OT - Running

[Phred]

Those two stories make me feel grateful that my only issue was a little bitter cold headwind.

 

I love all of these stories!

[Phred]

26 KM yesterday is some really crazy wind. It was crazy tough, and I went much slower than usual. Happy to have finished it though.

[stepay]

26 KM yesterday is some really crazy wind. It was crazy tough, and I went much slower than usual. Happy to have finished it though.

 

Sorry I did respond sooner, but congrats on that 10k PR! I knew you were in shape enough to do it. Lowering it even further is well within your ability too based on that 21:02 5k or yours.

 

My running is very hit or miss these days (continuing calf problems). I ran a mile on the track the other day with my son (he went 2 miles) in 8:00 (actually a mile...I started at the mile marker, not the 1600 meter mark). I was trying just to do even laps in 2:00 and I did, but it wasn't super easy. I could probably run 6:30 if I went all out, but that's about it. Man that's horrible.

[Phred]

Sorry to hear about your calf problems. I (knock on wood)so far haven't had anything major. A bit of soreness in my knees, but I have had that my whole life. I do hip flexor exercises and that seems to help a little.

 

That 26KM run was a double edged sword in my training. 1) A bummer because it was really hard, and really slow. It felt like I worked extra hard to get less speed. 2) I feel like now, I can do anything. I know I have it in me to finish the 42.2K, I also know that I may not finish it in the time I have planned, but that's ok - there's always next time.

 

I have a 1/2marathon race this weekend (on sunday) in which I am shooting for around 1:40, which would be a PR. We'll see.

 

Then, no more races planned, it's building up mileage (with a 2.5 week taper) until the May 27th Marathon race day.

 

[stepay]

Sorry to hear about your calf problems. I (knock on wood)so far haven't had anything major. A bit of soreness in my knees, but I have had that my whole life. I do hip flexor exercises and that seems to help a little.

 

That 26KM run was a double edged sword in my training. 1) A bummer because it was really hard, and really slow. It felt like I worked extra hard to get less speed. 2) I feel like now, I can do anything. I know I have it in me to finish the 42.2K, I also know that I may not finish it in the time I have planned, but that's ok - there's always next time.

 

I have a 1/2marathon race this weekend (on sunday) in which I am shooting for around 1:40, which would be a PR. We'll see.

 

Then, no more races planned, it's building up mileage (with a 2.5 week taper) until the May 27th Marathon race day.

 

Sounds like you've got a good plan there.

[Phred]

Thanks for the words and advice Dave. I have run a 1:41:26 half marathon, and think I can do it faster. The weather was perfect on that day, and the course was really flat, and the end was a long gradual downhill(just when you need it). Pretty perfect conditions, so maybe 1:40 is a tough goal, but I think I can do it.

[stepay]

Yeah, those tables don't work out too well for most people. Gives you an idea, but you can't count on it. Some people are just better at 5,000 meters than they are at the marathon (that would be me). My PR in the 5,000 suggests a time of about 2:26 in the marathon (according to one table I have), and I never did that -- 2:55 was my best.

 

All those tables and calculators are different too.

 

If you go here - http://www.mcmillanrunning.com/index.php/site/calculator

 

...it says a 46:01 10k predicts a 1:42:24 half marathon. It also predicts a 5k that is SLOWER than what Phred has run.

 

Fun to look at, but not terribly accurate.

 

I have a 1/2marathon race this weekend (on sunday) in which I am shooting for around 1:40, which would be a PR. We'll see.

 

Based on your 46 min. 10K, I was looking at the corresponding Half Marathon time in the "Road Racing for Serious Runners" book by Pete Pfitzinger & Scott Douglas. It says 1:43:17 and Marathon time of 3:38:54..fwiw.

 

When I used to be heavily into racing and being competitive, I found that a lot of the "corresponding tables" different people wrote never matched up for me. I was faster in the shorter distances like 5& 10 K, but couldn't hold the pace in the longer races like the Marathon. Basically I don't think I had the mental toughness to hold pace after mile 20 and gut it out.. My strongest race distance always was the Half for sure.

 

In any case your 16.1 miler will hold you in good stead for all up coming races this season. You'll get that added mental toughness of dealing with the extreme headwind. Don't ever discount those kind of efforts-they are to be filed under "quality runs" ! You're at or approaching the optimum age for distance running/racing. Use each hard effort as a stepping stone to the next race.

 

Don't go out too fast. Find that groove that you feel you can hold for the 13.1. Good luck on Sunday and let us know how it turns out.

[stepay]

I was trying just to do even laps in 2:00 and I did, but it wasn't super easy. I could probably run 6:30 if I went all out, but that's about it. Man that's horrible.

 

Welcome to my world ..I hate to be the bearer of good news ( ) , but come back in 10 years or so ( you're early to middle 40's ? ). It only gets easier...not. I'm 2 months and 7 days south of 59.

