ElmerJFudd
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Posts posted by ElmerJFudd
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I asked when the Gemini card was released if they had any intention of supporting sf2 or offering a way for users to create or upload their own samples, open it to third party dev, etc. I recall it not being in the works but not impossible.
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^^^
Sounds like an accessory opportunity for Crumar to investigate. Mojo mount for the Seven.
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If you want a 2 keyboard rig, with the bottom being the Seven and the top being a combination of a clonewheel-level organ that also covers all the likely synth needs, then an NS Compact is the way to go, isn't it? The better clonewheels won't cover other bases nearly as well, while boards that cover the other bases as well or better than the Compact are will have organ that falls significantly shorter of clonewheel quality. Are there other good candidates for that role I'm forgetting?
I feel discussion about the Seven's piano, while interesting, is largely academic. From what I can tell, the piano sounds good enough for band use. It may not satisfy the pickier amongst us for solo use, but then those are likely to be the same folks who wouldn't want to play solo piano on TP100 action. There's probably a very small segment of players for whom the Seven is the right tool only if the APs are good enough to rival the best from Nord, Korg, Yamaha, etc. If you're Crumar, then the question is how much resources do you invest to try to appeal to that small (though possibly vocal) segment.
Good points.
Other things to stick on top...
Forte 6 - if it ever shows up. PC3A6
Korg Kronos 61
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No problem, I thought maybe you owned both and compared both to a real piano to understand the differences. Guido's piano is modeled, the Nord is not. There are probably some nuances that Guido included in the modeling that Nord does not have because the Nord is sampled. And you didn't do a comparison of the two side by side. I just wanted to understand the basis of your statement. Thanks.
From what weve heard from the acoustic piano in the Mojo61 and the Seven acoustic pianos is something Crumar needs to work on. Sampled, modeled or otherwise. In mixed band context where the AP timbre is tweaked and frequency range is narrowed then placed in a mix, what they have is probably good enough or even just right for some of us. But if you play solo there are definitely better options. Ill place the obligatory IMHO so as not to cause a riot, but Im sure Im not alone in this assessment until we hear otherwise. Im working on an appointment to sit at the Seven - when I do Ill bring audio of the AP and post.
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Sweet!
But rather expensive way to get a better acoustic piano.....
No doubt. But it does get you your pick of their piano library and sample synth stuff (including a tool to add your own), a very good synth engine, and a competitive organ as well. You dont get anywhere close to it by sticking a Mojo61 on top. Unless, theres a single manual DMC in 73/76k with the full Gemini forth coming.
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I'm working to fit the new AP model into the Gemini, for this reason I had to delay the new update... Otherwise it was ready by the 12th of March but wasn't released for this very reason.
I doubt that a bigger enterprise can work faster... Yes, more people mean more work done, but doesn't mean that it's done faster. Here... it's sunday evening and I'm talking about job in a public forum. If I was an employee of a bigger company I'd be doing something else right now. And I would probably hate my boss
You wouldnt have to stay up so late, Guido if you moved to the states.
But youre right, even if you didnt hate your boss 20 years ago you would have learned to by now.
I think things have moved quickly since finishing the Gemini hardware and moving your instruments to DSP. That was perhaps the biggest task, I can imagine. Also, the Seven seemed to come out of nowhere, very much a surprise in design and concept. Not for everyone but definitely for the EP fan that wants to go digital. Would love to see the Gemini in a 73/76k synth action with waterfall keys just as long as you dont forget pitch and mod wheels for the synth engine. If thats not something on the radar then the desktop/rack hopefully is selling well enough to stay in production and get updates.
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Unfortunately developers of all sizes push out silicon with unfinished business. They pretty much all need to fix bugs without exception. However some are better than others at addressing issues, and some actually continue development (new OS, user requested features, new sounds, etc.). Although sales is typically the key ingredient to updates. If theyve sold enough of them, its going to get extended support. If they havent, development gets the axe. And thats how it goes.
I guess thats one reason to select a tride and true instrument like a PC3 or something after its been out for a while. Being first in line for the latest and greatest makes us beta testers. And if the developer doesnt have a hit on their hands - who knows if bugs will ever get fixed or promised features implemented?
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Thats not to far from me. Ill give a call and see if thats the case.
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Can you share where there is a Seven on a showroom floor?
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And yet to my knowledge they have never stated this in an official capacity. Heck they use their own marketing speak to refer to TP/100, TP/40 and TP/8O.
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If you purchased a Gemini module you could trigger the VB3 organ with an organ controller of your choice and trigger the EP's from an EP controller of your choice. You're basically getting the same sound set (except for the acoustic piano), with bi-timbrality for 1/2 the cost and could play it from the keybed of your choice.
Right. GSi has this covered and of youre particularly picky on action (like a lot of us) this would be the route to go. It might be possible to get the piano running on the Gemini - it doesnt thrill me today and the Gemini has a sample if you really need it - I know Jazz+ is hot to get the AP model on his Mojo61. Im more inclined to go Gemini desktop/rack route than the Seven. Although the Sevens user interface looks like candy and the build is retro stylish - and ANY action made plays better than my MkI. But thats not saying much!
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in our experience, when you are dealing with "hammer action keyboards" the chassis of the instrument is a part of the keybed itself and can make a big difference.
So that we can get a better idea about the Seven in comparison to other TP/100 instruments - which version did you go with and how does the Sevens chassis play into the key drop.
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Hi, Andrea. Ive no doubt you tried others and found the TP/100 was best that could be had for the Sevens design. Waldorf decided the same on the Zarenbourg. Its not my action of choice. There are some that are satisfied with it on some Nord products too - some just like it, some accept it for the weight trade off.
