Do you have a virtual analog synth?

[Robert Smedberg]

Simple question, what VA do you have and your opinion about it or other you have tested/own.

 

I had a Roland JP8000 two years ago that I sold because I didn't need it anymore.

But G.A.S kicked in two weeks ago and I bought a Novation Supernova.

And man, what a good one.

This is way better than JP8000.

 

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--Smedis,--

[IanD]

I have a Korg MS2000, as I have said in previous threads I really like it.

The sounds are great and the mod sequencer is a good feature.

It has good vocoder too.

I guess all peoples ears are different but it does the job for me.

Its one of those keyboards you can play all day!

 

Ian

[Robert Smedberg]

I have only played MS2000 for about 10 minutes and it sure sounds good, but only 4 notes at a time is a drawback.

 

What kind of music do you use it for?

 

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--Smedis,--

[F7sound -]

I've got a JP-8000 and love it. Supernova may be better, I don't know, but I'm diggin' my JP!

 

 

Michael Oster

F7 Sound and Vision

http://www.f7sound.com

[IanD]

Originally posted by Robert Smedberg:

I have only played MS2000 for about 10 minutes and it sure sounds good, but only 4 notes at a time is a drawback.

 

What kind of music do you use it for?

 

 

for recording 4 notes is not to bad as i use Cubase and record the Ms and mulit track it.

I use it for all sorts of diffrent sounds,pads,lead,basses etc

ok so big 10 note chords are out!

 

My music is hard to describe, Floyd?,Genesis?, Jan Hammer? http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif

 

on my downloads site are 2 track i have just done with the MS doing most of the work

http://www.geocities.com/dixonsmusic

The tracks are 'The 1st Bell' and 'The 3rd Bell'

 

Ian

[Tusker]

I've got an AN1X. I have got to know it pretty well, and it is pretty deep for a VA. I liked it better than the other first generation VA's, though I've got to admit I like the second generation ones an awful lot. Still, it's become my buddy, and if I trade up, I will keep it as a controller.

 

Things I like about the AN1x:

 

- 4 Free EG's- Draw any shape you like and have them modulate (virtually) anything you like

- Scene Morph - Interpolates (not crossfades) between two scenes (like patches)

- Lovely Controller for controlling other things (touch, ribbon, knobs, etc)

- Amp Feedback parameter - Works in a very controllable way for that overdriven monosynth Jan Hammerish bite.

 

Things I don't like:

 

- Kludgy interface

- Plastic

 

Cheers,

 

Jerry

 

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www.tuskerfort.com

[Magpel]

Ian, I'm listening to 3rd bell as (virtually) speak. What is the MS2000 on this. The bass and the lead?

 

Funny thing. I've played with a bunch of the VAs ins tores lately, and while I don't get very deep into them due to my own conceptual limitations, I'm sometimes amazed by how good the Retro AS-1 softsynth sounds in comparison. They realy nailed a lot of vintage sounds with that thing, and the programming setup is pretty usable. My problem with it is that latency is a tad on the losing side of acceptability, and I've done all the tweaking I can to improve the problem short of a new system or soundcard. This makes it a really cool toy that I shy away from for serious work.

 

John

[Gus Lozada]

REAKTOR !!!

 

That thing RULES !

It is simply my best synth.

 

I do also have Rebirth and Retro AS-1. Not that amazed by the AS-1.

 

... i wish i'd have a SUPERNOVA II ... great choice, Robert !

 

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Gus Lozada

 

Moderador de:

MusicPlayer.com/NuestroForo

"La voz en Español en Música y Tecnología"

 

Gus TraX @musicplayer.com

[Rod S]

No, and I've been debating about this for a while. Truth is I have a Kurz sample library which is quite good, which emulates a lot of the classic analog synths (It's a 30 disk floppy set which has actual samples from the instruments).. old obies, old korgs, minimoog, etc. The only problem is the kurz does not lead itself to easy editing http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif The CS6x actually has some decent analog sounding libraries. I'm staying away from soft synths since I work the whole day with a f***ing computer. I like to sit in front of a keyboard or module and tweak knobs.

