Iconoclast Posted February 24 Share Posted February 24 Any Key Largo USB audio users out there? I recently thought I'd try out the KL (KeyLargo) as I use Mainstage and Hardware keyboards in the same rig. 1st KL showed up and all the analog stuff worked fine but any of the digital stuff coming through the USB sounded digitally choppy and almost unrecognizable. I called Sweetwater and spent some time on the phone with their tech guys who even took over my computer remotely and tried to work their way through the problem with no success. The computer recognizes the device, and no drivers are required for Mac's, but the audio is unusable/unrecognizable. So they send me a new one. Sweet. Only, I just got the new one and it has the exact same issue. So now of course, I'm thinking of course that it's me. Tried it with both my MacBookPro and my MacStudio. Both recognize the device. The MBP produces short digital slices of audio only. Nothing usable. The Mac Studio on the other had, produces NO audio at all through the KL. For the geeks the MBP is a 2018 Intel 6 core i9, the MacStudio is a 2022 M1 Max. They both have no problem with any of my other devices (UR44, UA Volt 476, Soundcraft Ui24) and I'm able to switch back and forth and get Mainstage to work on everything except the KL. Some google searches and a look at the Radial website produced no similar failure modes for anyone. So, anyone here using the KeyLargo and had any similar problems or advice? Quote You want me to start this song too slow or too fast? Forte7, Nord Stage 3, XK3c, OB-6, Arturia Collection, Mainstage, MotionSound KBR3D. A bunch of MusicMan Guitars, Line6 stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElmerJFudd Posted February 24 Share Posted February 24 Never had a problem with mine. I’ve only used it on Intel Macs. But it’s a class compliant audio device so it should work fine on Intel or Apple Silicon. The first thing that comes to mind is the USB cable Quote Yamaha CP88, Casio PX-560 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iconoclast Posted February 24 Author Share Posted February 24 You got me on a thought and...OMFG, it's not backwards compatible to USB 3.0. But if I run it through an old cord into a USB 2.0 HUB and then into the macbook it works perfectly. Thank you Elmer, and take the rest of the day off with pay. 3 1 Quote You want me to start this song too slow or too fast? Forte7, Nord Stage 3, XK3c, OB-6, Arturia Collection, Mainstage, MotionSound KBR3D. A bunch of MusicMan Guitars, Line6 stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nursers Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 I love a quick resolution and outcome! Glad you got it sorted. The Radial stuff is usually as solid as a rock so would have been surprised if it was something intrinsic Quote The Keyboard Chronicles Podcast Check out your fellow forumites in an Apple Music playlist Check out your fellow forumites in a Spotify playlist My Music: Stainless Fields Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzpiano88 Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 9 hours ago, Iconoclast said: You got me on a thought and...OMFG, it's not backwards compatible to USB 3.0. But if I run it through an old cord into a USB 2.0 HUB and then into the macbook it works perfectly. Thank you Elmer, and take the rest of the day off with pay. Was it the cable or going through the hub that solved the issue? I drove myself nuts for days with a similar issue and it turned out the usb cable length was out of spec (too long) making it work for some data/devices but not others. Quote J a z z P i a n o 8 8 -- Yamaha C7D Montage M8x | CP300 | CP4 | SK1-73 | OB6 | Seven K8.2 | 3300 | CPSv.3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnderGroundGr Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 Intel imac and key largo, never had a problem, glad you solved yours! Quote Kurzweil K2661 + full options,iMac 27",Mac book white,Apogee Element 24 + Duet,Genelec 8030A,Strymon Lex + Flint,Hohner Pianet T,Radial Key-Largo,Kawai K5000W,Moog Minitaur,Yamaha Reface YC + CP, iPad 9th Gen, Arturia Beatstep + V Collection 9 https://antonisadelfidis.bandcamp.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delaware Dave Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 14 hours ago, Iconoclast said: You got me on a thought and...OMFG, it's not backwards compatible to USB 3.0. But if I run it through an old cord into a USB 2.0 HUB and then into the macbook it works perfectly. Thank you Elmer, and take the rest of the day off with pay. This is exactly why i dont like working with these centralized techs. One of the questions he should have asked was about your cabling, specifically if it was a 2.0 or 3.0 cable, yada yada. They dont know shxt.... Quote 57 Hammond B3; 69 Hammond L100P; 68 Leslie 122; Kurzweil Forte7 & PC3; M-Audio Code 61; Voce V5+; Neo Vent; EV ELX112P; GSI Gemini & Burn Delaware Dave Exit93band Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reezekeys Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 I had a similar issue with an older Korg NanoKontrol (1st version) connected to my old Intel MacBook Pro's USB3 port. Through a hub, it worked. Connected directly, it showed as powered but didn't pass any midi data. Interestingly, connected directly to my new MacBook Air (via a USB A to C adapter), it works fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnderGroundGr Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 I have connect my Key Largo in my imac usb 3 port and it works perfectly... Quote Kurzweil K2661 + full options,iMac 27",Mac book white,Apogee Element 24 + Duet,Genelec 8030A,Strymon Lex + Flint,Hohner Pianet T,Radial Key-Largo,Kawai K5000W,Moog Minitaur,Yamaha Reface YC + CP, iPad 9th Gen, Arturia Beatstep + V Collection 9 https://antonisadelfidis.bandcamp.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
