Roland FA-06 and FA-08

[bdpianoman]

Hi aellison62,

 

I have been following your posts on regarding the inability (or difficulty) of controlling the volumes of individual layers in real time. You mentioned that you were also looking at the MOXF8. I also need this functionality and am closely looking at the MOXF8 as well. Have you made a decision yet? I also need really strong pianos, strings, EPs, and decent organs. I also plan to do some linear sequencing. Which of the two boards would work better for this? I appreciate your thoughts in advance.

 

[DanL]

EXP-02 Keys Collection SRX sounds up on the axial site...

[Tonysounds]

Got my FA08 yesterday. I carried it across the house with one hand. Spent almost 2 hrs just playing presets. I'm gigging it Saturday in a duo, and then I'll start trying to program it to do my gigs.

 

 

[nadroj]

Got my FA08 yesterday. I carried it across the house with one hand. Spent almost 2 hrs just playing presets. I'm gigging it Saturday in a duo, and then I'll start trying to program it to do my gigs.

 

 

Money well spent then, or too early to tell?

[DanL]

The anticipation is killing me. I know it'll take me a couple weeks to get it up to speed for my gigs though. but having it will be the best part.

[Tonysounds]

Got my FA08 yesterday. I carried it across the house with one hand. Spent almost 2 hrs just playing presets. I'm gigging it Saturday in a duo, and then I'll start trying to program it to do my gigs.

 

 

Money well spent then, or too early to tell?

 

Its either going to do the job (replace my rack, which admittedly, is a tough sell: Muse Receptor, JD990, FantomXR, Motif), or its going to be a kick-ass third keyboard for spontaneous musical combustion.

 

I do feel like the FA08 feels more like an instrument than the FA06 does, and thats because of its weight (lack thereof).

 

[aellison62]

@bdpianoman,

 

No, haven't made decision yet. I just got word that my new FA08 arrived and I need to pick it up. I was using a floor model for a couple weeks. Sam Ash is giving me the option to return the new FA08 in 30 days and take home a MOXF8 instead. I think I will take the MOXF8 home first for a couple weeks and work with it to make my final decision.

 

From this forum's suggestions I have got to the point where I can pretty easily select a tone within a studio set and adjust it in real time while hearing all other tones playing. Using the pads makes the selection pretty quick. It's just that you need to do that selection first (one extra step than what I'd prefer) From playing the MOXF8 in the store I definitely prefer the action of the FA08 and the FA08's sequencer is a bit more user friendly. IMO, neither board has good organ sounds so I rule that factor out. Although, you could buy Bees Knees or Organimation for the MOXF8 and definitely upgrade it's stock sounds. The Leslie still lacks either way though.

 

I guess I need to experience how the real time adjustment on the MOXF8 is compared to what I now know I can do with the FA08 and see if sacrificing the action of the FA08 is worth it. I also have a fondness for the Motif sound set. There's a reason it's been a pro staple for many years now.

 

I know, one way or the other within the next 30 days I will be keeping one of these two boards.

 

Can you get a trial period from your local music store as well or are you buying from the internet?

[Analogaddict]

Money well spent then, or too early to tell?

 

I've had my 06 for a week, I really dig it. I loaded it with integra sounds and my own samples, and it's loads of fun. I'll be using this one a LOT.

[bdpianoman]

@aellison62,

 

Thanks for the reply. I do have a couple of local GCs and a Sam Ash that I could probably get a 30-day offer on one of the boards. Like you, I feel strongly that one of these will be my future keyboard of choice. In fact, just today I was in a GC playing both. For whatever reason, I am taking a stronger attraction to the action of the MOXF8. While it may not feel as realistic (ie as close to that of an acoustic piano) as that of the FA-08, it feels "easier" in touch and more responsive than the FA-08 to me. As for the soundsefs of each, based on my limited playing of both, I currently favor those of the MOXF8 (especially the pianos, EPs, and guitars). As I have not tested the sequencer on either, I cannot speak to this aspect of the comparison. If you are willing to do so, I would be interested in hearing your continued thoughts as you trial these keyboards and make your decision. Thanks in advance!!!!