 

I'm currently eyeing the following:

ms2000r

microQ

PLG An card for my CS6x

 

I haven't been able to listen to the AN, since no one has that installed. I'll probably have to risk ordering it and then return it. Out of the ms2kr and the microQ, I like the waldorf better, but the korg seems more immediately editable. I am planning to order a peavey 16 slider controller though, so this may not be an issue.

[coyote]

Same here. For me, it always comes down to price vs performance. The JP was the best I found under $1000. I couldn't at that time (or even now) justify the extra thousands for something like the Supernova or Andromeda. And I'm sure I haven't begun to tap the JP's potential - new sounds & possibilities for it seem to come to me every day now.

 

Originally posted by f7sound@gte.net:

I've got a JP-8000 and love it. Supernova may be better, I don't know, but I'm diggin' my JP!

 

Michael Oster

F7 Sound and Vision

http://www.f7sound.com

[IanD]

Originally posted by Magpel:

Ian, I'm listening to 3rd bell as (virtually) speak. What is the MS2000 on this. The bass and the lead?

 

Funny thing. I've played with a bunch of the VAs ins tores lately, and while I don't get very deep into them due to my own conceptual limitations, I'm sometimes amazed by how good the Retro AS-1 softsynth sounds in comparison. They realy nailed a lot of vintage sounds with that thing, and the programming setup is pretty usable. My problem with it is that latency is a tad on the losing side of acceptability, and I've done all the tweaking I can to improve the problem short of a new system or soundcard. This makes it a really cool toy that I shy away from for serious work.

 

John

 

yes the bass is the MS, using the mod seq.

The lead is the MS as is the elec piano and the chord pad

 

The other track on the site with the MS on (1st bell) uses the MS for all the parts execpt the lead, including the vocoda

 

Ian

[Robert Smedberg]

Speaking of softsynths...

 

I was in a store a week ago and had the Pulsar II demoed for me.

And when we came to "Miniscope"....

Listened to a preset called "wakeman". Blew me away!

But I'm not into softsynths either. Not now at least.

 

Anyone heard miniscope?

 

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--Smedis,--

[Robert Smedberg]

Originally posted by coyote:

The JP was the best I found under $1000. I couldn't at that time (or even now) justify the extra thousands for something like the Supernova or Andromeda.

 

I bought my Supernova for less than what I paid for my JP8000. (950$)

As someone earlier said in a different topic, the guy was heading for softsynths and I was there and bought it cheap. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif

 

 

 

 

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--Smedis,--

[marino]

I simply don't like the sound quality of most VAs I've played. The only ones that impressed me are the Virus and the Q. I also used to like the AN1x, but recently I tried the Yamaha analog card on a Triton, and it sounded thin and distant to me. Go figure.

So I never bought a VA. But you have to take into account that I got a Matrix-12, and beetween that and the Kurzweil, I can get all the analog-type sound I need.

Among the softsynths I've heard, my absolute favorite is the VAZ Modular. It can really sounds like an analog at times, depending on the patch and the sound system. Reaktor is amazing of course, but it seems to keep that "digital" quality... I really don'y know how to describe it.

[Rod S]

Originally posted by marino:

I also used to like the AN1x, but recently I tried the Yamaha analog card on a Triton, and it sounded thin and distant to me.

 

http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/confused.gif what do you mean a yamaha card on a triton? Do you mean the PLG AN card?

[Gus Lozada]

Originally posted by marino:

...Reaktor is amazing of course, but it seems to keep that "digital" quality... I really don'y know how to describe it.

 

Andiamo Mezzanote !

 

It is just a matter of using a lower resolution... I use it at 33Khz instead of 44.1 ... even lower makes a significant difference...

