OK, the Corona Virus Isn't Going Away. Now What?

[Notes_Norton]

as that same governor (we call him DeathSantis) fired the person who was reporting the truth and refusing to lie, minimizing the number of cases.

That's not true:

https://nypost.com/2021/05/13/how-rebekah-jones-peddled-lies-about-florida-covid-19-deaths/

 

Your media is horribly corrupt.

NY Post is a hyper partisan conservative paper with very questionable journalistic value. Not just my opinion, Politifact, Flackcheck, MediaMatters and quite a few others agree.

 

Jones was telling the truth. DeathSantis ordered her to fudge the numbers to make the state look good, she refused to lie, and she got fired.

[Notes_Norton]

<...snip...> 1.1% is enough for you to call him DeathSantis? <...>

 

Bob

Hi Bob. Since you don't live here, I'll fill you in.

 

1) When the CDC said the cruise ships could sail again, DeathSantis and his GOP cronies passed a law stating that a cruise ship cannot require either proof of vaccination or COVID tests to board the ship. In other words, they have to let people with COVID on the cruise ship. Do you remember the cruises that were superspreader events where no port would let them dock? That's obviously what he wants. That's one reason why we call him DeathSantis.

 

2) During the height of the pandemic, local businesses and communities were requiring masks, and the DeathSantis squad passed laws that forbid law enforcement agencies from enforcing any mask mandates.

 

3) Later, the DeathSantis squad passed a law forbidding communities from passing mask ordinances at all.

 

4) The same good ol' boys passed laws forbidding so-called vaccination passports anywhere. So a bar can refuse service because you have no shoes, but can't refuse service because you might infect the other patrons with a deadly disease.

 

5) DeathSantis even went as far to say that Hospitals, Clinics, and Nursing Homes cannot require the help to be vaccinated. Same for cruise ships and other businesses

 

6) Although it's been lax on enforcement, even a hospital or doctor's office can't require you to wear a mask to get in the door.

 

It seems the guy wants to kill people.

 

Actually it's the big business he is protecting. We common folks are pawns, our lives mean nothing, so if 10% of us die for greater corporate profits, it's all good to DeathSantis and the puppeteers that pull his strings.

 

Do you need more reasons? There are plenty.

 

But since you aren't local, you probably haven't heard about all of them.

 

Notes

[Notes_Norton]

IMO, 70% vaccinated is a lowball estimate for herd immunity. Original estimates were 80% or higher, but when it seemed we would never make that goal, they dropped the bar to try to convince more people to get their jabs.

 

This quote is attributed to Mark Twain. "It"s easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled."

 

I suspect that a lot of people who refuse the vaccine because certain politicians, pundits, preachers, propagandists, and social media posters spread fearmongering lies about the vaccine will never admit they were wrong.

 

Sure, the chances of getting a reaction from the vaccine is slight. Right now it's in the thousands of one percent. The chances of getting brain damage if you catch COVID are about 33%. Do the math.

 

A family member lost his sense of taste and smell over a year ago. It hasn't come back. He had a mild case of COVID. There is so much brain damage that he doesn't have the capacity to redirect other parts of his brain to take over the taste/smell function. He is a young man with a new baby (who also tested positive), has brain fog, and may never be able to enjoy a meal for the rest of his life. He was an anti-mask anti-vax person.

 

Plenty of the people telling you to refuse the vaccination are vaccinated. So why are they telling people not to get vaccinated when they got their jabs? You figure it out.

 

Insights and incites by Notes

[Dave Bryce]

Frankly, what the media chooses not to report is often far more damning to its credibility than what it chooses to report.

 

Next.

