External Power Supplies revisited

[Old No7]

Wall Warts...

 

Wonder how many came from keyboards???

 

Old No7

 

[Anderton]

It's a way to avoid having to go through UL. If the power supply has been certified, the company doesn't have to get certification for an onboard supply. Saves money and time for the company, so I sympathize...even though it's a PITA for us. 

 

The first thing I do with any product that has a wall wart is put a non-removable label on it with the name of the associated product!

[sunspot]

31 minutes ago, Anderton said:

The first thing I do with any product that has a wall wart is put a non-removable label on it with the name of the associated product!

 

Oh, the number of times I have cursed myself for not doing this and throwing it in the wall wart storage bin with the rest of the ones that I did my job properly and labeled!

[CEB]

External power supplies are a pain in the keister, but it’s not all bad. 

Many synth repairs have been power supply related. With an external power supply there is no bench time needed.   
 

I still prefer an internal supply fed by a standard IEC cord. 

[DroptopBroham]

54 minutes ago, CEB said:

I still prefer an internal supply fed by a standard IEC cord. 

Okay boomer.

[Mighty Motif Max]

1 hour ago, CEB said:

External power supplies are a pain in the keister, but it’s not all bad. 

Many synth repairs have been power supply related. With an external power supply there is no bench time needed.   
 

I still prefer an internal supply fed by a standard IEC cord. 

 

6 minutes ago, DroptopBroham said:

Okay boomer.

Gen Z’er here - I in fact strongly prefer the IEC cable method. For one thing, you can easily find those cables almost anywhere, so if you show up to a gig and realize you forgot your power cord, you can go to the nearest Walmart/Target/Best Buy/etc and get yourself one for $10 or so. I don’t worry about the thin wires getting bent over time either, unlike many external PSU’s. But I can live with those.

[eric]

I've shunned keyboards with wall warts for decades, LOL. Way back in 1988, I had my tech remove the power cord from my DX7IIFD (which was a permanent internal supply with attached cord) and replace with an IEC port so I didn't have to deal with that cable during transport. 

 

The only current gear I use with wall warts is permanently mounted in a rack with all of those things neatly zipped in place and velcro'd inside the rack.

[Delaware Dave]

i was going to buy a pc4 when they came out but learned it had an external PS rather than an IEC connection so i passed on it.  never had a ps issue with any k/b i've ever owned and they've all been internal.

[Dave Bryce]

1 hour ago, DroptopBroham said:

Okay boomer.

What does when you were born have to do with preferring internal power supplies over wall warts? 🤔

 

dB

 

 

[Old No7]

3 hours ago, Anderton said:

The first thing I do with any product that has a wall wart is put a non-removable label on it with the name of the associated product!

 

And the second thing to do -- if you'll be gigging with it -- is to buy a brand new 2nd unit, make sure it works, and always keep it in the keyboard's gig bag/case.

 

Old No7

[Anderton]

46 minutes ago, Dave Bryce said:

What does when you were born have to do with preferring internal power supplies over wall warts? 🤔

 

It doesn't, they have the same advantages and disadvantages no matter how old you are 🤣

[Anderton]

1 hour ago, Old No7 said:

And the second thing to do -- if you'll be gigging with it -- is to buy a brand new 2nd unit, make sure it works, and always keep it in the keyboard's gig bag/case.

 

Words of wisdom! And keep a third one at home if the power supply is proprietary.

[DroptopBroham]

This IEC thing comes up all the time when new keyboards come out. Most come out with external power supplies, deal with it. I've never forgotten an external power supply at home or at a gig, never had one fail on me except the original one I had with my Fizmo but that was a Fizmo issue that fried the power supply.

 

I'm just getting tired of all these boomers here complaining about external power supplies banging the IEC drum. Imagine the silent cries from the silent generation what is was like before the internet when keyboards moved from having hardwired power cables to IEC cables. "What if I forget my cable at home?" Oh no the travesty. 

 

Are we all just going to be playing through KC500's with it's hardwired power cable, when the KC600 is much more advanced and better sounding just because some random dolt forgets his IEC cable at home? 

 

It seems to be a boomer thing. There's a lot of great gear with external power supplies, mixers, synths, modules, pedals, to pass on technology because of it is idiotic. In this forum where everyone is using electronic keyboards it doesn't make sense that half the forum are luddites. I can see if I was on pianoworld but this is keyboard corner.