 

VAZ is good too, actually. I also have it but I do still preffer Reaktor. I'm an addict, sorry http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif

 

I know you're almost a purist in your sounds and understand why the Virus impressed you. As I have said before, If I had the bucks, i'd go for VIRUS Indigo AND SuperNova II.

[marino]

Sorry Guys, I was posting in a hurry... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/redface.gif

 

Rod, the Yamaha analog card was on a Motif 6, not a Triton of course.

 

And Gus, I just didn't explain well enough. What I meant is that for analog simulations, the VAZ filters seem to have just a bit more balls and presence than those on Reaktor, for my taste at least. I'm aware that Reaktor is so versatile, it's almost endless. I was just talking about pure sound quality; I compared the two on the same soundcard, and VAZ has something that just appeals to me. You could be right about a lower resolution... I'll try that (when I get a decent computer).

 

marino

 

P.S. - Ehi Gustavo, parli italiano?

[aeon]

Originally posted by Robert Smedberg:

Simple question, what VA do you have and your opinion about it or other you have tested/own.

 

I own:

 

Clavia Nord Modular (keys, DSP-expanded)

 

Likes: It's modular! The near-infinite depth allows for a wide range of timbres because so many synthesis techniques (subtractive analog, FM, additive, waveguide physical modelling) can be realized and explored. That fact plus the audio inputs make it an incredible effects processor. It has a wide range of modules. 18 knobs! By combining logic circuitry in the editor with sequencer modules, entire compositions can be realized within a single patch. 4 Morph groups with 25 parameters each per patch. Sounds great with no effects. The editor software is a pleasure to work with. The user-community and mailing list is incredible. It has allowed me to learn so many things about synthesis that I either didn't know or took for granted. Over 14,000 patches available online for study. I have come nowhere close to realizing its potential.

 

Dislikes: I don't particularly like attached power cords. Changing a patch in one of the four engines will mute all engines for a second. The keyboard is better-suited as a set of switches than a perfornance device. LFOs don't sync to MIDI as a built-in function, though this can be programmed. Knobs aren't labelled, and since they can be assigned to so many things I find myself using the "peek" function a lot when pressured. No memory-based temporal effects. The synth can demand a lot of time...I did nothing else in my studio for the first three months I owned it other than program. I have come nowhere close to realizing its potential.

 

 

Waldorf Q Rack (16-voice)

 

Likes: The quality of the oscillators - simply the best I have found in any VA synthesizer. The modulation matrix is deep and the degree of modulation allows for some really organic sounds. The fidelity of the sound is immediate and the character is electric and alive. Flexible filter section allows you to control inputs per osc, and the dual-filter bank is freely modulatable between serial and parallel configurations with stereo routing. As such, setups such as 48db/oct. lowpass or stereo panning comb filters can be realized. Fast envelopes. I like the endless rotaries for programming. The UI is fairly fluid. The wavetables are smooth in character, and their presence combined with FM and comb filters make this synth much more than an analog emulator...it is a powerful digital synth in its own right. The arpeggiator is very powerful and very programmable. The step-sequencer is a lot of fun. Patch morphing. Digital S/PDIF out. Sounds great without effects, but the onboard mod fx, pattern delays and quality reverb add to the fun. Powerful vocoder. I find the design and color to be aesthetically pleasing and functional.

 

Dislikes: I don't like the non-standard power cord. Sometimes I find the filters to be a little clinical in nature. The step-sequencer is limited since it does not have any kind of pattern chaining or remote recall. Endless rotaries are not as fun for live tweaking. No true power-switch - it uses a soft switch. FX params not destinations in the mod matrix. Audio input forces you to use a custom cable since it is a stereo 1/4" jack. 32-voice expansion is expensive. No wordclock in.