 

Seriously, you just have to take the attitude of it is what it is, I have to be thankful I'm still out here doing it, burning calories/fat, keeping the pipes (colon) clean, getting the heart-rate up and basically staying fit. I tell myself that on every step of every run these days.

 

I'm 45. I'm pretty sure my regular training days (as far as running goes) are over. It's too bad, because I used to love going for a 12 mile run on a Wednesday evening and then 18-20 on Saturday. Oh well. I've run a LOT of miles in my 45 years. Gonna have to be cross training from here on out...something I don't like as much, but I need to make sure I do.

[Phred]

Half marathon 1:40:20. Thrilled. PB by about a minute.

 

Time to pile on the mileage toward may 27th (Ottawa race weekend Marathon).

[Dave Ferris]

Most excellent !

 

5/27 isn't very far off , especially when you figure in the month's taper plus the recovery from today's hard effort.. Phred, don't increase to more then 10% of your weekly mileage to be safe. Hopefully you've done most of your buildup and long runs by now...

 

I ran my usual 12 mile Descanso/La Canada pavement loop with the gnarly hills. We had a pretty substantial rain on Friday so the trails were still muddy. I've been fighting this sinus infection/cold/ allergies from Hell since 3/3 , so was glad I was able to complete this today.

 

Felt pretty good but definitely got a little tired the last 2. I'm usually able to push the last 3 under 8 minute pace but not today. Could tell I wasn't 100% but I felt fairly strong the first 10, even with all the hills.. The time was 1:51:50 which = a 9:19 pace.

[Justin Havu]

Just got back from a midnight run. Had to blow off some steam.

[Phred]

Dave, I hear ya. I have done most of my long runs, but I have the 30K and the 32K left. I am following a schedule from the internet, (don't remember which one) and have been doing pretty much what they want down to a tee. Including this race. The schedule wants 3 weeks of taper, and my longest run being right before the taper.

[Phred]

Btw - Dave, I am still not good with gnarly hills. Great time for 12miles in the hills.

[Phred]

30KM this past weekend. Really tough.

[Dave Ferris]

18.6 miles is a long way no matter how you slice it.

 

I've had many bad days on long runs. One of those things you really can't predict how you are going to feel. If I have 2 bad weeks in a row on the long run, I know I need more recovery time. I'm guessing you might be feeling the effects of your hard effort PR in the half last week.

 

That's one of the rubs about training for a Marathon and running a real hard effort in anything over 10K in the training cycle. It can take a few weeks or more to recover from the half but you're still trying to build up for the main event.

 

Listen to your body and take some extra easy days or time off. Maybe do the cross train thing on a bike if you have one and it's not too cold up there still.

[Joe P]

30KM this past weekend. Really tough.

 

Yeah Phred, don't let it get you down. While not 30K, I did a 10 miler last Easter in preparation for my first half and was hurting from mile 3. It was the first kinda hot day of the year.

 

I lost all my confidence going into the half the following Sunday, but I ran a good race anyway and felt good.

 

Regards,

Joe

[Phred]

Sorry to hear that you were hurting at Mile 3 Joe. Good Job getting through it. Confidence is a big factor for me. I was feeling a little ego bruised for that 30k hell run a couple of weeks ago, but I have had a couple of good weeks since!!!

 

Because I needed that confidence boost, I entered another 10k race last weekend. It wasn't on my race plan, but I wanted to do one more. I did it in 44:13 !!! Which is a PB by 2 minutes.

 

And this weekend I did a 34K run, and although it was tough near the end, I did it. I can totally see myself finishing the marathon, and getting in the ballpark of my goal!

 

 

[Joe P]

Go Phred!

 

Tonight it's back to Greystone for me, 4 loops/6 miles.

[Cliffk]

Any recommendations for fairly basic GPS watches - distance, laps, times, maybe heart rate? What do you guys use?

[Phred]

I use this: Garmin Forerunner 305. http://compare.ebay.com/like/270374661166?var=lv&ltyp=AllFixedPriceItemTypes&var=sbar

 

It has a heart monitor that goes on your chest, and bluetooth's to the watch.

 

Also I can save mile (or KM) splits and recall them from the watch. It's bulky, but not too bad. It sometimes take a while to get a bead on a satellite, but usually it's not too bad.

 

P.S. - Dave, I wonder if your watch actually does do split recall, and you just don't know it. I am saying that because I recently showed a buddy of mine how to do it, after he owned the watch for 2+ years and didn't know. Here is how I do it. First, you have to have your watch set to auto lap every KM (or mile, whatever). I forget how I did that, but it is somewhere in the options.:

 

1. Press mode (bottom left button)

2. select 'history'

3. Select 'running' (there are three types of activities)

4. Select 'By Day'

5. Choose the date of the run you want

6. You will see a summary of the run. Select the 'View Laps?'

7. You will see a split for every lap you had setup.

[Cliffk]

Many thanks, guys.