 

dB

[Jazzmammal]

Here's a recent article from the Miami Herald about the Jones Wistleblower case which is quite different from the NY Post piece:

 

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article251838913.html

 

Here's where the problem is in trying to sort through something like this. I could go through each article and compare the names, dates and writing looking for inconsistencies and slant. There are sure to be data points that are in one article but not the other (the deliberate choosing to leave out important items in order to make their overall point). One glaring point is the Herald article opens with this "Just hours after the police entered her home, guns drawn and warrant to seize her electronics in hand,..." This looks to me like a classic example of a newspaper using what she says happened without any comment about if it's true or not. They simply accepted it. The NY Post says bodycam footage clearly shows no guns were drawn. Is that really true? They posted pics saying it is along with the link to the Florida Department of Law Enforcement website explaining the bodycam footage, here's that link:

 

https://www.fdle.state.fl.us/News/2020/December/FDLE-releases-full-body-camera-footage-from-Rebeka

 

It sure looks true to me that no guns were drawn. This is just one point and I don't have the time to analyze every single point in both articles. To go through all this point by point would take me a week and the resulting posts here about it could be a small book. All I'll say is the Herald article looks to me like a liberal newspaper deliberately taking her side because of bias. That opening line is pretty damning. They could have at least referenced the FDLE releasing the bodycam footage and if the Herald has a problem with that footage then fine, report on that but they didn't. They simply printed that opening line as if it's fact which it clearly is not. On this one point at least National Review is totally correct and factual unless someone can point to proof that the FDLE is now lying about the footage because they edited out scenes showing guns drawn for example.

 

Bob

[hardware]

I personally hold NIH and military scientists from the USA and China accountable.

 

They"re smart people. They know by politicizing the science worshippers of the DNC and GOP will fall in line and do their dirty work.

In China there"s no opposition, mostly because they disappear. So they sit back and watch the Sheepfights.

 

Let people take their sides since they"re easily distracted from the real issues, no sense trying to persuade those suffering from displaced aggression.

 

They have newspapers, politicians and 'experts' they can quote to appear informed.

Carrying their water gives a sense of purpose.

 

I"ll continue practicing safety even though I"m Moderna-ized

Too bad for hours wasted carrying politicians water there"s no reward, even when your team wins.

 

Good Luck To All.

[Anderton]

Perhaps but I don't know. Is there a liberal news source that has looked closer into this?

 

Well, the only reason you don't know is you obviously didn't look. Why do I have to do everyone's research for them? I should start a thread called "The ABCs of Search Engines."

 

I found this one by entering "Rebekah Jones New York Times" in the Edge search bar. If you consider the New York Times a liberal news source, here you go:

 

A State Scientist Questioned Florida"s Virus Data. Now Her Home"s Been Raided. It contains info like: The search warrant served this week did not represent Ms. Jones"s first brush with the law. She faced a number of criminal charges in Florida, including criminal mischief and violation of a domestic violence injunction, all involving a relationship with one of her former students when she was a graduate assistant at Florida State University. None of them resulted in a conviction, but last year, Tallahassee prosecutors charged Ms. Jones with cyberstalking the man.

 

It's not labeled as opinion, and the quality of writing, reporting, and fact-checking is so far beyond the crap piece in the Post that you should probably re-think your idea of what's a credible news source. In fact, given the publication dates (Times, Dec 11, 2020 and updated April 9, 2021 vs. Post, May 13, 2021), it looks very suspiciously like the Post got most of its information from the article in the Times, and just threw in a dash of hyperbole and partisan bias to pander to its core audience.

 

Oh, and here's what a bona fide left wing, NOT somewhat-left-of-center outlet like the Times, thought about the Times piece: New York Times Smears Covid-19 Whistleblower Rebekah Jones.

 

And the Washington Post, which I would consider predominantly liberal rather than center-left like the Times, did an article that presented both sides of the story in, again, a far superior way to the Post's shoddy "journalism": DeSantis applauds fired whistleblower"s Twitter suspension, the latest in an ongoing feud.

 

FWIW if the Post said "cars have wheels," I'd feel compelled to go outside and look at a car, just to make sure.

 

Next.

[Jazzmammal]

Ummm..OK. What did you just say? You hold the Brits and military from the US and China accountable? Politicizing science worshopers? Carrying their water?

 

Let people take their sides since they"re easily distracted from the real issues, no sense trying to persuade those suffering from displaced aggression.

 

Are you saying the Powers That Be are apolitical so they are manipulating everybody on both sides to their nefarious ends like some James Bond villian? What ends? Or, something else?

 

We are they, them, the Men in Black. Ohhhhhh better go hide now.

 

I don't get it.

