InMusic buying Moog?

[KuruPrionz]

On 10/10/2023 at 11:56 AM, analogika said:

 

Oh, we were here, all along! Maybe you missed it, because you're more at home in the world of synthesisers than in mixers, but believe me, there wasn't exactly "hate", but rather, scorn — and a lot of it. 

Because while they were ripping of Mackie, their knockoff mixers at the time were shit. 

Noisy, flimsy, underspecced power supplies, nearly irrepairable (but a surprisingly cheap three-day-turnaround would get you the mixer repaired to exactly the same spec that had already failed because you dared to keep a phantom-powered mic connected for two days straight!)… 

Truth. I posted in a different thread recently regarding a Behringer mixer that I bought and used for a few months. It was a piece of junk, I threw it away even though it still - sort of-kind of worked in a noisy, crap sounding way... 

[analogika]

I eventually gave mine away. 

[ksoper]

9 hours ago, DroptopBroham said:

... And create that oscillating abortion Moog One for 10k. 

 

 

That's a bit harsh. 

[Jim Alfredson]

On 10/11/2023 at 6:22 AM, Dave Bryce said:

 

 

I’m a bit curious to know what the general feeling is regarding this $449 Roland/Studio Electronics product. 🤔

 

 

dB

This thread is obviously concerned with the Moog aspect of this whole controversy, but as I've said numerous times, the issue at hand here isn't just Minimoog clones / counterfeits, whatever you want to call them. The issue isn't even cloning per se; it's the bully tactics and ruthlessness of B***inger that is the issue here. If you honestly think that their business practices didn't hurt Moog (or any other company for that matter), then I don't know what to tell you. Their history of lawsuits, both filed by them and against them, tells the story.

 

Moog was not killed directly by B***inger. Nobody is making that claim. It was a combination of many things, including trying to compete with a company that shamelessly copies your new product designs and offers them way cheaper, managing the expectations of synth nerds in regards to your legacy, trying to manufacture complicated electronics products in the USA, mismanagement, the expense of the Moog One project (even though people have been BEGGING them for a poly synth for decades), and other things.

Regarding SE, at least they have a pedigree. Their entire company started by taking original Minimoogs, rack mounting them, and adding MIDI. When Moog went out of business, they started making their own rack clone called the SE-1 (which is still produced and is great, btw). And of course Roland is a storied and honorable company.

I really enjoyed the discussion at the end of today's Sonic Talk livestream about this situation. The knee-jerk reaction to criticism of B***inger is "oh, you're just a hater / elitist / gatekeeper" nonsense. The critics are NOT the ones creating the controversy. B***inger is creating it by their actions and there's really no reason for it.
 

 

[Anderton]

15 hours ago, AnotherScott said:

but not knocking Arturia and others who are doing software implementations that directly compete with Moog's own app.

Just FYI - Arturia received permission to do the Minimoog virtual instrument. They sent it to Bob for his approval. He gave them a list of (IIRC) 17 aspects that he felt weren't right and needed to be changed. Arturia corrected all of them in the production version, and Bob approved it.

 

But that was back when Bob was making those kinds of decisions. When Bob died, I did a "Tribute to Bob Moog" preset pack based on Minimoog samples I had taken from my personal Minimoog, which Bob had signed when he stayed at my place for a few days after his divorce. My plan was to give most of the profits to the Bob Moog Foundation. Given how much effort I put into the creating the pack, I didn't expect to make much anyway for myself. It never occurred to me to ask Moog Music for permission to pay tribute to Bob. But Moog's CEO at the time said I could not mention the Moog name unless Moog Music got a piece of the action, and started talking about legal action. Bob would NEVER have done that. He would have understood it was all about my respect for him and his contributions. So, after the first batch was sold, I changed the name to the 70s Analog Synth Tribute pack. 

[Jim Alfredson]

3 hours ago, JoJoB3 said:

A 2025 version of the V Machine that can/will run nearly everything...for 2024.  Finish what was started!
More ports, power, hdmi out, multiple audio outs.

Or perhaps it exists (see: mini-PC, NUC, etc.

also:  ***k Apple

wrong thread?

[AnotherScott]

I'm not vouching for the accuracy of this, but FWIW, here's another perspective...