[Phred]

Update. Five days from my marathon, and I had a pretty scary weekend (training wise). On Thursday my knee was feeling a little tender, but nothing too bad. I did a fairly short (8K), but hilly (really hilly) run on friday. I felt good during the run, but after... I got up out my desk chair and almost fell down!!! It is really hard to explain, and maybe runners know what I am talking about. It was sore, but not too bad, I could walk on it without pain, and probably run on it without pain (didn't try). However I didn't to make sure that my leg was completely straight before I put any weight on it (after getting up) or it would just buckle underneath me.

 

I spent the whole long weekend (Victoria day in Canada) icing, and heating and RESTING. I canceled my last longish (I think 15k) run. I have a pool, so I swam a lot, and that seemed to help. Today it feels great, but I am certainly concerned about further injury. I have a few very short runs this week (topping out at 5k I think). My plan is to do one today, but if I have any (ANY) pain, I will stop and not likely do any more this week. I hate going into the Marathon under-trained, but it beats going in injured.

[Joe P]

Phred,

Good luck, I hope it turns out okay. I haven't had knee buckling, but I have had a hip thing that can make me almost fall when I get up after a long period sitting - especially in a car - but it's no problem when I run.

 

I have adopted stretching as a way of life and it seems to help. Even if I am not stretching the joint, stretching the muscles around the joint that load it up usually helps. For instance, constant calf stretching has eliminated any ankle and foot problems I used to have. Maybe others can chime in who have more knowledge and experience.

 

Regards,

 

Joe

 

 

[Phred]

Yeah - I hate to admit it, but stretching is not something I am good at doing. I do it, because I know I have to, but I am likely rushing it, and not doing it enough... Thanks Joe

[Adan]

I have switched to minimalist running shoes and am so glad I did. Two months into it, but so far so good, and thinking I will never go back to regular running shoes.

 

"minimalist" is the term applied to the new breed of running shoe that basically gives you no cushion, just a thin bit of grippy rubber between your foot and the ground. The theory behind them is that it returns you to a more natural running style where you land on the ball of your foot and use your natural shock absorbing system, rather than landing on the heel of a running shoe and relying the cushioning of the shoe. A few different companies make them, but I've been using the Vibram "5 fingers," which is probably the most popular model and definitely the most funny-looking.

 

I run 15-20 miles a week, not a lot by real runner's standards. But I was having more and more problems with pain in my feet, not so much while running, but all the rest of the time. With the 5 fingers, I have no foot pain at all, and most of my other running aches and pains have gone away as well. This alone made the switch worth it. But beyond that, running is just more fun. I feel more connected to the ground and something about this stokes the joy of running for me.

 

You're supposed to start small and gradually increase your endurance, because your putting stress on a new set of muscles and connectors. I gave myself about 6 weeks to work up to my usual mileage.

 

I suspect that minimalist shoes might not be good for attaining top performance in time/distance. I think I'm running a little bit slower in them. The difference is most noticeably on downhill grades, where regular shoes allow you to clompclomp landing on your heel with abandon. Without that cushioning, you really have to back off on the downhill shoosses. I don't care, because I don't run for performance.

 

 

[Phred]

I have seen people training in those minimalist shoes, and race in 'regular' shoes. I am not sure that is a good idea, as again different muscles at play. However it speaks to the 'not really good for performance' aspect.

 

It it possible that my issues stem from my shoes. I am not about to try anything new at this point, but after this weekend, I may consider switching up the shoe type.

 

[Adan]

I have seen people training in those minimalist shoes, and race in 'regular' shoes. I am not sure that is a good idea, as again different muscles at play.

 

Yeah, that seems odd. I suppose it's a little like running with weights and then taking the weights off to race. But since it's a very different running style . . . I don't get it.

[Joe P]

Adan, I think there is definitely something to be said for the toe-first strike, and I'm not surprised your ailments went away.

 

Phred, how many miles on your shoes? I meant to change mine out at 400 but didn't and got a hip problem around 450. New shoes - hip problem gone. If they are old maybe you should change them out if you have time to break them in before the race.

 

Regards,

Joe

 

[Phred]

New-ish shoes, but not far from being switched out.. Definately no time to switch em out, as the race is in 5 days...

 

I ran 6.25KM today. No pain. No issue.

 

I am not sure what happened, but the best way to describe the pain/issue I had for about 3-4 days, was as if I over extended my knee. That was what it felt like.

 

 

[Joe P]

New-ish shoes, but not far from being switched out.. Definately no time to switch em out, as the race is in 5 days...

 

I ran 6.25KM today. No pain. No issue.

 

I am not sure what happened, but the best way to describe the pain/issue I had for about 3-4 days, was as if I over extended my knee. That was what it felt like.

 

 

You are good to go man!

 

Have a good race, we want a full report and pics!

 

Regards,

Joe