Internotes, and distribution....

[Franknputer]

Originally posted by Ani:

I "do" look at the 2 + 2 in putting Tower together with CD Baby, especially with the loose language written inside their contract... centering on the "by other means" clause that was entered. This opens the door to "brick and mortar" distribution, which is all that Tower Records has been about in the past several decades. Don't think that they would not exercise that right if push came to shove.

You keep confusing the terms of the contracts for CD distribution and online distribution, which are completely separate.

Also, in the other article I sent to you, I found this line to stand out rather prominently

http://www.pacificavc.com/blog/2003/10/08.html

 

Or, as Tom Walker writes to suggest: "...buy from small independent used stores. That way we keep small businesses running, and our money doesn't get back to the RIAA since they already got their profits from the initial buy."

If you really must buy a CD in a real store, go to Wal-Mart. Help collapse the influence of Tower Records and other music specialists that are holding back the industry. While you're at it, consider moving your video business to Netflix or another online source. Kevin's analysis makes it clear that the Tower's of the world are near the root of the music industry's retrograde tendencies. Let the air out of their tires.

Again, here is a statement that gives an idea as to Tower Records "cut" in the online sales... keeping in mind that iTunes would probably also get "their" cut as well... I may be reaching here, but no stone goes unturned as far as I'm concerned; when looking at the overall picture.

This is a large leap to make. Quoting a blog from a VC firm, that is quoting another blog...who are these people? My teenage daughter has a blog, too - it hardly makes her an authority on the music business.

 

And suggesting that one strike a blow for expanding the music business by buying from Wal-Mart is laughable. They have already shown their willingness to exert pressure on the labels towards product that does not fit their 'image' - and they could give 2 sh*ts about music, anyway, because it's a loss-leader to get people into their stores to buy all the rest of the crap they sell.

 

On top of that, the economics are very good for the labels. One study I did for a major music distributor concluded that when you purchased a CD for $17.99 at Tower Records, the record label only got $3 - $5. Out of that, they paid the artist and their own expenses and profit. Count the additional sales you could get for a lower price, and the label makes more money from an online price of $3.99 than a store price of $17.99.

I also find it interesting that the first line of that sentence says the economics are good for the labels and yet Tower is filing a Chapter 11.

Tower Records is not a label.

 

Better question: How much did the artist get? The line "Out of that, they paid the artist and their own expenses and profit" should actually read "Out of that, they paid their own expenses and profit, and if there was anything left they paid the artist."

[nursers]

Just a thought/question: anyone object to me 'advertising' availability of the Internotes CD to other parts of the musicplayer forum when it is available?

[DanS]

With all due respect Nursers, at this point, it would mean that Jackpine will be the only one making any money off of this venture. Or have you come up with a better idea of how to do a short run on this disc, and how to split up any monies generated from sales to all the members?

Seems to me this is where we still stand, months after initial discussions. Furthermore, I'll go out on a limb and assume this is the reason your thread for Internotes 2 is generating so few responses.

C'est la vie.

[Wewus432]

The total price for producing each CD is going to be $4.00 or $5.00 right? Who says we can't sell it for more than that? We could sell it for $7.00 to $10.00 and keep the profits in an account, until we figure out how to split it them up equitably.

 

I think each group should get an equal percentage of any profits, payed monthly, or quarterly or whatever, to each manager, and then he would distribute money to members.

 

Of course we could put some money into our own website, for continuing these projects, with sales available on the site, and just promote that, instead of going through other distribution channels. That would entail someone being in charge of recieving and sending orders of course, which I'm sure wouldn't be too much trouble, and we could give them a small cut of the profits for doing that.

[jlampson]

Originally posted by TheWewus:

Of course we could put some money into our own website, for continuing these projects, with sales available on the site, and just promote that, instead of going through other distribution channels. That would entail someone being in charge of recieving and sending orders of course, which I'm sure wouldn't be too much trouble, and we could give them a small cut of the profits for doing that.

I checked and many of the Internotes."whatever" sites are available. That's a great idea, Steve.

 

As far as the technical side of things, I am willing to pitch in whatever I can. I can purchase desired domain name and host it on my server for nothing, including bandwidth. Let me know. I'd love to see this finally get off the ground.

