Roland V-Combo VR-09

[David Emm]

This thread has long legs! I understand that the engine has a few lacks and the "drawbars" are tooth-clenching for serious organists. I simply note that with so few other 5-octave instruments around, this could have become a controller of choice for a lot of players if the keybed wasn't so uninviting. I guess Roland held back so it wouldn't hurt sales of their higher-end pieces. Its like a flagship engine shrunk to a form you have to operate with a stylus. Urgh! 🤢

[franky64]

On 7/26/2024 at 9:09 PM, AnotherScott said:

 

I don't know if this is related to the changes you made, but I hadn't been able to get onto your site for quite a while, and now I can again. 🙂

 

In terms of your pros and cons, I think it's a pretty fair assessment, though with some adjustment, I think the overdrive doesn't have to be as bad as you make it sound, e.g. see https://forums.musicplayer.com/topic/147150-roland-v-combo-vr-09/page/117/#comment-2902568 .

 

OTOH, another con to me is that, unlike many (most?) clones, there is no button to make the organ sound reflect the current position of the drawbars. So if you're someone who likes to tweak the drawbars as you play, every slider must be manually moved into position every time, if you want to avoid undesirable results when moving the drawbars. (I don't remember off-hand whether VR-09 drawbars values operate as "catch" or "jump" when the sliders are moved, but neither is desirable for this purpose.) Referenced for example at https://forums.musicplayer.com/topic/147150-roland-v-combo-vr-09/page/105/#comment-2607906 . Related, if you do manually move your drawbars into a position for a particular sound, then call up a different registration for a different part of the song, there's no quick way to get back the organ sound you had just been playing (since, again, there is no button to make the organ sound reflect the current position of the drawbars, which could have brought you back to the sound of how you'd last left them). 

 

 

 

Thank you

overdrive: you're right. In the 'organ settings' page is even a chapter of 'deep analysis' of the harshness of OD (and the risk of running the organ into pre-amp clipping) - I just did forget to update the 'pro/con' page - will do that soon

'set to' actual drawbars:  : correct. VR 760 and 700 had the 'manual' button. Frankly: I personally don't make frequent 'live-use' of VR09 'drawfaders' anyway : they miss the feel of drawbars - they feel like ... faders. It's so different to 760 or 700 where one can 'work' on them. Also the reduced bars on Hammond SKs are still very usable.  The discomfort of VR09 continues with VC and  perc switches requiring menu select. VR09 'live organ controls' had been cut down. This is so 'unsatisfying' for organ work that I ended up using VR organ as designed: focused on 'presets' (VR registrations) 
So maybe we can add to  pro/cons that VR09/730 organ has 'limited' live controls ?

Personal VR09 workaround when starting with a registration as base for later 'live manipulation': usually a song starts with an 'accompaniment' set - that's the registration. I push all drawfaders back to 0, THEN call the registration. When it comes to 'solo' work, only the required faders are pulled. It's not ideal but quicker than initiating all 9 faders to the desired registration

With all this said: I consider the concept of 'only 1 dbar set' for combo-organs as not very usable, especially when working with lower manual it becomes a pain.
There exists only one 'true' solution:  the motor faders of Dexibell J7. Compared to, all other boards are 'crap' - a bit more 'crappy', a bit less 'crappy' - but 'crap'
Never understood why the entire 'Tonewheel community' had been so negative towards Dexibells motor-faders.

yet again, thank you for your comments - the website is community work

[franky64]

On 7/30/2024 at 7:04 AM, mrk7421 said:

