My long-winded, unsolicited NE3 review

[FunkKeysStuff]

I just got a shiny new Nord Electro 3 earlier this week. Since I haven't seen it discussed much on here yet, I thought I'd start a thread to ramble on about it a bit...

 

 

BACKGROUND

 

I got an original Nord Electro shortly after they came out, and I've been an unabashed fan ever since. That board, with its subsequent sound/software upgrades, has been my main gigging workhorse for the last however many years. (Six? Seven? Geez, I'm getting old.) In fact if I had to pick a single favorite board I've ever owned, that would be the one, hands-down. So if I sound a little biased and gushy, well, I probably am... but only because that board happened to be a perfect match for me, not because I have stock in the company or any such thing.

 

Still, much as I loved the NE2 for what it did, there were times when I wished it did just a little bit more; gigs when I could have used it alone (instead of bringing a separate digital piano along with it, which was my "standard" rig) if only the piano sound were better and it had a couple very basic string/pad/synthy sounds. And let's face it, even if it went against the "philosophy" of the instrument, a little reverb would have been nice. Plus, lately I'd been noticing that the action was no longer what it used to be. The NE3 seemed like it should, in theory, be the answer to all those concerns.

 

Since I'm new here, I should also explain that I'm kind of the opposite of the typical gear-junkie keyboardist. I hate buying new keyboards. I want to find something that does what I need, and does it as well and as simply as possible... and then I never want to have to think about it again. I mention this to illustrate how rare it is for me to do what I did with the NE3: ordered it sight unseen, without ever having played or heard one live.

 

The short answer: overall I'm happy with that decision.

 

 

FIRST IMPRESSIONS

 

The first tangible improvement was something I noticed while unpacking the box, before I ever plugged the board in: the power cable is about twice as long as the original's. I immediately flashed back to a handful of minor (but not negligible) headaches that this would have prevented, so it was nice to find.

 

Once the board was up and plugged in, I turned it on, waited for it to boot, plonked down a big two-fisted chord, and was greeted with something I'd been yearning to hear for years: a piano sound I could use on a gig, without feeling the need to apologize for it. A cursory bit of playing revealed that it was not what I'd call a great piano sound... but unlike its predecessor, it was functional. I wouldn't use it on a solo gig or jazz trio gig (not that I'd use a 61-note board for those anyway), but I'd be more than happy to use it in a typical band situation among guitars and vocals. What makes all the piano samples less than great is a weird, pervasive tinny quality that's hard to describe; the grands sound strangely like Yamaha electric grands, and the electric grand sounds like an RMI. (I imagine if it had an RMI sample, it would sound like an '80s video game or pocket calculator.) Nonetheless, I wasn't hoping for something I could play solo at a concert; I was hoping for something I could use on a gig, and I got it. One wish granted.

 

Scrolling up through the presets, the EPs sounded pretty much like those from the NE2. Since I'm a big fan of those, this is not remotely a complaint. Some of the Rhodes seem to have a little more bite and grunge in the attack, which is nice. The Wurli is a little bit buzzier at high velocities in the low end, which I'm actually not thrilled with. In fact it's the one sample where I'll say I liked the old one better. The Clav seems identical, though it benefitted greatly from a springy new action; the keys bounce back nice and quick for those all-important staccato snaps. (Note: the Clavinet is the only "vintage keyboard" about which I am an unapologetic snob, because it's the only one I've ever owned for real. The NE offers the only imitation of it that I actually enjoy playing, and that includes the various plug-ins and models.)

 

Next up were the organs. I knew the NE3 had a whole new organ engine, but the difference was greater than I was expecting. To be honest, at first I wasn't thrilled with it. However, I soon realized that this was because I had my NE2 organ sounds tweaked exactly the way I liked them, and I'd had them that way for so long, I'd forgotten that they didn't come that way right out of the box. Once I set up both boards side by side, dug in, and started listening and tweaking, I was able to get "my" sounds out of the NE3. There are differences that will take some getting used to -- like, the drawbar response isn't quite the same, so my settings needed some adjustment, and my "drawbar instinct" will have to be recalibrated. But as I learned my way around, I gradually got what I was looking for, and I have to say it sounds fantastic. The Leslie sim is a definite improvement, and the overall tone sounds ballsier and crisper. Bottom line, I lost track of time as I sat there playing all my usual jazz, blues, funk and rock organ stuff, with a big grin on my face.