 

John

[ani]

There are flaws in what Steve has presented John. It's easy enough to just jump out and say, "Hey, let's just divide everything equally among the managers and let them divide among their players", but in essence, the efforts that have gone into this project have NOT been equally distributed among managers; nor have all teams partipated equally.

 

There are teams that have no songs whatsoever on the CD, there are teams with only one song on the CD, and there are teams with three songs on the CD; the agreed upon guidelines stated 2 songs per team, but the CD was falling short of entries after the deadline which is where the 3rd song came in to help fill the void and push the song count up. This is not to say that those teams that did not manage to get a song placed on the CD, did not have some credible contributions to this project.

 

Brakka hosted the majority of the private team forums while assisting me with mine, and also came up with the initial idea for the project. He, myself, Sylver, and Nursers put in massive hours pounding out details on guidelines for participation, getting the word out for sign up, establishing rules, regulations, and deadlines, and then coordinating player sign-ups as they rolled in so that all entries would be accounted for and placed along with their profiles into the list of candidates willing to participate for the selection process by managers. There was "A LOT" of concentrated effort that went into the development of this project long before others entered the scene. Sylver and Brakka are VERY MUCH a part of the process that went into helping the Fantasy League project get off of the ground; while Nursers and myself assisted in getting the ball rolling and keeping it rolling. Brakka continued through to the end with hosting the private forums, although his team did not have an entry on the CD; Brakka was actively involved throughout the entire process. Sylver and Brakka combined wrote a large portion of the guidelines that got this project underway.

 

Some managers completely fell out of the project, with little to no efforts involved; so where would there be any entitlement to a cut of the pie?

 

Then, when the time came for the final processing of the CD to come together; people like Bob Phillips stepped up to the mound and worked to pull all of the works together for the final master. I provided the graphics, but that's beside the point on my graphics as I considered the experience of CD cover design educational; my usual graphics have always been for web design which is quite a bit different from those of print quality. Still, these are things (expenses that would be exhausted for services) that would not normally be "lumped in" and forgotten about in the production of a CD.

 

Also, there would be a separate cut set aside for Project management, outside of the team management.

 

There were a total of 8 songs that went onto the CD, and what would seem to be a reasonable distribution, would be to divide the portions up according to the number of songs entered by each team. Also providing allowance for Project Management and Final Engineering processes. The team managers would then divide the portions received by their teams among their players as they seen fit.

 

The Fantasy League project was not just a handful of participants, and didn't just "HAPPEN" ....

 

Also, there is SO MUCH MORE that could happen with a project this big, if folks wanted to come to terms in a fair and equitable manner for ALL involved.

 

As far as Fantasy League 2 goes.... given the lack of respect and appreciation, from many participants, that the project managers from FL 1 have been shown (ie: Brakka, Sylver, Nursers, and myself); I will not even consider participation in another project without pre-established goals for projected success while having writers agreements IN PLACE by all participants.

 

I went back in and reviewed some of the initial threads, and actually I had stated during the establishment of the guidelines for Fantasy League 1, that I was looking at the potential marketing... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=11;t=000088 midway through the page, the topic was brought up. There was another place where I mentioned being "serious" about the marketing of this project; by not enforcing the fact that written agreements were signed prior to putting in all the time I did, was simply a foolish mistake of mine that will not be repeated as such. As many have said this project was all about fun; there were discussions early on during the development of this project about pursuing higher levels beyond that of this forum.

 

What it all comes down to is this; the word "FUN" seems to equate to "We don't stand a chance against today's teen idols, and we're just a bunch of sorry ended, washed up, wrung out old geezers that want to devote our lives to music to entertain our friends. We wouldn't stand a chance, so we're not even going to try." Because many of us have families, it does not put us out of the market for making and SELLING quality music. It may put us out of the MAINSTREAM pop crap that dominates the airwaves; but a difference NEEDS to be made. As long as people fear the challenge of taking new avenues to pursue success; there will always be a market dominated by HYPE rather than quality music. A champion often survives on strictly "bully techniques"... If no one is strong enough to challenge them; they remain in control. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

 

As far as fun goes, I have fun with my children, and "THIS" summer, I intend to enjoy being a bum in the sun with them again... If I have not offended the SOMA team (In it's current state of active members Bob, Brett, Dan, Wrave, John, and me) by now, "THEY" are a team worth every effort spent and I will continue working with them as long as they are willing to keep me !!!! A team that I can honestly say "EQUALITY EXISTS"

 

My rant.... as it stands.... If something becomes of Internotes I, other than just a mere distributed copy for the pleasure of our little group here, then I would be more than happy to step back in and assist in the marketing and promotion. But for now, I'll be seeking ONLY to work with individuals that are willing to pursue higher levels of success.