 

 

Access Virus b

 

Likes: There is a lot of character to the sound. It can generate some of the most raw, ripping, edgy tones I have ever heard from a synth. A collection of digital spectral waves allow it to achieve PPG-like tones. One of the best digital filter implementations I have ever heard. You are able to overdrive the filter section (saturation) with a number of distortion types, both analog-esque and digital. Sexy wood end-cheeks! Internal aux busses allow you to send a voice channel through the engine again on another channel for further rounds of processing. Wicked-fast envelopes. Flexible vocoder with classic sound. Smooth-as-glass pads. Analog input makes this one hell of a filterbank and effects processor. Adaptive smoothing on knobs means sweeps and the like can be zipper- and glitch-free. Extensive MIDI CC control. With the exception of the global delay/reverb, effects are per channel for all 16 channels. Effects parameters are destinations in the mod matrix. Arpeggiator params are destinations in the mod matrix. Two user-assignable knobs.

 

Dislikes: The oscillator models are a little weak to my ear in terms of emulating a VCO...they don't have the quality of being flowing electric current. The line lump powersupply with non-stress-reinforced plug is a drag. While the source and destination list for the mod matrix is very extensive, there are only 3 sources and 6 destinations in a grouping of 1, 2 and 3 destinations per source. Significant potions of the voice architecture are found in hierarchical menus even though the primary functions have knobs. Delay/reverb is global only. Arpeggiator is very basic, although modulatable. Availablility as a ProTools TDM plug-in means you hear it in a lot of TV commercials.

 

 

I did not buy them because they emulated analog synths...I bought them because they were powerful digital synthesizers with tone colors that really caught my ear. I also like that I have person-to-person contact with each of their creators and that they are supported with updates that have extended their functionality beyond what was present at time of purchase.

 

My experience with analog synthesizers is fairly limited (rev. 2 Prophet-5, Obie Xpander, Akai VX600, Roland Juno-106, Waldorf Pulse, 2-rackpanel Serge), but I would say all three can achieve sounds that are analog in character. The accuracy of their analog emulations does not concern me much...they sound badass in and of themselves.

 

I have briefly used a Roland JP-8000 and a Yamaha AN1x but as I do not have extensive experience with them I choose not to comment on them.

 

I also have a Korg OASYS, but I have not gotten deep enough into the analog emulations on it to say anything more than they sound great and Korg clearly went for DSP-quality over quantity.

 

[edited to amend my Waldorf Q Likes section]

 

This message has been edited by aeon@mediaone.net on 09-09-2001 at 02:54 AM

[Pat Azzarello]

I went the cheap route (and some may argue that it's not a true VA) and bought a used CS1x. It does the analog job for me admirably, and pretty much gets the idea across. I haven't compared it to the "originals" side by side, but people have approached me and asked if I have a synth in my rack as they can't believe that the CS1x sounds as good as it does on certain patches. I never use the multitimbral aspects and when recording I usually cut the track to audio/disk if I need to use it for a couple of different sounds. I never use the arpegiator either (someday I'm going to come up to date on that thing).

 

Unfortunately, values are quantized (filter, LFO, etc) pretty coarsely http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/frown.gif , so its hard to get things exactly right. I managed to get a decent "helicopter" in Frankenstein (Edgar Winter), but the quantizaton on the LFO speed was "between the cracks", so I never quite sync up with the drums (but no one notices as the crowd usually is holding up lighters at that point in the show http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif )

 

Anyone have an Alesis QS patch for the Frankenstein helicopter?

[dansouth]

I had an original nord lead, but it made my ears ring every time I played it. Pity, I liked it as a controller.

 

Now I have a JP-8000 and a JP-8080. The 8000 sounds much warmer even though the guts of the two instruments are essentially the same. Go figure.

 

The Pro-52 plug in is the bomb. It's made by the Native Instruments, the Reaktor people. My submission to the Keyboard Corner CD was done on the Pro-52 exclusively.

[DougP]

Aeon - EXCELLENT review of your three VA's, thanks! (I'd add something if any of my analogs were virtual, but they're not.)

[Dr Teeth]

I would like to have a nova laptop... Why every body mentioned "Iwould like to have a nova but the price", when a nova laptop is in MS2000 and Jp8000 price range