 

Bob

[Anderton]

Ummm..OK. What did you just say? You hold the Brits and military from the US and China accountable? Politicizing science worshopers? Carrying their water?

 

Let people take their sides since they"re easily distracted from the real issues, no sense trying to persuade those suffering from displaced aggression.

 

Are you saying the Powers That Be are apolitical so they are manipulating everybody on both sides to their nefarious ends like some James Bond villian? What ends? Or, something else?

 

We are they, them, the Men in Black. Ohhhhhh better go hide now.

 

I don't get it.

 

Bob

 

Neither do I. I'm tempted to delete the post, because it doesn't add anything to increase our knowledge about the reality of Covid.

 

Even bringing up Jones was stretching it, BUT the decision of states to open up or lock down greatly influences our decision about live performance possibilities, so it's important to know how states arrive at their decisions. Notes can now play in Florida, and he feels that being an outdoor, small gig and his having been vaccinated, he's probably okay. Others might feel Florida was too hasty about re-opening, and if asked to play a festival, might bow out.

 

At this point how it started is of academic interest. How we get out of this situation, in the most intelligent, balanced, and strategic way, is what matters.

 

People supporting the politicization of covid are just making things worse.

[KenElevenShadows]

I find myself wishing for the day when people debated these things on the merits of science and facts.

 

I'm particularly appalled that people dig their heels in to misinformation campaigns despite all facts and evidence to the contrary.

 

We live in the Age of Misinformation, and I don't know that it is possible to get out of it.

[Anderton]

PLEASE READ THIS

 

I'm seriously thinking of just closing this thread, although I still feel we need to discuss how, as professional musicians, we're going to deal with this reality.

 

It's clear a lot of people don't do ANY homework before posting opinions that have a tenuous connection to reality. It sure seemed like PrairieGuy thought he found a "gotcha" about the "liberal" press not blowing the whistle on Rebekah Jones, under the now-popular guise of "I'm just asking a question." But, I doubt he bothered to look for an answer before asking the question, which is a waste of my time and thread bandwidth.

 

I'm not singling him out by any means, it's just the most recent example that comes to mind. The point of this thread is not to reinforce someone's prejudices, but find out the truth, however uncomfortable it may be to people holding certain opinions or wanting to conform to certain ideologies. But, any comments need to be fact-based, and from sources that have a track record of accuracy, regardless of their ideological slant.. I've quoted both "right-wing" and "left-wing" sources, if the information is, based on all available data, correct.

 

I put a lot of effort into presenting information that is accepted by an overwhelming majority of medical professionals as accurate, but only in light of current circumstances. When those circumstances change, which happens with regularity when a virus - not people - are in control, I change my assessment as well. For example, current estimates are that herd immunity will require 85% - 90% of people with antibodies, because the Delta variant has reset things quite a bit. This is important information, because it pushes out the timetable for getting back to "normal."

 

When I present information that shows someone is totally incorrect about something, the reaction is seldom, if ever "Wow thanks, I had no idea, thanks for checking that out. I learned something." Either there's radio silence, or deflection to a different topic. I don't expect people to agree, I just expect them to open their minds and consider a bigger data set, so they can have more informed opinions.

 

Is that asking too much?

 

I think that perhaps the solution is more aggressive moderation. But rather than banning people or deleting posts, I'd just wipe the words, and edit the post to say:

 

I apologize, but I don't have time to waste on this. Please do some research to get all sides of the story before formulating your opinion and posting it. Also, please restrict your comments solely to issues involving us as professional musicians, although it's understood that's a pretty broad topic - from how safe is it to go on the road and eat at truck stops, to whether it's a good idea to book gigs months in advance, to which states' policies are more conducive to personal safety. Thank you for your cooperation.

 

I don't want to "silence" people, I'm not averse to learning new information that goes against what I thought was true. In fact, I welcome it. I just want an improvement in the quality, and most of all accuracy, of their discourse.

[KuruPrionz]

Craig, please do close this thread and keep it on the page as a reminder.

 

In a couple of years, those of us that are still around (and truly NONE of us know the time of our passing) will have something to ponder.

 

"Did I really write that?"

