Stereo DI's - Quality???

[loxley11]

So I'm looking at some stereo Direct boxes to make life easier for the sound guy when we gig. Of course guitar center wants to sell me the $150 Radial, when there are models around for about $50. While I realize the Radial and its counterparts are better quality than the alternatives, am I really gonna notice the difference playing in a noisy bar at high volume with the typical mediocre equipment one finds in a bar sound system? I'm guessing not, but then I have very little experience with DI's and salesmen will only try to sell the most expensive item instead of actually telling you what's best in your situation...

 

loxey11

[eric]

I have been using the Radial JDI Duplex for quite some time and love, love, love it. I think it is an industry standard and highly recommend it.

 

Regards,

Eric

[J. Dan]

I've used all kinds of cheaper DI's. The difference is much bigger than you would imagine. I currently use the rackmount 8-channel Radial DI (keys, click, kick, snare, toms, Drum FX, Sax, R. GT). I finally had enough of the others and decided it was time to buck up, and I've been glad I did. They are superior in the following ways:

 

1) Noise: never have ground loop issues anymore - was constantly fighting them with others.

2) Build Quality: Built like a tank, I've had Jacks break and everything else on others

3) Sound quality: a little more subtle, but you will likely notice the difference.

 

As a side note that won't apply in your case - each channel has summing inputs, as opposed to the direct wired parallel 1/4" in's. This means I can safely plug 2 keyboards into a channel and mix w/main volumes. It's intended to sum stereo sources to mono, but works well for 2 mono keys.

[mate stubb]

I use the Radial JDI Duplex also. Will the world end if you use a $50 Whirlwind? No.

[timwat]

Another JDI Duplex user here. I think the JDI Duplex is around $350, and worth every single penny.

 

Several years ago I spent the better part of a day A/B'ing it against ProCo, Countryman FET, Whirlwind and a host of other DI's and can attest that other DIs suck the life (timbre, dynamics, bass response) out of the signal in ways I didn't realize until I spent the time to compare directly. It's also built like a freaking tank.

 

Will you notice the difference? IMHO, if you can't, it's because the downstream PA is POS.

 

[RedKey]

And yet another Radial JDI Duplex user here.

Worth every penny.

 

[Joe Muscara]

Will the world end if you use a $50 Whirlwind? No.

But maybe the show might, prematurely.

[Ian Benhamou]

Radial ALL THE WAY!!!!! Industry standard for DI's. The JDI duplex is of course the Rols Royce, and trust me, there is a difference and it is tone. Your keyboards will just have more life. If you find the price a little steep, I would suggest getting the slightly less expensive Pro Series from Radial. It's not the Jensen-equipped top of the line JDI, but a good budget alternative with very low phase distortion and noise loop elimination.

 

Whatever brand or model you end up getting make sure you use passive DI and not active ones. Active ones on a strong line level keyboard output will make your transients sound very harsh and unnatural.

[Mark Schmieder]

Actually, Whirlwind makes some higher-end gear as well, but I'm not sure if they go with Jensen transformers or not (I did download their spec sheets at one point).

 

Quality mono DI's are plentiful, but stereo and multi-channel (usually quad or octal) is another story. I can't really think of any better options than the Radial stuff, except MAYBE the high-end Whirlwind rack-mount gear. Similar price anyway.

 

80s-LZ pretty much summed up why this is not an esoteric choice for the golden-eared. Save money by buying right the first time.

 

In mono-land, my Avalon U5 was the right choice and I doubt I'll ever switch it out. I use the Ashly octal stereo mixer (LX-308b) for my keys live and in the studio (to avoid patchbay nonsense), but feel the need for a DI solution for some problematic situations we sometimes find ourselves in (especially at outdoor holiday function gigs in parks, etc.).

[BillWelcome Home Studios]

My whirlwind DIs work okay, but they didn't even compare to the Countryman (which was the industry standard for about 25 years), let alone the BSS or the Radial lines, which are superior. I happen to have a few Whirlwinds, with no reason to change (they ain't broke) but if I were buying today, I'd buy Radial... and I'd have a hard time deciding which one.

