmmm. I Wonder if the headphone amp is its own component or on the main board.  if it can’t be swapped for a better component, I suppose I’d feed the audio outs to a mixer.  Given the comment about noise floor at the main outs - after checking that the power line is clean and that there aren’t any ground issues - see what works best when gain staging between the Legend 70s and the mixer and your amplification.  
 

Be sure to provide Viscount with this invaluable feedback so they can address in board revisions. 

**Editing this post as I was able to get the HP out to sound notably quieter; turns out something I had plugged into the rear Aux audio input was introducing noise, thought I had unplugged it!

[bjosko]

Mine is dead silent, both through headphones and mixer.

Do you have another board on top, or a computer connected through the USB port that might give that famous ground loop noise ?

[ElmerJFudd]

1 hour ago, bjosko said:

Mine is dead silent, both through headphones and mixer.

Do you have another board on top, or a computer connected through the USB port that might give that famous ground loop noise ?

Anything else to share about the board?  Which one did you go with?  Which modules did you install? 

[Brad Kaenel]

1 hour ago, bjosko said:

Mine is dead silent, both through headphones and mixer.

Yes, so is mine' no hiss at all.

 

I have a Compact 73, with A.Piano, E.Piano, SoundCollection modules installed.

 

Is yours hissy even with all of the modules turned OFF?  Maybe try turning *everything* (modules volumes, FX volumes, amp sims, etc.) down to zero, and see if you can identify a particular component or circuit or level that is particularly noisy?

 

I've had all manner of small synths and accessories sitting on it,and haven't had it pickup any noise or act like anything needed additional shielding.  Hmm...

[bjosko]

Same here, Compact 73. At the moment with A.Piano, E.Piano, Sound module and the Synth module installed.

I used it for a while in one of my bands for rehearsal , but when I also joined a second band, I missed one here at home where it do it’s duty.

I think i prefer this one over my Numa X73, but it is way more bulky to transport.

But I needed some time to adapt to the keyboard on the Legend, and prefer to dial down the brilliance and dynamic when playing A Pianos.

Before that it felt like to little range between minimum and maximum velocity, but after a while I adjusted to it.

 

For gigs, I prefer my NS3 ( even if it is the not so great HP model) and my Mojo 61. Sound and function on this two cover my needs.

And the NS are so much faster to tweak on the fly, but of course also in another price range.

I have turned 60, and prefer a light load 🙂

[bjosko]

Numa X vs Legend’s

 

 

[BluesB3]

I'm interested in this board likely vs a CP73. I like the looks of the form factor and access to controls without menus. Two quick questions for those gigging with it..

• how are you protecting it in transport? (The thickness of the case looks like it might be a factor)
• is it possible to purchase with only the AP and EP modules?