 

Dan,

 

I don't think that Jim (JackPine) is doing anything more than recovering his expenses on these small run offs. I will assume partial responsibility for the possible misconceptions in comparative pricing relating back to the initial discussions about accepting Jim's offer. When bringing up manufacturing houses such as Disc Makers having 1 offs within reasonable rage; that was prior to thoroughly reviewing Jim's humble offer that "INCLUDED" all packaging and shipping costs to anywhere around the globe.

 

I will go to bat for Jim here on this one, as I have been carefully considering how much upfront cash would be needed to place an order with a well known replication facility large enough to capitalize on quantity discounts... so to even come close to Jim's pricing for smaller runoffs. Considering that the postage for ONE disk within the Continental U.S. will run Jim at least a $1.00 each, plus the bubble pack CD mailer falling in somewhere between $ .70 to $1.00 each; then not to mention ink supplies (both thermal printing and paper), blank media disks used, (both for final copies and those that were flawed or deemed unusable for one reason or another), jewel boxes, paper for the CD inserts, and other things considered....I don't think that Jim is "making" money but instead, just covering his expenses.

[jlampson]

Well put, Ani. Let's just say that, yes, there are flaws in just issuing a blanket statement to do something this big one specific way. My intention was to just give everybody one of those micro-pep talks, you know, like "come on team, what are we all waiting for?"

 

I've seen too many people languish waiting for others to move on this. It is extremely frustrating and I wasn't even involved in it!

 

Anyway, I do hope that this can be resolved in some suitable manner quickly. Count me in for a copy of that CD!

 

John

[ibescotty]

Kind of a complicated mess we've got going here. I'd contribute a gig or two's worth of cash to this project to get it off the ground if need be.

 

As for profits for Internotes I, maybe we pick a charity and be done with it. I was never in this for money.

 

Internotes II? I'll be with doublepost if they'll keep me around. Even if I have been a slacker lately!!

[Wewus432]

I think what Anita is wanting to do is start a Label, which is beyond the scope of this forum.

 

We just need to burn up some CD's of our project, and move on to the next one. If Anita or anyone else wants to start a Label affiliated with these projects, I think that is an idea worth exploring, and I'm interested, but right now we just need to burn what we got, and put it out there, and move on to the next thing.

 

There's nothing keeping anyone, or any group here from taking work done here, and using it on their own album, or whatever. That has nothing to do with what we're doing here....RIGHT NOW.

 

Small project.... project is complete, release CD's, PLEASE!!!!!

[ani]

No, actually Wewus,

 

I was looking at the broad range of global territory that was covered in this project and I recognized the potential for marketing such a feat if it were actually accomplished; it's one of the main reasons that I put as much as I did into the project.

 

However, although I was talking about the marketing far before the player sign ups began; apparently there were crossed signals in communication as I didn't realize that we were just doing this for the fun of it. Of course, I was involved mainly in the threads where the structuring and development of the project was taking place; I didn't spend a lot of time in the other threads.

 

Where I failed in this overall project, is the fact that I neglected to call for written agreements of any type from participants right up front. Although, I did start an individual thread inside of my private forum right off the bat for the SOMA team; nothing was really ever written down or discussed until after SOMA had finished three songs.

 

You are wrong in the fact that I'm trying to start another label. To produce and market a specialty group for its' uniqueness is one thing, but it is an entirely different ballgame to open source for any and all; a label would not be an isolated group of individuals.

 

As it stands right now, it is obvious that Internotes I has no future for marketing or mass distribution whatsoever. I'll not continue building the website that I started relative to the inception, development, and success of Internotes; although I don't consider it a success to conquer a project that had such potential, and then say "oh well, it was just for fun".

