MOTIF XS, Sudden GAS!! Talk me into it!

[Bobadohshe]

Well guys I've had my Motif 6 Classic for about 4 years now. I've played the living daylights out of it and taken it to Europe twice, Argentina, Brazil, New Zealand, all over the US, you get the idea. It's been great and still sounds phenomenal. But I'm starting to realize as I work with it in the studio, that the patches on it are 6 years old, and it's a little limiting. The EPS are still wonderful. The organs work great live. But I'm starting to feel like I could use a little boost of newness, especially for sounds in the studio and rad live setups. I've been very satisfied with it, but made the mistake of playing the MOTIF6 XS at GC on Friday, and now it's haunting my dreams.

I'm gonna be back on tour in Europe for all of August, and I'm starting to have fantasies about rocking the MOTIF XS all over the continent in glorious style, not to mention having some sweet downtime with it in different hotel rooms to explore it's beauty. And diving deeply into the manual on the plane. Doesn't that sound nice?

And there's probably a small element of 'check out my badass new rig' lame pride/showyoffyness invovled here too. A scratched up MOTIF classic vs a sleek (and lighterweight) XS. Which would you prefer?

Well that's it. I'm strongly considering buying it, possibly even tomorrow. Does anyone else have any thoughts? Should I snap out of this GAS or take the plunge?

[SilverDragonSoun]

The XS certainly sounds nice and may have the best sounds out of the box. There are some big concerns about it as a workstation. Yamaha took a different route and it seems to cater more to the home studio user. having played one pretty extensively I was impressed by the sounds and the ease of use over the other Motif models. Its certainly a step up in some ways but if your looking for a true workstation in the more traditional sense, you might be disappointed. I think your idea of reading the manual may be a good idea to give you some feedback as well. I also recommend doing a search as its been discussed before. My spidey senses are also tingling right now which means for our purposes here that Keyboard magazine will be reviewing one very soon. :grin:

[Tonysounds]

I gotta be honest; I don't get it. I've checked out the XS a couple times, and especially as a gigging board (I don't care about its workstation-ness), I don't see why you would need to upgrade to the XS. I still think the EPS and pianos on the Classic are better, and have more girth (especially important if you play in a band context), and if you need a little something to spark them up, get in there and tweak!

 

I don't hear enough "new sounds" to even justify changing. If anything, I'd go pop for a small rack module (maybe a FantomXR, or a JD990 which you can get for about $300 and believe me, nothing out there sounds like it)or a Receptor which then lets you load anything you want into it. The Motif Classic has enough midi control to make the Receptor a really good idea (since you can hit it with multiple zones).

 

Of course, this is just my opinion, but as a fellow GASser, I thought for sure I would have taken the plunge on this, and it just hasn't happened.

 

T

 

 

[Song80s]

its a no-brainer for about 90 % of folks

 

The time you waste fussing over it , you could be playing the XS

[Tusker]

Six years is along life for a gigging board. This is a logical upgrade for you. Enjoy your XS.

 

[Bill H.]

There is absolutely nothing wrong in replacing a six year old keyboard. And the high I get from having a hot new board onstage is as great as most people get from a new car.

 

But keep in mind that other than piano, the greatest sound improvements are in non-gigging categories.

[Nicky]

For your application (gigging), the sounds haven't changed all that much. Some would argue the original Motif piano cuts better for gigs. The ep samples are the same but they have been reprogrammed to include some new amp effects, which is cool for gigging. The clav and B3 samples are the same, again, just slicker programming. You will get 2x the polyphony which is better for layers and splits. It now is a 8 zone controller compared to 4, with more sliders. And it is a little lighter....I say if you can make it work $ wise, go for it. It sounds like you're touring enough to justify it.

[Bobadohshe]

Guys, I thoroughly appreciate the opinions, which are equally divided! You see my dilemma. In EPs, and Organs, the board is pretty much the same you say. But it has all those killer effects, and how can the organs really be the same with eight elements? Would a crossgrade be more appropriate, to a Fantom X6 for instance, for purposes of pallete expansion? Or is this a BAD time to buy that board; how likely is a new Roland at NAMM 08?

[Kayvon]

Well the key action on the XS6 is nice enough that it gave me GAS for the thing and those new effects look tasty as well. Am I helping with the GAS here?

[Nicky]

Oh yeah, forgot that the action is improved. I would stay away from the fantom x as it will surely be replaced this winter namm. Motif XS6 + Sonic Cell.

[Bill H.]

I wouldn't get a Fantom X right now because I believe a new Fantom is just around the corner. Roland typically cuts the MAP on things a few months before they discontinue them, and I kind of expect a $400-500 cut on Fantoms this fall.

 

But you never really know.

 

The biggest improvement in organ sounds I was looking for in the XS was a better Leslie sim, which didn't happen. If you are doing a lot of organ work, a better move might be an XK-1 or Electro. That one would probably get more oohs and ahhs from your bandmates.