 

Oh, and it has Vox and Farfisa sounds too, which I guess some players, somewhere, might have reason to use. I suppose I'll keep a couple of those presets stored up in the high numbers, so I'll have them in the unfortunate event that I'm ever on a gig where "Light My Fire" gets called.

 

Next up, something totally new in the NE world: samples of non-electro-mechanical-keyboard instruments. Long story short, the expected bases are covered, and covered admirably well. The assortment of strings, pads, brass, synth textures, mallets, etc. is a good mixed bag. I'm very glad they're there. What I'm even more glad about, however, is the ability to replace the ones I don't need with ones I like better, either from Clavia or home-grown. I haven't launched their sample editor yet, but in the coming weeks I definitely see myself spending some time putting it to work and loading up the board with my own samples. Assuming that all goes as planned, the board will become a truly awesomely useful tool.

 

Looking beyond the sounds themselves, the effects and the interface have undergone a significant overhaul from the NE2. Basically, because the NE3 offers more options, each option gets less space. This is where I'll get a little less gushy and a little more critical. The effects, while there are more of them, are not as flexible as they were in the NE2. On the old board, all the time-modulated effects (chorus, trem, phaser, etc.) had two knobs: one for rate, and one for depth. On the NE3, the depth knob is gone. Instead, you have only three depth levels to choose from -- low, medium or high. To me, this is the NE3's most serious drawback, and frankly, it kinda sucks. I'd be less hostile about it if the old models had the same implementation, but this is a blatant step backward. I like my Wurli with just a little touch of tremolo -- specifically, just a little bit less than the NE3's "low" setting. Similarly, when I go into Wish-I-Was-Richard-Tee mode, the amount of phaser I want on my Rhodes is right in between two of the levels on the NE3. In both cases, I'm screwed. Clavia, if you're reading this, this is the thing to fix. You spoiled us with earlier models, and now you've taken one of our toys away. Not our most cherished toy by any means, but nonetheless, one that we will kick and scream about when we want it and it's not there. I don't know how a full depth control could even be implemented since the physical knob for it is gone (shift + rate knob, maybe?); all I know is, I want it back.

 

The amp sims are new, and I imagine some people will enjoy having a choice of different amp types, though I was happy with the simple "overdrive" knob on the NE2. I wish the rotary overdrive was available without kicking in the rotation, but no such luck (and simply setting the rotation speed to "stop" doesn't cut it).

 

The other major downer is the way the presets are stored and accessed. Instead of the eight presets that one could reach with a single keystroke in the NE2, there are now a grand total of... two. Yes, you read that right, two. You can select between the A and B banks, but other than that, it's a flashback to the bad old days of '80s rack modules with a single pair of up/down buttons. Seriously. On a full-sized, professional-level keyboard. In 2009. Booo!

 

The good news is, that pretty much wraps up my significant criticisms of the instrument so far. There are a couple odd-but-not-bad quirks, like the fact that all the LEDs on the panel are red with one exception: the pair that indicates the Leslie speed has one red and one green. Given only that much info, you would probably assume that the green one was for fast (green = go), and the red one was for slow/stop, right? Wrong. They reversed it for some counterintuitive reason, so the fast one is red and the slow/stop one is green. Not that this will ever detract from the playing experience, of course; I simply thought it was an odd choice. Oh, and with the newly-designed "square" end pieces (as opposed to the old tapered ones), the NE3 comes so very close to being able to fit into the NE2 gig bag... but it doesn't. The cynic in me wonders if this was a deliberate ploy to force previous NE owners to buy a new bag, even if they wouldn't otherwise have needed one. (And I wouldn't have; my old one's faded and beaten up, but still going strong with no discernable structural damage. I hope the new one is as well-built.) I have this vision of many previous Electro owners ripping the bag while trying to cram the NE3 in there, but trust me, it ain't gonna happen.

 

 

ON THE GIG

 

After playing with it at home for only a couple days, I gave it its first real-world test on three nights' worth of gigs, all with a rock/soul cover band at a bar in a popular tourist trap. My plan was to bring my standard digital-piano-and-NE rig, and simply replace the NE2 with the NE3. However, at the last minute I decided to take a chance and ditch the piano, bringing only the NE3. This was partly because I wasn't sure how much space I'd have onstage (first time with this band at this particular club), and partly just because that's what I had been hoping to be able to do anyway. So trial by fire it was.