 

I'm reluctant in even attempting to involve myself with Internotes II because I know what went into the making of Internotes I. Meeting the deadlines with my SOMA team was the absolute "EASIEST" part of the entire project; and there were some rough spots even with that. By tacking the "II" onto the project, it takes the glow off of the uniqueness of the initial project; in essence, something tried and failed. Potential investors would question what happened to the first project and it's a sore topic with me that I'd rather avoid. Just being honest!!!

 

Anyone can deny me what they will in the development, progress, and completion of this project, as in time it will become evident once a person is no longer around to pick up the slack. Brakka and Sylver appear to have already had their fill.

 

I'm not one to sit around and wait for someone to throw me a crumb; I go out and harvest the crop that makes the bread. It amazes me that so many will grope over the success of others, but when potential success is sitting within arms reach; they slap it away.

 

I will honor my offer to JackPine in creating a site for him at no charge to accept online orders and sell the CD at the price of $5.00; if he is still interested.

 

I am still VERY interested in completing an INTERNATIONAL project, but at this point, I don't think that another Internotes is the avenue I want to pursue. I think that I'd rather open up a project to special invitation only that would involve the works of a multinational/international collaboration of artists willing to work towards the ultimate goal of globalization and commercial marketing. I am already involved in two other project simultaneously, and also I have signed on as a volunteer political campaign supporter; I may be doing some online work for them. I'll have to select wisely those projects that I am willing to devote my time to, as I haven't got the time in my life for playing around. Music is more than just a game or a pass time to me.

 

20to20, MixterRader, DanS, Wrave, jLampson, Nursers, Mats Olsson, Flyscots, Gus Lozada, James from Italy, and others from around the world will be among those that I would like to involve on a single compilation of world artistry at its' best. If I don't find the participation that I would like to find in these forums, then I will use the MusicBizBuzz web site to provide exposure to event. Given that my site is completely and totally international, I'm sure that there would be expressed interest.

[ani]

To All,

 

If I decide to steer away from involvement with another Internotes and move with a different type of International Collaboration; those not mentioned above can feel free to contact me to express an interest. Don't do it, if you're not committed and willing to work for projected goals.

[Wewus432]

You mean we're not going to be stars? Give me a freakin' break here. It's just some demos we made. It's not that great. If you want to take your tracks and promote them internationally, knock yourself out. I hope you make it to the big time, or make a million bucks, or whatever it is you're looking for.

 

Just for the record. No one here has any expressed, or implied rights to promotion of, or distribution of any tracks I wrote, or played on.

 

That makes things a lot simpler doesn't it?

[jlampson]

No problem, Steve, I'll take all the profits from the sale of your song and take a picture of them in various locations, similar to the lawn gnomes.

 

Oh yeah, that was a joke.

[ani]

Actually Steve,

 

There were TWO accomplished names in the music business that had expressed interest in this project; one of which actually registered on these forums and reviewed the progress from a LURKER stance. The other, a Mercury records veteran that has current status with all Majors.

 

Although I'm not really pushing any sales or business on my web site, other than a small distribution of Amazon books that are mainly there in providing my viewers a convenient listing of popular music biz books, my site is recognized world wide and links to the site can be located in multiple college directories, attorney associations, and trade association directories. Not to forget, the site is listed all throughout major search engines WORLD WIDE!!!

 

You can make funnies all you want, but an opportunity has just closed its' door. These people were aware that there might be complications in getting people to pull together and do an equitable divide, so there is no mud in my face. It is the attitudes such as yours and Chris Kemps' that will close this opportunity for the others involved in this project. I don't have to deal with the nonsense, and I won't. I'll send copies of Internotes to my contacts anyway, with their knowledge that nothing can be done with it, but they will be able to see the works that went into the project and know that there are certainly possibilities for something even bigger down the road. If those contacts lose interest prior to completion of another project; there will be other opportunities.

 

While some were off on an adventure ride in trying to find themself on the West coast; others were diligently pouring their heart and soul into the continued progress and finalization of this project. Nursers nudged the project back into view after Kemps' insistance that one could just provide server space and the project would resolve itself; his claim was that no management was needed to move the project along... I pulled out at the time to allow Chris to prove his point and the point was well received; the project went NOWHERE.