[Stormfront]

redundant but +1 for Radial JDI. I NEVER worry about my di working / sounding good / needing phantom power / falling apart (been there). It just works!

[J. Dan]

If you're handy and have real budget constraints, you could always roll your own.

 

http://www.jensen-transformers.com/

Datasheet

Schematic

 

At $73.08 per transformer for 1-3, you could probably do a single channel for a hundred bucks, or stereo for slightly under $200. But for my money, I'd just buy the Radial.

[Mark Schmieder]

Yeah, there isn't a lot of extra cost beyond the fixed cost of the Jensen transformers themselves, making the Radial gear great buys in spite of widespread perception that they are overpriced.

 

And as Stormfront says, there's not much point of considering other options that are less proven when Radial is so well-known as reliable. Unless there's a particular hole they haven't plugged yet (unlikely), in which case look at Whirlwind.

 

Yes, Radial's product line can be confusing -- although less so now than a couple of years ago. Certainly I would already own something from them if I hadn't been so confused at several critical junctures.

 

Then the "immediate need" for multi-channel DI passed... only to hit me by surprise again later, so it's better to just get one and Be Prepared. :-)

[jimmymio]

I use a mono Radial Pro DI. However, I've been hearing a lot about these : http://tinyurl.com/m77npr.

 

I'd love to A/B this with a Radial.It's hard to imagine any level of quality at such a ridiculously low price but I've bought plenty of cables from them and they are quite good and very inexpensive.

 

JP

[Maze Sound]

I've dealt with Mark and Liz at Audiopile on a few occasions. Great people!. One thing I've learned is that if Mark makes a claim about one of the products he sells, he stands behind it. The price of all electronics are dropping like a rock. Transformers are no exception. While there may be a noticeable difference on a scope, hearing it is a "whole nuther story". I do SR on the side and have dealt with all the DI's mentioned in this post. Granted the Radials are a good unit. The question to me is do I have to spend big bucks to get good results. If it was 5 years ago I might have agreed, but not today. Today I think that the secondary feature are as important as the intended use of the product. Once it sounds good, which a lot of the cheaper units do, ground lifts , summing, # of channels...etc, becomes the decision maker. By the way,for cables, Mark's are high quality and priced right.

[The Real MC]

Radial is my DI of choice. Excellent products.

[Sparky2]

+++++1 on Audiopile and the EWI cables. Amazing quality for incredible value. I've been using their TRS snakes and mic cables with absolutely no issues. GC and HOSA should wake up.

Mark

[BillWelcome Home Studios]

I use a mono Radial Pro DI. However, I've been hearing a lot about these : http://tinyurl.com/m77npr.

 

I'd love to A/B this with a Radial.It's hard to imagine any level of quality at such a ridiculously low price but I've bought plenty of cables from them and they are quite good and very inexpensive.

 

JP

 

I have not seen anyone try to promote them as being anything other than a decent low cost DI.

 

In terms of DIs in general, and why the better ones are more expensive.... we can make a DI with a sub-$5 transformer from Mouser, and it is likely to be as good as we ever need a DI to be. And when/if we compare it to another brand, we -may- under that circumstance, not hear much difference.

 

But transformers are really really different, one from another. And often when people think that they are hearing 'tubes' making something sound a particular way, they are really hearing the effects of the transformers.

 

A friends of mine custom-winds transformers for high-dollar audio circuits, and for years has been re-discovering the art. It is difficult to get good audio transformers now. There are a number of factors that separate the low budget transformer from the more expensive spread... saturation, ringing, and a bunch of other stuff that I do not understand.

 

But the reason that Lundahl, Jensen, and those couple of other brands of raw transformer are so expensive... and why gear made with them is that much more money... is that they are that much superior, and that much more expensive to create.

 

I guess if i said that a Radio Shack keyboard was a good choice -for the money-, it might give you a similar sense of what we're talking about.

 

Quality sound has always been important to me, and I stopped buying gear that was "good -for the money-" many years ago, as it usually ends up dissappointing to the ear.

 

So, the Whirlwinds, EWIs etc, they are fine, and a reasonable price, and may be all that you need. But there is value in the higher quality offerings.