 

 

[CrossRhodes]

On 10/11/2023 at 1:42 PM, DroptopBroham said:

This guy smh. Behringer had nothing to do with Moog being run into the ground after Bob Moog passed. Bob was about innovation and moving forward with the Voyager and affordable Lil Phatty. He didn't want to reissue the D. He dies and then they just repackage the same synth 10 ways, reissue the D as a cash grab and create that oscillating abortion Moog One for 10k. The management after Bob died was just milking every last drop out of the Moog name before selling out to a conglomerate.

 

The Behringer D killed Moog Music puhleaze. Their CEO killed them. Behringer D is stealing sales from the 5k Moog Model D. And this guy's take that hardware synths are a luxury and you should be using VSTs and plugins to make music wouldn't generate sales for Moog either. Then he praises Arturia who have the Mini V which itself is a clone of the D and in the basically the same thing as the Behringer D. His logic is flawed af.

 

This dude just used Moog management cashing out as a premise to do a hit piece on Behringer. The video doesn't get into the real reasons why Moog sold out but spends like 80% of the time bashing Behringer.  And now Sweetwater is supposed to be evil too? C'mon man.

 

If these cheap Behringer synth were that amazing and potent, why hasn't Roland collapsed under the multi-pronged assault of Behringer's 808, 909 and TB303 clones?

 

The management who scuttled the ship was Moog's CEO plain and simple. They tried to position themselves as the Louis Vuitton of the synth universe in a world with runaway inflation, mired wages and gigs paying the same as 20 years ago. Gouging and ripping off your customers is not a sustainable business model. It's a shame they ran it into the ground. Maybe with Inmusic the Moog name will live on in bluetooth speakers and motorcycle sound systems like they did Marshall.

 

The guy in the video is an uninformed, biased, idiot with a hard on for Behringer for some reason. Lots of synth makers and software synths doing the D thing, but this guy gives them a pass and encourages their use. Weak sauce video.

 

 

 

Looks like so many people shared the same sentiment and called Jordan out on it that he ended up changing the name of the video from "What killed Moog" to "Moog's fight with Globalism". I found him really off putting overall and he lost me when he made jabs at lower income musicians with the snarky comment about it being fine to buy Behringer if you're ok with being the guy on the court with fake Jordans. Having a middle aged guy sitting in front of thousands of dollars of gear mocking you if Behringer is all you can afford or better yet, telling you it's a luxury item which you shouldn't be able to afford anyway is instantly going to alienate a lot of the people he's trying to reach.

Personally I don't feel that musical instruments are luxury items. They can be essential ingredients in finding your voice as an artist not to mention the mental health benefits of making music. For many people around the world the type of synths that Jordan owns and even the "lower end" Moog synths will simply never be within their reach. Telling them to buy soft synths instead of Behringer still doesn't put money in Moog's pocket so not really sure how that saves the day. I think Jordan's contempt for Behringer clouded his message on this one but again, so did many people hence the title change.

It's interesting because I found this older video in which he has the complete opposite stance telling watchers who have purchased Behringer synths to go ahead and have fun with them and he "could think of a lot worse ways to spend a few hundred bucks". His demeanor here kept me watching the entire video and listening to his bigger points about the downside of Behringer as a company and why he wouldn't be featuring their gear on his channel anymore. I'm not condoning Behringer's more egregious behavior when it comes to frivolous lawsuits and attacking journalists, I just don't think going after lower income folks and trying to shame them into not purchasing musical instruments to create on while surrounded by thousands of dollars of gear is really the best way to make a point. 

As someone who purchased a Little Phatty and several Moogerfoogers made in the Asheville factory, I was bummed about the news of the layoffs and the end of that era of the company. It takes the most minimal amount of digging though to hear first hand accounts of how morale and QC at Moog had been declining for years making it clear that a lot of us are lamenting the end of a Moog that actually no longer existed. 
 

 

[RABid]

18 minutes ago, CrossRhodes said:

I found him really off putting overall and he lost me when he made jabs at lower income musicians with the snarky comment about it being fine to buy Behringer if you're ok with being the guy on the court with fake Jordans. Having a middle aged guy sitting in front of thousands of dollars of gear mocking you if Behringer is all you can afford or better yet, telling you it's a luxury item which you shouldn't be able to afford anyway is instantly going to alienate a lot of the people he's trying to reach.