 

It may be obvious (I hope it was to the more observant) but I find myself overly tempted to simply bait people, sort of a test that serves no purpose whatsoever.

Since I find myself agreeing with your thought to close the thread, this will be the second time I've left the thread but it will also be the last.

 

And I do wish everybody to be safe and to be well. Cheers, Kuru

[hardware]

People supporting the politicization of covid are just making things worse.

 

That was my point.

 

I have no troubles bypassing purely political copy/pastes and researching on topics myself.

With 2 nurses in my family I totally understand what we faced and are facing.

 

Talk in Vegas for those of us lucky to be working, is valid proof of Vaccination, which I don"t mind, and masking.

Casinos don"t want a lawsuit so some precautions will be around for the near future.

 

Wish I had the answers, but we learn as we live through this.

Politicizing this serves those employing said tactics, I wont carry either teams water.

 

I might have to go study and practice again if the Strip shuts down.

Saw flights cancelled from 911, conventions close from CEOs vrs the Presidents public battle, but never saw the strip go dark.

 

Guess I"ve been here too long, but it"s where the money is (was) for guys who love to perform live.

 

Didn"t mean to ruffle any feathers.

[Anderton]

I have no troubles bypassing purely political copy/pastes and researching on topics myself.

With 2 nurses in my family I totally understand what we faced and are facing.[snip]

 

Thanks for the context! Your post makes a lot more sense now. Perils of an all-text medium.

 

I've decided I'll give a few more days for people to give any final comments, and then I'll start a new thread called "Performing in the Age of Covid." Warning: Moderation will be ruthless, swift, and just

 

I do think it has been important to provide a place where people can do some venting, but when the venting becomes ingrown, it has outlived its usefulness.

 

We're all frustrated and we will continue to be so, for a variety of reasons. The object was to get the venting over with, then figure out how to make things better. Hopefully the new thread will do the latter. Developments are occurring rapidly, and we do need to stay on top of them.

[David Emm]

I have both of my vaccines and a throbbing case of COVID Fatigue fatigue. Let's start a nice, cleansing fight. Who makes the worst synthesizer?

[Notes_Norton]

I was couch-surfing the web last nigh, I came across an article, it was behind a paywall, but I saw the picture. People were demonstrating, carrying homemade signs protesting masks and vaccines. One of the women had a T-shirt on that had, in bold print, "Choose Life" written across her chest. I love unintentional humor.

 

I will continue to try to avoid COVID like the plague. It's about self-preservation.

 

Notes

[GovernorSilver]

Thought about attending an indoor concert at a beloved DC rock venue,

 

Then my home county released an announcement advising masking up again indoors due to more and more vaccinated people getting sick from Covid. Nobody I know wants to go that concert because it's indoors, and likely to be crowded (no social distancing).

 

Thanks, Delta variant!

[RABid]

I went to the public library today. They are back to requiring mask upon entry. They used to have a monthly concert and several classes each month on various topics. Right now everything is still online only.

[Jazzmammal]

It's clear a lot of people don't do ANY homework before posting opinions that have a tenuous connection to reality. It sure seemed like PrairieGuy thought he found a "gotcha" about the "liberal" press not blowing the whistle on Rebekah Jones, under the now-popular guise of "I'm just asking a question." But, I doubt he bothered to look for an answer before asking the question, which is a waste of my time and thread bandwidth.

 

When I present information that shows someone is totally incorrect about something, the reaction is seldom, if ever "Wow thanks, I had no idea, thanks for checking that out. I learned something." Either there's radio silence, or deflection to a different topic. I don't expect people to agree, I just expect them to open their minds and consider a bigger data set, so they can have more informed opinions.

 

This is exactly what I did yesterday Craig about the "Guns Drawn" thing. I researched it, posted links and nobody including you has said one peep about it. I also pointed out the original source was not the Post, it was National Review and not a peep from anybody about that either. I did this precisely because I'm willing to be proved wrong. That's happened before in this thread many months ago and I admitted it so what's going on now? The fact that nobody has responded to my post makes it look like this is a genuine gotcha and this thread is full of the same sort of people many here are complaining about. If it's something that goes against their belief system, it's radio silence. The FACT that many liberal sources not just one or two but pretty much ALL of them referred to this raid with GUNS DRAWN is one helluva gotcha when the official police responce, which I posted, is videocam footage showing that is a lie.