.The 760 I just got got has phenomenal chorus vibrato and Leslie sim.....I don't ever recall hearing them this good on the VK8. How similar might the VR09 be to the VR760? If it's anywhere close It could be worthy of consideration

for info: 760 and 700 are also 'VK8' engines, but improved.
V/C: don't remember 760 VC but 700 is very likely the same: frankly, it's horrible - I never use it other than for 'bizzare organ sounds'
V/C on VR09 is much improved, especially Chorus: C1/2 are decent (C3 smears a lot).
Leslie sims are VERY different. On old VRs it's oldschool leslie, ondulating L-R. VR09 has 3 leslie models: an oldschool-like and 2 with complex '2D distribution' (there's another sim called 'MFX Twin rotary', but it's 'complicated' : it can be used as a very clear sounding leslie or added as 2nd leslie to the 'organ leslies') 
All leslie sims,  old VR and new VR09, have their 'character', their 'charme'.
A BIG advantage of VR760/700 leslie is tweakability: more rotary and amp models (20 combinations in VR700) and VR700 additional controls like mic distance, 'randomisation' etc (there is also net frequency and comb filter - but it's  such subtile nuances barely hearable that it's irrelevant for 'band application')
Example: born to be wild: the 'wobbeling' leslie on the famous E chord (imho left-panned and 'mono') can be quite accurately reproduced on VR700 adjusting amp/leslie model and mic distance  - on VR09 it cannot. 
The ideal Roland organ would be:
organ-engine ('timbre') of VR700. Drawbars and controls of VR760 (real V/C knob). Leslie and organ deep parameters of VR700. Leslie sims VR700+VR09 combined.  Waterfall action of VR760/700. Weight and size of VR09 (plus max 2 kilos). Fixed 'organ note-retrigger-bug' of Fantom 0x
 

[franky64]

On 7/28/2024 at 6:13 PM, brenner13 said:

Sorry about the delay…a second bout with COVID took me out of commission for a couple of weeks. Finally got hands on my rig again at yesterday’s gig and took about 30 seconds to check the Roland EV7 through the VR09 controlling Yonak’s KingB and can attest that the sweep range of the swell pedal is nearly complete. There are just the slightest areas of dead spots at both the very bottom and the very top of the throw. No scientific measurements or anything, but probably less than 10% on either end. I forgot to verify, but pretty sure I’m using slope #3 on the VR09’s internal expression pedal parameter. 

still unexplicable. To this point the only - yet very theoretical - explanation (a part from an already 'modded' pedal) that I can imagine that EV7 has some sophisticated electronics that detects 'exotic Roland keyboard calibration types' - this sounds still voodoo though.
We should find someone with a EV7 who is willing to open it and see if it has  a circuit board and 'chips'  - I suppose you won't? 

BTW, if you midi the pedal out to an app (or module), the 'slope setting' has no impact (it applies only to VR internal sound)

F


 

[brenner13]

I have a second EV7 with a short in the min vol knob that I’ve be procrastinating opening up. I guess I’ll have to now.😁

 

I really don’t know what I’ll be looking at with the circuit board but I’ll get some photos.

 

On a side note, I had a cheep-o M-Audio pedal go bad, and my guitar player put a new larger-gage cable on it and it works pretty well now, better than I remember when it was stock, considering the short throw. Could it be that the thicker wire and perhaps the somewhat amateur soldering could cause enough interference (resistance?) to make the VR09 respond correctly? Again, I know almost nothing about electricity. 

[franky64]

2 hours ago, brenner13 said:

I have a second EV7 with a short in the min vol knob that I’ve be procrastinating opening up. I guess I’ll have to now.😁

 

I really don’t know what I’ll be looking at with the circuit board but I’ll get some photos.

 

On a side note, I had a cheep-o M-Audio pedal go bad, and my guitar player put a new larger-gage cable on it and it works pretty well now, better than I remember when it was stock, considering the short throw. Could it be that the thicker wire and perhaps the somewhat amateur soldering could cause enough interference (resistance?) to make the VR09 respond correctly? Again, I know almost nothing about electricity. 

 

[EV7 photos] If you take some photos of EV7 entrails  it dan be helpful. Thus said it would be more important to get photos of the EV7 that 'works well' - to see if there had been any 'modifications'. Let's underline that it's not about being 'right or wrong' but about finding solutions for VR users
[cables]: definitely that's not the cause (it's possible that faulty cabeling made things even worse): VR issue is a principal 'problem' of VR expression signal detection.
F

[brenner13]

This is the one with the short in the volume knob. It has the same near-full throw as the other, just have to wiggle the knob sometimes.