 

It turned out to be the right choice. A two-board rig would have made things unpleasantly crowded, and the NE3 performed like a champ. The piano sound actually sounded better onstage than it had at home, which was a pleasant surprise. The organ, EPs and Clav were an absolute joy ("Superstition" suddenly became fun again), and the other samples covered everything I needed -- good ballsy brass for the "Brick House" horn stabs, enough synth textures to cover the Journey and Bon Jovi stuff (and even a pretty good "Jump" synth), nice strings when I needed them. I had the foresight to group all the presets I thought I'd need together, so even if I couldn't recall them instantly, at least I'd only have to scroll up or down a few steps rather than, say, sixty. This proved to be a lifesaver, and a strategy I'll definitely stick with as I customize the thing further.

 

One slightly worrying quibble: I changed the tremolo rate on the Wurli patch from its default setting and saved it, yet sometimes when I recalled it, I found it had switched back to the default rate. I would then change it and save it again, and sometimes it would stay where I wanted it -- but a few times it randomly switched back. I'm hoping this is just a glitch that will magically go away when I upgrade to the latest OS, which I haven't done yet.

 

 

CONSLUSIONS

 

Overall the NE3 does exactly what I had hoped it would do: allows me the option of doing a typical band gig with a single, 22-pound board I can carry on my back (that is, once the new gig bag gets here, and I no longer have it floating around ridiculously inside an 88-key GigSkinz bag). Of course there will still be times when I'll want a separate piano for added fexibility, multi-part playing, etc. But it is so, so nice to have the option to bring only one board if I want to, and know it can do everything I need. For that, it's worth what I paid for it. There are things about it that aren't perfect, as I discussed earlier, and I hope the things that can be improved will be. But even if they're not, it's still a considerable upgrade to my previous favorite board, and a worthy successor.

[Roland Genske]

Hi FunkKeys!

 

 

Thank you for this comprehensive and informative review!

[Jeff_D_in_MD]

Thanks for the detailed review. The main thing that would make me hesitate (besides $$$) is the absence of the 8 preset buttons like on the NE2. A better acoustic piano sound would be great, however, and might make up for the preset deficiency.

 

Speaking of the piano: there are several different Ac. Piano sounds available for NE2. What keeps Nord from offering NE3-quality pianos for the NE2? Is it just marketing, or is there a technical reason?

 

 

[Joe Muscara]

AFAIK, it's a tech reason. There ain't enough memory in the NE2 for the Stage pianos. Otherwise, it seems they would have given them to us a long time ago. (After the Stage came out, I think they gave NE2 owners cut down versions that would fit.)

 

Thanks for the review, FunkKeys!

[Outkaster]

"Since I haven't seen it discussed much on here yet, I thought I'd start a thread to ramble on about it a bit"

 

There are some detailed threads on this and over on HC forums. I know a few guys that have the NE3.

[ITGITC]

Thanks for the review.

 

But other than weight, why would someone choose this red keyboard over a KURZWEIL PC3?

 

 

 

[Calumet]

Thanks for the review.

 

But other than weight, why would someone choose this red keyboard over a KURZWEIL PC3?

 

 

 

 

1. The EPs are better in the Nord. I tried both. The Kurzweil's are good but they aren't playable across the range of the board...and they seem like smoke and mirrors compared to the natural feel and sound of the Nord. When you put effects (like an amp sim) on the Nord EPs, they react as you would expect the real thing to react.

 

2. The organ. You can't even begin to compare them.

 

 

The Kurz probably wins on the piano front.

 

[Mogut]

Armed with the NE3 and a workstation/digital piano board, you shouldnt need for much more.

[ITGITC]

 

1. The EPs are better in the Nord. I tried both. The Kurzweil's are good but they aren't playable across the range of the board...and they seem like smoke and mirrors compared to the natural feel and sound of the Nord. When you put effects (like an amp sim) on the Nord EPs, they react as you would expect the real thing to react.

 

2. The organ. You can't even begin to compare them.

 

 

The Kurz probably wins on the piano front.

 

 

Unfortunately, I have yet to get my hands on the Kurzweil PC3. I have a PC2X.

 

I haven't heard the Electro 3 yet either, although I've played the Electro 2.

 

The electric pianos are good on the Electro 2. But the action isn't my favorite. But in all fairness, it's tough to come up with a semi-weighted compromise that will work for electric pianos, clavinet, acoustic pianos, and Hammond organ simulation, right?

 

And I agree that the Hammond simulations are good on the Electro 2. But it doesn't have drawbars. That doesn't bother me too much, but some prefer the panel to be laid out just like a Hammond. Fair enough. The PC3 has nine (9) drawbars/sliders. I think that's at least a move in the right direction. (Pun intended, of course.)