 

Now, that doesn't mean the entire piece from NR is completely true but like we say in showbiz, the opener is the most important part of the show and these articles from either pure liberal or center left news organizations opened with "guns drawn". NYTimes: brandishing guns... Washington Post Florida police officers with guns drawn raided... I could quote many, many more.

 

Another thing concerning bias and the use of the word "raided". This was not a raid, a raid is supposed to be a surprise by definition. In the NY Times piece they posted one of the bodycam vids. First, she says stop pointing guns at my kids! That's her trying to manipulate the situation, no guns were drawn, then right after that point you can hear an officer telling her to calm down by reminding her they called her the day before to tell her they were coming to serve a search warrant. Hardly a raid.

 

Bob

[Anderton]

This is exactly what I did yesterday Craig about the "Guns Drawn" thing. I researched it, posted links and nobody including you has said one peep about it.

 

That's because I agreed But maybe not for the same reasons. Really, it gets back to what I said originally: this will be resolved in court. Until then, all journalists can do is report on the back and forth. No article states whether ALL the bodycam footage was released, but that's something a court can find out. The only real difference between the NR reporting and the Times was that NR said the video "does not appear to show police pointing their guns at anyone in the house." That doesn't prove they didn't, any more than Jones' statements proved they did.

 

The Times did report that "The Department of Law Enforcement denied that agents pointed their weapons at anybody and released body camera footage on Thursday showing how agents repeatedly knocked on Ms. Jones"s door and called her cellphone to announce the search warrant." She posted a video clip of the agent's arrival on a Twitter account, but the account has been suspended, so we can't see it. The reality is that we have NO IDEA who's telling the truth, but all media concerned did in fact report on what Jones, her lawyer, and the police said.

 

(Personally, if I was a cop, and someone didn't answer repeated knocks on a door after 22 minutes, I sure as hell would have my gun drawn as a precautionary measure. So I didn't recoil in horror at the thought that might have happened. Obviously, no one was shot.)

 

I also pointed out the original source was not the Post, it was National Review and not a peep from anybody about that either.

 

Yes, but it was an excerpt, and compare the headlines - Post: "How a fake whistleblower peddled lies about Florida"s COVID deaths" vs. NR's more measured "Rebekah Jones, the COVID Whistleblower Who Wasn"t." Also the NR piece was published after the Times' update, and I can't help but think that's not a coincidence. Maybe I've just seen too many of my articles published on the web without credit

 

But remember, I wasn't responding to whether the pieces were true or false, but in response to a statement that no "liberal" media dug into Jones' past and published the shady side of Ms. Jones. They had. My position is still that we won't know anything until the trial. I also think the word "allegedly" should be used a lot more often, to indicate something for which there is no confirmation.

 

And let's face it, give what journalists are paid, we're not going to get Einsteins every time.

[Jazzmammal]

Fair enough Craig but I think you're still giving too much credit to the liberal media. I posted the link to the FDLE response and here it is again:

 

https://www.fdle.state.fl.us/News/2020/December/FDLE-releases-full-body-camera-footage-from-Rebeka

 

They clearly say they released the FULL body cam footage and went on give a time stamped narrative about it. I know many people simply refuse to believe anything the cops say, again due to liberal bias ihmo but for now if we're at least leaning towards giving credance to these news reports then we need to give credance to this FDLE response too. Nobody but me has given any credit at all to PrarieGuys original post, the four or five people who responded to him directly totally savaged him by saying what a POS that Post article is and implying he's an idiot for even reading it. I say, no. There is plenty here to justify posting it like he did. I will say the Times was a bit fairer about it because they did get into her not so great past but still they just had to put in the "brandishing guns" and they just had to use the very predudicial word "Raid". They couldn't help themselves because they have a biased agenda imho and PrairieGuy's shoice of words in calling the mainstream media horribly corrupt is a bit strong but he's not wrong either.