EV7 potentiometer assembly:

[franky64]

Thank you. No electronics, no voodoo, just a simple potentionmeter (the 'thing' with 3 pins and 3 attached wires).

This is just unexplicable.

[brenner13]

I’m very reluctant to take the assembly apart to perhaps find some numbers on the main potentiometer as my reassembly skills are often less capable than the ease at which I am able to disassemble (Demolition skills: 7.5. Repair skills: 1.8…generous numbers at that).

 

However here is a photo of the volume pot: 905t 50KB

 

 

BTW, doused the volume pot with some parts cleaner and worked the pot back and forth 15 or 20 times and it appears to be working flawlessly now…YAY!

[drivanov2003]

Hey all!

I am a new owner of V-combo VR-09B, and i try to connect my midi keyboard Keystation Pro 88 to the VR09B, and to control the lower drawbars, using the CTRLR EDITOR for this (i create rules in the page "KBD config" that CC13 - 20 controls lower man. drawbars 16 to 1 on Ch.1). But the range of the CCs are 0-127, and the range of the drawbars on VR-09B is 0-8, so i receive a huge wah wah effect, if i move the first and the third sliders simultaneously, on my M-audio. (surprisingly - when the lowest drawbar is fully out, at value 8 the controller start to pull out the next one, till all of them are fully out...to 127....). 
So, my question is:
 how can i limit the range of a midi controller, or to divide the value which he send to VR-09B (if possible in CTRLR EDITOR) ?

Edit: few days later, i already reed the TransMIDIfier User Guide, were there is a think called "CC Map transform", and i hope this is the answer of my question.

Best regards,

I. Ivanov

[franky64]

9 hours ago, drivanov2003 said:

...

 

 

Welcome to VR world

 

[keyboard Keystation Pro  ...  But the range of the CCs are 0-127, and the range of the drawbars on VR-09B is 0-8, ] 

Doesn't Keystation provide the possibilty to set the value range of its sliders? From all controllers I know one can set a min and max value (or low-high or how ever they call it)

 

[(surprisingly - when the lowest drawbar is fully out, at value 8 the controller start to pull out the next one, till all of them are fully out...to 127....). ] 

 

indeed, that's a funny effect (of VR): when you send values >8  to a drawbar we would expect them just being ignored. - but VR  moves the next bar(s)  
This alreadyh gave me some '????' until I understood what was going on

 

[TransMIDIfier ]

Transmidifier ist a very handy and effective tool - but the editor should be able to handle this 'issue' by itself  

 

As said please check if keystation faders have a 'range' setting and set it to 0 - 8
In the mean time  I'll add a 'value mapping option'  to editor

 

[drivanov2003]

15 hours ago, franky64 said:

 

 

Welcome to VR world

 

[keyboard Keystation Pro  ...  But the range of the CCs are 0-127, and the range of the drawbars on VR-09B is 0-8, ] 

Doesn't Keystation provide the possibilty to set the value range of its sliders? From all controllers I know one can set a min and max value (or low-high or how ever they call it)

 

[(surprisingly - when the lowest drawbar is fully out, at value 8 the controller start to pull out the next one, till all of them are fully out...to 127....). ] 

 

indeed, that's a funny effect (of VR): when you send values >8  to a drawbar we would expect them just being ignored. - but VR  moves the next bar(s)  
This alreadyh gave me some '????' until I understood what was going on

 

[TransMIDIfier ]

Transmidifier ist a very handy and effective tool - but the editor should be able to handle this 'issue' by itself  

 

As said please check if keystation faders have a 'range' setting and set it to 0 - 8
In the mean time  I'll add a 'value mapping option'  to editor

 

Dear franky64, thank you for yours reply, and dedication!