Jim, before you send it back. Are there any KCers your friendly with nearby that can pop over to give it a spin?
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Very useful info, Jim. I'm also not a fan of the TP/100, I don't know what exactly makes it particularly awful on the Arturia or the Seven (if it's the AT strip, hard to say without taking it apart), but I'm not surprised you didn't go for it.
Do you have MIDI on your VV Electric Piano?
Also, can you share some actions that you've played that you feel would be a better match for the sounds in the Seven?
Roland A-88 has the Ivory Feel G (this is the one that Spectrasonics used in all their Keyscape demos). I find the drop on this action shallow for acoustic piano playing, but it might be a better match for EPs. My MkI's action is terrible, btw.
Studio Logic SL73 or 88 TP/100LR (this does have an after touch strip)
Studio Logic SL88 Grand TP/40Wood (also has after touch strip)
Arturia Keylab 88 (as you mentioned this is also a TP/100 with aftertouch)
Doepfer LMK4+, LMK2+, PK88 TP/40GH (with aftertouch)
As a side note...
The Kurzweil Forte and Forte 7 are both equipped with the TP/40L and aftertouch.
If able to pair with just the right controller, I'd personally be more inclined to look at the Gemini for these sounds than the Seven (as awesome as it looks, the build quality as you've eluded to, and the real time interface controls). We all know the TP/100 is a weight/price choice that a lot of developers are stuck with.
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Just got my Seven last night.
Ill post later tonight with my initial impressions versus my VV
Great news. Congrats.
Cant wait to hear.
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Thanks for sharing, Dave.
Great read. Useful info.
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That's a tough call between the 8 and 16.
IMO, 8 is great for monotimbral but split/layer capability definitely makes a strong case for 16.
Ya, but I know no gig I'm playing would be doable on a 61k synth - even one as potent as the Prologue. Like the OP, it would be ancillary. Heck, I'd even be interested in keyless desktop or rack version.
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My brain went on GAS fire when the prologue was announced. That's a tough call between the 8 and 16. You don't need the 16 for leads, bass lines, and comping chords in a band with 3 or more other instruments. It's a respectable decision. IMHO
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The problem with the real thing is that they all sound different and you dont know what youre going to get. Then you have to physically mechanically tweek it to get what you want by adjusting how every key on the action vibrates the tines and where the pickup is located for every tine with screw adjustments. Then theres preamp mods, mods for adding analog fx and controls (like the quadrapuss for example) then you get into tube amp and speaker selection and then you may want to mod those to get more of what youre after. Modeling can do for the electro mechanicals what its done for the guitar world.
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Embedded for the click averse:
[video:youtube]
Excellent. Beautiful model of a Rhodes piano.
Nice bark, able to be clear and warm/dirty with velocity. I wonder if this example is using the amp sim?
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The Gemini module with its dual DSPs does splits and layers?
And do you need to create these patches with web browser over WiFi?
Or can you do it from the front panel with input from your keyboard controller?
And how easy is it to recall patches from a controller keyboard with the Gemini module?
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I'm guessing that if Guido has already figured out how to do it better, he'd have done it. Or who knows, maybe it's in progress.
And I can confirm that I am still working on improving the AP and the CP models... It's likely that the Seven will see its first firmware update very soon.
But it's also possible that a top quality modeled piano is simply a particularly hard nut to crack, and we (and perhaps Guido himself) cannot yet tell when (or if) such an implementation from him will happen.
I couldn't have said it better.
excellent
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Abeck sold his DMC-122, no?
It was that someone else.
I just did a gig with 2 guys on jazz guitar who are right now in university. They played great. The future is not lost. Though jazz will never be pop radio again, The EDM sound will fade and playing styles will return.
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Again I ask: When has Guido NOT done this? He built a little VST that turned into one of the best tonewheel emulations in the world thru many updates. Ditto for his leslie simulator. Ditto for his reed piano model. Ditto for his clavinet model. Ditto for his tine piano module. They are all among the best in the world now.
What makes anybody think that having conquered all these, he is going to sit on his hands and not apply his energy and creativity to the acoustic piano model?
I'm sure this is true - but it's not the case at the moment and that's a factor for me. YMMV. I'd love to have the Seven, but it's an impractical purchase, luxury item (again, for me). It would stay home, maybe I'd drag out to jam with friends from time to time.
You may be overestimating the aesthetic sensitivity of the average solo piano audience. I haven't heard anything in the videos that would make people drop their dinner forks and flee from the room.
I'd agree that for someone who does lots of solo piano work and only occasionally plays band stuff where EPs are needed, the Seven may not be a logical choice.
Things have changed the last few years, you know. Kurzweil Forte, Nord Piano Library, Yamaha Motif... with competition from software piano developers they couldn't offer a 40mb acoustic piano on a ROM any longer. Our expectations are higher. And with the amount of time we put into playing our repertoire well - it means a lot to us to have a portable digital piano that really sounds like the real deal - and this includes the amplification problem issue too. It's not easy getting a digital instrument to sing like an acoustic.
Most audience/listeners only hear basic timbre (that's a piano, that's an organ, etc.). Very true. And while they can't tell the difference in the details - they can tell if something is honky, abrasive, tinny, too cutting. You see this by them walking away from the speaker - knowingly or subconsciously. I don't think that this is the case with the piano model we are hearing on the seven. To me it sounds quite thin in the sustain/decay, and the variation in attack is not what I am wanting to hear. But they haven't offered much to go by yet. Would really like to hear Guido solo this engine like he has with the CP and the Rhodes.
Again, reiterating - I do find this instrument desirable. I love the concept. The AP is important to me however, and I have to be sold on the action. But these things are true on every instrument from every developer (for me). Again. YMMV.
Crumar Seven
in The Keyboard Corner
Posted