 

I avoided posting things like this over a year ago because I felt it was too political even though there are a couple of guys here who have no problem doing that anyway. Since you're about to close this thread down and invited us to come up with our final posts, I decided to go for it. Anybody who tries to say the NY Times, the Post, CNN, and others are in any way neutral when it comes to politics is out of their minds, I'm sorry to put it that way but they've got blinders on. I will say they are all really good news organizations with anything OTHER than politics like the LA Times which I subscribe to. And yes, I completely agree their reporting on COVID, the science of it and all that is really good BUT when they see a chance to use what looks like science to rake a GOP governor over the coals like this Jones case then their bias comes right to the front. This is an obvious news event and should be reported but did they do it in a neutral fair way? Absolutely not.

 

I just did some more searching and found this followup article in National Review by the same author.

 

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/rebekah-jones-admits-she-was-never-asked-to-delete-covid-deaths-in-florida/

 

Waiting to go to court has nothing to do with this. Now she has admitted she was never told to delete COVID deaths. What!? What is she saying here? Read it for yourself guys. All of these organizations simply hate DeSantis and did everything they could to show he somehow was behind her being ordered to delete those death numbers. They made no effort at all to do any due diligence first, iow act like legitimate reporters.

 

Bob

[Notes_Norton]

I liked DeSantis before he got into office. He seemed to be an environmentalist. But his reaction to COVID is inexcusable. His latest executive order is that if a school requires masks for students, he will immediately withhold all state funds for that school.

 

The local paper calls it "Death By DeSantis". His anti mask, anti vaccine laws are probably the main reason why 20% of all current COVID cases in the USA are in Florida.

 

And his 'environmental' stance turned out to be a defense of the largest polluter in our state, Big Sugar. The taxpayers bought the land and will build and maintain the cesspool (called a reservoir) to clean the water that Big Sugar pollutes. It would have been easy to say to Big Sugar, the water leaving your fields must be as clean as the water you draw from your wells, but there was no mention of that at all. Instead, the trillion dollar clean up, construction, and continued maintenance to clean Big Sugar's poison falls squarely on the shoulders of the taxpayers.

 

Those are two good reasons why I went from liking DeSantis to disliking him.

 

What we have now between Ms Jones and the government is too mired in contradictions to sort out. Is there a cover-up? Was she wrong? Is she being framed? I read too much pro and con that conflicts with other publications to know for sure.

 

But the governor's actions to spread COVID are obvious. Why else would he require that people infected with COVID be allowed on cruise ships and in public indoor places? By making it illegal to require vaccine passports or masks, and also making it illegal to test for COVID before admittance? These laws and executive orders are really all I need to know.

 

Back on topic..........

 

So now what?

 

I have to protect myself and only take outdoor gigs.

 

A friend of mine took an underpaying gig in a club that got closed due to COVID a couple of weeks later. 3 members of his band tested positive for COVID, all 4 got very sick (one didn't get tested) and one of the members died. If COVID passports or a valid test was required, this wouldn't have happened. But it's illegal in Florida to deny access to anyone who has COVID.

 

I haven't passed up any indoor gigs yet, but until this thing gets under control, I'll turn them down if offered.

 

I want to avoid COVID like the plague.

 

Notes

[Jazzmammal]

Man, so many local articles in newspapers that come up in searches are all behind paywalls but I'll say this. He's not anti masking or anti vax. What I think he's saying is everybody knows all about COVID now and it's up to individual responsibility to decide what to do. He is applauding the fact that many more people are getting the vaccine now, he just doesn't believe in people being forced to get it. When it comes to schools there is no consensus about masking or not masking and this article from

NBC spells that out pretty clearly.

 

https://www.nbcnews.com/science/science-news/delta-vaccinated-parents-people-kids-12-need-know-rcna1590

 

School is a huge issue right now. Many articles have talked about how remote learning has completely failed in many households. Socialization with young kids is very important and they have been isolated from a school environment for 18 months. There are many articles about that and then the biggest thing is a school is the primary day care center for parents who have to go to work. The data shows young children under 17 have a very low risk from COVID but of course news outlets will tell us all about when somebody's kid dies from COVID even though it's pretty rare. The Delta variant could change that but it's hasn't yet but of course it's too soon to tell. I understand your point but I don't see DeSantis saying masking is unncessary and he certainly has never said the vaccines are not necessary, all I hear him saying is he does not believe in mandating these things. Let the people decide for themselves which is something I have said all year since the vaccines became available.