 

External power supplies bring a lot to the table, big upside, from lighter keyboards to being easily replaceable without a service visit. It's 2024, get with the times.

[Stokely]

For me, a wall wart is not the reason to not buy a piece of gear, but it's "a" reason.  It's a mark in the "con" column.   Being able to use standard power cables is a mark in the "pro" column.   

Assuming it's not dry humor he whole "boomer" thing gets really old.  Isn't there some other more creative way to insult people?  "Boomer" is what my teenaged kid used to say all the time before he grew up a bit and turned 17.  And for the record, I ain't one.

If you are stuck with a wart, two suggestions (one I already saw).

- labels - I finally got wise, bought some tab labels that fold over the cable with velcro.  They have a small writing surface, better would be printable ones I guess.
- sleeve - that same flex sleeve I use for larger snakes comes in tiny sizes.  I put some 1/8" (iirc) around one wart cable and it really helps.  The wire is thicker and stiffer with the sleeve, coils up and doesn't tangle or catch on anything.

I also tend to buy a 2nd wart for important gear, and keep the backup in my backup gear case.   Has saved me a couple times when I was practicing at home and forgot the wart when I packed up the keyboard.  And that right there is the main reason I prefer standard cables--I not only have backups, but the rest of the band also uses them.  But hey whatever floats everyone's boat!

[BluMunk]

1 hour ago, DroptopBroham said:

I'm just getting tired of all these boomers here complaining about external power supplies banging the IEC drum. Imagine the silent cries from the silent generation what is was like before the internet when keyboards moved from having hardwired power cables to IEC cables. "What if I forget my cable at home?" Oh no the travesty. 

 

Are we all just going to be playing through KC500's with it's hardwired power cable, when the KC600 is much more advanced and better sounding just because some random dolt forgets his IEC cable at home? 

 

It seems to be a boomer thing. There's a lot of great gear with external power supplies, mixers, synths, modules, pedals, to pass on technology because of it is idiotic. In this forum where everyone is using electronic keyboards it doesn't make sense that half the forum are luddites. I can see if I was on pianoworld but this is keyboard corner.

... and many here are using that gear. The first three (and only) responses to the thread before you "ok boomer"-ed it were people talking about how they manage using external power supplies.

No one in this thread has said they "pass on technology" because of external power supply. Conversely- form factor, aesthetics, ease of set-up, and a host of other things go into decisions to purchase one piece of gear over another. There's nothing "luddite" about preferring internal power, just as there's nothing luddite to preferring mod wheels above the keys vs to the left, vs mod paddle vs mod strips. I don't think you have an understanding of what "luddite" means. Internal vs external power is not an old vs new technology.

I don't know why you're so pissed off, or who you think you're fighting with, but you seem to have made up a position that no one has taken, assumed a demographic, and decided to drop insults instead of just sharing your experience, or explaining your opinion. 

At any rate, this millennial will continue to gig with his board with external power, while also wishing the board had an internal power supply.

[Delaware Dave]

9 minutes ago, BluMunk said:

... and many here are using that gear. The first three (and only) responses to the thread before you "ok boomer"-ed it were people talking about how they manage using external power supplies.

No one in this thread has said they "pass on technology" because of external power supply. Conversely- form factor, aesthetics, ease of set-up, and a host of other things go into decisions to purchase one piece of gear over another. There's nothing "luddite" about preferring internal power, just as there's nothing luddite to preferring mod wheels above the keys vs to the left, vs mod paddle vs mod strips. I don't think you have an understanding of what "luddite" means. Internal vs external power is not an old vs new technology.

I don't know why you're so pissed off, or who you think you're fighting with, but you seem to have made up a position that no one has taken, assumed a demographic, and decided to drop insults instead of just sharing your experience, or explaining your opinion. 

At any rate, this millennial will continue to gig with his board with external power, while also wishing the board had an internal power supply.

 

he still uses a kc500 so what does he know, just ignore him.

 

[The Real MC]

Wall warts are banned from my stage rig and from my studio.

Very few devices in my system require external power supplies, and I use the old Juice Goose 12Paq to replace the wall warts.

[Stokely]

Ah yeah, that's another thing you can do--get a power supply.  Gets tougher I think with 15V or 18V units, the typical guitar power supplies won't work.   Cioks and Eventide make them, they are not cheap though.  I think some forum members here use these, sounds like that Juice Goose might be similar.  I'm in a minimal phase not even using a pedalboard right now, but if i go back to using it I might pick something like that up.