 

After Nursers call for actions, Bob Phillips was instrumental in pulling the tracks together for final mastering where I stepped back in to encourage others to get their finals in and provided server space to those who needed it to transfer tracks; even though some didn't use the FTP access for one reason or another, if they requested the access, I spent the time to set up the accounts and provide the room. PbbPaul, and Bunny can both be recognized for bringing together final tracks to help complete unfinished songs for their teams in order to have enough songs to complete a CD; Flyscots can be thanked for getting a ball dropped in his lap and managing to come through although bouncing all over the country. Unfortunately Double Posts last song didn't make it to the disk, but Fly made his best effort to get everything together in his transition in traveling about and returning home.

 

Again, when discussions began about distribution and people actually started offering to pitch in to help get the project to production; Kemp stepped back in to interject his view of how things should be handled. Where was Kemp at when the call for musicians was being made? He was tending to personal issues that all of us had to deal with in one way or another throughout the life of this project. He had no musical interest whatsoever in this project, and yet, made serious efforts to throw a wrench in whatever we could get going.

 

Just on my team alone, Wrave and Bob suffered both serious flooding and electrical storms that made it almost impossible for them to remain active at such times; although they came through with flying colors. DanS had just put in a swimming pool that needed his attention, and then was pulled Stateside to work in Detroit for several months while having a bulk of his equipment still sitting in Canada; still, HE pulled through with flying colors. Brett was in the field and not able to access his equipment on an off throughout the entire project and yet, he too, came through with flying colors. Myself, we had tornadoes sweeping the Kansas City area and horrendous weather that could be damaging to equipment for several days. A tornado wiped out an entire neighborhood less than three miles from my home.... still SOMA delivered the two songs projected in the guidelines of the Fantasy League by the deadline and continued to create a third song to help with the song count.

 

I am not one to leave out people who made serious contributions to this project, but I am also not one to agree to allowing those who did not contribute equally to come in and call for equal splits. That would be like me saying that the entire lot of the SOMA team deserved equal splits.... I don't think so.... there were two players that did very little whatsoever and without any musical contributions to the works; those two would not be entitled to the same portions as would the others who put full efforts into the project. Although, I would have been honorable enough to allow them a "slight" credit for that which they did do.

 

Anyway, the point seems moot now, so, as I said earlier; I don't see the point in trying to breathe life back into a dead horse. I'll go another route where I have a little more control of the situation. Not that I want control, but things need to be in written order to take them to higher grounds.

[Wewus432]

Damn, you're full of shit. Who died and made you our leader? Frankly, I don't want anything I do, associated with anything you do, so I'm through with this Internotes bullshit. I don't even like that name anymore.

 

I'm sure if you get this great record deal you can find some tracks to substitute for mine. You're not my agent, or my manager, or anything, and I don't want you representing me in anyway.

[flyscots]

OK, I'm ignoring the last few posts for now - too much reading, too little time.

 

First of all, ibescotty, of course you're welcome to stick around with Double Post. You know that already! Don't worry about recent inactivity, we're all guilty of that from time to time and I think we all got hit with other commitments simultaneously this time. Keep your eyes & ears open for more developements.

 

Right, the potential money thing. I really like the idea of any profits being put towards a website which could then be used for further promotion. If there are excess profits then Ani is right, we'd need to figure out how to spread them fairly rather than just do a simple equal split.

 

As always here though, a potentially good, important discussion has turned into a mess of long assed rants of opinions and "here's the fact whether they are relevant or not" kinda posts.

 

Ani, thanks for including me in that list of names. We'll see.

[Wewus432]

The only thing I am giving permission for is for this CD to be sold at cost, through the MusicPlayer forums. There will be no profits.... and any other sales or promotion through any other websites is strictly against my wishes.

 

If you want to make copies and give them to your friends, or whoever, to show what we're doing here, that's fine. If you start selling a CD, with my work on it, without my permission, and I find out about it, you're going to have a legal problem.

 

The purpose of this PROJECT was to demonstrate some of the abilities of the people here, and to foster collaboration among the people here. Everything else is bullshit.

[PBBPaul]

Here's my two cents:

 

To achieve a goal, it must have several components. It needs to be specific, measurable, attainable, rewarding, time-bound and - most importantly - clearly communicated to all involved. Of these, the only component present was the time element. And that was as gray as could be. So if there was a specific goal in this project, I think it was different for every person involved.