 

We've already talked about this, as cases and risks rise among the unvaccinated, the daily number of people getting vaccinated is going up. That's the essence of people deciding for themselves and I think this unvaccinated question will resolve itself fairly quickly. That plus the rising case counts just gets us that much closer to herd immunity. Speaking of that, it's been all over the news the last few days, Biden announced the nation has reached his goal of 70% vaccinations with the first jab counting in that because even the first shot gives pretty decent protection. Add the cases and it's well over that but as we've been discussing some areas are below that number. How long will it take to get to 80 or even 85%? I don't think it will be that long, a few more months maybe.

 

Again, anybody who's really worried is free to wear a mask, tell their kids to wear it at school, stay home if they want, not take any indoor gigs, whatever. Nobody's telling us we can't do any of that.

 

Bob

[Anderton]

Bob, just remember my first response was that I didn't think Jones passed the smell test. Which is why I didn't "take a side," but figured it all would come out in a trial. As more info comes out, it sure seems tilted against Jones. But, everything is still not crystal clear, because part of the video was redacted. The report says "Upon entry into Ms. Jones" residence..." and here's what it says about the disclaimer:

 

The video has been redacted in accordance with the following state and federal laws:

 

s. 119.071(2)(l)2.a., F.S. Body camera recording, or a portion thereof, is confidential and exempt if the recording is taken within the interior of a private residence

 

So who knows if they "brandished" guns inside the house. Or whether they just happened to have guns on them, which was twisted into the hyperbole of "brandishing."

 

In a situation where either the plaintiff or defendant is not telling the truth, the place to find the truth is not by asking the plaintiff or defendant. It's by having a trial in a court of law, where impartial experts can evaluate the claims made by both parties.

 

I totally agree with "Anybody who tries to say the NY Times, the Post, CNN, and others are in any way neutral when it comes to politics is out of their minds," to which I would add every media organization you didn't mention Some are worse than others.

 

Everyone sees life through their own filters. If you got harassed by a cop on meth, you're going to assume the cops are the problem. If your father's life was saved by a cop, you're going to assume the cops are the solution. It's human nature.

 

I give more slack to people who believe that what they're saying is true compared to those who say something to fit a particular political or financial agenda.

 

I've appreciated your posts, and I can see that you, too, struggle with trying to separate the factual part of things from the fictional part. We're dealing with shades of gray, not black and white. But all we get fed is red or blue.

[Anderton]

And now, as promised, it's time to close the thread.

 

[cue applause & cheers]

 

Here's what I've learned from this thread, and I don't think any of the participants would disagree with these conclusions.

 

* Covid sucks.

* Most people think vaccines are a good idea, because they're more concerned about potential damage from covid than from the vaccine.

* Other people avoid vaccines, because they're more concerned about potential damage from the vaccine than from covid.

* Covid variants suck.

* People wish there were truly trusted, vetted, 100% accurate sources of information.

* We have not experienced a situation where a life-and-death crisis affects the entire world simultaneously (unless you're well over 100 years old). Even world wars didn't touch the entire world.

* Covid mutating into additional variants in the future sucks.

* Some people think the reason why advice from experts changes is because they're being deliberately devious. Some people think it's because they have to make it up as they go along, because there's no real precedent, so they're winging it as more data comes in.

* Covid still sucks.

* There's still no clear understanding of what this will all mean regarding live performance for musicians.

 

...which is a perfect way to segue into inviting people to the thread "Live Performance in the Age of Covid." Moderation will be subjective, unforgiving, and ruthless if I feel a post doesn't address this specific topic in some constructive way. Example of acceptable phrase: "Governor Bob Blurf has announced a moratorium on all indoor concerts for the foreseeable future." Example of unacceptable phrase: "Moron RINO socialist governor Bob Blurf has decided to use his power to unilaterally destroy the lives of all musicians by announcing a moratorium on all indoor concerts for the foreseeable future."

 

See you there. Thank you for your participation in this thread. I hope everyone learned something of interest.