 

The Nord's acoustic pianos... well I wouldn't care to use them in a solo setting or a trio. I just can't see paying $1,700 for a NE2 and having to defend the acoustic piano sounds at a gig. Ouch. They are asking $2,200 for the NE3 with newer acoustic pianos (and some reverb)? For an additional $500 I hope they're much better. But nobody buys an Electro for the acoustic pianos.

 

So I need to try the electric pianos on the Kurzweil PC3. I don't have a problem with mine on the PC2. Sure, the upper register on the Rhodes programs need a bit of tweaking; that's well documented on the forums. But the midrange and bass notes are fine. When I'm playing EP, that's where my hands stay most of the time anyway.

 

In the latest version of the Kurzweil PC3 OS, they fixed the Leslie Sim, according to MoodyBluesKeys. Do the organs on the PC3 sound as good as the Electro 3? I haven't had a chance to compare them. It may not be a deal-breaker to many, but not having drawbars on the Nord never has been a plus.

 

The PC3 has a better variety of really good samples along with great programming (over 850 new presets). With improvements in VAST, I understand that they're better-sounding than the PC2X. If that's true, then they are very, very good.

 

And, the PC3 is a much more capable controller keyboard than the Electro.

 

We're lucky to have two excellent keyboards to choose from here. But for me, the acoustic piano programs are paramount. Although the Electro 3 has great-sounding electric pianos, Hammond organ sim, and weighs less than the Kurzweil, I still think the PC3 is the best bargain.

 

The Electros are a pretty shade of red though.

 

 

 

[bhodaway10]

Thanks for the review!

 

IGITC that makes total sense. I also think the PC3 (if they fix the organ) might be a better deal than the Electro. I did play the PC3x and thought it was very nice. I would love to feel the action on the PC3 vs. the Electro.

 

 

 

 

[Chris Link]

Thanks for another thoughtful review. I didn't realize the effects were less tweakable on the new model. That is unfortunate. The presets sound less useful as well.

 

You got the 61, right? I moved up to the the 73 so that I could comfortably gig with just the NE (especially where space is an issue). The 61 was just too short to play piano. If you're still within your time to send it back, consider trading up to the 73.

 

Thanks again. enjoy the new toy!

[Mogut]

I dont see how you can compare the 2 boards really. That is not apples to apples.

[ITGITC]

I dont see how you can compare the 2 boards really. That is not apples to apples.

 

I just did.

 

One has 73 keys and is $2,200.

 

The other has 76 keys and is $2,300.

 

They both have unweighted or lightly-weighted (but not fully-weighted) keyboards.

 

They both do EPs, Clavs, Organs.

 

One has 850 presets, while the other has less... but a few of them sound really good.

 

I think there are many musicians comparing these two right now. For those who are seeking good EPs, Clavs, and organ sounds - they are definitely in the same ballpark.

 

For those who play solo piano or in a jazz trio where the acoustic piano sound is prominent. Well, in that regard they really can't be compared.

 

 

[Mogut]

the nord a is monotimbral emulator... PC3 is multitimbral board, with alot of workstation/synthesizer/controller features. Hardly comparable.

 

...get a workstation before you buy a "one trick pony" like the nord

[bhodaway10]

Here is apost on the sonikmatter forums regarding the "new" PC3 organs (with a post from MoodyBlues as well) :

 

http://community.sonikmatter.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=43350

 

 

 

 

[ITGITC]

the nord a is monotimbral emulator... PC3 is multitimbral board, with alot of workstation/synthesizer/controller features. Hardly comparable.

 

...get a workstation before you buy a "one trick pony" like the nord

 

Agreed.

 

However, there are lots of musicians who want the bread and butter sounds that these two boards offer.

 

Both are in the running simply because they are within $100 of each other and each provides the user with solid bread and butter sounds.

 

I like them both. Our moderator does too. In fact, he owns both.

 

In the list of important features, for many I believe that the quality of the sounds and playability of the action and front panel controls comes first.

 

In fact, I would wager that many may purchase one board or the other without contemplating the benefits of whether it is a is monotimbral emulator or a multitimbral board... with workstation/synthesizer/controller features.

 

The price is comparable. They have many of the same sounds. They have 73/76 keys.

 

Of course, one is red.

 

 

[ITGITC]

Here is apost on the sonikmatter forums regarding the "new" PC3 organs (with a post from MoodyBlues as well) :

 

http://community.sonikmatter.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=43350

 

 

 

 

And that's surely another plus for team Kurzweil - they are actively listening, tweaking, and providing real-time feedback to their users on the Sonikmatter forum.