I will start digging in the KeyPro88 Advanced Guide about the range of CCs.

[Outkaster]

Why are people still talking about this board. I played one with a band they had at practice. I never got the appeal.

[AnotherScott]

6 minutes ago, Outkaster said:

Why are people still talking about this board. I played one with a band they had at practice. I never got the appeal.

 

Cheapest, lightest, smallest board with drawbar organ, fully editable VA synth (albeit external editing), and full set of "bread and butter" rompler sounds, plus an easy-to-use pretty direct, hands-on interface.

[Outkaster]

OK but the build quality is terrible.  I didn't like the action either. 

[JoJoB3]

@franky64  Separate question about the VR series and CTRLR + Panel (win/PC here).
I haven't messed with CTRLR yet but is it true using this I could get the added sounds found in the VR-730 on the VR09 and be retained on the 09 via registration saving?
 

[AnotherScott]

1 hour ago, Outkaster said:

OK but the build quality is terrible.  I didn't like the action either. 

I listed the positives. The list of negatives is also substantial. 😉 Personally, over the years, I purchased it twice, and ended up returning it both times. It's not for me, but I do see the appeal. Though in my case, neither the build quality nor the action were the deal-killers! I did end up keeping the Fantom-07, though. There are a few places where it lags the VR, but overall, it's a much better board for me. Not sure the action or build quality are any better, though!

[Outkaster]

I understand what you mean its amazing this thread still comes up I guess but I see what you are saying. 

[AnotherScott]

Some of the thread resurgences are because Frank keeps coming up with new ways to improve the board's capabilities via his freeware Mac/PC editor. 🙂

[brenner13]

Build quality? I’ve said so many times that I’ve been gigging this thing in dirty bars, dusty festivals, and wild pool parties for over 11 years and have only had to replace the pitch paddle…and that is likely due to my exuberant use of it for rotary speed changes and fun pitch bends of clav, flutes, sax, harmonica, and killer synth solos. It has seen gigs in 110 degrees Fahrenheit in full sun and 34 degree-sleeting snow days where we played beyond the numbness in our hands. It’s been rained on several times and often suffers condensation in late summer and early spring as the sun goes down. 
 

Still rocking the thing nearly every weekend and almost always get comments about how good the “Hammond” sounds. 
 

Ya really need to get into the menus or utilize the dang-good iPad programmer app to get your own sound. Lots of stuff in there for key-click, rotary speed settings, high/low gains, and such. 
 

I recall absolutely hating the keybed when I first got the thing in May of 2013…especially when that crappy stock acoustic piano was the default sound upon power-up. Several firmware updates later and organ is what it does so well, it is now rightly the first sound at power-up. The high trigger on the organs sounds is just awesome. Fantastic keybed for synth solos…lighting fast.

 

I still keep thinking a Hammond SK Pro or XK4 or a Crumar Mojo, or even a Yamaha YC61 might provide more cred, but then I get a compliment from an audience patron like I got this week and get very satisfied with this amazing instrument that Roland built.

[JoJoB3]

2 hours ago, brenner13 said:

Build quality? I’ve said so many times that I’ve been gigging this thing in dirty bars, dusty festivals, and wild pool parties for over 11 years and have only had to replace the pitch paddle…and that is likely due to my exuberant use of it for rotary speed changes and fun pitch bends of clav, flutes, sax, harmonica, and killer synth solos. It has seen gigs in 110 degrees Fahrenheit in full sun and 34 degree-sleeting snow days where we played beyond the numbness in or hands. It’s been rained on several times and often suffers condensation in late summer and early spring as the sun went down. 
 

Still rocking the thing nearly every weekend and almost always get comments about how good the “Hammond” sounds. 
 

Ya really need to get into the menus or utilize the dang-good iPad programmer app to get your own sound. Lots of stuff in there for key-click, rotary speed settings, high/low gains, and such. 
 