 

My own understanding of Internotes I was that it was to be an experiment in creating music with a group of musicians with totally unrelated backgrounds, influences, styles or even faces. This was to be a completely virtual project with the distinction of making real music by real players with no immediate physical interaction. I understood that IF there was an actual resulting product, it could possibly be used to generate press interest in virtual music creation and the use of technology for that purpose. The resulting level of press coverage would then determine the level of corporate interest in further production and possibly profit. I personally would still like to see a nice press package put together for distribution to news organizations in all media.

 

Had I known up front that the resulting product itself was to be a profit-generating business venture (which I personally believe is an unrealistic expectation from a larval work such as this); I would have approached it quite differently. Frankly, I don't think that this project would stand up on its musical merits alone (at least not the stuff that I had direct control over) and is not worthy of commercial release - although I haven't heard the final versions so I could be wrong (and people will, after all, buy what they're told to buy - American Idol as an example). I do think that it has value as a demonstration of the use of Internet technology in real music production and the ability of the Internet to bring people of diverse cultures and political viewpoints together with common goals.

 

As it is, I am grateful for the opportunity to have "met" some great people and participate in the experiment. If we can make it go anywhere, that's icing for me. I also don't believe in allowing initial failures to inhibit future successes if the goal is valid. If I did, I wouldn't know how to ride a bike, play guitar and I would have been fired from every job I've ever had.

[Wewus432]

Thanks for the words of wisdom Paul. You know if you start selling a CD like this, you are in effect going into business with all the other people involved with the CD. I didn't sign on for that! Like you said this project is still in the larval stages, so it's really too early to talk about anything except making the work from it available to the people who participated, and other MusicPlayer members.

[PBBPaul]

Originally posted by TheWewus:

Thanks for the words of wisdom Paul. You know if you start selling a CD like this, you are in effect going into business with all the other people involved with the CD. I didn't sign on for that! Like you said this project is still in the larval stages, so it's really too early to talk about anything except making the work from it available to the people who participated, and other MusicPlayer members.

I hear ya Steve. That's why my thoughts are to use this CD as a kind demo of what's possible with this new-fangled internet thing that everyone's talking about. Maybe talk about how file-sharing isn't just for the music thieves anymore. Maybe call it open-source music development, I don't know but I think it should definitely be talked about. Didn't somebody at some point write a narrative about this project? That may be a good place to start with a press release.

 

While Anita may be a bit more wide-eyed and optimistic than you or I, the project would certainly not be where it is (wherever that may be) without her. She does have a point in that all of the hours put into this thing should have some kind of result. Again, I don't think that it should be sales at this point but I think that publicity would be cool and it would be a good way to judge the market place. If, on the other hand, the press starts going wild and inviting all of us to perform on talk shows, or if some A&R guy from Sony comes knocking and just has to have this CD in his stable, then we know that we have something and it's time to talk about financial proposals and entertainment attorneys.

[ani]

Damn, you're full of shit. Who died and made you our leader? Frankly, I don't want anything I do, associated with anything you do, so I'm through with this Internotes bullshit. I don't even like that name anymore.

For starters, not for your benefit Steve, but for others involved in this project that might have questions.

 

You say that I'm full of it, but one can easily go to Google.com, Yahoo.com, or any other search engine for that matter and run a test on how many sites or directories include the listing of MusicBizBuzz. All one has to do is type the words links; musicbizbuzz making sure to include the semi colen and space. Each search engine will return different results, as some sites are not listed on all engines.

 

Any site on the web can claim to be international, as the mere presence of being online provides international access. However, to truly be an international site, it involves being listed in foreign directories and not just those within the USA; those that outside countries would have to access by specifically searching out an American search engine that provided USA directories.

 

I'm not just blowing smoke. As you browse through the connected sites to mine, you will find major search engines ALL OVER THE WORLD carrying the link, Universities, (either titled directly or identified by the .edu URL extension attached to the acronym of the Univ.), you will find Patent Attorney directories, lot's of Music Biz organizations (Composers Societies, Songwriter's Assoc., Jazz and other Genre Associations, Professional Photographic Orgs, Applelinks, and etc.), other music directories, government offices, and etc. Most of all linked are either directories for professional music, or things dealing with professional trade and copyright laws. What you won't find are many individual band sites or artists.