[Tonysounds]

Money Well Spent.

 

I have yet to start trying to replace my rig with it, but I spent two hours last nite being inspired by sounds and writing.

 

Perfect.

[aellison62]

EXP-02 Keys Collection SRX sounds up on the axial site...

 

Love the OB bass demo. So you download these to the SD card and select from the card into the FA?

[CEB]

This is annoying me. I manually manipulate the cutoff and resonance on the Am chord semi-quavers on Bad Romance. But if I re-initialize the tone it doesn't reset the Resonance and Cutoff to zero. My Yo-mama-ha does.

[jvckey]

This is annoying me. I manually manipulate the cutoff and resonance on the Am chord semi-quavers on Bad Romance. But if I re-initialize the tone it doesn't reset the Resonance and Cutoff to zero. My Yo-mama-ha does.

 

I think these settings belong to the studio set, try putting the same tone in another studio set and you may hear the difference

[DanL]

EXP-02 Keys Collection SRX sounds up on the axial site...

 

Love the OB bass demo. So you download these to the SD card and select from the card into the FA?

 

I think they download via USB to the virtual expansion slots on the internal flash memory, not the SD card.

[aellison62]

Yes, I see now thats it. There is a video link on the Roland Clan forum showing it.

[Cybersoniq]

Does the FA-06 keyboard feel good enough for organ and synth lead and pad parts where you also use a weighted action or better quality bottom keyboard for AP and EP? I guess our expectations at this price point shouldn't be that high.

I think so.

 

CEB Quote: I think for organ part the quality of the action will depend on what keys you play in. Sitting here right now playing the organ set to 888886666 3rd percussion on soft fast. playing in E - A - C -F - G ect aint too bad. Playing in C#m and F# are worse. Black keys respond worse than the white keys.

Thanks Guys! I finally got to demo the FA-06 keyboard this W/E at GC. Maybe because my expectations were set low, I thought the 06 keybed felt OK for organ, synth and clav parts. That said, my fingers were still hoping in vain for keyboard aftertouch to modulate things. For two-handed keyboard parts, I'd have to get an extra expression pedal to remap aftertouch for mod control.

 

 

[AnotherScott]

From playing the MOXF8 in the store I definitely prefer the action of the FA08

That's obviously a matter of personal taste (and bdpianoman came to the opposite conclusion two posts below yours). But there are a couple of techniques which I think are at least somewhat objective... try doing some same key repetitions, and try doing a thumbnail glissando. I think the Yamaha action is more amenable to these things. Of course, if you don't do much of those things, or hate the action otherwise, any benefit there might be moot.

 

IMO, neither board has good organ sounds so I rule that factor out. Although, you could buy Bees Knees or Organimation for the MOXF8 and definitely upgrade it's stock sounds. The Leslie still lacks either way though.

I don't think the Yamaha organ will be any better than the FA's overall, even with the other libraries. That's not to say you might not find some patches that are more to your liking, again that's always subjective. But there are just inherent limitations to sampling vs. modeling when talking about organ, which will show up in things like polyphony and phase issues. And, of course, the ability to create any drawbar registration you want. So I'd have to give the edge to the FA here, even if it's only to say that one sucks less than the other. ;-)

 

As for the Leslie, the FA with its Aux out would be more amenable to being adapted with a Ventilator, and then it would clearly be the stronger choice. You could even go all the way and add the Ocean Beach drawbars as well.

 

I also have a fondness for the Motif sound set. There's a reason it's been a pro staple for many years now.

As I was discussing elsewhere while this forum was down, I think that's the biggest advantage of the MOXF. The Roland has a lot of benefits... sample pads, aux out, big color screen with a better interface, VA synth, organ model... but if you're talking about rompler-style sounds, I think the Yamaha has more to offer.