I recall absolutely hating the keybed when I first got the thing in May of 2013…especially when that crappy stock acoustic piano was the default sound upon power-up. Several firmware updates later and organ is what it does so well, it is now rightly the first sound at power-up. The high trigger on the organs sounds is just awesome. Fantastic keybed for synth solos…lighting fast.

 

I still keep thinking a Hammond SK Pro or XK4 or a Crumar Mojo, or even a Yamaha YC61 might provide more cred, but then I get a compliment from an audience patron like I got this week and get very satisfied with this amazing instrument that Roland built.

Truth.  It isn't high fallutin' but my is it the best little 12lb swiss army knife I've seen in a while.

[Mike Kent]

2 hours ago, brenner13 said:

Build quality? I’ve said so many times that I’ve been gigging this thing in dirty bars, dusty festivals, and wild pool parties for over 11 years and ...

...

Still rocking the thing nearly every weekend and almost always get comments about how good the “Hammond” sounds. 

...

I still keep thinking a Hammond SK Pro or XK4 or a Crumar Mojo, or even a Yamaha YC61 might provide more cred, but then I get a compliment from an audience patron like I got this week and get very satisfied with this amazing instrument that Roland built.

Yep. Why is my VR-09 still relevant after all these years? Mainly the best organ+rotary speaker. Usable sounds all around*. Dependable Roland build. The light weight is a big win for me. And I know this is a silly thing, but I have a music rest for it so I can put my iPad there without having to take a music stand.

 

*Piano is barely passable and made worse by the key action.The key action sucks. And I am not picky about key action. Velocity between white and black keys seems way off. Subtle is not possible.

 

Registration system based on Atelier organ thinking, so access to programmable patches sucks.

 

I have a YC61 which is better than the VR-09 is almost every way. But the VR gets used way more based on the superior organ+rotary. Maybe a Hammond or Crumar would suit me. But it's impossible to play those at any local store so it would be a big gamble to try one.

[JoJoB3]

7 minutes ago, Mike Kent said:

 

 

I have a YC61 which is better than the VR-09 is almost every way. 

Ooo I dunno. It's got a better ac piano and keybed but I thought it's synth section was limited af (you just get more/more functional with the 09/730). That and the epianos were ho-hum at best.   Both ultimately 'fine' however because NOT RED. 

[AnotherScott]

1 hour ago, Mike Kent said:

I know this is a silly thing, but I have a music rest for it so I can put my iPad there without having to take a music stand.

Not silly at all. I love when boards have that feature. It's why I now usually end up putting my traditionally lower-tier piano board on the upper tier.

 

1 hour ago, Mike Kent said:

I have a YC61 which is better than the VR-09 is almost every way. But the VR gets used way more based on the superior organ+rotary. 

Since the 1.3 update for the YC61, I would no longer say the VR09 is better. Now I'd say it's at least a tie (some of this is always subjective).

 

59 minutes ago, JoJoB3 said:

Ooo I dunno. It's got a better ac piano and keybed but I thought it's synth section was limited af (you just get more/more functional with the 09/730). That and the epianos were ho-hum at best.

Yes, VR-09 beats YC61 on synth functionality, but I'd take the YC for the EPs.

 

The board I have that comes closest to the VR09 is the CK61. But VR09 beats it in both synth and organ. CK wins on MIDI functionality (4 external zones vs. 1, sliders that send MIDI CC, ability to recall your saved patches over MIDI); being able to split/layer 3 sounds however you want, with effect independence (and more effects controls in general); better patch selection functionality (8 buttons vs. 4, with screens that show you what sounds are currently assigned tt the 8 buttons); having speakers and built-in USB audio interface. And while it's not a first-rate action, I can play piano on it better than I could on the VR09. And I think its front panel ergonomics are better in general. So it ticked more boxes for me. But if you're buying a board primarily for VA synth and organ functionality, the VR beats it. (Or a Fantom-06 almost does it all, though not quite. It still lacks VR's 9th physical drawbar and high trigger; still lags the CK in piano playability, speakers, class-compliance on the audio interface. It also doesn't have battery operation, and is more complicated. But of course, it also has tons more functionality overall.)