U.Honey Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 On 2/24/2024 at 3:58 PM, Iconoclast said: You got me on a thought and...OMFG, it's not backwards compatible to USB 3.0. Where did you find that out? Just curious because I thought USB is by design downwards compatible. I've been using my M2 Mac with Keylargo with no issues. I'm using the Apple USB3->USB2 adapter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David R Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 Also running a Key Largo over USB (with the Apple USB A-C dongle) on a MacBook M1 and i have had no issues. Maybe increase your buffer size compared to your other interfaces? Quote My Site Nord Electro 5D, Novation Launchkey 61, Logic Pro X, Mainstage 3, lots of plugins, fingers, pencil, paper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergievsky Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 I had a problem also but it was that the audio suddenly stopped, even though it showed the KL usb audio still connected and software was still running through it, just no audio coming out. It didn’t happen right away, worked for awhile, then suddenly no more audio. Hard to recreate, as it was after awhile during rehearsal, and also happened before after a bit of time as well, so not sure I can call tech support as it would probably be working throughout my call. Anyway, just wondering if someone else had a similar problem. I’ll also try several different hubs and cables and see if it’ll work. Otherwise great unit, but unless I get this figured out can’t rely on the usb part of it. Quote Raul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzpiano88 Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 As I mentioned earlier in the thread, definitely take a look at your cable length. The spec for maximum length without a repeater or hub is 5 meters. I had purchased a long cable (maybe 20 feet) due to a long run from my controller (CP300) and iMac Pro. It was unreliable, sometimes working for short bursts and sometimes not communicating at all. Once I replaced it with a shorter cable, everything worked fine. Just a shot in the dark to check. Quote J a z z P i a n o 8 8 -- Yamaha C7D Montage M8x | CP300 | CP4 | SK1-73 | OB6 | Seven K8.2 | 3300 | CPSv.3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iconoclast Posted February 28 Author Share Posted February 28 I'm not at home this week, but will check no the cable length issue. I know the cable I was using was way less than 5 meters but it was one of my longer USB cables. Quote You want me to start this song too slow or too fast? Forte7, Nord Stage 3, XK3c, OB-6, Arturia Collection, Mainstage, MotionSound KBR3D. A bunch of MusicMan Guitars, Line6 stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iconoclast Posted February 28 Author Share Posted February 28 11 hours ago, Sergievsky said: I had a problem also but it was that the audio suddenly stopped, even though it showed the KL usb audio still connected and software was still running through it, just no audio coming out. It didn’t happen right away, worked for awhile, then suddenly no more audio. Hard to recreate, as it was after awhile during rehearsal, and also happened before after a bit of time as well, so not sure I can call tech support as it would probably be working throughout my call. Anyway, just wondering if someone else had a similar problem. I’ll also try several different hubs and cables and see if it’ll work. Otherwise great unit, but unless I get this figured out can’t rely on the usb part of it. This sounds similar to how my problem presented itself sometimes. Maybe try a shorter USB? Maybe run it through a different USB connection or a USB hub? Quote You want me to start this song too slow or too fast? Forte7, Nord Stage 3, XK3c, OB-6, Arturia Collection, Mainstage, MotionSound KBR3D. A bunch of MusicMan Guitars, Line6 stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Burgess Posted March 2 Share Posted March 2 It's a bug bear, but sometimes you gotta bite the bullet and use the proper (expensive) Apple adapters now everything is on USB C/Thunderbolt connectors. Not all USB C > USB B cables are created equal. They might power stuff, but will not handshake, or pass data. Was in my local bar one day after they got a new LED wall. Macs would just not see the controller using Amazon level adapters. Had 6 guys on site trying to fix it for an event. Told them a hundred times to go get an Apple Thunderbolt to HDMI adapter - after many man hours, they did, and it worked instantly. Been working for a year. Same with Ethernet adapters etc... you just don't know what you're gonna get. Although I've had success with UGreen stuff in the main. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iconoclast Posted March 3 Author Share Posted March 3 Just got back in town and tried it again with different cables and it appears that it's the cable length and perhaps cable type that it's sensitive to. I was able to bypass the USB 2.0 hub with a shorter (and much older beat up looking) cord and even use it through a small USB-A to USB-C dongle, and it seems to be working fine now. The USB spec is 5 meters, and the cord I was using is 15 feet long, which is about a foot shorter than the spec. I have two of them that I use for some other longer runs in my studio and while they both work fine for those purposes, neither will function with the KL on either of my studio computers (MBP and the MacStudio). FWIW, I have used even longer cords for some purposes and never had a problem, even recording audio. So it doesn't appear to be an issue with not being backwards compatible, but more that the KL is just very sensitive to cable length? Or maybe that it just doesn't like this brand of USB cable, I don't know. But it's definitely the cable. Quote You want me to start this song too slow or too fast? Forte7, Nord Stage 3, XK3c, OB-6, Arturia Collection, Mainstage, MotionSound KBR3D. A bunch of MusicMan Guitars, Line6 stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iconoclast Posted March 3 Author Share Posted March 3 @Sergievsky Did you try your KL through different or shorter USB cables and if so what was the result? Quote You want me to start this song too slow or too fast? Forte7, Nord Stage 3, XK3c, OB-6, Arturia Collection, Mainstage, MotionSound KBR3D. A bunch of MusicMan Guitars, Line6 stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzpiano88 Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 Just another thought... With cable lengths near the spec, the variability of transmitter/receiver signal level capability would also be near spec, and possibly unreliable. The material I've read is that, not only is transmission signal level degradation with long lengths an issue, but also the handshaking backward transmission/reception. Quote J a z z P i a n o 8 8 -- Yamaha C7D Montage M8x | CP300 | CP4 | SK1-73 | OB6 | Seven K8.2 | 3300 | CPSv.3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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