I watched an interesting video by him and clicked on follow, expecting more of the same. Watched two more videos and unfollowed. 

[JoJoB3]

On 10/14/2023 at 3:07 PM, Jim Alfredson said:

wrong thread?

 

Haha! Yes sorry, wrong thread

[RABid]

It is a shame that Moog could not follow the same path as Synthesizers.com. It also went up for sales some time back and customers were afraid that it would close down. Instead a group of customers bought the company. This is a post from ModWiggler.

Quote

 

Originally Posted by Patcher Jack

We understand and appreciate the questions you are asking in regards to changes that have recently occurred at Synthesizers.com. We value the deep emotional connection you have for the machines with which you choose to create music and the companies that serve the synthesizer community. We share that connection.

Below, you will find answers to some of the questions that have been raised. We are answering them to the best of our ability with the constraint that DOTCOM will never divulge personal information of any of its current or past owners or employees. If at some point in the future these individuals would like to reveal details about themselves, we support them doing so.


Did DOTCOM ownership change? Yes

Who are the new owner/owners?
We will not divulge personal information pertaining to ownership. However, we can tell you that they are former customers who fell in love with the quality and service that has become the signature of DOTCOM over the past 25 years. They are well capitalized and wholly dedicated to continuing that rich tradition.

Are Roger and James still involved?
We will not divulge personal information about past ownership. However, we can say that we fully understand Roger's designs and manufacturing and QC procedures are the foundation of DOTCOM. They have been and will continue to be painstakingly preserved.

James' contribution to DOTCOM has been nothing short of heroic. The events of the past 2 and a half years have caused untold hardships in the manufacturing sector and his dedication to continuing to push through without sacrificing the quality of the products sold is something we should all recognize and be grateful for. He is equally dedicated to the transfer of knowledge currently taking place. We look forward to relying on his expert knowledge to the extent that his time and energy allow.

Additionally, we are committed to tapping into the enormous talents and knowledge base of the synthesizer community as a whole to spur our innovation and design processes. If you have ideas for fresh and interesting products not currently offered, we want to hear from you!

Is DOTCOM still in same facility in Tyler, TX?
We are still proud to call Tyler, TX home. We are still in the same facility with most of the same faces working every day to delight our loyal and new customers alike.


We sincerely hope this answers some of your questions. We understand the skepticism from our long time customers that may come along with a transition like this. The onus is on us to prove to you that DOTCOM remains in capable and dedicated hands. The future of the company is bright and we are excited about the opportunity to serve you and grow alongside the synthesizer community. If you have particular questions please feel free to reach out to info@synthesizers.com.

Thanks and keep patching.

 

 

[Jim Alfredson]

Looks like the first In-Music Moog product is about to be released. Those that watched the Super Bowl may have spied Usher's all-Moog keyboard rig. But underneath his Matriarch was an unidentified keyboard that set the synth-net on fire. Seems In-Music has sent prototypes to several industry folks.

https://www.facebook.com/andrewismusic/posts/pfbid02LXvTpPueYuVCoonhYJhViAcM34WQiYa3qSJThT4ea3VxkG5PWFH4DcihGKAwfo77l

[analogika]

It's the Moog/Akai Synth Wolf! 

[Tusker]

Two oscillator poly synth? Would be very cool. Please not a paraphonic.

[David Emm]

3 hours ago, Tusker said:

Two oscillator poly synth? Would be very cool. Please not a paraphonic.

 

There's a notable lack of the profusion of knobs for which Moog has generally been known. That says there's some sort of hybrid thing going on, perhaps with group assignable controls. There are also five octaves, so its not just a lead or "experimental" instrument like the Grandmother. I get the feeling that it won't be an $8K monster. Its time Moog had a $2-3K poly in its catalog. It looks nice so far, but I'm not making an appointment with my tattoo guy to have it etched into my hide just yet.   

[Doerfler]

https://synthanatomy.com/2024/02/moog-secretly-premiered-a-new-hardware-synthesizer-at-the-2024-super-bowl.html

[JoJoB3]

Cloning...
It's becoming clear to me that most here have not gone mic preamp shopping in a while, if ever.

*and there's some wonderfully close options now.