 

It doesn't get any better than that.

 

 

[kanker.]

The Kurz probably wins on the piano front.

Not if you like piano...

[ITGITC]

The Kurz probably wins on the piano front.

Not if you like piano...

 

 

...and warmed-over beer while listening with one ear plugged up so that you can get a realistic MONO effect at all times - through all sources.

 

Hi Kevin.

 

Where are ya now?

 

Have you finished with the tour?

 

[GDP]

Have you tried any of the Piano samples from the Nord website? They have a demo of the Steinway D that sounds good....I wonder if it is better/worse than the factory loaded pianos.

[drawback]

Welcome to the shark pit, FunkKeysStuff.

 

You had me at Wish-I-Was-Richard-Tee.

 

Cheers!

[Dana.]

The Kurz probably wins on the piano front.

Not if you like piano...

 

+1

[kanker.]

The Kurz probably wins on the piano front.

Not if you like piano...

 

 

...and warmed-over beer while listening with one ear plugged up so that you can get a realistic MONO effect at all times - through all sources.

 

Hi Kevin.

 

Where are ya now?

 

Have you finished with the tour?

Home for a minute, which is good. Back at it in early June and then hit the ground running in July. Still trying to fool someone into taking me back to the Triangle...

 

How bout yourself?

[Tonysounds]

The Nord Electro is NOT a jack-of-all-trades keyboard or workstation like the Kurzweil PC3 is. And like anything in life, it seems that when you want a specific tool for a job, that tool costs more than the multi-purpose hammer/pliers/screwdriver/duct tape.

 

Bear in mind that while the Kurzweil is a great machine, it has the same problems with its pianos that the Nord has: you either love them or you hate them. The difference here is that the Electro is including them, but they are not a designed function of the product line. Ive owned both, but I only OWN the Nord now.

 

To get to the point why would you choose the Nord Electro 3 comes down to this: if you want a keyboard that most faithfully reproduces the sound and functionality of the Hammond organ, Hohner Clavinet, Fender Rhodes, Wurlitzer 200A and Yamaha Cp80, and Mellotron (and yes, the Mellotron was an electromechanical keyboard!), as well as the immediacy of those instruments in terms of changing its sound, NOTHING comes near Nord for that. I wish it had drawbars, but I have no problem with the buttons.

 

You cant compare the sound of the Electro 3 to Kurzweils KB3 mode: one sounds like a really good ROMpler, one sounds like a great organ. And while the multi-layers of the PC3s Rhodes sounds are really sweet sounding, again, they dont compare at all; wanna throw some phaser on there for the chorus? Reach over, and hit the button and spin the knob (wow, its just like having a Small Stone or a Mutron BiPhase sitting on top). Sure, you can do that on the PC3, let me just get into the menu real quick, and.Same goes for wah on the clav, trem on the Wurlie, grind on the Hammond, or ring modulator on any of them. Wanna try a different amp? Hit the button on the Electro and turn the knob. You cannot get that immediate satisfaction from the PC3.

 

This is not to disparage the Kurzweil PC3: its a beautiful sounding instrument, and is capable of a whole lot more than the Electro. Kurzweils Virtual Analog and Orchestral sounds are frankly stunning. But in terms of electro-mechanical emulations, if thats what you really want and are concentrating on, the PC3 is not the right board for you. If youre looking for a great digital piano at the expense of all else, I wouldnt recommend either the Electro or the PC3. But there again, youll need to concentrate on a specialty tool.

 

[Dana.]

Something that I find to be lose-lose about the NE3 and PC3 are the actions. Unless you're primarily playing organ, playing piano and electric piano on those overly-springy actions is a compromise many, including myself, can't make. That's why there's a little group of us on the forum waiting for rack versions.

[Chris Link]

The Nord Electro is NOT a jack-of-all-trades keyboard or workstation like the Kurzweil PC3 is. And like anything in life, it seems that when you want a specific tool for a job, that tool costs more than the multi-purpose hammer/pliers/screwdriver/duct tape.

 

This from the Nord Electro web page sums up the Electro philosophy nicely: "Sometimes the best tool isnt a Swiss Army Knife."

 

[Outkaster]

Why would you want to play piano on a non-weighted action or organ on a weighted action. I just don't get that.

[Calumet]

I don't. That's why I bought a Nord Stage to go with my Nord Electro 3!

[Mogut]

these 2 boards are completely different animals.

[kanker.]

Why would you want to play piano on a non-weighted action or organ on a weighted action. I just don't get that.

Occasionally, necessity...