[SilverDragonSoun]

I know the Fantom X pretty well and don't think you'll be happy with it in terms of sounds. They are different and not as crisp and full as the Yamaha sounds and user samples. The Fantom X is deep and you can do alot with it, but you have to really edit and layer to get deep crisp sounds IMO and that can eat polyphony. One of my issues with Roland is how they samples the user banks. They are very dry which is fine but editing with layering leaves the user samples still sounding thin, again IMO.

[RABid]

Well, the FantomX was the best selling of the big three last year. Unless the new Motif changes that I'm not sure that Roland will update it. After the initial rush on the Motif XS things seem to have cooled quite a bit. More and more are complaining about the Cubase integration and removal of slots for the PLG's.

[SilverDragonSoun]

Well, the FantomX was the best selling of the big three last year. Unless the new Motif changes that I'm not sure that Roland will update it. After the initial rush on the Motif XS things seem to have cooled quite a bit. More and more are complaining about the Cubase integration and removal of slots for the PLG's.

 

I was just stating my opinion as a Fantom X owner. Many others also share this opinion as well but after all it is just an opinion. I agree about the integration with Cubase. I personally hate that but again my opinion. The PLG's are hit and miss for me. I didn't like most of them and didn't think their non-inclusion was that big a deal, but I know many others did. I think Yamaha could make some amends for this by releasing a free sound bank or two for each new series.

[ProfD]

Bobby, it is a hard decision. I personally do not see a huge difference between the Motif XS and ES.

 

However, since you have been working with a Motif for the past 6 years, the newer soundset may be a source of inspiration. Good luck.

 

 

[Bobadohshe]

The biggest improvement in organ sounds I was looking for in the XS was a better Leslie sim, which didn't happen.

 

Duly noted, thanks for that tidbit. I was pretty thrilled when I heard the organ that one of our forumites had pieced together on the XS. I think it was Burningbusch? I've always thought the MOTIF organs were pretty dang good for what they were, organ samples from 2001. I figured the XS organs could only be better.

 

If you are doing a lot of organ work, a better move might be an XK-1 or Electro. That one would probably get more oohs and ahhs from your bandmates.

 

I've, strongly considered it. But I can only bring one board on the road (the 2nd tier, 88 key stage piano, is backlined) and I need organs, EPs, clavs, AND synth sounds AND pads AND performances. That's a bit beyond the scope of the Electro if I'm not mistaken.

[Bill H.]

Yup.

[MikeT156]

Something to keep in mind about the "Leslie SIMM" on the Motif series KBs. Yamaha didn't over do it on the intensity of the SIMM on the ES or XS series. You can edit the SIMM and "improve" the presets. Adding a slow LFO in addition to the 2 speed rotary speaker SIMM helps. There's a multitude of different chorus types to try out. I am able to get what I consider a pretty good slow leslie SIMM on my ES8. The only thing I haven't gotten to the sound I like is the transition from slow to fast speed. With that, I'm still under impressed. I'm still working on it.

 

Mike T.

 

 

[RABid]

Well, the FantomX was the best selling of the big three last year. Unless the new Motif changes that I'm not sure that Roland will update it. After the initial rush on the Motif XS things seem to have cooled quite a bit. More and more are complaining about the Cubase integration and removal of slots for the PLG's.

 

I was just stating my opinion as a Fantom X owner. Many others also share this opinion as well but after all it is just an opinion. ...

 

And I've had the same opinion and did not mean to critisize that view. Until last month I was still using my Fantom 76. I held it with expectations that the new Fantom would be released at Winter NAMM 2007. By history that is when Roland should have released an update. But, it never happened. Through my contacts I was told that the reason Roland never announced an update is because Fantom X is outselling other workstations, so why change until it stops being the top seller. That makes sense so I went ahead and replaced my Fantom 76 with a Fantom X7.

[RABid]

Well guys I've had my Motif 6 Classic ...

 

Seeing that this is a Classic you may be ready to update. Like me going from a Fantom 76 to Fantom X7, you will double your polyphony, get more up to date memory card storage, and can consider it an overhaul for that much used key bed. Your question may be should you pay a premium for the XS or go for one of those deals on a new ES, if they can still be found. If my ES6 had better resale value I would have grabbed an ES8 while they were going for 2k.

 

Robert

[Tonysounds]

It's beyond the scope of the Electro, but not above that of the Stage. The Stage will give you piano, Eps, Clavs, organ, synth, midi control of something else, all at the same time.

 

T

[SilverDragonSoun]

It's beyond the scope of the Electro, but not above that of the Stage. The Stage will give you piano, Eps, Clavs, organ, synth, midi control of something else, all at the same time.

 

T

 

True but now your getting into a very large price difference between the board he's considering, the XS 6 and Nord Stage.

[shadowcompany]

Go ahead and get the Motif XS. Its got great sounds and more importantly it sounds like you really want one. I don't think you'll regret the decision.

[Legatoboy]

Bobadohshe,

 

Get it, in 100 years or so... we'll all be dead! All of us!

(alot less for me!)