 

For what it's worth, and I saved the HTML, Harry Fox Agency was #3 among my top 30 visitors earlier in the month. I don't have to impress anyone because I know that I am sitting on a goldmine; a key that unlocks almost any door I knock on in the professional world of trade and music. When I say that I can provide GLOBAL EXPOSURE, there is no B.S. to it. I do have contacts all throughout the Music Biz, some more tight than others, but nonetheless they are there.

 

There is a multi platinum award winning producer, who is also a music consultant, that expressed an interest in the project when I phoned him to discuss an upset that wrapped him in the middle of a controversial issue here on the forums. He is a business associate of mine and he is now a registered lurker on these forums.

 

I had thought to keep the Music Biz people out of things, but this guy is definitely well versed in legalease; which is something I'm not an expert at. He offered his services and appeared to be VERY interested in the project we had going with Internotes; I didn't ask. Even if I were to steer clear of the Labels, having a music biz expert to accompany a corporate business attorney would be a wise move if dealing with corporations. I'll not mention the other contact, but I will say that he is from a foreign country and is very much into Globalization such as I am; we've discussed the subject of globalization at length. There is only a slight possibility in him being available, as he is an extremely busy man, but I didn't approach him for his invovlement... instead we merely discussed what each other had been up to with our sites and the topic of Internotes was mentioned...... He thought the project sounded incredibly exciting; and if he is still the same person that I became acquainted with way back when both of us were starting out sites, I think that he might want to be involved if his schedule would allow.

 

Steve,

 

For me to just be making outlandish claims would be right down stupid. Anyone knows that, if I could gain the trust of the people by tossing out lies, that trust would immediately be abolished when I couldn't produce. I think that people inside the forums here know my virtual personality enough to know that I'm dead serious about accomplishments; and that I follow through with commitments.

 

For your stance about legal issues and what-have-you; I had already stated that I would spin off on my own for those interested and willing to agree to terms. I'm not idiot enough to attempt putting myself into a vulnerable position that would make me liable to someone like yourself. However, you have no regard for any person involved in this entire project by spouting off your legal threats. I merely offered to set up a site for JackPine to make the ordering process more friendly. I'll not reduce myself to your level, I'll just not included you in any project that I will be a part of ever again.

 

Since you are taking the stance that you are, with consent of other FL members, your songs can always be removed. The works of those on your team would be dumped down the drain; but I would personally see to it that they would have fair opportunity to participate if they wished to do so... while offering my assistance to them without any request for splits.

 

Hopefully the SOMA team will follow in the spin off, and perhaps Flyscots might be able to get his team to agree to terms, Maybe B_3guy, PbbPaul and their team might be interested............ Nursers and Bunny and the rest of the team that have not expressed definite positions are certainly welcome to follow. It's a gamble in how many will follow, but there is too much talent involved to let it die. Maybe Steve doesn't think anything is of commercial value, but the mere concept of this entire project has perked the interest of at least a few Pros.

 

Even my banker that is working a refinance on my home expressed an interest and has asked for a cut of the CD. So much for that!!!

[Wewus432]

What CD? We've got 8 songs, that's not even a whole CD worth of material, it's a damn demo. You've got to have something to sell before you start trying to sell it.

 

I know some people in the music business too, you think I'm going to call them up and say "Hey man, look at this, we've got 8 whole songs, can you sell this?"

 

You are out in the ozone somewhere. Earth to Anita, come in.

 

Your website is a collection links. I'm sure that's convenient for some people. I can get all that same information by doing a web search on the subject I'm interested in. Duh? Are there some secret links on there that no one but you knows about? Please point those out. Everyone here is tired of you going on about your website. If it's such a goldmine, what are you waiting for?

 

You've got a REAL PROBLEM with your ego tripping Anita, and this is not the place to do it. Nobody gives a shit about who you know, or who you talked to, or what you're going to do with this great CD.

 

You're a postal worker. If you want to be more than that, you need to do a reality check and start from there.

[nursers]

Ok, time for me to enjoy some of the glamour that comes with being a moderator

 

My take is that the only point of agreement is that those who took part are welcome to a copy of the CD, which jackpine has VERY kindly offered to do. My suggestion would be that we leave it at that for Internotes 1, and those who wish to follow up with Anifa on her proposition are obviously welcome to do so, and those that don't need not worry.

 

There is a seperate thread to discuss interest in receiving a CD, so to avoid any further disharmony over the issue i will lock this thread in the next day or so.