 

The basic "rompler" section of the FA is the 64 mb soundset from the XV-5080 (which is 14 years old); if you load up the two virtual SRX slots, you're up to 192 mb. The MOXF starts at 741 mb, and if you install a flash card, you can download another 500-600 mb of free sounds from Yamaha, and also add third party downloadable sounds (or create your own). You can have a total of up to 1765 mb of wave data, 9 times more than on the FA. Size isn't everything (I still think Kurzweil did amazing things with 64 mb!), but it's not totally irrelevant, either. (Though to be fair, the Roland figure doesn't include the new SuperNatural piano, EPs, clav, basses, acoustic guitar, or ensemble strings, nor the aforementioned clonewheel and VA synth, nor the memory for the samples you can trigger from the pads.) On the Integra, Roland's advantage comes out in the SuperNatural acoustic instruments, but only a small subset of those made it to the FA. Of course, if the FA has the sounds you need, and you like them, the rest may be academic.

 

[aellison62]

@bdpianoman

 

Well I brought home the MOXF8 over this past weekend and although I love it's soundset and am familiar with the Motif UI and programming I couldn't make myself like the action. For me it is too semiweighted like and kinda bouncy. For what I want to use this board for I need a more piano type action and the FA gives me that. I also am one of those who like the Roland piano sound as well. Of course this is completely subjective but if the action and feel of a keybed doesn't make me WANT to play it, it's useless to me. The Yammie guitars ROCK as usual and I've not heard better rompler type guitars on anything else but I don't play guitar on keyboards much so no loss for me. With my PC361 covering the organ sounds and orchesral stuff I think I'm going to be pretty happy with the FA08 as my bottom board. From what you've said I wouldn't be surprised if you pulled the trigger on the MOXF8 and I don't think you could go wrong as long as YOU like the action.

[CEB]

If I had tried the FA-06 before buying I probably wouldn't have bought it. I'm glad I got it. I've played it alot and have adjusted to it.

 

I like the way the architecture is laid out. It is a lot like the way I would use Cantabile or Forte. I setup studio sets like they are a virtual rack. Each voice receives on a different MIDI channel. I can load multiple instances of the same patch in the studio set. Good if I want to modify the cutoff and resonance then switch back to the stock sound. You have to remember to disable program change for the studio set parts.

 

My only issue is with my Yo momma ha. I can't get it to stop transmitting note information on channel 1 even when every zone in the Multi setup is set to a different channel. My work around is to not have any parts in the FA's studio set to receive on channel 1. It is OK as long as 15 parts is enough.

 

As far as the action I found it better to play Saturday when it was on a beveled upper tier instead of parallel with the floor.

[DanL]

are you using master mode on the Yamaha? you can set the tx channel there. also, there are times where I set the tx note range to be c0-c0 so it won't trigger the sound on the 2nd board.

[bdpianoman]

@aellison62,

 

Thanks for the follow up. While I am not TOTALLY in love with the MOXF8 action, for whatever reason, I do seem to favor it. I guess it's just a matter of opinion. I do favor the soundset of the MOXF8, though. I think that I may try out both at least once more before making the choice. Thanks for the additional help/information. Enjoy the FA-08!!!

[bdpianoman]

One additional comparison question for those of you familiar with the MOXF8: Which of the two boards (MOXF8 vs FA-08) is the better option for linear sequencing (ie laying down complete song tracks instead of looping)?

[bdpianoman]

@aellison62,

 

Regarding the adjustments on the fly (ie real-time), were you able to find a workable solution on the FA-08? Is the MOXF8 more user friendly for this issue? Also, do you know if the MOXF8 has sliders to help with fading in and out layers?

[aellison62]

Yes, selecting the part from the studio set first, via the pads, and then using the assignable volume knob seems to work well enough for me. It's one extra step.