 

There are always 2 things I think about in terms of Gas. I usually, when GAS is approaching, look at people driving expensive autos.... Now, probably you grandmother can drive that car! But how many people can drive a Steinway (or an XS)! They justify those car purchases in a blink of an eye! Not to put anybody down for being into cars, God knows I love cars too! But if I had a choice between a really nice car and a Steinway, I'd take the Steinway!

 

My second point is this! I break my butt on gigs and I make $$ with my gear! I don't think $2000 worth of drapery makes $$, it basically just sits there looking pretty!

 

:love::love::love::love::love:

:love::love::love::love::love:

 

http://www.musiciansbuy.com/mmMBCOM/Images/yamaha_MOTIFXS6_dw.jpg

:love::love::love::love::love:

:love::love::love::love::love:

 

 

 

lb

[MikeT156]

Eight sliders when used for organ will give you more flexibility when used live in Voice Mode. On the ES there are four sliders, and in voice edit mode, you can select the bottom 4 drawbars on a Hammond (as one sampled sound) to be controlled by one slider, and then two independent drawbar samples to be controlled by a slider for each one. You then can use the 4th slider for controlling percussion. With the XS, you have double the sliders and you don't have to jerry rig your organ patches as much to have the controls setup the way you want them. So many of the basic samples are the same on the XS as on the ES, but you have better control for live use.

 

Edit: I missed the suggestion to get a Nord Stage instead of the XS. I don't think so. The piano samples on the XS SMOKES the Stage. The "synth" section of the Stage isn't near as full featured as the XS. The Nord "Probably" has better organ sounds and Leslie effect. Rhodes and Clavs? Drop back 10 and punt. If you need a great sounding piano more than organ sounds, the XS hands down. If you want great organ and Leslie simm, get the XS anyway. You can work with the organ sounds on the XS and if they're not enough, you can always get a used Electro OR a Motion Sound Leslie with all the money you make touring!

 

 

 

Mike T.

[MortenJ1642607708]

I wouldn't get a Fantom X right now because I believe a new Fantom is just around the corner. Roland typically cuts the MAP on things a few months before they discontinue them, and I kind of expect a $400-500 cut on Fantoms this

 

They just released SonicCEll that they say is the best Soundmodul that may be in the next fantom

[eric]

I tried posting this earlier, but seems like it got lost in cyberspace.

 

Looking at this from a gigging standpoint, XS will give you a lift in polyphony, FX, controllers and keyboard action. It is also a tad bit more compact. From a 'bread and butter' gigging keyboardist-type sounds standpoint, I find there is not a night and day difference between Classic, ES and XS. Sweetness sounds like Sweetness sounds like Sweetness (one of my favorite presets, by the way).

 

Sounds like your Classic has paid its dues, so if you have the means to snag an XS, go for it! But if you are going for the staple sounds, you won't find it to be leaps and bounds above what your Classic can do.

 

You are probably familiar with my story (tried to slim down from S90 Classic to XS7) - did not work because I could not acclimate to synth action rather than S90. A side factor was what I mentioned on the sounds. I've got my S90 Classic tweaked to such an extreme and there is no automated way to recreate that in the XS. So you would spend a lot of time dialing in your gig performances (if you use them). I spent countless hours listening and programming and was never completely satisfied. Sure, I found some fun new sounds along the way, but for the most part I was getting side-tracked on the way cool arps.

 

As for the organ sliders, it is just OK. I had high hopes for it, but it cannot rival a dedicated Hammond clone. For one, you push them rather than pull them. It is better than many romplers, but not a stand-in for a clone.

 

Speaking of the 8 sliders, I never found much of a gig purpose for that many of them. You can't stack 8 sounds in performance mode and sometimes that amount of hardware can be a bit daunting when you're working with 3-4 sounds only in a performance. That part of the instrument was overkill for gigging, in my opinion.

 

Sorry if I'm a little bit down on the GAS, but just wanted to share my experiences.

 

In the end, I actually found an ES6 (for the lightweight rompler solution) on closeout at $900. You may actually find something like this to be an easier investment and you would get most of the same lift other than the keyboard action and the 8 sliders.

 

Regards,

Eric

[SilverDragonSoun]

They just released SonicCEll that they say is the best Soundmodul that may be in the next fantom

 

If true that would be pretty sad. I'd expect a few of sounds possibly but to release something like the sonic cell and put your best sounds for your next work station in it would be silly. I've also heard that the sonic cell sounds an awful lot like the Fantom X w/out much difference and that its too similar to the XR for some people. I will reserve my own judgment until I get a chance to play around with one.

[Bobadohshe]

Well......I got it, on Monday. It's sitting right here next to me, and it looks enough like the Motif Classic to the untrained eye that no one is the wiser. At first I wasn't so sure that I made the right descision, but having spent the entire night last night exploring and editing and setting up my patches, I have become quite enamored of this thing.

I have nothing new to add to the reports that the other XS purchasers on this forum have given. My observations are largely the same. I have to say that I am quite blown away by the pianos. They are awesome. And I was initially a little apprehensive about the organs, but after digging deeper and editing they also sound great.

Tonight it gets its first gig test.