Roland V-Combo VR-09

[voxpops]

1 hour ago, mrk7421 said:

I don't know ....I am not sure that the VK7 is the same engine as the VK8 or the VR760. I have renewed interest in Roland clonewheels after picking up a 760 at a price almost too good to pass up.The 760 is very impressive .....I had a VK8m and I don't remember the Leslie sim sounding this good. The 760 seems to have Superior electronics or something.....also interesting is that all the keys play organ tones.  But there is the aggravating issue that it will not do upper and lower split...I just don't get it

 

Yes, I got that wrong: the 760 uses VK8 (not VK7), so the VR-09 won't sound the same.

[mrk7421]

Well that is interesting and worthy of discussion. So you are saying.....the VR09 has the VK7 and not the VK8 sound engine....which probably includes the 760. This 760 I got has been an amazing discovery because ....trust me ....it holds its own and then some up against.....Crumar Mojo, Viscount Legend and HX3. I have module versions of all the above .The thing about the760 is Its Clarity.....and the fact that the Leslie sim interferes with the percussion a lot less than the Crumar and Viscount. The HX3 does not have the same level of quality of chorus vibrato as the other three . ..........................................................................................................................................................................  I may have to start a separate thread for VK8/ VK8m/ VR760. I am not sure that those who bitch about Roland have....for example spent much time at all with the VK8m in sim bypass mode. That is why I was hoping the. VR09 might be in that league. Are you sure the VR09 used VK7 engine?

[voxpops]

6 hours ago, mrk7421 said:

Are you sure the VR09 used VK7 engine?

 

Pretty certain. It was well documented back when the VR-09 first appeared. A Roland rep apparently said it was used because it was "grittier." Roland may have tweaked the original engine, but there is still a slight thinness to it. The VK8 was a bit beefier and "rounder."

[brenner13]

…

[brenner13]

On 3/25/2013 at 4:46 AM, Craig MacDonald said:

Just a quick update and sorry for not doing this earlier. I had an opportunity to play the VR-09 last Saturday, not for an extended period of time but long enough to form some initial impressions..

 

So first of all, it really seems like great value.. a VK organ engine GX pianos, and a Juno style synth built in for $999 is an incredible amount of sonic power.

 

VK engine.. first thing that the roland rep said was that it wasn't the VB8 engine it was the VK7 engine.. then he backed off a bit, and said that the engineers had some discussions about this and decided that they preferred the grit of the VK7 over the VK8, and his impression was that this was more VK7 based. Either way it still sounds like a VK engine to me.. not my favourite.. I had high hopes for the new Twin Rotary effect (which is supposed to simulate 2 leslies) and it didn't work at all for me it just sounds like a single leslie with some kind of chorus on it. However, the basic leslie sim seemed better. I was listening to the VR-09 through very small nearfield monitors so it's a bit hard to imagine how it will sound at volume through an amp, PA or a pair of QSC K10's (which I use). So the jury is out on the organ.. I am pretty fussy about my organ sounds and I don't expect to love it, but I expect it will be "workable".

 

The Pianos are all based on Rolands top "sampled" pianos which are from the GX piano line, and they sound GREAT! I've never been a big fan of Roland Pianos, but these do sound suprisingly good for such an inexpensive instrument. The synth sounds really fat, and others will know more about this synth than I do, but it seems to have the Juno architecture, and it realy does sound great (I didn't spend any time on this).

 

Loop mode.. bullshit waste of time..

 

Live performance... clearly this thing is designed for live performance, and by that they seem to mean that in the middle of a song you take a piano solo and you turn your acoustic piano into a wailing synth, and back again.. That seems to be the focus of many of the product demos.. personally I tend to start an song with one piano sound and end with one piano sound so I don't see myself using these live features (or the pooper looper).. I would have preferred the synth to have a setlist feature, rather than the looper/live effects section.. that would have been more valuable to me.

 

All in all, great sound, great value.. the keyboard and buttons are not as substantial as higher end synths, but you get what you pay for, and lighter buttons, knobs etc doesn't necessarily mean lower quality.. only time will tell..

 

Great entry level all in one, with better than entry level sound!

 Page 16 of this thread has a post from Craig MacDonald that his Roland insider contact said the engine is based on the VK7.

However, there are two Hammond-style engines to choose from: Jazz and Rock, the latter being brighter. 

[Baggypants]

Synth is based on the Roland Gaia, and there's two them. And I bloody love that little looper. You can set it up to trigger a rhythm loop and start the loop record when you hit the keys. People I play to like a little loop action sandwiched in a set.

 

"Only time will tell"? it's been ten years. I think it's proven itself.

[Mike Kent]

On 9/7/2024 at 1:23 AM, voxpops said:

Both the VR-09 and the VR-760 use the VK7 engine that first appeared in 1997. The VK8 was a later development.

I owned the VK-7 (bought in 1997). My brother still owns one.

I now have VK-8 (2002) and VR-09 (2012). After all those years, I know them well.

The VR-09 is based on the VK-8 engine, not the VK-7.

Side by side in my studio. Same sound.

 

[brenner13]

Which of the two organs engines of the VR09 do you compare to your VK8? It’s got Jazz and Rock, the latter being brighter and more crisp. 

[Mighty Motif Max]

5 hours ago, Baggypants said:

…

"Only time will tell"? it's been ten years. I think it's proven itself.

Just so you’re aware, the quote you’re referencing is from a post made in 2013 when it first came out…

[JoJoB3]

28 minutes ago, brenner13 said:

Which of the two organs engines of the VR09 do you compare to your VK8? It’s got Jazz and Rock, the latter being brighter and more crisp. 

I think you have that reversed (jazz vs rock organ in the VR09) but it depends on your meaning of 'crisp'.

