Forte KB3

[rickzjamm]

... I think it's one of the best sims on the market that dwells within a monster DP. But I'm having issues getting the included rotors to feel like my vent . Is this possible or will the upcoming upgrade have more to choose from? This is such a powerful instrument I know that it can be done.

thanks

[DaBous]

I have been struggling with the double leslie as well. The factory patches are not realistic at all. I found some on ksetlist that were better and I got one from Dave W that sounds really good in a mix. Best so far.

 

With the upcoming OS release that has built in editing I think it will be easier ( I have the beta but you can't edit chains directly from a KB3 programs. Should be fixed in next beta though). The soundtower editor hates me and crashes every time I edit an FX chain.

 

I am hoping that as some point they will come out with a new version of the leslie sim that takes advantage of the additional FX power of the Forte.

 

In the meantime I have it sounding pretty good with my vent.

 

 

 

 

[Delaware Dave]

I would doubt that many people have spent the number of hours that I have tweaking KB3 and the internal leslie. Hundreds, and that's no bullshit. There are issues that need to be addressed with the fundamentals of the KB3/leslie application within the Forte. The Forte has addressed the polyphony issue of KB3 (zero polyphony) but there are issues brought over from the PC3 series that still linger: The percussion is routed through the C/V, so when C/V is on the percussion warbles; the C/V itself is sub-par and not realistic as compared to a vibrato scanner on a tonewheel; the C/V does not interact well with the internal leslie; the double leslie low rotor has an unnatural warble to it; it can be minimized but not eliminated; the high rotor sounds unnatural in the upper drawbars (especially the 1' drawbar in chorale); the KB3 tone is both too bright (like a red cap hammond) and has a grit to it that can't be removed.

 

The Ventilator seems to react better with the C/V than the internal leslie does so there is a chorus rate adjustment that needs to be made in KB3 to get this correct; unfortunately the chorus rate is not adjustable in KB3. The Vent cleans up the leslie issues but still doesn't address the organ issues mentioned; There still is alot to get right with both the KB3 organ and the internal leslie. Leslie stop doesn't actually completely stop the rotors, they still move and you can hear the rotors slightly moving even in stop mode. There is no dual KB3 mode, you have to use one KB3 organ and one VAST organ; unfortunately the VAST organ's notes aren't phased locked (KB3 is).

 

If the above were addressed (both KB3 and internal leslie) the Forte would probably be the only synth on the market where you actually had the complete package of all electro mechanicals and acoustic piano being top notch and it probably would be the best all-in-one keyboard on the market.

[b3plyr]

Great and useful posts. I just got my Forte so haven't had much time to play with the B3. However, it does sound good enough to use in many situations. No, it does not sound as good as my Mojo, but it is more than useful.

 

I do agree with these posts. The B3 can be improved. With the horsepower the Forte has, this probably can be done. Just remember Kurzweil R&D is very small in staff.

 

I also have Dave's B3 programs but have not tried then yet. Delaware - I agree that with a bit of fixing' on the B3 this could be the only board you need. For me, it might be anyway.

[Griswold]

I am still playing the PC3 as my main board & I have grown quite fond of several KB3 patches which I have modified. Reverb on SW1, overdrive on the mod wheel, Leslie mods & some tone wheel adjustments. One program uses heavy percussion (think Green Eyed Lady). Anyway I always get compliments on the organ sounds. I use a Burn sometimes & have stripped the Kurz effects accordingly & Yes the leslie sim, especially the overdrive is more accurate but not always more pleasing to my ear. It's hard to explain but the KB3 warmth just sits so well in a band setting.

 

I visited Dave W. at his home in Boston last summer & had the opportunity to play the Forte. I was really impressed with the new Rhodes sounds in particular. Of course the AP sounds are awesome as well. I didn't spend much time with the KB3 but I believe the basic sound engine is similar to the PC3, of course with improved polyphony.

 

BTW if everyone was as generous & kind as Dave the world would be a better place.

[rickzjamm]

Griswold you speak the truth!! DW contacted me & asked what specifically was I looking for in the KB3 & how could he help... how many people of his stature do that? Other companies forget your name as you drive off the lot but DW establishes friendships... with DW you get more than a great board; yup, the world would be a better place - David, have you ever considered running for president? ;-)

[stevie b]

I've been considering the Kurz PC3K7 as my top do it all synth/organ/sample board and have to give kudos to both Dave Weiser and D. Dave.

I have asked each of them a few questions about KB3 and other features, and both have been extremely helpful.

 

Good people here

[Theo Verelst]

The problem with the kurz processing power and potential realism is that there a lot of sound elements, usually being put together as a mix that favors a very small segment of the normal sound palette, and some of the sound elements that get a lot of human attention by their nature cannot easily be found because they hide under the available editable parameters in a complicated way. So maybe on certain speakers with certain type of mixer settings, you can get an organ sound that does a certain recognizable thing pretty well, but in the meanwhile it may well whine like a b*tch and sound like a blown up transistor amp with small speaker, and that's usually not what people want. Obviously more or less seasoned keyboard persons will think, and try to change settings, some equalization compressor, etc, and well, find out that doesn't work.

 

T.

[allan_evett]

I've used my Forte 7 alone, and with an XK-1c second tier. The XK is difficult to beat as a digital replication of a B3 / Leslie combination; Hammond - Suzuki simply has the inside edge in that area. But for most stage-based organ work I find that KB3 does a great job, and splitting hairs over the difference becomes a pain - as does bringing two keyboards and extra staging hardware, when one keyboard will do just fine.

 

That said, Dave Weiser's KB3 Programs sound and play great in the Forte; definitely a level up from the original PC3-based organs. Based on what I've been learning about VAST and the Forte's architecture, and with continued OS upgrades, the tools are coming together to bring this clone engine to the level that Delaware Dave is suggesting.