Are there any antique synths left to emulate?

[jverghese]

I've been working on a successor to the ProSoloist+ rack unit I made years back, I think it was in 2009. However, the current component shortage has made it almost impossible to proceed with the project, and that is annoying the hell out of me right now. Incidentally, I was looking in my archives the other day and found a demo VSTi that I had intended to use to demonstrate the emulation algorithms developed for the rack unit. I can share it if anyone's interested. Executables or zip files cannot be uploaded here, but I can try to make it available some other way. It's Windows only, unfortunately.

[David Emm]

What you'd really kill for is an ARP Pro Soloist with none of its old issues, with a Prophet-6 under the hood.

 

The base voice was a weenie for sure, which also highlights why those same effects make any mono synth in particular take off. As for the vintage front-end, many controllers offer you a preset list function and better pitch bending, for example. If you squint a little, that could make the cut.

 

If you want it so you can pretend to be the next Tony Banks, that's a different thread. I don't think that kind of posing works anymore, even for keytar players.

[The Real MC]

Another thing, let's be honest, when people say "ARP Pro Soloist", they mean "Tony Banks".

 

Not all of us.

 

Otherwise, I suspect most people purchasing it are going to feel a bit let-down by it's rudimentary sound.

it's raw sound wasn't anything to write home about.

 

It never got in my way.

 

It was a single-OSC monosynth with an early ARP filter (ie: not the crunchy Ladder or SEM filters that really took off).

 

ProSoloist had the 4034 ladder filter module. It never had the "SEM" 4023, which is earlier than the 4034.

 

The Pro/DGX with the black/orange halloween paint scheme changed the filter to the 4075 filter module, people have reported that it sounds different.

 

But without a good delay, phaser, and chorus, the little runt really isn't going to sing.

 

Only if you're channeling your Tony Banks personality.

 

When I bought my PS back in 1994, I was unfamiliar with Tony Banks' work on it. I found a lot of good uses for my PS without any influence by Banks.

 

When I did hear Banks' work on the PS, it was good but I'm not anxious to replicate it.

[The Real MC]

Incidentally, I installed this MIDI Interface in my ProSoloist. It's really cool to play the PS from my weighted action MIDI controller (responds to 44 notes), and it's REALLY cool to assign the pitch bend on my controller to AT to get a pitch wheel for the PS!!!

[jverghese]

Sometimes a single-oscillator synth sound run through a slap-back echo or good reverb can sound refreshingly original compared to the 'usual' buzzing of two or more oscillators. But you need a good oscillator, and fortunately the Pro Soloist had that.

 

To stay on topic, here's another vote for a good recreation of the ARP/Rhodes Chroma.

 

Another synth I would like to see emulated (although it probably never will happen) is the Knifonium tube synth, because I hear it sounds great, but could never afford one.

[jyrkik]

Another synth I would like to see emulated (although it probably never will happen) is the Knifonium tube synth, because I hear it sounds great, but could never afford one.

 

A plugin emulation actually does exist... see for ex plugin alliance. I have no glue how good it is, and having briefly tested the real Knifonium, suspect that the sound and soul are hard to replicate. But you can sure save some cash by going the sw route.

 

And Jonte sure has quite high standards and work ethics. Hence he would propably not approve any substandard Knifonium emulation either.

 

Jyrki

[jverghese]

Kiitti Jyrki, didn't know about that, will check it out!

[Bill W]

I've been working on a successor to the ProSoloist+ rack unit I made years back, I think it was in 2009. However, the current component shortage has made it almost impossible to proceed with the project, and that is annoying the hell out of me right now. Incidentally, I was looking in my archives the other day and found a demo VSTi that I had intended to use to demonstrate the emulation algorithms developed for the rack unit. I can share it if anyone's interested. Executables or zip files cannot be uploaded here, but I can try to make it available some other way. It's Windows only, unfortunately.

 

Joachim - I didn't know you were on this forum. I've emailed you about one of those rack units, but ended up using samples in a Kronos live for the Genesis stuff. I'd be interested in the that demo VSTi, but I'm strictly a Mac guy now.

[jverghese]

Bill, I sent you a PM.

[jerrythek]

With all the talk about the simple "voice" of the Pro Soloist it should be noted that the modulation effects that it offered were somewhat unique, and hard to emulate with many of today's virtual analog and soft synths. As an example, the Growl function used a super-fast LFO to filter modulation - the Pro Soloist could generate a 32kHz LFO speed (I learned this from Gordon Reid when I was writing my column on Billy Preston)! Not always easy to recreate...

 

Jerry

[Tusker]

A plugin emulation actually does exist... see for ex plugin alliance. I have no glue how good it is, and having briefly tested the real Knifonium, suspect that the sound and soul are hard to replicate. But you can sure save some cash by going the sw route.

 

Yes, the VI goes on sale periodically for not very much, despite the list price. That seems to be the business model.

 

YMMV but ...

 

I have it and I keep trying to like it. I turn it on, play a few notes. I think "Oh yes, that sound." Then I turn it off and create the same sound on Zebra, except it sounds more three-dimensional and alive. No virtual tubes required.

 

I've heard the analog original is very special. I can't recommend the VI given the great alternative VIs available.

[synthizen2]

Sometimes a single-oscillator synth sound run through a slap-back echo or good reverb can sound refreshingly original compared to the 'usual' buzzing of two or more oscillators. But you need a good oscillator, and fortunately the Pro Soloist had that.