 

On the MoxF8 you push the two buttons next to the assignable knob section simultaneously and it puts you in the 4 voice volume adjustment mode. You use the assignable knobs just like the FA ( no faders ). It's just that the MOXF8 can adjust all 4 voices once you enter this mode, however you are limited to 4 voices within a performance where the FA has 16.

[CEB]

are you using master mode on the Yamaha? you can set the tx channel there. also, there are times where I set the tx note range to be c0-c0 so it won't trigger the sound on the 2nd board.

 

Yes I am using master mode to call everything. Thanks a lot for the tx note range tip.

[burningbusch]

EXP-02 Keys Collection SRX sounds up on the axial site...

 

Interesting in that it matches the SRX-07 Ultimate Keys for the most part but does not include the Marcus Miller, John Patitucci and Abe Laboriel basses taken from the Spectrasonics Bass Legends.

 

Busch.

[bdpianoman]

Thanks. for the clarification, aellison62.

[Cybersoniq]

I also have a fondness for the Motif sound set. There's a reason it's been a pro staple for many years now.

As I was discussing elsewhere while this forum was down, I think that's the biggest advantage of the MOXF. The Roland has a lot of benefits... sample pads, aux out, big color screen with a better interface, VA synth, organ model... but if you're talking about rompler-style sounds, I think the Yamaha has more to offer.

 

The basic "rompler" section of the FA is the 64 mb soundset from the XV-5080 (which is 14 years old); if you load up the two virtual SRX slots, you're up to 192 mb. The MOXF starts at 741 mb, and if you install a flash card, you can download another 500-600 mb of free sounds from Yamaha, and also add third party downloadable sounds (or create your own). You can have a total of up to 1765 mb of wave data, 9 times more than on the FA. Size isn't everything (I still think Kurzweil did amazing things with 64 mb!), but it's not totally irrelevant, either. (Though to be fair, the Roland figure doesn't include the new SuperNatural piano, EPs, clav, basses, acoustic guitar, or ensemble strings, nor the aforementioned clonewheel and VA synth, nor the memory for the samples you can trigger from the pads.) On the Integra, Roland's advantage comes out in the SuperNatural acoustic instruments, but only a small subset of those made it to the FA. Of course, if the FA has the sounds you need, and you like them, the rest may be academic.

Besides the size/scope/breath of the MOXF and FA ROM/Flash libraries, I also find that the sound designers/programmers at Yamaha and Roland really define their sound set philosophy (Motif vs. FA/XV)...whether you're listening to an AP, EP or Synth program. So if you are looking for the cleaner/less processed Yamaha sound, I'd go to the FA MFX/Chorus/Reverb (and maybe IFX/TFX as needed) and dial things back on the FX Sends and Wet/Dry ratio on over-processed sounds to have them fit better in the mix. BTW it goes the other way too...I find that many Motif ES stock sounds really don't take advantage/show off all the Insert FX/Types and real-time processing control possibilities to create sounds with unique character and performance variation. Add or change an Amp type Insert FX on a Rhodes or Clav voice/tone and you have a whole new vibe.

 

For me while both instruments have deep/sophisticated sample synthesis tools and ROM to work with, the FA really goes the extra mile and gives you your choice--a four partial PCM synth for sample synthesis with variable structures or a three partial/discreet VA synth path with lots of PCM wave options. And add that you can select a SN-S or PCM-S engine in any/all 16 parts and you have a real beast in your hands!

[DanL]

My FA08 is here. Having some fun so far! Tweaking some stock sounds to my taste and saving as studio sets, then adding to favorites. Haven't started to dive into the complex stuff yet... Some REALLY nice sounds in this box.

 

I like the keybed. It took a few minutes to get used to compared to the S70XS but I'm enjoying it now.

 

Probably not a lot of sleep in my future. Too bad I have a rehearsal tonight, otherwise I'd be working on the patches I need for live use.

[Tonysounds]

Yeah, I'm trying to get mine programmed for this Saturday's gig, but that may be a little too optimistic.

 

WHATS EVERYONE USING FOR A CASE OR GIG BAG?