All I know is the VR09/VR-730 has proven itself time and time again it can hang with most of the new VSTs and expensive hardware models in organ and leslie sim land.  I think Roland (accidentally perhaps?) exceeded here.

[Mike Kent]

59 minutes ago, brenner13 said:

Which of the two organs engines of the VR09 do you compare to your VK8? It’s got Jazz and Rock, the latter being brighter and more crisp. 

I don't think I have ever used the Jazz organ.

[JoJoB3]

20 hours ago, Mike Kent said:

I don't think I have ever used the Jazz organ.

Unnecessary too as each are essentially a take on what is the Hamm 3-series.  Roland is adorable.

[brenner13]

21 hours ago, JoJoB3 said:

I think you have that reversed (jazz vs rock organ in the VR09) but it depends on your meaning of 'crisp'.

All I know is the VR09/VR-730 has proven itself time and time again it can hang with most of the new VSTs and expensive hardware models in organ and leslie sim land.  I think Roland (accidentally perhaps?) exceeded here.

Crispy? 
It’s good fun to play this quirky little beastie.

[franky64]

On 9/9/2024 at 6:55 AM, Mike Kent said:

I don't think I have ever used the Jazz organ.

oh, with some customising it can sound nicely especially when things drift away from hard rock

I personally use e.g. on a 'lounch version' of Amies Valerie, a steriodised Claptons After Midnight  - and of course, Tinas Last Condert Proud Mary (ospel syle organ

[franky64]

On 9/9/2024 at 5:14 AM, Mike Kent said:

I owned the VK-7 (bought in 1997). My brother still owns one.

I now have VK-8 (2002) and VR-09 (2012). After all those years, I know them well.

The VR-09 is based on the VK-8 engine, not the VK-7.

Side by side in my studio. Same sound.

 

That's interesting
Compared to the 'lastest evolution' of VK8, VR700 , VR09 sounds differently (the overall 'Roland timbre' is the same but there are differences, not only in the naked harmonics (more details, bigger bass) but also the different various amp- and rotary-types that sound very different to VR09.
Me seems VR09 is more of a migration of VK to 'SN architecture' implemented in Ateliers and later Jupiter-80.
 

[AnotherScott]

6 minutes ago, franky64 said:

seems VR09 is more of a migration of VK to 'SN architecture' implemented in Ateliers and later Jupiter-80.

 

I thought the VR09 hammond sound was much better than that of the Jupiter 50 (which would have been same as 80). I don't remember the detail... maybe it was the rotary and/or overdrive rather than the basic organ tone that made me feel that way. But I could pretty happily play the VR-09 organ if playing organ-centric stuff, I don't remember ever being equally satisfied with the Jupiter's organ. 

 

And VK8, VR760, and VR700 were all more satisfying than the 09. Again, I don't know about the tones, but of course, the actions were better, and I think the overdrive amp/sims of all of them were better as well.

[franky64]

On 9/9/2024 at 12:53 AM, Baggypants said:

Synth is based on the Roland Gaia

 

Jupiter 80 / Integra   VR09 'VA synth' is  1:1 Jupiter-80 and Integra (including VA options  hidden in VR09 but accessible through ctrlr editor ;)) 
What I really miss  in VR09 'VA synth' is 'oscillator sync' : VR09 (JP, I7) have only the osc2->1  'Ring Mod' option, Gaia also has osc sync - which allows it to recreate sounds of famous synths like Syntex, e.g. the Jarre Laser-Harp : it's not possible to  recreate the harp in VR - which is a shame because VR would even have the EH Small Stone Phaser

 

[franky64]

9 minutes ago, AnotherScott said:

 

I thought the VR09 hammond sound was much better than that of the Jupiter 50 (which would have been same as 80). I don't remember the detail... maybe it was the rotary and/or overdrive rather than the basic organ tone that made me feel that way. But I could pretty happily play the VR-09 organ if playing organ-centric stuff, I don't remember ever being equally satisfied with the Jupiter's organ. 

 

And VK8, VR760, and VR700 were all more satisfying than the 09. Again, I don't know about the tones, but of course, the actions were better, and I think the overdrive amp/sims of all of them were better as well.

right, VR is 'better' than JP50/80, FA etc, but all are of 'new SN generation'
Latest evolution is in Fantom 0x, isn't it? Well, could compare F and VR side by side and R went back to VK8  'amp/rotary models' and options. While (to my ear)  the F organ sound is very close to VR09 (not to VR700) it got more details - maybe better hardware  - higher resolved samples/modeling  - who knows.
right, the OD is much more 'tube like' on old VRs.

[franky64]

last but not least:
 

CTRLR EDITOR v1.12.23: 'soft update'
 

this 'soft update' (without change of release number) adds some user proposals:

• MidiMapper 'organ' (both VR-sysex=>CC and CC=>VR-sysex): added 'drawbar value mapping' for midi controllers that don't have customisable 'fader ranges': e.g. mapping 0-127 to '0-8 inverted' that means 0-127 faders work as a 'drawbar' (pull to rise value) for VR
• 'VR ORGAN patch' : a 'very special patch' that corresponds to VR Tonewheel/Transistor with '88800000' + 2nd perc and is customisable through 'VR organ options' (Jazz/Rock/Transistor, gain, click, leakage, V/C, perc etc)  - eXtra Sounds: OTHERS
• Editor 'patch displays' now show a 'sound category' (factory patch, Atelier patch, GM patch etc) : this might help to 're-identify' patches in forgotten registrations 

Website: https://v-combo.webspace.rocks/editor-vr09-730
direct download:  https://drive.google.com/drive/u/1/folders/1_CJVGF0tACCxr1m0Y5yw7YLWEg1bvMF0