 

Speaking of single-oscillator synths, I just bought a used (but mint condition) Minibrute for my son for Christmas. Got it home for testing before re-packaging it with gift wrap.

 

As I test ran it, I discovered a whole new way to obtain thickness and warmth from that single oscillator (and it's a good one; the Steiner-Parker multimode filter rocks too). The single osc produces simultaneous sawtooth, square, and triangle waveforms... plus a sub osc... plus noise!... but you can't detune these against each other because... yup... they're from the same osc. But they give you a "supersaw" (or something like that) parameter that thickens up the sawtooth, and a "metalizer" to thicken or distort the triangle wave. I suspect these are just types of continuous waveform shaping that are given these weird gimmicky names by Arturia.

 

I was able to dial in some cool sounds... but the whole thing really came to life after running it through a reverb/delay unit. Hell, I was even able to re-create a close-as-hell mockup of Tony Banks' famous lead sound on "Firth of Fifth".

 

I took some snapshots of sounds I made, to give my son a head start on synth programming.

 

If he doesn't want to learn synthesis, Santa will be unhappy, and will replace the Minibrute with a lump of coal.

[drawbars]

RMI Rock-Si-Chord (both the harpsichord and piano presets) and Electra-Piano.

 

I owned the RMI Electra Piano (an early blue one) and gigged with it all through college. It was the most fantastic, bizarre, and frustrating keyboard I've ever owned!

 

Nord has some RMI 368X samples in their library for the Electro and Stage.

[ProfD]

Another vote for Rhodes Chroma.

 

 

 

From a synth programming perspective, anybody care to point out what these two have in common.

[zeronyne]

I"m having trouble seeing all the posts on this phone, but the Synergy has been emulated by the guy who owns the IP. I met him at KnobCon. I think this is the link: https://jariseon.github.io/synergia/

 

And I think one of the big emulation suites now has or is about to release the Ensoniq SQ80

[mate stubb]

Another vote for Rhodes Chroma.

 

 

From a synth programming perspective, anybody care to point out what these two have in common.

 

Nothing at all except one slider programming. I sold a kidney to buy a Chroma brand new when they came out, and became very proficient at flying around on the interface. The Chroma parameter chart was a necessary companion, but some fanatics have also made bespoke knobby controllers.

 

 

[ProfD]

Another vote for Rhodes Chroma.

 

 

From a synth programming perspective, anybody care to point out what these two have in common.

 

Nothing at all except one slider programming. I sold a kidney to buy a Chroma brand new when they came out, and became very proficient at flying around on the interface.

Right. We have come ful circle from programming sounds with knobs and sliders to one slider and membrane switches to a combination of everything nowadays.

 

IMO, the *fun* aspect of the technology especially when it was new cannot be emulated or duplicated.

 

The trip down memory lane is cool until we're reminded of why we replaced that particular piece of gear with something else.

[Rod S]

The trip down memory lane is cool until we're reminded of why we replaced that particular piece of gear with something else.

 

Well, the replacement always has several reasons, technology improvements / changes, cost, market trends (real or not), and sometimes the replacement is a step forward, a step back, or whatever is in the eye of the beholder. New releases bring a mixture of awe, frustration, rage, expectation, confusion, and I personally enjoy it because life is chaotic whether we like or not.

 

The nostalgia is technical, emotional, and many others. I had 2 experiences that I found interesting - (a) Some things are better left in the past - I learned a lesson purchasing a Poly 800 again in 2001 (was my 1st synth circa 85), realized the mistake quickly and (hopefully) learned a lesson. (b) But in another case, the indulgence brought a warm and fuzzy feeling. I have no reason to still have a DX7, but found an absolutely perfect condition one and bought, and I'm happy as a kid.

 

I like how the soft synths allow us to indulge without a significant financial commitment, and a lot of the physical recreations bring back something old and new, refreshing and outdated, gratifying and infuriating. The KArp is only non-preset synth I have, frustrating sometimes, but gratifying like listening to vinyl instead of just finding the album in Spotify (quality issues aside)

[jverghese]

As I test ran it, I discovered a whole new way to obtain thickness and warmth from that single oscillator...

Yes, a slow vibrato coupled with echo or reverb can sound really good -- candy for you ears, especially in contrast to all of that that multi-oscillator EDM stuff you hear on the radio (although I like some of that too).

[ProfD]

The trip down memory lane is cool until we're reminded of why we replaced that particular piece of gear with something else.

 

I learned a lesson purchasing a Poly 800 again in 2001 (was my 1st synth circa 85), realized the mistake quickly and (hopefully) learned a lesson. (b) But in another case, the indulgence brought a warm and fuzzy feeling. I have no reason to still have a DX7, but found an absolutely perfect condition one and bought, and I'm happy as a kid.

The Poly 800 mark II was my 1st synth too.

 

Several years ago, I bought a Yamaha DX7IID. It was a fun nostalgic trip that lasted about 6 months before I sold it.

 

Surely, the great thing about today's technology is that we can buy the gear of yesteryear relatively cheap to indulge in the real deal.

 

Then, we can unload that old gear sometimes at a profit and buy a newer piece of gear that covers the same bases and does even more.

 

We're living in the best of times when it comes to our beloved instrument.