 

And my take on whether Internotes should/could have been something more than a fun project? Fun was my first priority. If it went further than that then excellent. I flagged fairly early on that my experience with Rocket Network and the album deal with a major label that resulted, showed that disgagreement amongst participants can very easily kill momentum. It appears history repeats. Of course, whether there WAS momentum is subjective, but then isn't everything. We will probably never know now

[Wewus432]

What disagreement? All we've got is one person going off on some crazy ego trip because of an 8 song demo, three of which she was involved in.

 

Someone show me a real deal, and get someone involved who has some fucking idea of what they're talking about, and I'm there. I'm just sick of the little kid mentality of sitting around talking about how great we are, and how someone in the business is interested in our music, and bla bla bla. I got over that bullshit when I was a teenager. It's bullshit.

[nursers]

I didn't say there was disagreement - just that there was only one point of agreement

[Wewus432]

There would be almost 0 problems HERE if Anita wasn't involved in this project. There would have been a lot more participants too. I've had 5 people tell me so far that they didn't sign up because they were afraid they would get picked for her team, and I'm sure there's a lot more than that who didn't say anything.

 

I don't understand how anyone can stand to work with her. Her whole focus seems to be on controlling people, pumping up her own ego, and making things seem harder than they are.

 

I'm through with The Collaboration Corner if she continues doing anything here. I refuse to work with people like that, or even be around people like that, and so should you.

[PBBPaul]

Originally posted by nursers:

My take is that the only point of agreement is that those who took part are welcome to a copy of the CD, which jackpine has VERY kindly offered to do. My suggestion would be that we leave it at that for Internotes 1, and those who wish to follow up with Anifa on her proposition are obviously welcome to do so, and those that don't need not worry.

 

And my take on whether Internotes should/could have been something more than a fun project? Fun was my first priority. If it went further than that then excellent. I flagged fairly early on that my experience with Rocket Network and the album deal with a major label that resulted, showed that disgagreement amongst participants can very easily kill momentum. It appears history repeats. Of course, whether there WAS momentum is subjective, but then isn't everything. We will probably never know now

I agree. It was fun and educational and I would certainly do it again. This is music after all. A form of art. Free expression. Emotional release. The fact that there's an industry attached just screws it up and introduces the root of all evil - lawyers. For me it's about the free exercise of music and collaboration with like minded but different folks. Any financial or other reward is purely gravy. So I'm with Nursers. Let's let it be and move on to the next one. Hopefully we all learned something.

[DanS]

Gee Steve, why don't you tell us how you really feel?

[nursers]

Originally posted by PBBPaul:

Originally posted by nursers:

My take is that the only point of agreement is that those who took part are welcome to a copy of the CD, which jackpine has VERY kindly offered to do. My suggestion would be that we leave it at that for Internotes 1, and those who wish to follow up with Anifa on her proposition are obviously welcome to do so, and those that don't need not worry.

 

And my take on whether Internotes should/could have been something more than a fun project? Fun was my first priority. If it went further than that then excellent. I flagged fairly early on that my experience with Rocket Network and the album deal with a major label that resulted, showed that disgagreement amongst participants can very easily kill momentum. It appears history repeats. Of course, whether there WAS momentum is subjective, but then isn't everything. We will probably never know now

I agree. It was fun and educational and I would certainly do it again. This is music after all. A form of art. Free expression. Emotional release. The fact that there's an industry attached just screws it up and introduces the root of all evil - lawyers. For me it's about the free exercise of music and collaboration with like minded but different folks. Any financial or other reward is purely gravy. So I'm with Nursers. Let's let it be and move on to the next one. Hopefully we all learned something.

Exactly. The Keyboard Corner guys are up to Vol 8, and it all seems to work really well. We don't have to be the same as the KC compilations, but it's a good template on which to start

[DanS]

Originally posted by nursers:

 

And my take on whether Internotes should/could have been something more than a fun project? Fun was my first priority. If it went further than that then excellent. I flagged fairly early on that my experience with Rocket Network and the album deal with a major label that resulted, showed that disgagreement amongst participants can very easily kill momentum. It appears history repeats. Of course, whether there WAS momentum is subjective, but then isn't everything. We will probably never know now [/QB]

I think there was plenty of momentum, during the sign-up process.