[voxpops]

Just a note regarding the swell pedal issue. I have a cheap M-Audio pedal and there's a switch on the bottom to go between "M-Audio" and "other." Counterintuitively, if the pedal is switched to "M-Audio" it works quite well with the VR-09 (useless with "other"). No need to disassemble and use some sort of electronic voodoo! They're not the most ruggedly built pedals, but I've had mine (and a spare) for years with no problem.

[ProfD]

On 8/22/2024 at 3:21 PM, Outkaster said:

I understand what you mean its amazing this thread still comes up I guess but I see what you are saying. 

You've had access to the real deal and other organ options.  The VR-09 is not the 1st or last KB an organ aficionado will grab. 

 

However, the VR-09 might be perfect for musicians who need an organ-ish KB with a variety of bread and butter sounds in a small footprint. 

 

Roland basically came up with an Electro-lite. 🤣😎

[Outkaster]

Yeah it seems so.

[Baggypants]

There are 120 pages of people saying "What about this, why not that?"

 

It drives me wild when the YC-61 is mentioned, and yet is over twice the price of a VR-09 here (1500 vs 660). There is nothing that matches the VR-09 on features, AT THE SAME PRICE.

 

NOTHING

 

Either the alternatives don't have drawbars, or a looper, or din ports, or a programmable VA synth, or "as good" romples, or they are heavier, or they don't run on AA batteries, or they are more expensive, there is always, always, always, some compromise in the competitors.

 

That's not to say the VR doesn't have it's own set of compromises.

[voxpops]

9 hours ago, Baggypants said:

There are 120 pages of people saying "What about this, why not that?"

 

It drives me wild when the YC-61 is mentioned, and yet is over twice the price of a VR-09 here (1500 vs 660). There is nothing that matches the VR-09 on features, AT THE SAME PRICE.

 

NOTHING

 

Either the alternatives don't have drawbars, or a looper, or din ports, or a programmable VA synth, or "as good" romples, or they are heavier, or they don't run on AA batteries, or they are more expensive, there is always, always, always, some compromise in the competitors.

 

That's not to say the VR doesn't have it's own set of compromises.

I agree. I've been using the VR for years now and found it way more versatile than the Electros I've had in the past. I've thought many times about the Nord Stage and always been put off by the fact you can't select a split point with precision (a feature I can't perform without), not to mention the price. No, I don't like the action (much prefer the Vox Conti), but the bang for the buck is undeniable. There are a lot of compromises, but there are also a lot of workarounds.

 

I find that, using the controls and FX offered, I can coax a huge range of useful sounds out of it, as long as I am mindful of effect limitations on the lower part. The organ may be just a tad thin and lacking "grease," but the rotary is surprisingly good and the tone can be dialed in with precision. Yes, it's annoying that the organ volume setting often gets lost when switching registrations, but that can be compensated for in the menu (although Roland should have fixed that bug). There are relatively few boards that offer both organ and VA synth (the reason I bought it in the first place) and the synth is actually pretty versatile, with a wide tonal range, as long as you're aware of the potential for aliasing in upper octaves. And talking of octaves, pitch is easily adjusted either side of a split point... unlike the Vox. For learning the material and rehearsals, it's convenient to have the facility to play back both WAV and mp3 files and it's so easy to save set lists. Even the 4-registration button limitation can be so easily overcome using the rotary dial and/or the "NEXT" button.

 

I don't have any use for the onboard rhythms or the looper on a gig and even the piano section barely gets a look-in (it's my upper-tier board), but I still find them useful when I'm working stuff out. Even the 3.5mm input can come in handy from time-to-time. Everything else is utilized to the max. 