[BluMunk]

I just had a Roland FP-7 in for repair because the power supply would not stay reliably connected. Which to me highlights one of the more crappy things about external power supplies as implemented by most manufacturers: the connectors are cheap (both on the PSU and the gear itself), and do not stand up to a long life of setup/teardown.

I am reminded of the first mixer I bought back in the late 90s- a small Behringer that had this massive external PSU, and the connector had three pins and had a ring that screwed onto the mixer for a reliable connection. If more PSUs had more robust connectors and cables, instead of those tiny barrel and pin types, I'd be less suspicious of them.

[Shamanzarek]

The only external power supplies I have had a problem with is Kurzweil. I had a PC88 and the PSU failed. It took months to get a replacement as they were out of stock. I got a PC2 and it had a proprietary PSU with a four pin DIN connector. I had problems with this, too. This wasn't the only issue with Kurzweil but I have stayed away from them ever since.

 

I now use Casio keyboards for most bar gigs because I can't risk expensive keyboards. The external power supplies for these seem to be readily available and aren't too expensive.

 

I also have a Nord Stage 3 Compact which has internal power so all that is needed is an IEC cord which for some reason didn't come with the keyboard when I bought it.

[Stokely]

As an aside, my Nord Stage 3 refused to turn on at my last gig (Sunday, NYE).  Scared the hell out of me, with great hope and trepidation I tried a different cable and it worked into the trash went the other one.   

Which is why the other reason to have a backup wart and backup cables is if it fails, though I can't recall one failing on me until that gig.  Usually I leave it someplace.   User error, sure, but sometimes you just have to try to moron-proof your rig!  

 

[marino]

4 hours ago, Stokely said:

For me, a wall wart is not the reason to not buy a piece of gear, but it's "a" reason.  It's a mark in the "con" column.   Being able to use standard power cables is a mark in the "pro" column.  

 

Same here. And as external PSUs for different units keep accumulating with time, an internal PSU on a new device is more and more a "pro" point.

[kenheeter]

I guess a lot of the pros are boomers......

[Jim Alfredson]

I just modified my Hammond SK2 so it has an internal power supply. I always hated that damn line wart with the proprietary (or at least very uncommon) barrel connection. I gave my SK2 to a friend and couldn't burden him with the shitty original PSU.

My other bane: Attached power cords. Very common on older synths and if I can, I remove them an add a standard IEC panel mount jack.

[rogs]

My biggest gripe with wall warts is the number of different types available. 

OK, the output DC voltage and current capabilites need to be matched to the device to be powered, but there are a bewildering number of different connection options that also need to match.

• 2.1 mm 'power plug'  connctors

• 2.5 mm 'power plug' connectors 

• Various other diameter 'power plug' connectors (less common)

• Centre terminal positive

• Centre terminal negative

Some wall warts come with a selection of output volatges available , and some with 'reversible' power plug connections, but these tend to be pretty unreliable in my experience.

Shame there doesn't seem to have been any attempt at standardisation?

You can bet your life that when you need to replace a wall wart urgently the only 'spares' lying around will have the wrong output voltage -- and/or the wrong size/polarity connector!

 

[jazzpiano88]

On 1/4/2024 at 3:38 PM, Dave Bryce said:

On 1/4/2024 at 2:26 PM, DroptopBroham said:

Okay boomer.

What does when you were born have to do with preferring internal power supplies over wall warts? 🤔

It doesn’t.  She/he appears to have prematurely Dropped his Top down the Broham.  
Unfortunately or fortunately, it could be permanent.  

[Jim Alfredson]

 

On 1/4/2024 at 3:35 PM, Mighty Motif Max said:

I don’t worry about the thin wires getting bent over time either, unlike many external PSU’s.

This is another negative of external power supplies. The wall-wart variety also take up a lot of space on a power strip or wall outlet. IEC is universal, easily attainable if needed on the gig, and easily replaceable. Linear power supplies are dirt cheap, extremely efficient, and extremely reliable. Putting them IN the gear shouldn't be that much of a hassle. 

[Fleer]

Some of the newer keyboards have an internal wall wart, simply taping the little bugger in the actual keyboard, so there’s that. 

[Finale]

[Synthaholic]

OMG!   🤣

 

I have mine grouped and marked in silver Sharpie by volts, mA, and whether it's negative or positive tip, for easy identification. I'm a sick man.