 

Frankly I'm amazed that, over the past decade, there has been so little in the way of competition to this board. It's immediate, fun, versatile, with reasonably good sounds and FX at a very affordable price. I could pay four or five times the price and still have to accept compromises. It's also much more durable than expected. As for the YC61, I'm not going to buy a board with keys as narrow as that. The VR keys are a fraction narrower than standard, but not enough to cause problems: the YC is a step too far and not what I expect from a pro board.

[AnotherScott]

On 8/15/2024 at 6:26 PM, David Emm said:

This thread has long legs! I understand that the engine has a few lacks and the "drawbars" are tooth-clenching for serious organists. I simply note that with so few other 5-octave instruments around, this could have become a controller of choice for a lot of players if the keybed wasn't so uninviting. I guess Roland held back so it wouldn't hurt sales of their higher-end pieces. 

I don't think it had to do with not hurting sales of their higher end models, if for no other reason that, when the VR-09 came out, there was no higher end model that a VR09 customer would likely have found similarly appealing anyway (except maybe a leftover VR-700, but those weren't around for long). They didn't have other boards that included drawbar clonewheel functionality. If someone would have bought the VR-09 if it weren't for the action, rather than buy some higher end Roland, I think they would have been more likely to buy some non-Roland. So rather than lead to an upsell, the lesser action could I think more easily lead to a lost sale.

 

But I think it's interesting that, when they chose to add a 73-key version, they made the choice to also use a better action. So while again I wouldn't say they put a lackluster action in the 09 so as not to hurt sales of the 730 (they probably weren't even sure they'd be doing a 73 when they designed the 61), it does seem to indicate that, at least at some point, they realized that the action was one reason some people were turning their nose up at the 09, or would be willing to pay more for an improvement, and that a better action offering could make it less likely that someone would choose that non-Roland instead.

 

3 hours ago, voxpops said:

I've thought many times about the Nord Stage and always been put off by the fact you can't select a split point with precision (a feature I can't perform without)

Though even just in terms of the split function, there are serious trade-offs... neither is a great board for split purposes. Yes, the Roland beats the Nord in allowing you to freely place a split. OTOH, unlike the Stage, it limits you to only one split vs. multiple, and the two sounds you split don't have independent effects, and you can generally only have one sound on either side of the split (you mostly can't split and layer simultaneously), you can't send your split sounds to different outputs, you have less flexibility in easily recalling your saved split arrangements if you have a significant number of them (e.g. only 4 select buttons, a bank-up button but no bank-down, no selection via MIDI)... to me, that's a lot of split-beneficial functionality you have to lose to get that one other split function you want. I understand, that's the single most over-riding need for you, but to me, if I cared that much about split functionality to begin with to rule out the Nord, I'd probably rule out the Roland as well. 😉 

 

One other point, if you're comparing the VR09 (rather than the VR730) to the Stage... The fact that the Nord gives you 73 rather than 61 keys may also make it easier to live with less flexible split location. The fewer keys you have overall, the less flexibility you may have in exactly where a split point must be in order to give each sound the minimum key range you need it to have.

 

3 hours ago, voxpops said:

Frankly I'm amazed that, over the past decade, there has been so little in the way of competition to this board. It's immediate, fun, versatile, with reasonably good sounds and FX at a very affordable price. I could pay four or five times the price and still have to accept compromises. It's also much more durable than expected. As for the YC61, I'm not going to buy a board with keys as narrow as that. The VR keys are a fraction narrower than standard, but not enough to cause problems: the YC is a step too far and not what I expect from a pro board.

 

If you could live without the 9th physical drawbar and high trigger, Fantom-06/07 could hit the mark. Other than that, the Hammond SK Pro would probably be the other most viable contender, if you're okay with the polyphonic synth sounds being sample-based rather than VA (still fully editable, though, i.e. in terms of envelopes, filters, LFO, etc.). Still, you're in the range of double the weight and double the price. But it pretty much does address the main VR shortcomings (e.g. in terms of split functionality, multiple effects, patch selection, action, drawbar feel, MIDI functionality).

 

But of course, there's much to be said for making the most of what you've already paid for, too. 🙂